Insomnia, Weight Gain, Stress, Extreme Hunger - Please Help!

KyleKingsly

Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2018
Messages
97
Background on what caused my issues:

I've developed some serious health issues from bad eating habits - first I started seriously undereating last summer unintentionally by skipping breakfast or just eating a small protein bar or something for breakfast, eating a small lunch, and then not getting enough carbs at dinner. I did not realize the cause of the problem until I had followed this pattern for a couple months and started getting hypoglycemia regularly, waking up hungry in the morning often, feeling hungry throughout the day consistently, and getting a bad cascade of stress hormones as a result which made everything worse.

Then over last year, I was drinking a meal replacement shake as my breakfast everyday for months despite the fact that it did not fill me up much at all and so probably was getting too many calories that way. I started slowly but surely gaining weight last Fall for the first time in my life and noticed that I was still feeling hungrier than normal (which probably was the beginning of me developing insulin + leptin resistance).

To make things far worse, I took phenibut and f-phenibut (they're GABA agonists somewhat similar to benzos but working on GABA B instead of A) for sleep and then tried to taper off them too quickly when I realized I had become dependent on them. That gave me anhedonia, much worsened serious chronic stress, inability to eat during the day which caused me to eat highly processed carb-rich meals without much protein or fat before bed so I could sleep, messed up sleep, intense anxiety, and a whole host of other issues. My weight gain definitely started to accelerate during this time. I managed to do a slower taper of phenibut after I realized but I was going too fast but that still was incredibly brutal for me, making it much harder to eat as my stress hormones were so high, giving me sleep issues, and anhedonia which persists somewhat to this day.

Start here if you don't have time to read the background:

After these mistakes, I've gained 50+ lbs, am definitely insulin and leptin resistant (including being right in the range of prediabetes with an A1C of 5.7%), and have intense hunger to match that. I also have an intense sensitivity to stress which I believe is caused somewhat by HPA dysfunction, opioid system dysfunction, and downregulated GABA receptors which make me sensitive to adrenaline and cortisol.

The main thing I'm looking for advice on are sleep, as I wake up after 6ish hours of sleep a couple days a week at least these days and sometimes for days in a row. I take a fresh skullcap tincture which works well in helping me get to sleep quickly but I still will wake up after 6 hours often feeling exhausted but hungry, shaky, and stressed. It feels like high cortisol to me, not necessarily adrenaline because it does not seem to resemble hypoglycemia so much as depleted glycogen stores and my body struggling to switch over to burning fat. It absolutely destroys my focus and zest for life when I don't get enough sleep, especially for multiple days in a row so I'd love some insight into what the problem could be and what I should do about it.

I think it's definitely partially related to my diet as well tho I'm not sure what I should be trying to improve. I'm doing high ish protein right now probably too much according to most of you but it is really hard to get enough carbs while I'm at home and my parents are trying to push low carb on me. I think I'm getting a moderate amount of carbs from 4 - 5 pieces of large fruit per day plus two bowls of rice and two servings of oatmeal, maybe I need to go higher. I'm kind of torn between that and fat.

I'd also love some advice on the best ways to improve my insulin and leptin sensitivity as it's very annoying to have to eat so much and I'm pretty sure I'm making both of those worse because it feels like I'm constantly overeating or coming close to overeating just to feel full and shut down the stress hormones. You have to understand that I feel incredibly awful if I don't eat that much, my stomach hurts and sometimes growls, my stress seems to go higher and higher, and I can't focus or do anything. It seems like I'm caught in a vicious cycle of worsening my issues but it also seems like if I don't satisfy the hunger things just get worse and worse, from my sleep to my life overall.

I'd really love any and all advice, any suggestions on supplements/drugs/hormones I should try would be greatly appreciated as lifestyle stuff doesn't seem to be cutting it for me rn. I just bought a red light/NIR bulb in hopes it would release adipocytes and help me lose weight but I'm not sure if it's helping or not so far. Sorry this is so long and thanks so much if you read it all! I just am at a complete loss for what to do, been reading a ton on here but there's so much conflicting info...
 

ilpmusic

Member
Joined
May 13, 2017
Messages
91
I feel your pain as I use have severe insomnia for 13 years, use sleeping pills for 10 years. Beef gelatin helped me alot right before going to bed but one has to take it with a
fat (like cheese or something else) and some food .
I posted my negative experience with weight gain on amazon-Kate Deering 's book on Healing your metabolism who is very pro ray peat.
PS I happened to see your post since I no longer go on this website-the post will explain .
 

mbachiu

Member
Joined
Oct 12, 2015
Messages
124
Background on what caused my issues:

I've developed some serious health issues from bad eating habits - first I started seriously undereating last summer unintentionally by skipping breakfast or just eating a small protein bar or something for breakfast, eating a small lunch, and then not getting enough carbs at dinner. I did not realize the cause of the problem until I had followed this pattern for a couple months and started getting hypoglycemia regularly, waking up hungry in the morning often, feeling hungry throughout the day consistently, and getting a bad cascade of stress hormones as a result which made everything worse.

Then over last year, I was drinking a meal replacement shake as my breakfast everyday for months despite the fact that it did not fill me up much at all and so probably was getting too many calories that way. I started slowly but surely gaining weight last Fall for the first time in my life and noticed that I was still feeling hungrier than normal (which probably was the beginning of me developing insulin + leptin resistance).

To make things far worse, I took phenibut and f-phenibut (they're GABA agonists somewhat similar to benzos but working on GABA B instead of A) for sleep and then tried to taper off them too quickly when I realized I had become dependent on them. That gave me anhedonia, much worsened serious chronic stress, inability to eat during the day which caused me to eat highly processed carb-rich meals without much protein or fat before bed so I could sleep, messed up sleep, intense anxiety, and a whole host of other issues. My weight gain definitely started to accelerate during this time. I managed to do a slower taper of phenibut after I realized but I was going too fast but that still was incredibly brutal for me, making it much harder to eat as my stress hormones were so high, giving me sleep issues, and anhedonia which persists somewhat to this day.

Start here if you don't have time to read the background:

After these mistakes, I've gained 50+ lbs, am definitely insulin and leptin resistant (including being right in the range of prediabetes with an A1C of 5.7%), and have intense hunger to match that. I also have an intense sensitivity to stress which I believe is caused somewhat by HPA dysfunction, opioid system dysfunction, and downregulated GABA receptors which make me sensitive to adrenaline and cortisol.

The main thing I'm looking for advice on are sleep, as I wake up after 6ish hours of sleep a couple days a week at least these days and sometimes for days in a row. I take a fresh skullcap tincture which works well in helping me get to sleep quickly but I still will wake up after 6 hours often feeling exhausted but hungry, shaky, and stressed. It feels like high cortisol to me, not necessarily adrenaline because it does not seem to resemble hypoglycemia so much as depleted glycogen stores and my body struggling to switch over to burning fat. It absolutely destroys my focus and zest for life when I don't get enough sleep, especially for multiple days in a row so I'd love some insight into what the problem could be and what I should do about it.

I think it's definitely partially related to my diet as well tho I'm not sure what I should be trying to improve. I'm doing high ish protein right now probably too much according to most of you but it is really hard to get enough carbs while I'm at home and my parents are trying to push low carb on me. I think I'm getting a moderate amount of carbs from 4 - 5 pieces of large fruit per day plus two bowls of rice and two servings of oatmeal, maybe I need to go higher. I'm kind of torn between that and fat.

I'd also love some advice on the best ways to improve my insulin and leptin sensitivity as it's very annoying to have to eat so much and I'm pretty sure I'm making both of those worse because it feels like I'm constantly overeating or coming close to overeating just to feel full and shut down the stress hormones. You have to understand that I feel incredibly awful if I don't eat that much, my stomach hurts and sometimes growls, my stress seems to go higher and higher, and I can't focus or do anything. It seems like I'm caught in a vicious cycle of worsening my issues but it also seems like if I don't satisfy the hunger things just get worse and worse, from my sleep to my life overall.

I'd really love any and all advice, any suggestions on supplements/drugs/hormones I should try would be greatly appreciated as lifestyle stuff doesn't seem to be cutting it for me rn. I just bought a red light/NIR bulb in hopes it would release adipocytes and help me lose weight but I'm not sure if it's helping or not so far. Sorry this is so long and thanks so much if you read it all! I just am at a complete loss for what to do, been reading a ton on here but there's so much conflicting info...
Would you say you had been underrating for a long time prior to this experience? Were you exercising a lot before, without properly fueling yourself? It sounds like some classic refeeding to me, as these are pretty much the exact issues I was dealing with over the summer while I stopped dieting & exercising, & instead started refeeding. B1, B2 & B3 May help with insulin sensitivity, but someone who understands this more should probably chime in on that, as I am no expert
 
OP
K

KyleKingsly

Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2018
Messages
97
I feel your pain as I use have severe insomnia for 13 years, use sleeping pills for 10 years. Beef gelatin helped me alot right before going to bed but one has to take it with a
fat (like cheese or something else) and some food .
I posted my negative experience with weight gain on amazon-Kate Deering 's book on Healing your metabolism who is very pro ray peat.
PS I happened to see your post since I no longer go on this website-the post will explain .

I've started eating far more protein than I was while lowering carbs a good bit and this has actually completely solved my sleep issues, I think the problem is that the satiation and energy from the carbs wasn't lasting long enough and so I was getting a big drop in fuel in the middle of the night. Also just being much more consistent in what I eat and making sure I eat until I feel pretty satisfied has helped a lot too.

Hey, any progress?

Nice to know that others are following this thread when it seemed like I wasn't getting much interest/help at first. I've fixed the insomnia now which has made everything a lot better. Unfortunately it took more weight gain to figure out how to eat so that I can sleep and function well consistently. My weight is stable now, I'm trying to slowly lose weight but it's very difficult rn for reasons I'll discuss below.

Would you say you had been underrating for a long time prior to this experience? Were you exercising a lot before, without properly fueling yourself? It sounds like some classic refeeding to me, as these are pretty much the exact issues I was dealing with over the summer while I stopped dieting & exercising, & instead started refeeding. B1, B2 & B3 May help with insulin sensitivity, but someone who understands this more should probably chime in on that, as I am no expert

Yes, now that I think about it, I was 100% under eating for just around a year before the weight gain started. It's all because I was so lazy about cooking for the first time after going off the meal plan on college. I also was trying to save money on groceries so I could buy more nootropics and supplements which are my true life and love. I was prob undereating carbs most of all because I was eating a decent amount of protein most of the time but still wouldn't feel satisfied after that sometimes and I would get hypoglycemic routinely in the late afternoon at work last summer

It was stupid af in retrospect to try to save time and money on food because now I have to spend far more time and money on cooking food and supplements to reverse all the damage I caused by undereating and then overeating to compensate. I've never exercised that much, I really hate it and it's not really that important for weight loss tho I do know it's pretty good for insulin resistance. And yeah, a lot of people have been recommending b vitamins to me, prob will get those soon.
 
Joined
Aug 21, 2018
Messages
1,237
I've fixed the insomnia now which has made everything a lot better. Unfortunately it took more weight gain to figure out how to eat so that I can sleep and function well consistently.

How did you fix insomnia?
 
OP
K

KyleKingsly

Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2018
Messages
97
How did you fix insomnia?

Eating a ***t ton of protein, as I explained above. I think my metabolism is too fat-burning driven right now to be able to use a lot of carbs well, plus my glycogen storage isn't ideal at all even tho my liver enzymes are fine. I'm doing intermittent fasting rn which helps me control my eating a lot by inducing much higher satiety with two massive meals than I'd get with three smaller ones. This way I also am more hungry in a healthy way for dinner which then lets me eat enough to make it comfortably thru the night with no sudden wakeups, whereas before when I was eating three meals I often wouldn't be too hungry for dinner and so wouldn't eat enough to sleep thru the night.

The big thing is definitely the protein for me tho, it's digested much more slowly than the carbs which really helps me have steady energy for the whole night. It's not super enjoyable, I just eat a shitload of chicken every day for lunch and dinner without fail, but I've never enjoyed eating that much, the main thing for me is getting it over with and then being able to focus afterwards for an extended period without any food-related distractions (I hate snacking).
 
Last edited:
OP
K

KyleKingsly

Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2018
Messages
97
My main problem right now is not exactly "hunger" per se as it is a noticeable lack of satiety/satisfaction until I eat a ridiculous amount of food. I'm talking like 1lb of chicken breast or other lean protein for lunch and 2 - 2.5 lb for dinner (remember I only eat 2 meals per day rn and no snacks), this takes an immense amount of time for me plus it's incredibly tedious to cook this much food and then chew on it for hours when I don't even like eating like I said. My life is all fine as long as I eat this much food, not much issues with focus, hunger, sleep, or anything, but I can't go out to eat because I feel shaky and on edge from hunger afterwards if I do (because it's so much less food than I need to eat) and eating this much is really consuming a lot of time these days too. I've tried meal replacement shakes and protein shakes extensively but they're digested far faster than actual food and so they don't work well for me at all, liquids in general don't satisfy me for long so I try to avoid them except for water and tea.

There are a lot of factors contributing to my lack of satiety such as me becoming extremely overweight (I'm considered obese now for weighing 196 lbs at 5' 7", basically I have like 70 lbs of fat), the whole intense stress from the phenibut withdrawal and post acute withdrawal symptom, family history of diabetes on both sides, etc. but I'm pretty sure the two biggest issues I have are extreme leptin and insulin resistance. Both are those hormones are key messengers for satiety and neither of them are working well at all in my body, which is why I feel so bad if I don't eat massive amounts of food.

I just got my fasting insulin tested a couple weeks ago and it was 19.7!!! It's supposed to be 8 or less in normal people, ideally 6 or less, so mine is seriously off the charts. Thus, my question is, what are the very strongest ways to improve my ability to be satisfied from food. The best way I can see to do this would be to heal my insulin resistance because it seems hard to improve leptin resistance. So I bought NA-R-ALA, berberine, magnesium liposomal so far. I have $100 more to spend rn so trying to figure out the best way to spend that rn. I was interested in aspiring, niacinamide, and pyrucet, things that inhibit lipolysis/FAO but I was worried that those would make me gain even more weight which I really cannot afford nor want.

I am trying to slowly lose weight in a healthy, not too stressful manner but it's super difficult rn given how bad my insulin resistance is plus my stress tolerance has just been obliterated since my whole phenibut withdrawal situation, everything is a lot harder to deal with than it used to be. Any suggestions for losing weight, dealing with insulin resistance, and most of all improving satiety are greatly appreciated, thanks in advance!
 
OP
K

KyleKingsly

Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2018
Messages
97
Oh yeah, one big question I have is who are some well educated members/coaches/health guides that follow Peat's ideas or the like that might be able to help me? People like Danny Roddy would be awesome, I think he charges money for his coaching which I can't at all afford rn but I believe DaveFoster does free coaching so I'm gonna try to hit him up soon. Anyone know any other individuals that might be able to help someone that's really struggling with their health (me) for free?
 

Dino D

Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2017
Messages
365
Oh yeah, one big question I have is who are some well educated members/coaches/health guides that follow Peat's ideas or the like that might be able to help me? People like Danny Roddy would be awesome, I think he charges money for his coaching which I can't at all afford rn but I believe DaveFoster does free coaching so I'm gonna try to hit him up soon. Anyone know any other individuals that might be able to help someone that's really struggling with their health (me) for free?
There are a lot of members here that know a lot and that can give you 100% contradictiry advices... search the forum and try it 4 your self...
Starch, no starch
Low fat, high fat
Low protein, high protein
A lot Sugar+juice, or moderate
Coffee, no coffee
Lot of meat vs low meat
And so on ;)
 
OP
K

KyleKingsly

Member
Joined
Feb 15, 2018
Messages
97
There are a lot of members here that know a lot and that can give you 100% contradictiry advices... search the forum and try it 4 your self...
Starch, no starch
Low fat, high fat
Low protein, high protein
A lot Sugar+juice, or moderate
Coffee, no coffee
Lot of meat vs low meat
And so on ;)

Yup, I've searched this forum for hours on end looking for answers and found all of those debated back and forth to no end. I guess each of us just have to experiment and see what works best for us.

Personally where I'm at rn is:
Starch (only rice, no gluten)
Low fat, but not super low
Very high protein (since it's the only thing that can really satisfy me)
Moderately low sugar in the form of fruit, oatmeal, and rice only, no juice or added sugar except a little in my oatmeal (I think I'm probably moderately low by most people's standards on here but moderate by more mainstream standards)
No coffee because it's too stressing for me
Lots of meat (this might not be ideal, Ik adding some gelatin would prob be good)

I feel like my nutrition is pretty on point, maybe I need to reduce carbs and/or increase fat a bit but it's close to ideal for me at this point. I was actually hoping for more supplement related advice in terms of which of haidut's products, herbs, supplements, etc. might be able to help me best increase my satiety levels in a healthy way. There are so many things out there but I only have $100 to spend rn.
 

Dino D

Member
Joined
Nov 14, 2017
Messages
365
Yup, I've searched this forum for hours on end looking for answers and found all of those debated back and forth to no end. I guess each of us just have to experiment and see what works best for us.

Personally where I'm at rn is:
Starch (only rice, no gluten)
Low fat, but not super low
Very high protein (since it's the only thing that can really satisfy me)
Moderately low sugar in the form of fruit, oatmeal, and rice only, no juice or added sugar except a little in my oatmeal (I think I'm probably moderately low by most people's standards on here but moderate by more mainstream standards)
No coffee because it's too stressing for me
Lots of meat (this might not be ideal, Ik adding some gelatin would prob be good)

I feel like my nutrition is pretty on point, maybe I need to reduce carbs and/or increase fat a bit but it's close to ideal for me at this point. I was actually hoping for more supplement related advice in terms of which of haidut's products, herbs, supplements, etc. might be able to help me best increase my satiety levels in a healthy way. There are so many things out there but I only have $100 to spend rn.
1. B complex
2. Vitamin C
3. Maybe magnesium
4. Bcaa

That would be my pick, and you can get all of it on that budget
 

tara

Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2014
Messages
10,368
Personally where I'm at rn is:
Starch (only rice, no gluten)
Low fat, but not super low
Very high protein (since it's the only thing that can really satisfy me)
Moderately low sugar in the form of fruit, oatmeal, and rice only, no juice or added sugar except a little in my oatmeal (I think I'm probably moderately low by most people's standards on here but moderate by more mainstream standards)
No coffee because it's too stressing for me
Lots of meat (this might not be ideal, Ik adding some gelatin would prob be good)
Have you run this through cronometer or similar to see roughly what nutrition you are getting, and whether there are obvious gaps? (Ignore their calorie advice.)

AIUI, both carbs and protein stimulate insulin release, which is intended to help shuttle amino acids and glucose into cells for building and burning.
In general, eating lots of protein will stimulate high insulin. If you don't have much carbs with the protein, this can get unbalanced. My hunch would be to gradually try to shift this and see if it works.
but I still will wake up after 6 hours often feeling exhausted but hungry, shaky, and stressed. It feels like high cortisol to me, not necessarily adrenaline because it does not seem to resemble hypoglycemia so much as depleted glycogen stores and my body struggling to switch over to burning fat.
Lack of sufficient food the previous day/supper is the most likely think to either keep me awake in the evening when I'm trying to sleep, wake me up too early. When I was waking up in the night, I found quite small carby snack by the bed would often help me get back to sleep within minutes, as compared with lying awake for a couple of hours.

Yes, now that I think about it, I was 100% under eating for just around a year before the weight gain started. It's all because I was so lazy about cooking for the first time after going off the meal plan on college. I also was trying to save money on groceries so I could buy more nootropics and supplements which are my true life and love. I was prob undereating carbs most of all because I was eating a decent amount of protein most of the time but still wouldn't feel satisfied after that sometimes and I would get hypoglycemic routinely in the late afternoon at work last summer

It was stupid af in retrospect to try to save time and money on food because now I have to spend far more time and money on cooking food and supplements to reverse all the damage I caused by undereating and then overeating to compensate. I've never exercised that much, I really hate it and it's not really that important for weight loss tho I do know it's pretty good for insulin resistance. And yeah, a lot of people have been recommending b vitamins to me, prob will get those soon.
I don't know that there is a cheap and easy way around the fact that preparing food and eating take some time and effort. But it's better if eating is enjoyable. Quite apart from the social aspects (which are also important), enjoying the taste of food sets the body up to be able to digest it better.

I could be wrong, but I'm wondering if part of the issue here is that you haven't learnt to cook? How about looking at cook books and recipes online and learning to make some dishes? If you want to eat chicken, look up chicken soups or stews. Any other foods you want to include, you can search for recipes with those ingredients, and then get ideas about what else you can combine with them. Most recipes can be modified some what if you've got an idea of the basics of how they work.

I'd encourage you to take some time to figure you recipes you can make and enjoy eating. Incorporate as wide a range of veges as you can find, and see which ones work for you. Even without going for high carbs, you can make salads and sauces to accompany your meat, using veges, vinegar, herbs, etc, with a little coconut or olive oil if you want.

Supplements are not supposed to replace food, even though they are sometimes useful to fill the odd gap, or for special needs.
 

Similar threads

Back
Top Bottom