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In Defense of Starch - TCM and eating many cold/damp foods (fruit/milk) seems to be anti-metabolic ?

K

Kayaker

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I think in general they want a maximally neotenous while chiseled mature look- look at most male celebrities- leaning in preference towards neotenous over chiseled when young and then towards chiseled as they get older.
That's because their fertility goes down. Progesterone makes women attracted to lean, intelligent prettyboys, and estrogen makes women attracted to buff, provider-type men.
 

mamakitty

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I think in general they want a maximally neotenous while chiseled mature look- look at most male celebrities- leaning in preference towards neotenous over chiseled when young and then towards chiseled as they get older.
It’s true about celebrities, but we are discounting genes in such cases.
Also, I saw some old movies trailers and noticed Brad Pitt, for example, always had a chiseled masculine look even when he was young. Whereas, Justin beiber not so much. I also came across this very hot male model for davidoff I think. He was also chiseled and masculine even in his youth, it seems.
 

mamakitty

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That's because their fertility goes down. Progesterone makes women attracted to lean, intelligent prettyboys, and estrogen makes women attracted to buff, provider-type men.
Is that true? I have heard of science supporting maybe the opposite? They say women on the pill go for weakish beta types. But when they come off the pill, they prefer strong willed men with a good jaw. Data apparently showed the same during ovulation. In ovulation for sure the oestrogen is probably higher, but I think the pill makes women oestrogen dominant? So, it seems it’s maybe not as conclusive? I’m open to more data either way.

Btw, when i was talking about most women preferring masculine men, I was in no way talking about buff gymbros. I was talking about more of a mature androgen look as opposed to a baby face. Many intelligent lean men fall into that category and many women, including myself, are attracted to intelligence. Some like ectomorphs and some, like me, like mesomorphs. Also, in the current era, it’s the intelligent men that can actually provide, not really the hurr durr muscle man types.
 
K

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Is that true? I have heard of science supporting maybe the opposite? They say women on the pill go for weakish beta types. But when they come off the pill, they prefer strong willed men with a good jaw. Data apparently showed the same during ovulation. In ovulation for sure the oestrogen is probably higher, but I think the pill makes women oestrogen dominant? So, it seems it’s maybe not as conclusive? I’m open to more data either way.
By fertility, I mean high progesterone. It's the main hormone for fertility in women.


Also, testosterone makes women attracted to masculine men, and women have higher testosterone during ovulation.


With age, both progesterone and testosterone go down.
Btw, when i was talking about most women preferring masculine men, I was in no way talking about buff gymbros. I was talking about more of a mature androgen look as opposed to a baby face. Many intelligent lean men fall into that category and many women, including myself, are attracted to intelligence. Some like ectomorphs and some, like me, like mesomorphs. Also, in the current era, it’s the intelligent men that can actually provide, not really the hurr durr muscle man types.
Gymbro implies they build muscle in the gym, and ecto, meso, and endo men all do that. It requires a lot of success for men to become muscular enough to be "too muscular" for most women, and that often requires steroid use.

The way I see it, healthy ecto means more intelligence, healthy endo means greater stress resistance, healthy meso means more boldness. Mesomorphs indeed don't make good providers in the system and they have a higher rate of delinquency.


However, I'm sure they are more likely to fight against tyranny than ectomorphs, who are more likely to have a stable job and enjoy the stability of authoritarianism, and be too skittish to fight back.
 

mamakitty

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By fertility, I mean high progesterone. It's the main hormone for fertility in women.


Also, testosterone makes women attracted to masculine men, and women have higher testosterone during ovulation.


With age, both progesterone and testosterone go down.

Gymbro implies they build muscle in the gym, and ecto, meso, and endo men all do that. It requires a lot of success for men to become muscular enough to be "too muscular" for most women, and that often requires steroid use.

The way I see it, healthy ecto means more intelligence, healthy endo means greater stress resistance, healthy meso means more boldness. Mesomorphs indeed don't make good providers in the system and they have a higher rate of delinquency.


However, I'm sure they are more likely to fight against tyranny than ectomorphs, who are more likely to have a stable job and enjoy the stability of authoritarianism, and be too skittish to fight back.
I’m not sure if the links are disproving what I said regarding women not being attracted to baby faced men. Teenage girls might be, but are they the most fertile at 13-17? I don’t know, I have previously seen data saying they are not. I haven’t read all the links you provided yet, so I’m not necessarily disagreeing with you.

I think I got my morphs wrong. My husband is broad chested and strong bulky, could be more muscular but he doesn’t work out at all now. He is also an actual maths genius (officially identified). I’m equally attracted to his intelligence as I’m to his jaw lol
Anyway, the point was in the current society an intelligent stable individual is more likely to provide rather than brawny men. There are plenty of warrior philosophers around. The thing in common is they don’t have a soft childlike physique or a baby face. Maybe there are some though, who knows, I’m just sharing my observations.
 
K

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I’m not sure if the links are disproving what I said regarding women not being attracted to baby faced men. Teenage girls might be, but are they the most fertile at 13-17? I don’t know, I have previously seen data saying they are not. I haven’t read all the links you provided yet, so I’m not necessarily disagreeing with you.
Do you have a source for that?
I think I got my morphs wrong. My husband is broad chested and strong bulky, could be more muscular but he doesn’t work out at all now. He is also an actual maths genius (officially identified). I’m equally attracted to his intelligence as I’m to his jaw lol
Spatial intelligence such as for math is more masculine than verbal intelligence as well.
Anyway, the point was in the current society an intelligent stable individual is more likely to provide rather than brawny men. There are plenty of warrior philosophers around. The thing in common is they don’t have a soft childlike physique or a baby face. Maybe there are some though, who knows, I’m just sharing my observations.
Warrior philosopher, so you're implying, a warrior ectomorph? They could have a mesomorphic side, especially since they don't have a babyface or feminine physique.

These are just generalizations, so feel free to share your observations, lol.
 

mamakitty

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Do you have a source for that?

Spatial intelligence such as for math is more masculine than verbal intelligence as well.

Warrior philosopher, so you're implying, a warrior ectomorph? They could have a mesomorphic side, especially since they don't have a babyface or feminine physique.

These are just generalizations, so feel free to share your observations, lol.
I don’t have a source on my drive, but it’s mainstream stat that younger teens have higher rates of miscarriages and even Down syndrome as compared to women in their twenties or late teens. Most cultures don’t encourage 13 year old girls to reproduce for a reason. The childbirth kills the young girls, the data on this that I read is from Africa and African Americans as well, which some can claim is confounding. However, the birth canal has not matured and the pelvis usually doesn’t widen enough till late teens for all races. The menstrual period itself doesn’t stabilise for a few years after puberty, which means ovulation is not regular or strong. Again, I don’t have sauce on hand but it is something google doesn’t hide. As a previous 13 year old girl myself, I can vouch for at least some of that lol

Re maths; yes indeed, spatial intelligence is quite masculine and probably why I’m quite attracted to my husband whose verbal intelligence is not great tbh hahaha.

By warrior philosophers, I meant masculine people who are also very intelligent and can stand up for themselves. They may or may not be ectomorph. May or may not be mesomorph. I know some ectomorphs and they don’t have a baby face or feminine physique, they are just very lean and almost lanky but not feminine. Just my observations, once again.
 
K

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I don’t have a source on my drive, but it’s mainstream stat that younger teens have higher rates of miscarriages and even Down syndrome as compared to women in their twenties or late teens. Most cultures don’t encourage 13 year old girls to reproduce for a reason. The childbirth kills the young girls, the data on this that I read is from Africa and African Americans as well, which some can claim is confounding. However, the birth canal has not matured and the pelvis usually doesn’t widen enough till late teens for all races. The menstrual period itself doesn’t stabilise for a few years after puberty, which means ovulation is not regular or strong. Again, I don’t have sauce on hand but it is something google doesn’t hide. As a previous 13 year old girl myself, I can vouch for at least some of that lol
I was referring to fertility as likelihood of pregnancy, rather than ability to bear a child. However, ovulation not being regular or strong in the early years after puberty is relevant to this question. Is this claim based on your anecdotal experience of being a 13 year old girl in the past or on a double-blind peer-reviewed scientific study? :smug

Since testosterone increases during ovulation, maybe young girls go for less masculine boys because they haven't strongly ovulated yet.
Re maths; yes indeed, spatial intelligence is quite masculine and probably why I’m quite attracted to my husband whose verbal intelligence is not great tbh hahaha.
Says the person who says "Re maths". Lol.
By warrior philosophers, I meant masculine people who are also very intelligent and can stand up for themselves. They may or may not be ectomorph. May or may not be mesomorph. I know some ectomorphs and they don’t have a baby face or feminine physique, they are just very lean and almost lanky but not feminine. Just my observations, once again.
This is all very complicated indeed.
 

mamakitty

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Is this claim based on your anecdotal experience of being a 13 year old girl in the past or on a double-blind peer-reviewed scientific study? :smug
It’s the statistics I have seen before from some medical sources. Not sure if it was a double blind peer reviewed study tho.
Says the person who says "Re maths". Lol.
bro, my verbal skills are impeccable ?
This is all very complicated indeed.
Indeed!
 

Waynish

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That's because their fertility goes down. Progesterone makes women attracted to lean, intelligent prettyboys, and estrogen makes women attracted to buff, provider-type men.
Studies show that women taking synthetic estrogen are attracted to less masculine men. I don't think the rest of your duality has anything to do with reality. Providing is intelligent, being pretty as a boy is perverse, and being lean is not opposed to being buff (but you put them as opposites). Anyway, this mental fabricationism is not helping you all figure this out. Go back to experience. Nice to see some first hand accounts of experience in this thread - trying things and knowing what the effects are first hand.
 
K

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Studies show that women taking synthetic estrogen are attracted to less masculine men.
It isn't because estrogen itself causes attraction to less masculine men, or reduces attraction to masculine men, but because estrogen reduces and inhibits testosterone. During ovulation, both testosterone and estrogen are high, and women are more attracted to masculine men.
I don't think the rest of your duality has anything to do with reality. Providing is intelligent,
Women already have intelligence and the ability to work. Providing is 'providing' what they generally lack, and it's more likely to be physical ability and abilities like fixing and building things than money.
being pretty as a boy is perverse,
What do you mean by that?
and being lean is not opposed to being buff (but you put them as opposites).
By buff, I meant "massive", or high fat and high muscle, rather than just high muscle.
 

Vins7

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Drinking 4 pints of hot water every day and only eating warm, cooked meals.
Applying physical heat to the liver and gallbladder area (e.g with a hot water bottle or heat pack).
Resting after meals.
Avoiding cold food, cold water, drinks or juices.
Avoiding supplements, especially oral fat-solubles.
Taking thyroid might have also played a role.
Did you add salt or any mineral supplements to that amount of water?
 

Korven

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Thank you so much, I’m going to start this today! Do you avoid news all the time or just after meals to digest? It’s really hard to avoid all the time, even this forum has a lot of current events articles that enrage me.

Also, I was wondering if the hot water and bitters could dissolve galllstones? My mother has them and was planning to get surgery upon her doctor’s advice, I have stopped her for now.

My aim is to never watch ANY news or social media, but truthfully I keep getting sucked back in reading about the Covid-19/vaccine totalitarian stuff. Recently I realized I was wasting way too much time and energy caring about all of that, and getting stressed out about things beyond my control/the present moment. Now I'm at a point where I trust God has a greater plan for all of us (he holds the entire world in his hands). Maybe all of this will lead to a much-needed change in society.

I think it could be worth a try! For me hot water drinking has been way more effective for fixing cholestasis vs stuff like TUDCA. For gallbladder and liver issues I'd also make sure to get some quality animal protein, like eggs and red meat, every day for the nutrients.

Did you add salt or any mineral supplements to that amount of water?

Just plain hot water. In my experience hot water on its own improves absorption and retention of minerals! If you want though you could add some salt.
 

mamakitty

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Now I'm at a point where I trust God has a greater plan for all of us (he holds the entire world in his hands). Maybe all of this will lead to a much-needed change in society.
Good point! I’m trying to remind myself of this most days.
For me hot water drinking has been way more effective for fixing cholestasis vs stuff like TUDCA. For gallbladder and liver issues I'd also make sure to get some quality animal protein, like eggs and red meat, every day for the nutrients.
Thank you! I will tell my mother this, hope she listens!
 

Sergey

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Correct. Being out of balance is anti-metabolic even more than most Peat recommendations. And in the modern world so many people have excessive dampness. This causes digestive problems. Where does nastiness grow in one's house or temple? Where it is dark & damp! I've worked in clinics before and saw the dampness being pushed out of many sickly people - and it is obvious. Think of the stereotypical unhealthy person exercising... They're all gooey and it is a nasty kind of sweat. A well cooked potato with butter and meat is anti-damp - and people who are damp will all get way warmer after eating that vs eating ice cream. I've never actually seen an exception to that in real life and I can't imagine how & why Peat's clinical experience is so different from mine.

"I rarely ever see this topic discussed in RP and I do see many people on the forum have trouble having a lifestyle tolerating mainly liquid/damp food (i.e. focusing on mainly only fruit/dairy)" -- I've been mentioning it on this forum for years but it always gets ignored.

Even in this very thread everyone is talking about "starch" and being overly reductive in their theorizing... Which has nothing to do with "TCM." It isn't about whether it is "starch" or "not starch" - that is a new classification and is separate from the "damp or not" classification. Not to mention the classification of other substances in TCM that increase the ability for the spleen/pancreas (same thing in TCM) to function.
I was going to post something like "TCM is not eating starch or not eating starch; and in general, TCM is not compatible with most "diets" described on this forum"
And then I saw your post which said it all. :cheers
 

Korven

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Good point! I’m trying to remind myself of this most days.

Thank you! I will tell my mother this, hope she listens!

You're welcome! :xmas Hope your mom gets better and that she can avoid gallbladder surgery... always risky with medical procedures.
 

Vileplume

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the best i have felt in my entire life all aspect wise was after ingurgiting kilos of fruits,up to 7kilos,during the winter,even the times it made my extremities cold,i felt fantastic,and the cold extremities went away with 100to200grammes of meat/liver/kidneys.seasons do not necessary doom you to not eat high liquid food.actually it is a cold winter in France,i have discovered coconut water recently an iam drinking from 3 to 6of these a day with honey and some meat,its incredible how good i feel.i go out alot with thin clothes and i dont suffer the fresh weather even when its arround 8degrees with no sun
What are your favorite, ripest fruits during the winter?
 

Nomane Euger

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What are your favorite, ripest fruits during the winter?
any perfectly riped oranges,best variety i have tryed are semi blood tarroco oranges,well riped cherimoya,thats he lonely very good fruits i have experienced during the winter.I avoid fruits high in certains colorfull pigments even the semi blood tarroco oranges i dont pick the ones with purple flesh,i pick the ones tht are mostly orange.in term of fruits nothing i have experienced come close to perfectly riped oranges,second best is coconut water from fresh coconut,i still eat some fruits because there is something specific to it that you wont get if you only drink coconut water
 

Vileplume

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any perfectly riped oranges,best variety i have tryed are semi blood tarroco oranges,well riped cherimoya,thats he lonely very good fruits i have experienced during the winter.I avoid fruits high in certains colorfull pigments even the semi blood tarroco oranges i dont pick the ones with purple flesh,i pick the ones tht are mostly orange.in term of fruits nothing i have experienced come close to perfectly riped oranges,second best is coconut water from fresh coconut,i still eat some fruits because there is something specific to it that you wont get if you only drink coconut water
Thanks for this info! And Merry Christmas.
 

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