Implementing Low-fat Diet And Needing Advice

[DanielleB]

Some background:

I discovered Peat and his practices in my search to right some extreme dietary practices I had taken on when I begin to suddenly put on some weight and experience cold hands and feet and digestion issues about 3 years ago. I have always been slim, 120-125 lbs as a 5'6" female. I never had any food allergies but suddenly developed digestive issues and constipation and had intolerances with dairy and gluten. I then went overboard in trying to lose weight with chronic exercising, low calorie diets, a stint of raw veganism/fruitarianism and still haven't been able to shift the weight successfully. I suspect a low thyroid and stress being factors that have impeded results. I am currently between 145-150 lbs and my symptoms are as follows---

*Difficulty losing weight
*Depression
*Varicose veins
*Cellulite
*Fewer BM's
*Gluten and dairy intolerance
*Delayed recovery from exercise
*hair loss/thinning

I had some labs done recently and while I did not get my T3 and T4, reverse T3 and antibodies, I did get my TSH and a few others which I will post here:

TSH: 0.10
Sodium:141
Potassium:5.0
CO2:23
Glucose:75
Calcium: 9.7
Cholesterol:191

Although I don't have the full picture from the labs as to what is up with the thyroid , it's obviously low so why am I having hypothyroid symptoms? Since eating the Peat way for 1.5 months, my temps have been up to 97.7-98.0 upon waking and hit 98.6 on most days before noon although they still can be 98.4 in between meals.

I have recently been taking 81 mg of aspirin every other day or so, 800mg of Vitamin E, some supplemental magnesium and have, within the past 1.5 weeks, been eating very low fat. Here is what my daily diet looks like:

1.5L Fairlife fat free milk (lactose free) w/1 tbsp hone and 1 tsp salt
1 L orange juice
Fage 0% fat free yogurt or a 4 oz cod fillet
1 cup of grapes
2-3 dates
2-3 cups of coffee with 1 tsp of sugar and some non-fat milk
carrot salad with 1 tsp of coconut oil
20 pieces of shrimp with 1 tsp coconut oil
2 altufa mangos
2-3 tablespoons of Great lakes hydrolyzed collagen

Total calories are between 1800-2070
Macros: protein 126.8g, carbs 372.3, fat 4.8 g not counting coconut oil because it stimulates metabolism
Some things I have noticed is that I will seem to have days where I am full of energy and temps are pretty consistent and then some days where I am very tired throughout the day and temps are low. Would the "bad days" correlate with PUFA release? I should mention I am also doing 45 minutes of medium-intensity weight lifting 5x a week since starting the low-fat experiment and noticed that after doing a particularly intense weight day like, say legs, the day after is when I will experience lethargy and lower temps. I try to walk outside to be in the sunshine for at least 15-20 minutes daily as well.

I am wanting to lose weight but also increase metabolism and I'm thinking fat free will help me with that but I am feeling like I should maybe only weight train 3x a week instead of 5 to mitigate stress and improve recovery but it seems ironic that activity is supposed to help with metabolism yet in my experience, it seems to have the opposite effect, at least with training 5x a week. I should mention I have a mostly sedentary job as well.

Any tips or insight would be much appreciated. I haven't noticed much effect from the low-fat experiment as of yet, it's only been 1.5 weeks. Just wondering why I seem to have lower energy days and if it is corresponding with the heavier work outs, should I just stick to lower calories on the days I don't work out because from others in the forum who have tried the VLF diet, they advocate consuming close to your caloric recommendation and even over and that you can still lose weight. I fill satiated at the amount I am consuming now and don't feel the need to overload the carbs but I am open to critique.

 

[Wagner83]

It's not ironic at all, too muvh exercise is terrible for health, particularly when the body is trying to recover. You could keep (increase?) the walking and lessen the frequency of the more intense training, and avoid going overboard.

 

[DanielleB]

It's not ironic at all, too muvh exercise is terrible for health, particularly when the body is trying to recover. You could keep (increase?) the walking and lessen the frequency of the more intense training, and avoid going overboard.

I appreciate the reply. I guess I say "ironic" because there have been several threads that have mentioned the benefit of weight lifting to increase BMR. I do feel the exercise should be toned down a bit. I did a 45 minute leg day work out yesterday and my temps and energy have suffered for it today significantly.

Any thoughts to the TSH reading low?

 

[jitsmonkey]

My pulse and temps are always much better on VLF
My brain is sharper and my moods much less volatile
About 1x per week I will have a high fat meal for social purposes and I will supplement my fat soluble vitamins at that meal
this is the only method in 40+ years that I've lost weight on.
NONE of this may be true for you.

As far as weights, this IS true for you.
you could easily gain strength doing nothing more than singles.
ie. Squat... 3 reps very light, increase weight on bar x amount do 1 rep and rest
increase again x amount 1 rep and rest
repeat this to where set 5 is an attempt at your 1 rep max
low stress, make you strong like bull, done in 15 min or less.
Even if you NEVER EVER approach your 1 rep max on a given day for set 5 you'll still gain regardless
ZERO reason for "leg day" or any other workout to ruin you.

 

[DanielleB]

My pulse and temps are always much better on VLF
My brain is sharper and my moods much less volatile
About 1x per week I will have a high fat meal for social purposes and I will supplement my fat soluble vitamins at that meal
this is the only method in 40+ years that I've lost weight on.
NONE of this may be true for you.

As far as weights, this IS true for you.
you could easily gain strength doing nothing more than singles.
ie. Squat... 3 reps very light, increase weight on bar x amount do 1 rep and rest
increase again x amount 1 rep and rest
repeat this to where set 5 is an attempt at your 1 rep max
low stress, make you strong like bull, done in 15 min or less.
Even if you NEVER EVER approach your 1 rep max on a given day for set 5 you'll still gain regardless
ZERO reason for "leg day" or any other workout to ruin you.

Thank you for your reply! Can I ask how long you were implementing the VLF before noticing weight loss? Can I ask what your symptoms, if any, were before you started VLF? Can I ask what your macros look like and how many calories you get on the daily? Any advice towards my daily macros being a female and all? I'm thinking of just cutting the workouts to 3x a week since everyday seems to be taking the energy at an alarming rate when I'm attempting to raise metabolism and heal other issues at the same time.

 

[jitsmonkey]

sure.
I've had success all my adult life with VLF
and get in trouble when I've strayed. (and I've strayed A LOT ;-)
3 years ago I was disabled, suicidal, exhausted, couldn't get out of bed, rarely left the house.
Weight loss on VLF for me is within a few days of returning it begins.
My suggestion is stop thinking of workouts being for metabolic/weight benefit
Workouts from a health perspective are a neurologic/brain activity that's the only reason to do them from a purely health perspective.
There is no reason for workouts to harm/hurt/distress you.
You could lose plenty of weight on VLF and walking everyday with ZERO workouts.
I'm not saying don't workout, I workout everyday.
And sometimes just because its fun I go apeshit but that's rare and just
like with any of the other dumb excessively stressful things I do it requires
some additional TLC.
the benefits are important provided they're being done with an eye towards their actual purpose.
You don't need a "leg day" or any "day" that makes you suffer, its just not necessary to get the benefits
for a normal mortal. Its just that its not sexy or impressive when you tell your friends
My leg day lasted 7 minutes today. Much sexier to post a selfie of you lying on the floor in a puddle
of your own sweat (or at least that's what the culture says).

I think as far as macros it begins with your pulse, temp, mood
establish a baseline and work from there. If you're in a hurry it will take 10x as long as if you're not.

When I go VLF I just stop eating foods that have fat and end up around 5% incidental fat for the day.
AGAIN I have done this on and off for YEARS, I have an ENORMOUS amount of personal data to draw from
so this is only what I have seen work for me. You are a female, you have a different makeup, history, etc....
you may need 10 or 15 or 20% I have no idea. My point is it begins with a baseline and you just work from there
you'll get your answers to "how much is too much, how much is not enough" with ease.
Are my pulse, temp and mood good? y/n
am I losing weight? y/n
those aren't the be all end all obviously but on a day to day week to week month to month basis they are in fact the be all end all.

 

[DanielleB]

sure.
I've had success all my adult life with VLF
and get in trouble when I've strayed. (and I've strayed A LOT ;-)
3 years ago I was disabled, suicidal, exhausted, couldn't get out of bed, rarely left the house.
Weight loss on VLF for me is within a few days of returning it begins.
My suggestion is stop thinking of workouts being for metabolic/weight benefit
Workouts from a health perspective are a neurologic/brain activity that's the only reason to do them from a purely health perspective.
There is no reason for workouts to harm/hurt/distress you.
You could lose plenty of weight on VLF and walking everyday with ZERO workouts.
I'm not saying don't workout, I workout everyday.
And sometimes just because its fun I go apeshit but that's rare and just
like with any of the other dumb excessively stressful things I do it requires
some additional TLC.
the benefits are important provided they're being done with an eye towards their actual benefits.
You don't need a "leg day" or any "day" that makes you suffer, its just not necessary to get the benefits
for a normal mortal. Its just that its not sexy or impressive when you tell your friends
My leg day lasted 7 minutes today. Much sexier to post a selfie of you lying on the floor in a puddle
of your own sweat (or at least that's what the culture says).

I think as far as macros it begins with your pulse, temp, mood
establish a baseline and work from there. If you're in a hurry it will take 10x as long as if you're not.

When I go VLF I just stop eating foods that have fat and end up around 5% incidental fat for the day.
AGAIN I have done this on and off for YEARS, I have an ENORMOUS amount of personal data to draw from
so this is only what I have seen work for me. You are a female, you have a different makeup, history, etc....
you may need 10 or 15 or 20% I have no idea. My point is it begins with a baseline and you just work from there
you'll get your answers to "how much is too much, how much is not enough" with ease.
Are my pulse, temp and mood good? y/n
am I losing weight? y/n
those aren't the be all end all obviously but on a day to day week to week month to month basis they are in fact the be all end all.

That was very helpful advice, of which I am appreciative. I have noticed looking a bit slimmer since starting but I'm not a huge fan of the scale so I haven't checked the actual weight, I go more by looks and snugness of clothes. I've noticed higher temps and more energy, generally speaking.

How can I accurately gauge macros based on my temps and pulse? Any suggestions are more than welcome! Do you think that coconut oil can be used sparingly but not count towards total daily fat since Peat says it's pro-thyroid and hypermetabolic? I'm wondering if I'm not seeing noticeable weight loss since my calories are still pretty high although I am cutting fat which makes me wonder if I need to drop them.

Weight lifting has always been a part of my life, especially before the weight issues begin. However, nowadays, I feel like they create a stress response and recovery is twice as long so i'm thinking of cutting down the days per week that I do them and/or just sticking to the walking for a while. I seem to have higher temps and more energy and digestion is better on the days I don't work out.

Do you think going VLF will have an impact on hair regrowth? Or could it possibly exacerbate it?

 

[jitsmonkey]

you track your pulse/temps everyday a few times a day (waking, post breakfast and possibly pre / post lunch)
you track your macros with cronometer
write everything down you'll easily see the correlations over time.
Same for coconut oil, gather your data without coconut oil, gather it with and voila you have your answer. ;-)
The issue with weights is not the weights the issue is the intensity, madness and off purposeness of the workout.
You could do the singles workout I mentioned and walk out of the gym and you'd not be broken nor stressed nor exhausted
BUT you'd have gotten your work in. Taking some time off would be fine I'm sure, I'm just saying the thing is not the thing
its how you use the thing ;-)

I have no idea about the hair growth thing.
The better your temps,pulse, mood puts the odds in your favor.
but a direct correlation I have no idea.

 

[tca300]

The role of gallbladder emptying in gallstone formation during diet-induced rapid weight loss. - PubMed - NCBI

 

[jitsmonkey]

The role of gallbladder emptying in gallstone formation during diet-induced rapid weight loss. - PubMed - NCBI

those people are eating 500-1000cals a day. definitely not recommended

 

[Wagner83]

The role of gallbladder emptying in gallstone formation during diet-induced rapid weight loss. - PubMed - NCBI

Thanks for the link. It's a bit odd that they compared a 500 kcal diet to double the amount, but the emptying of gallbladder/fat connection has been discussed before. I wonder if all fats are created equal in this regard, olive oil has been (perhaps wrongly) associated with increased bile flow me thinks (liver flush..).

 

[tca300]

those people are eating 500-1000cals a day. definitely not recommended

How does that negate that ultra low fat during fat loss can cause gallstones?

 

[tca300]

Thanks for the link. It's a bit odd that they compared a 500 kcal diet to double the amount, but the emptying of gallbladder/fat connection has been discussed before. I wonder if all fats are created equal in this regard, olive oil has been (perhaps wrongly) associated with increased bile flow me thinks (liver flush..).

I dont think shorter chain fats stimulate bile flow, so fats from beef, dairy, eggs, and olive oil would be preferable to coconut, which would have to be consumed in much higher qualities to stimulate equal bile flow.

 

[Wagner83]

I dont think shorter chain fats stimulate bile flow, so fats from beef, dairy, eggs, and olive oil would be preferable to coconut, which would have to be consumed in much higher qualities to stimulate equal bile flow.

Perhaps they are metabolized too fast. Since you did both ultra low fat and then added CO oil did you end up with such issues? I think I read westside has reported gallbladder pain with a higher fat intake. An other member had reported that butter helped him with bm while CO didn't at all.

 

[DanielleB]

you track your pulse/temps everyday a few times a day (waking, post breakfast and possibly pre / post lunch)
you track your macros with cronometer
write everything down you'll easily see the correlations over time.
Same for coconut oil, gather your data without coconut oil, gather it with and voila you have your answer. ;-)
The issue with weights is not the weights the issue is the intensity, madness and off purposeness of the workout.
You could do the singles workout I mentioned and walk out of the gym and you'd not be broken nor stressed nor exhausted
BUT you'd have gotten your work in. Taking some time off would be fine I'm sure, I'm just saying the thing is not the thing
its how you use the thing ;-)

I have no idea about the hair growth thing.
The better your temps,pulse, mood puts the odds in your favor.
but a direct correlation I have no idea.

Wonderful advice! So hypothetically, if temps remain high while doing, say 1700 calories, would that indicate I should stay at that intake or that I should increase it? Or just dictate by hunger signals?

 

[DanielleB]

The role of gallbladder emptying in gallstone formation during diet-induced rapid weight loss. - PubMed - NCBI

An interesting study but I would think the caloric intake would play a factor causing the gallstone formation in the presence of low fat intake. From what I have gathered here, if the liver has adequate glucose from high carbs, then this won't occur. But a low calorie diet is problematic from the start so I'm not sure that much can be gathered from a study that implemented such a chronically low calorie intake to begin with.

I'm glad you commented though as I had read a few of your own threads regarding implementing low-fat diet. Can you tell me how that worked out for you overall? Pros and cons?

 

[jitsmonkey]

How does that negate that ultra low fat during fat loss can cause gallstones?

I think the fact that they are obese, have high caloric and nutritional requirements and you now deprive them of fuel
is a far bigger factor than the lack of fat. In the study setup it would seem that fuel and nutritional shortfalls set the table for gallstones and other issues.
I just don't see a causative relationship here, they get too many things wrong all at once. There may in fact be a relationship but there are far too many things being done wrong from the get go to be fingering fat levels as the source of the trouble.

 

[jitsmonkey]

Wonderful advice! So hypothetically, if temps remain high while doing, say 1700 calories, would that indicate I should stay at that intake or that I should increase it? Or just dictate by hunger signals?

Not intending to be flippant...

It means you would test higher cals and see what happens
if you were doing well on 1700 and went to 1900 you wouldn't gain 30 pounds instantly
you'd see if that improved things, worsened or neither.
The most valuable thing I've learned from Ray is take nobody's advice
implement what seems intelligent to you and measure it against your metrics
then act accordingly.

 

[DanielleB]

Not intending to be flippant...

It means you would test higher cals and see what happens
if you were doing well on 1700 and went to 1900 you wouldn't gain 30 pounds instantly
you'd see if that improved things, worsened or neither.
The most valuable thing I've learned from Ray is take nobody's advice
implement what seems intelligent to you and measure it against your metrics
then act accordingly.

Well said! thank you :)

 

[danishispsychic]

WIth a TSH like that I doubt you are hypo- sounds more like you are low in progesterone- to me it would help to see your cortisol and hormone levels in general. My guess is low progesterone, estro dominance , and you might research fats and their effects on female hormones. As for the 20 shrimp you are eating = if you have hashimotos at all.... then that is too much iodine, IMO. I would really re think it in terms of : female hormone balance /perimenopause.... iodine overload possibly making your possible hashimotos worse, and the very low fat might have worked for you before when your hormones were different but now it might actually be hindering your balance. Alsoyou might want to test that TSH a lot to see if it bounces around a bit. Your TSH to me seems almost hyperthyroid.