IME oversleeping always causes anhedonia

[Androsclerosis]

Even with Progesterone + caffeine + aspirin combo, the boringness of life is still there, and this happens with only 9 hours of sleep a day. Or if you sleep 7 hours, wake up and sleep another 30 mins, you also get anhedonia. Even if the sleep quality is very high.

 What are your experiences with oversleeping? Do you have a strategy to overcome the anhedonia?

 

[TheSir]

At what point will it be oversleeping? Is it possible not to wake up until you have overslept? Are you sure shorter sleep is not just fueling you through stress metabolism, and that with more sleep you have neither sufficient stress hormones nor energy production to make you feel good?

 

[Korven]

I also feel bad after oversleeping, it just puts me in a horrible mood.

I can't take cyproheptadine anymore because I sleep for 10-11 hours and wake up angry.

 

[miquelangeles]

Same experience. It messes with the circadian/hormonal rhythms. Sleep itself is a zeitgeber.

 

[TheSir]

I can't take cyproheptadine anymore because I sleep for 10-11 hours and wake up angry.

Do you get similar results with supplemental melatonin?

 

[Androsclerosis]

At what point will it be oversleeping? Is it possible not to wake up until you have overslept? Are you sure shorter sleep is not just fueling you through stress metabolism, and that with more sleep you have neither sufficient stress hormones nor energy production to make you feel good?

It is possible to not wake up until oversleeping, but not always. When I'm on progesterone oversleeping happens, so to set up alarm is a must, mostly because cortisol production is blocked.
I am usually very calm during the day and I fall asleep in less than 2 mins.
When I oversleep sometimes I feel more inflammation in the brain and I have to take some aspirin to counteract it.
If I would be living on stress hormones, after eating I should become sedated which is not the case. During the winter I felt more sedated and lots of times I didn't need an alarm to wake up, so in that case it applies.

 

[ThinPicking]

Even with Progesterone + caffeine + aspirin combo, the boringness of life is still there, and this happens with only 9 hours of sleep a day. Or if you sleep 7 hours, wake up and sleep another 30 mins, you also get anhedonia. Even if the sleep quality is very high.

 What are your experiences with oversleeping? Do you have a strategy to overcome the anhedonia?

?

I also struggle to resist a kind of sleep inertia when I don't go to sleep excited/optimistic for some novelty in tomorrow. I'm sure there's dietary/physiological factors but I think some positive anticipation trumps it.

 

[TheSir]

It is possible to not wake up until oversleeping, but not always. When I'm on progesterone oversleeping happens, so to set up alarm is a must, mostly because cortisol production is blocked.
I am usually very calm during the day and I fall asleep in less than 2 mins.
When I oversleep sometimes I feel more inflammation in the brain and I have to take some aspirin to counteract it.
If I would be living on stress hormones, after eating I should become sedated which is not the case. During the winter I felt more sedated and lots of times I didn't need an alarm to wake up, so in that case it applies.

Hmh, interesting. I often sleep for as long as I feel like sleeping, and equally often it will feel like my day doesn't truly begin until the evening. In the evenings I feel creative, happy and alert. Up until that point of the day I will feel lethargic, dull and brain-fogged. I too have noticed that spontaneously waking up abnormally early can give you a better start for the day than waking up later from the middle of the deep sleep cycle.

 

[TheSir]

I also struggle to resist a kind of sleep inertia when I don't go to sleep excited/optimistic for some novelty in tomorrow.

In the evening you wll think: tomorrow I will wake up early!, then in the morning hitting the snooze will feel like the best thing you've ever done.

 

[Korven]

Do you get similar results with supplemental melatonin?

I should really keep better notes of my experiments but I remember trying melatonin and feeling bad (?) so I stopped. But I'm not sure if it was due to oversleeping like with cyproheptadine.

I think Ray peat calls melatonin the "hormone of death and darkness" or something like that LOL.

 

[TheSir]

I should really keep better notes of my experiments but I remember trying melatonin and feeling bad (?) so I stopped. But I'm not sure if it was due to oversleeping like with cyproheptadine.

I think Ray peat calls melatonin the "hormone of death and darkness" or something like that LOL.

It would be interesting if the effects were similar since their effects on serotonin are opposite to each other.

 

[StephanF]

I wake up after several hours of sleep, go to the bathroom once and then have trouble getting back to sleep. I take 2.5 mg melatonin when going to bed and depending on how long I slept before waking up at night I may take another melatonin tablet. Best if I take valerian root drops after waking up at night. It calms me down otherwise my thoughts race in my head and I can’t fall asleep.

I am considering buying another EarthPulse magnetic pulser. This has a sleep program and it really works. One of them that I had I gave to a family whose mother went into a coma, since it got my elder brother out of a coma but he later died. Another pulser I gave to a young woman, we met her at the hotel we were staying when we visited my elder brother, she had brain injury from a bicycle accident and was on rehab. She said that for the first time she was able to sleep again!

The pulser produces magnetic pulses if frequencies that are found during the various sleep phases. The magnetic pulses produce microcurrents in the brain thus stimulating it. It really works.

 

[Vajra]

?

I also struggle to resist a kind of sleep inertia when I don't go to sleep excited/optimistic for some novelty in tomorrow. I'm sure there's dietary/physiological factors but I think some positive anticipation trumps it.

This is what solved it for me. The longer it is to fall asleep, the shorter it will be to wake up. If I wait until I feel groggy and really tired, I'll want to sleep 9+ hours instead of 7.5-8.5 or so (i.e. 1 less sleep cycle). Whereas if I feel wired and ideas/memories are coming and going in my mind and I just decide to go to bed anyways, I wake up much more quickly/easily and dream more.
Inertia is legit, and it's obvious in retrospect, really. Don't let the nighttime prolactin and so on tire you out.

 

[Lokzo]

I can absolutely relate to this.
In fact, sometimes when I sleep only 5 hours, I feel hypomanic and euphoric the next day.

 

[CLASH]

This has been my experience as well.

Another experience that aligns with this is, if I wake up early in the morning, and/ or I wake up and stay up instead of going back to sleep after hitting snooze, I am able to easily fall asleep that next night. However if I wake up later in the morning, and/ or I hit snooze, that next night I have a much harder time getting to sleep.

The only problem is, waking up early like that absolutely sucks for about 10-20 minutes. I'd rather nothing in the world than to go back to sleep.

 

[Quelsatron]

I can absolutely relate to this.
In fact, sometimes when I sleep only 5 hours, I feel hypomanic and euphoric the next day.

undersleeping is a known antidepressant for some reason, i'm too lazy to give sources but you should be able to find things even on this forum

 

[Nomane Euger]

Even with Progesterone + caffeine + aspirin combo, the boringness of life is still there, and this happens with only 9 hours of sleep a day. Or if you sleep 7 hours, wake up and sleep another 30 mins, you also get anhedonia. Even if the sleep quality is very high.

 What are your experiences with oversleeping? Do you have a strategy to overcome the anhedonia?

Hi,from my experience the 2 last hours of sleep past 6 7 hours,are the ones in which i mostly dreams,and the ones where i do get a high increase in masculine characteristics including calmness,resilience,stoicism,this high degree of stoicism reduce both the intensity of my negatives and positives feelings,and i often wake up a first time after these 6 7 hours and then if i do sleep back i get these 2 additional hours.if i do eat mostly fruits,honey and coconut water,less meat to no meat at all,no sex,no hard work out i quickly tend back to a more sensitive,more joyfull,less stoic, less masculine state,more euphoric.if i do eat mostly fruits and honey and do not have hard work out,do not experience high competivity,i do not eat meat,i dont manifest anymore the characteristics associated with masculinity,and those associated with a higher degree of serotonin,and i sleep only 6 to 7 hours and i do not dream at all,i feel and sound like a kid with the highest degree of euphoria,sensitivity.for me there is a positive association with the 2 last hours of sleeps past 6-7 hours,dreaming,manifesting masculinity,higher stoicism and less sensitivity,a lesser degree of enjoyement;it can still be solve in the coming hours after i wake up.the dreams i do get in these 2 last hours of sleep can be fantastic,flying,having sex and ejaculatings multiples times,fightings,exploration in environnements that i have never been before with abondant vegetation,with only positives feelings and no negative feelings.

 

[Androsclerosis]

Hmh, interesting. I often sleep for as long as I feel like sleeping, and equally often it will feel like my day doesn't truly begin until the evening. In the evenings I feel creative, happy and alert. Up until that point of the day I will feel lethargic, dull and brain-fogged. I too have noticed that spontaneously waking up abnormally early can give you a better start for the day than waking up later from the middle of the deep sleep cycle.

That may be a cause of oversleeping.
There are some benefits of sleep deprivation which increases dopamine and I noticed always increased awareness and verbal fluency with only 5 hours of sleep a day. I have some mild aphasia and this issue is solved with it.
Also sleeping less will make you desire more sleep, regulate your circadian rhythm, and over time it will increase the quality.
You should experiment with it, but don't eat 2 hours before bed and make sure you got your carbs during the day.

 

[Androsclerosis]

I wake up after several hours of sleep, go to the bathroom once and then have trouble getting back to sleep. I take 2.5 mg melatonin when going to bed and depending on how long I slept before waking up at night I may take another melatonin tablet. Best if I take valerian root drops after waking up at night. It calms me down otherwise my thoughts race in my head and I can’t fall asleep.

I am considering buying another EarthPulse magnetic pulser. This has a sleep program and it really works. One of them that I had I gave to a family whose mother went into a coma, since it got my elder brother out of a coma but he later died. Another pulser I gave to a young woman, we met her at the hotel we were staying when we visited my elder brother, she had brain injury from a bicycle accident and was on rehab. She said that for the first time she was able to sleep again!

The pulser produces magnetic pulses if frequencies that are found during the various sleep phases. The magnetic pulses produce microcurrents in the brain thus stimulating it. It really works.

Wouldn't be better to find a way to solve your issues naturally? Do you eat enough?

 

[miquelangeles]

The antidepressant effect of sleep deprivation can be replicated with appropriately timed bright light therapy.
Some people have a phase advance others a phase delay in circadian rhythms.