I'm Losing Hope

Manoko

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Hey everyone,

I've been browsing this forum for a while now, and listened/read about Danny Roddy's works and of course Ray Peat.
I'm a 24 year old male, and in the past I've tried many different diets and lifestyles, paleo, intermittent fasting, but I've been pretty much grains free for a while now (with very rare cheat days). I've experimented with many supplements and maybe this is what really messed me up (a lot of different minerals, as well as digestive aids).

I used to practice thai boxing at a near competitive level, three times a week, and I felt great. But lately I've had so much health problems that I can't seem to solve, that I've lost all my energy and I've been feeling hopeless.

It's been a few weeks now that I've followed strictly the advice found in this forum and the diet guidelines, for a "Peat diet".

Since a few months ago, my digestion and sleep have tanked.
At some point, I was never hungry, and even if I was, a few bites of a meal would instantaneously make me feel like I ate too much, like it was sitting in my stomach and I would have the urge to throw up if I added even one more bite. All the while, I've been severely constipated (maybe bowel movements two times a week, small hard dry lumps difficult to pass through), my stomach a bit bloated.

With this, I've been having poor sleep quality: I wake up multiple times during the night, and no matter how long I sleep, I always wake up feeling like I did not rest much, with a low level headache, the type you get when really tired (shaking my head makes the pain worse, it doesn't feel like a migraine).

On top of that, my body seems to take a really long time to heal from injuries. Even small cuts take very long to heal fully, and I've hurt my knee more than two years ago and it is still inflammed a bit and hurting during certain movements.

I've tried to correct nutrient deficiencies, my diet consists mainly of orange juice, milk, liver once a week (or non-defatted liver powder sometimes with meals), ground beef that I balance with gelatin, cheese, sugar, mussels once a week (it isn't possible in France to find canned oysters for some reason), well cooked spinach and broccoli, coffee and potatoes.
I cook with butter, and I eat the carrot a day on an empty stomach.

I also have hair loss, and it's really hard for me to bring my metabolism up most of the time.
Taking dessicated thyroid for example doesn't seem to have an effect.

I'll be honest with you, this sudden huge decline in health, at my age, has really made life not worth living to me as of late.

Anyway, thanks a lot to everyone who'll give some advice.
 
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Manoko

Manoko

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Temperature fluctuates a lot I think, but I usually feel cold at the extremities.
I'll try to find or buy a thermometer to give you accurate readings.
Edit: Found one, my temperature is 36.3°C, which is 97.34°F.

My pulse, resting, fluctuates between 60 and 70. Right now I'm at 63 pbm.
 
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RMH

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Your story sounds a lot like mine. Everyone is different and it takes time but I've had good luck recovering from paleo and warrior type diets with the following:

-Massive increase in calorie consumption. Every night before bed I'll eat 1-1.5 cups of quality vanilla ice cream (Haagen Dazs or homemade).
-Magnesium baths once a week or ionic magnesium citrate mixed in water for regularity.
-Red light either from the sun or a bulb/LED setup really helps with energy and mood levels especially during the colder months.
-Reduce stress levels by finding a hobby or something that you enjoy. I've been demolishing and rebuilding a house and just having a project and goal has been helpful.
-Low dose methylene blue (I use Haidut's Oxidal, 400mcg-800mcg a few times a week) seems to help with a lot of the stomach issues I've had for years.

I'd also recommend reading up on threads about short term antibiotic use. A lot of your issues could be endotoxin related and chronic inflammation can also sometimes benefit from a course of antibiotics.
 

jaywills

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Manoko,

Sorry to hear of your troubles. Couple of things that spring to mind:
1) you mention transitioning into a 'peat-diet' recently; but how long have you been eating potatoes/drinking milk?
2) have you began being constipated since the start of eating this way or before?
 
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Manoko

Manoko

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Your story sounds a lot like mine. Everyone is different and it takes time but I've had good luck recovering from paleo and warrior type diets with the following:

-Massive increase in calorie consumption. Every night before bed I'll eat 1-1.5 cups of quality vanilla ice cream (Haagen Dazs or homemade).
-Magnesium baths once a week or ionic magnesium citrate mixed in water for regularity.
-Red light either from the sun or a bulb/LED setup really helps with energy and mood levels especially during the colder months.
-Reduce stress levels by finding a hobby or something that you enjoy. I've been demolishing and rebuilding a house and just having a project and goal has been helpful.
-Low dose methylene blue (I use Haidut's Oxidal, 400mcg-800mcg a few times a week) seems to help with a lot of the stomach issues I've had for years.

I'd also recommend reading up on threads about short term antibiotic use. A lot of your issues could be endotoxin related and chronic inflammation can also sometimes benefit from a course of antibiotics.

Thanks for your reply.

I've been doing Oxidal topically since recently, for a bit more than a week now. (With MitoLipin too).

Sometimes it helps for an hour, and a feel a bit warmer, but sometimes it doesn't.
It's a hit or miss so far, which points me to the idea that there is something impairing my metabolism as a whole, it's not sluggish but "blocked", if it makes any sense.

I bought incandescent light bulbs recently to try it, while my halogen was still working I tried it and it helped me feel warmer and have more energy (but didn't solve my problems).

As for the bacterial problem, I took very recently two weeks of antibiotics, because I had to treat a tooth canal infection (which wasn't painful but there was a sign that the jaw bone lost mineralization, so it's imperative to clean it).
But it didn't change a thing, as far as digestion goes. I thought about this too and was excited to finally get rid of my digestive problems thanks to this, but it didn't help.

Thanks again, I'm of course open for other suggestions !
And it helps reading people having a similar situation and getting out of it.

I'll definitely try the ice cream too.

Manoko,

Sorry to hear of your troubles. Couple of things that spring to mind:
1) you mention transitioning into a 'peat-diet' recently; but how long have you been eating potatoes/drinking milk?
2) have you began being constipated since the start of eating this way or before?

1) I've been eating potatoes non-stop, since it was a part of all the diets I tried over the years.
As for milk, it's only since I've come to try a pear way of eating. I've always been cautious about "inflammatory foods", as I read about A1 milk being a probable cause for inflammation in the body. I'm not sure if it's true or not.

2) I've been constipated for as long as I can remember. But it got worse before I started eating a pear inspired diet.
But maybe it is linked/doesn't help. What's your thought on this ?

Thanks for the reply as well !
 

keith

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Don't give up, brother. Things will ge better. Depending on what you were doing before, it may take a while for your body to adapt to a new diet. Lots of people here have talked about having transition periods that can be lengthy. My advice, for whatever it is worth (I am still far from figuring everything out for myself), is to listen to your body as much as possible. Calories alone might be most beneficial for raising your metabolism, so eat what you feel up to eating, even if it is not "ideal". I would suggest not trying to make your diet quite so perfect, and just focus on eating what you can tolerate best.

If i understand what you wrote, it sounds like you are having trouble digesting what you are eating and not eating enough (not uncommon here). There is a saying here in U.S.: don't sacrifice the good for the perfect. Eating what you can tolerate and pass, and getting the digestive process working better is probably the best place to start, and then you can slowly transition to more ideal food types. But if bread works for you right now, I would eat bread. If you do better with fruit, eat that. Some find ice cream to be relatively easy to digest, and it certainly will help with calories. Seems like lots of different people here tolerate lots of different foods in completely opposite ways. Some do great with starch, but starch completely wrecks others. Some do well with fat, others not so much. Some can drink gallons of milk and OJ, others can't touch either. Same with eggs, potatoes, fruit, and everything else i can think of. Everyone seems to reactndifferently to different foods, and it can change over time. Eat what works for you. If you get your digestion working better, it will be easier to add/transition to a more "ideal" foods, and it will also be easier to sort out what is or isn't working.

The only thing I would recommend avoiding is PUFA, but I wouldn't go crazy about even that, if you find you do well with a particular food that has some PUFA in it and don't have a suitable replacement, it is probably better to get the calories, and get your metabolic process restarted. Try letting your cravings be a guide, and then listening to your body (how a food makes you feel, digestion, skin, etc), and go from there.

That's my advice; hope it helps. If you keep trying, you will figure it out. don't give up!
 
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Manoko

Manoko

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Don't give up, brother. Things will ge better. Depending on what you were doing before, it may take a while for your body to adapt to a new diet. Lots of people here have talked about having transition periods that can be lengthy. My advice, for whatever it is worth (I am still far from figuring everything out for myself), is to listen to your body as much as possible. Calories alone might be most beneficial for raising your metabolism, so eat what you feel up to eating, even if it is not "ideal". I would suggest not trying to make your diet quite so perfect, and just focus on eating what you can tolerate best.

If i understand what you wrote, it sounds like you are having trouble digesting what you are eating and not eating enough (not uncommon here). There is a saying here in U.S.: don't sacrifice the good for the perfect. Eating what you can tolerate and pass, and getting the digestive process working better is probably the best place to start, and then you can slowly transition to more ideal food types. But if bread works for you right now, I would eat bread. If you do better with fruit, eat that. Some find ice cream to be relatively easy to digest, and it certainly will help with calories. Seems like lots of different people here tolerate lots of different foods in completely opposite ways. Some do great with starch, but starch completely wrecks others. Some do well with fat, others not so much. Some can drink gallons of milk and OJ, others can't touch either. Same with eggs, potatoes, fruit, and everything else i can think of. Everyone seems to reactndifferently to different foods, and it can change over time. Eat what works for you. If you get your digestion working better, it will be easier to add/transition to a more "ideal" foods, and it will also be easier to sort out what is or isn't working.

The only thing I would recommend avoiding is PUFA, but I wouldn't go crazy about even that, if you find you do well with a particular food that has some PUFA in it and don't have a suitable replacement, it is probably better to get the calories, and get your metabolic process restarted. Try letting your cravings be a guide, and then listening to your body (how a food makes you feel, digestion, skin, etc), and go from there.

That's my advice; hope it helps. If you keep trying, you will figure it out. don't give up!

Thank you.

Honestly, I don't feel any craving, and I've been trying to eat a pretty complete diet in terms of micro-nutrients, and that's why I don't understand why my body seems to be crashing like that.

I'll try getting more calories, mainly in the form of dairy/orange juice because out of everything that is said to be good to eat (according to a peat inspired diet) I seem to be able to eat more calories from these than other foods. It doesn't mean I don't follow your advice on also eating non-peat approved foods, it's just that none that I think of sound like I would be able to "binge" on.

These answers are very valuable to me, so thanks a lot for everyone who replied so far.
I'm still open to suggestions of course, I honestly feel like I'm overlooking something, because it's crazy to me to think how much I struggle now, as a still somewhat young (24) and lean individual, compared to how I should and did feel a year or so ago.
 
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Manoko

Manoko

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Did you get some blood tests done? TSH ?

I didn't, I wanted to do this thread before, to get an idea on what could cause my problems and what would be great to test for.
Blood tests here in France are free, I hate them but I'm willing to do it of course, so it's definitely something I will do.
 

paymanz

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At some point, I was never hungry, and even if I was, a few bites of a meal would instantaneously make me feel like I ate too much, like it was sitting in my stomach and I would have the urge to throw up if I added even one more bite
i experienced similar problems for awhile ,and the only thing worked was not dieting, eating/drinking whatever i crave and dont force myself to eat when im not really hungry, and slowly it got better.for me it worked with that.
 

tara

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Sorry you are getting discouraged. The odds are there will be a way forward for you, even if you haven't found it yet.

Lots of good ideas above.

It's been a few weeks now that I've followed strictly the advice found in this forum and the diet guidelines, for a "Peat diet".
I'm not sure what this would mean, since people here have such varied experience and advice, and I don't think Peat recommends a strict diet.

Taking dessicated thyroid for example doesn't seem to have an effect.
How much did you try, for how long? Did you monitor body temps during this experiment?

(maybe bowel movements two times a week, small hard dry lumps difficult to pass through)
What have you tried to address this constipation? Peat has suggested well-aged cascara sagrada when it's needed. The constipation could be compounding your trouble, and it might make a difference to everything to get this moving.

If your appetite is low, I wonder if you could get yourself to eat more by being less strict, and going after whatever foods might taste good to you? I still think it's worth keeping PUFA low, but unless you are allergic to something specific, almost any food is better than little or no food. Could be that something specific you are eating is bothering you - for me, coffee and milk both seem to cause trouble at the moment (hoping that changes sometime). For some people, milk contributes to constipation. For me it messes with my head and makes me feel unwell, but no digestive trouble that I can tell. Have you tried a few days without milk to see if you feel better? For me, a little coffee can sometimes give me a temporary boost, but usually at a cost of lower energy later. I'm not against milk or coffee in general, just that they don't necessarily work well for everyone at all times.
Do you have an idea of how much you are eating in a typical day?

Have you assessed your magnesium intake? Some people seem to do better with more than RDI, and some people have trouble absorbing some forms, so trying other forms can help - topical usually gets in if the gut has trouble with supplements.

May be worth monitoring your body temp over time - it may help you see more of what's going on.

If you are in danger, please get local real life support.
 

snowboard111

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2) I've been constipated for as long as I can remember. But it got worse before I started eating a pear inspired diet. But maybe it is linked/doesn't help. What's your thought on this ?

Two bowels movement a week is definitely/obviously not enough and dangerous... Your colon is more than likely swollen -> accumulated endotoxins -> high NO -> low CO2
I would try to fix that before anything else with antibiotics, cascara, carrots or charcoal.

Might want to read/reread this one... I think Peat strong emphasis on NO is more than likely a good indicator of how important he think it is in a bunch of different health problems.

Lactate vs. CO2 in wounds, sickness, and aging; the other approach to cancer
Lactate vs. CO2 in wounds, sickness, and aging; the other approach to cancer
 
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FD8

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I didn't, I wanted to do this thread before, to get an idea on what could cause my problems and what would be great to test for.
Blood tests here in France are free, I hate them but I'm willing to do it of course, so it's definitely something I will do.

I think that's an important thing to do, I suspect you might be hypothyroid. Hypothyroidism can impact digestion and can cause hair loss.
When you get the results and even if your TSH is "normal", keep taking the thyroid, unless it's below 1.
 

YuraCZ

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I'm constipated due to lack of bile production/flow. How looks your poop? Normal brownish color? Or green/pale? Any tension/pressure under right ribs in the gallbladder area?
 

mujuro

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I will say the worst thing I did when I started introducing Peat foods was drinking too much liquid. To this day I still can't drink the amounts some people drink on here. Two quarts of milk/OJ a day is just way too much. I get cold, I feel weaker, my bowels don't work properly. And trying to complement all that liquid by adding in teaspoons of salt just made me want to sleep all day.
 
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Manoko

Manoko

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i experienced similar problems for awhile ,and the only thing worked was not dieting, eating/drinking whatever i crave and dont force myself to eat when im not really hungry, and slowly it got better.for me it worked with that.

I hope this will happen for me too.
Thanks for sharing your experience. :)

Sorry you are getting discouraged. The odds are there will be a way forward for you, even if you haven't found it yet.

Lots of good ideas above.


I'm not sure what this would mean, since people here have such varied experience and advice, and I don't think Peat recommends a strict diet.


How much did you try, for how long? Did you monitor body temps during this experiment?


What have you tried to address this constipation? Peat has suggested well-aged cascara sagrada when it's needed. The constipation could be compounding your trouble, and it might make a difference to everything to get this moving.

If your appetite is low, I wonder if you could get yourself to eat more by being less strict, and going after whatever foods might taste good to you? I still think it's worth keeping PUFA low, but unless you are allergic to something specific, almost any food is better than little or no food. Could be that something specific you are eating is bothering you - for me, coffee and milk both seem to cause trouble at the moment (hoping that changes sometime). For some people, milk contributes to constipation. For me it messes with my head and makes me feel unwell, but no digestive trouble that I can tell. Have you tried a few days without milk to see if you feel better? For me, a little coffee can sometimes give me a temporary boost, but usually at a cost of lower energy later. I'm not against milk or coffee in general, just that they don't necessarily work well for everyone at all times.
Do you have an idea of how much you are eating in a typical day?

Have you assessed your magnesium intake? Some people seem to do better with more than RDI, and some people have trouble absorbing some forms, so trying other forms can help - topical usually gets in if the gut has trouble with supplements.

May be worth monitoring your body temp over time - it may help you see more of what's going on.

If you are in danger, please get local real life support.

Thanks for the reply.

By following "Peat inspired food", I was mainly referencing this post (and the image that comes with it).

I've been doing it for over a month now, and you're right I didn't measure temperatures, I was doing it by "feeling" (to see if I feel better this way and if it solves my symptoms).
I've been adding and removing things on and off to try and pinpoint things that worked best and things that don't, I need to do this with milk (as you said) for example because it is a common allergen as I've read and maybe it doesn't help my digestive problems or my metabolism as a whole.

How much I'm eating in a day ? Probably around 2000-2500 calories, since the addition of sugared orange juice and sugared whole milk too.

About magnesium, I've thought about it and I have magnesium citrate in supplement form. I've tried popping a pill (400mg) with a meal but it didn't change much, or maybe I should try it more. My feeling is that, with broccoli and spinach being part of my diet (at least once a week each), I may have enough stores of magnesium from diet anyway.
But maybe I'm wrong, of course.

Two bowels movement a week is definitely/obviously not enough and dangerous... Your colon is more than likely swollen -> accumulated endotoxins -> high NO -> low CO2
I would try to fix that before anything else with antibiotics, cascara, carrots or charcoal.

Might want to read/reread this one... I think Peat strong emphasis on NO is more than likely a good indicator of how important he think it is in a bunch of different health problems.

Lactate vs. CO2 in wounds, sickness, and aging; the other approach to cancer
Lactate vs. CO2 in wounds, sickness, and aging; the other approach to cancer

Thanks for reply and the link.

I've done two weeks of antibiotics lately, and I eat the raw carrot once a day, but it doesn't seem to be enough.
Haidut also told me that cascara might be a good idea, I'll try to find it here in France, and report back if it helped or not.

I also feel like sleep/digestion are the two things really impairing my health, and that if I could manage to fix both, things would probably get back in order.

I think that's an important thing to do, I suspect you might be hypothyroid. Hypothyroidism can impact digestion and can cause hair loss.
When you get the results and even if your TSH is "normal", keep taking the thyroid, unless it's below 1.

Alright, I'll do that then.
About taking dessicated thyroid though, Ray Peat suggests to take it with a meal to slow down the absorption, as getting such a rise (if taken on an empty stomach) of thyroid hormones is unphysiological.
The problem is that apparently calcium and iron impairs the absorption of it, so I really don't know with what food I should be taking my dessicated thyroid pill.

Any suggestion ?

I'm constipated due to lack of bile production/flow. How looks your poop? Normal brownish color? Or green/pale? Any tension/pressure under right ribs in the gallbladder area?

Lately, it has been a bit green and pale indeed. But I don't know if it's been going on since my symptoms began, because I only noticed it the last few days.
As far as the tension, I can't feel any in particular.

I've tried eating spicy food (by adding cayenne pepper powder for example), or simply popping HCL (with pepsin) pills and digestive enzymes with food, but it didn't help much.

---------------------

Thank you all for your valuable help.
 

lindsay

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I am very sorry to hear of your troubles and sad feelings. I hope very much that you will find some good guidance on here, and it already looks like there are a lot of great ideas!!

I have struggled with constipation for many years and have compounding problems from Zelnorm use when I was in college and everything began - the longer term use of that drug really messed up my system. Starch is a major problem for me and I've actually avoided it for years (with a brief high starch run two summers ago that ended in appendicitis). I can eat starch only in very small doses and with good fat.

That being said, keeping the gut clean is vital, IMO. I can go from feeling horribly depressed to fabulous with just a good bowel movement. However - and this is a big however - the only thing that really improves my digestion in a very noticeable way is thyroid. Foods also help, but if my thyroid function is low (and it is), it doesn't matter what I take or use, I will not be feeling great until I improve that one thing. And it's really hard to naturally improve thyroid function when you are struggling with chronic constipation.

Recently I had a lot of tummy troubles because I have run out of all my thyroid meds I ordered from abroad - and while TyroMax does help greatly, it's not the same as a Cynoplus or good t3. So I ordered some T3 from Blue Sky Peptide and have been taking a couple drops of that throughout the day in my coffee and have noticed some good improvements in bowel movements. I also take small amounts of cascara sagrada and activated charcoal when necessary and eat a good amount of gelatin - both for protein and for intestinal health. I also take Ox Bile once per day - this might be controversial on here (due to serotonin), but I don't have a gallbladder (one of my young and stupid regrets), so I find it really helps me digest protein rich foods containing fat (like eggs).

Do you drink coffee? It also really helps with bowel movements. As does good Orange Juice.

Anyhow, I hope that you will be constipation free and feeling better soon! I agree with others - you should figure out the constipation first before dealing with any other dietary stuff. Clean those intestines out first and then work on the nutrition! Best wishes to you!
 

Makrosky

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. I also take Ox Bile once per day - this might be controversial on here (due to serotonin),
lindsay, why do you say that ? What's the relationship between supplementing Ox Bile and increased serotonin ?
 

lindsay

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lindsay, why do you say that ? What's the relationship between supplementing Ox Bile and increased serotonin ?

Haidut mentioned in a thread somewhere that bile release triggers serotonin. But I'm not sure taking Ox Bile would do the same. It does often trigger bowel movements when taken with food (at least for myself), but I'm not sure that means it triggers serotonin release. And I'm sure that it's beneficial for excreting toxins in the bile and getting rid of old bile. So really, I guess I'm open to hearing more thoughts about Ox Bile supplementation.
 

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