If Anarchists Can Make Pharma Drugs, Why Can't Somebody Make Lead-free Vitamin C

zewe

Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2018
Messages
265
I'm taking Ray Peat's word for it.

I don't agree with your thesis that since there is so much lead pollution around us, consciously taking more lead in wouldn't hurt much more than it already has. By your reasoning, all of us have lead toxicity in us, and we should just chill.
@yerrag & @Dave Clark Is the banter betw/ you two what one would call a pissing contest?!

Reading that back and forth and esp. Dave's last remark, I couldn't help myself.....so here it goes. Enjoy:

To all the kids who survived the 1930's, 40's, 50's, 60's and 70's. ...

First, we survived being born to mothers who smoked and/or drank while they were pregnant. They took aspirin, ate blue cheese dressing, tuna from a can and didn't get tested for diabetes.

Then after that trauma, we were put to sleep on our tummies in baby cribs covered with bright colored lead-base paints.

We had no childproof lids on medicine bottles, locks on doors or cabinets and when we rode our bikes, we had baseball caps not helmets on our heads.

As infants & children, we would ride in cars with no car seats, booster seats, seat belts or air bags.

Riding in the back of a pick up truck on a warm day was always a special treat.

We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle.

We shared one soft drink with four friends, from one bottle, and no one actually died from this.

We ate cupcakes, white bread, real butter and bacon. We drank Kool-aid made with real white sugar. And, we weren't overweight. Why?

Because we were always outside, playing...that's why!

We would leave home in the morning and play all day, as long as we were back when the streetlights came on. No one was able to reach us all day. And, we were O.K.

We would spend hours building our go-carts out of scraps and then ride down the hill, only to find out we forgot the brakes. After running into the bushes a few times,we learned to solve the problem.

We did not have Playstations, Nintendo's and X-boxes. There were no video games, no 150 channels on cable, no video movies or DVD's, no surround-sound or CD's, no cell phones, no personal computers, no Internet and no chat rooms. We had friends and we went outside and found them!

We fell out of trees, got cut, broke bones and teeth and there were no lawsuits from these accidents.

We ate worms and mud pies made from dirt, and the worms did not live in us forever.

We were given BB guns for our 10th birthdays, made up games with sticks and tennis balls and, although we were told it would happen, we did not put out very many eyes.

We rode bikes or walked to a friend's house and knocked on the door or rang the bell, or just walked in and talked to them.

Little League had tryouts and not everyone made the team. Those who didn't had to learn to deal with disappointment. Imagine that!!

The idea of a parent bailing us out if we broke the law was unheard of. They actually sided with the law!

These generations have produced some of the best risk-takers and problem solvers ever.

The past 80 years have been an explosion of innovation and new ideas.

We had freedom, failure, success and responsibility, and we learned how to deal with it all. If you are one of them: Congratulations!

You might want to share this with others who have had the luck to grow up as kids, before the lawyers and the government regulated so much of our lives for our own good.

Kind of makes you want to run through the house with scissors, doesn't it?
 
Last edited:

Dave Clark

Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2017
Messages
1,978
@yerrag & @Dave Clark Is the banter betw/ you two what one would call a pissing contest?!

Reading that back and forth and esp. Dave's last remark, I couldn't help myself.....so here it goes. Enjoy:

To all the kids who survived the 1930's, 40's, 50's, 60's and 70's. ...

First, we survived being born to mothers who smoked and/or drank while they were pregnant. They took aspirin, ate blue cheese dressing, tuna from a can and didn't get tested for diabetes.

Then after that trauma, we were put to sleep on our tummies in baby cribs covered with bright colored lead-base paints.

We had no childproof lids on medicine bottles, locks on doors or cabinets and when we rode our bikes, we had baseball caps not helmets on our heads.

As infants & children, we would ride in cars with no car seats, booster seats, seat belts or air bags.

Riding in the back of a pick up truck on a warm day was always a special treat.

We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle.

We shared one soft drink with four friends, from one bottle, and no one actually died from this.

We ate cupcakes, white bread, real butter and bacon. We drank Kool-aid made with real white sugar. And, we weren't overweight. Why?

Because we were always outside, playing...that's why!

We would leave home in the morning and play all day, as long as we were back when the streetlights came on. No one was able to reach us all day. And, we were O.K.

We would spend hours building our go-carts out of scraps and then ride down the hill, only to find out we forgot the brakes. After running into the bushes a few times,we learned to solve the problem.

We did not have Playstations, Nintendo's and X-boxes. There were no video games, no 150 channels on cable, no video movies or DVD's, no surround-sound or CD's, no cell phones, no personal computers, no Internet and no chat rooms. We had friends and we went outside and found them!

We fell out of trees, got cut, broke bones and teeth and there were no lawsuits from these accidents.

We ate worms and mud pies made from dirt, and the worms did not live in us forever.

We were given BB guns for our 10th birthdays, made up games with sticks and tennis balls and, although we were told it would happen, we did not put out very many eyes.

We rode bikes or walked to a friend's house and knocked on the door or rang the bell, or just walked in and talked to them.

Little League had tryouts and not everyone made the team. Those who didn't had to learn to deal with disappointment. Imagine that!!

The idea of a parent bailing us out if we broke the law was unheard of. They actually sided with the law!

These generations have produced some of the best risk-takers and problem solvers ever.

The past 80 years have been an explosion of innovation and new ideas.

We had freedom, failure, success and responsibility, and we learned how to deal with it all. If you are one of them: Congratulations!

You might want to share this with others who have had the luck to grow up as kids, before the lawyers and the government regulated so much of our lives for our own good.

Kind of makes you want to run through the house with scissors, doesn't it?
@yerrag & @Dave Clark Is the banter betw/ you two what one would call a pissing contest?!

Reading that back and forth and esp. Dave's last remark, I couldn't help myself.....so here it goes. Enjoy:

To all the kids who survived the 1930's, 40's, 50's, 60's and 70's. ...

First, we survived being born to mothers who smoked and/or drank while they were pregnant. They took aspirin, ate blue cheese dressing, tuna from a can and didn't get tested for diabetes.

Then after that trauma, we were put to sleep on our tummies in baby cribs covered with bright colored lead-base paints.

We had no childproof lids on medicine bottles, locks on doors or cabinets and when we rode our bikes, we had baseball caps not helmets on our heads.

As infants & children, we would ride in cars with no car seats, booster seats, seat belts or air bags.

Riding in the back of a pick up truck on a warm day was always a special treat.

We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle.

We shared one soft drink with four friends, from one bottle, and no one actually died from this.

We ate cupcakes, white bread, real butter and bacon. We drank Kool-aid made with real white sugar. And, we weren't overweight. Why?

Because we were always outside, playing...that's why!

We would leave home in the morning and play all day, as long as we were back when the streetlights came on. No one was able to reach us all day. And, we were O.K.

We would spend hours building our go-carts out of scraps and then ride down the hill, only to find out we forgot the brakes. After running into the bushes a few times,we learned to solve the problem.

We did not have Playstations, Nintendo's and X-boxes. There were no video games, no 150 channels on cable, no video movies or DVD's, no surround-sound or CD's, no cell phones, no personal computers, no Internet and no chat rooms. We had friends and we went outside and found them!

We fell out of trees, got cut, broke bones and teeth and there were no lawsuits from these accidents.

We ate worms and mud pies made from dirt, and the worms did not live in us forever.

We were given BB guns for our 10th birthdays, made up games with sticks and tennis balls and, although we were told it would happen, we did not put out very many eyes.

We rode bikes or walked to a friend's house and knocked on the door or rang the bell, or just walked in and talked to them.

Little League had tryouts and not everyone made the team. Those who didn't had to learn to deal with disappointment. Imagine that!!

The idea of a parent bailing us out if we broke the law was unheard of. They actually sided with the law!

These generations have produced some of the best risk-takers and problem solvers ever.

The past 80 years have been an explosion of innovation and new ideas.

We had freedom, failure, success and responsibility, and we learned how to deal with it all. If you are one of them: Congratulations!

You might want to share this with others who have had the luck to grow up as kids, before the lawyers and the government regulated so much of our lives for our own good.

Kind of makes you want to run through the house with scissors, doesn't it?
Good post, yeah I lived all that and agree. BTW, really no pissing match, just trying to say that I believe there are other places to be concerned about lead. If you eat conventional food you consume more lead than what you will get from your vitamin c , by virtue of the pesticides and other chemicals. It's just that people don't consider that. When was the last time you saw a COA on the food you eat everyday?!! Also, as I agree with your post, you must also take the bad with the good, they poisoned people for years with lead exposure, I didn't see that mentioned. And, BTW, I am grateful to have grown up then as compared to having to grow up now, by all means!
 

nwo2012

Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2012
Messages
1,107
These are not necessarily in opposition to each other. Gates seems to want to prevent the excessive population boom Africa is set out to experience. Almost exclusively good things could come out of this. When there are less people, everyone wins.

Naive at best. The reality is he views anyone not in the so called elite AKA inbred scum, which also means yiu and I as a waste of space.
 

zewe

Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2018
Messages
265
@Dave Clark I lived in New Jersey as a kid for awhile in the 60s and they would come around in the evening with trucks and spray DDT, while we were outside playing. Wonder how much that f**ked my health up?! I'm lucky my son doesn't have fins for arms.

Rachel Carson was trying to shake sense into industry leaders then with, "Silent Spring."

They mocked her as a hysterical woman. Yeah right! Our eagles are just now starting to come back because the DDT made their egg's shells so thin they'd crack before the babies were born.
 
OP
yerrag

yerrag

Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2016
Messages
10,883
Location
Manila
Naive at best. The reality is he views anyone not in the so called elite AKA inbred scum, which also means yiu and I as a waste of space.
I could not understand why Gates and Soros feels what they're doing is for the greater good. Smart in their own way, but twisted in how they want to shape the world with their influence. Surely Gates isn't so stupid as to know vaccines do more harm than good. And surely Soros isn't blind to the consequences of supporting ideologies that are antithetical to the pursuit of freedom and happiness.
 

jaguar43

Member
Joined
Oct 10, 2012
Messages
1,310
...or allergen-free fructose, using DIY minilabs?

https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/...-own-medicine-four-thieves-vinegar-collective

I personally think there is a conspiracy involved. Why are the majors-

- making lead-tainted vitamin C
-making allergen-tainted fructose
-adding harmful excipients to aspirin

when they have the resources to produce better vitamin C, better fructose, and better aspirin?

In the case of aspirin, isn't the reason people don't use aspirin is because mainly it is about being allergic to it? And if adding harmful excipients to aspirin is meant to lead people to use more expensive blood thinners in place of aspirin, aren't we glad we can still buy harmfulexcipient-free aspirin? I'm glad that because of this, Ray Peat isn't warning us not to take aspirin, as there is aspirin that can be bought that isn't purposefully "tainted."

Unfortunately, the same cannot be said of vitamin C and fructose.

Therefore, we need to be able to find a lab that can make these for us. A lab in our own home would be nice, wouldn't it?

Can someone develop a minilab and either sell it or publish DIY plans to make vitamin C and fructose? If it's to be sold and funds are needed for developing it, I'd support a Kickstarter project on it.

Wouldn't it be nice if Ray could finally say "Vitamin C is good" and "Fructose is allergy-free."

I think your right, except for the fact that one of the problems with manufacturing supplements is that everyone is importing them from countries like China. When a country loses it's manufacturing base, it loses it ability to control the quality of goods and service by being alienated from manufacturing methods and production. Until it returns, I don't have any hope of those manufacturing techniques changing for the better.
 
OP
yerrag

yerrag

Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2016
Messages
10,883
Location
Manila
I think your right, except for the fact that one of the problems with manufacturing supplements is that everyone is importing them from countries like China. When a country loses it's manufacturing base, it loses it ability to control the quality of goods and service by being alienated from manufacturing methods and production. Until it returns, I don't have any hope of those manufacturing techniques changing for the better.
It's not a China thing. Vitamin C being contaminated with lead started long ago. If China now makes vitamin C, it's only because it can make any vitamin C competitively, tainted or not. But what China doesn't make is a product where is no significant demand, and there is no significant demand for lead-free vitamin C, where it costs more. Even if manufacturing comes back to the US, it wouldn't change a thing. Self-manufacture is the answer, if possible.
 

Prosper

Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2017
Messages
516
Naive at best. The reality is he views anyone not in the so called elite AKA inbred scum, which also means yiu and I as a waste of space.
He is not wrong. Neither of us is going to matter in the overall course of humanity. Those who have the money and power will. You and I, we will be a net loss in terms of resources consumed vs value generated.
 
Last edited:

Birdie

Member
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
5,783
Location
USA
According to this guy a cup of saukeraut has 700mg of vitamin c.


This is the sort of thinking that says if a food has a lot of a nutrient, then eating it guarantees the body will absorb and use it. And without any harm to the body.

Ray points out the negatives in a lot of foods that are generally viewed as being packed with nutrients.
 

smith

Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2017
Messages
386
Are all forms tainted? Is ascorbic acid more tainted than a mineral ascorbate?
 
OP
yerrag

yerrag

Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2016
Messages
10,883
Location
Manila
Are all forms tainted? Is ascorbic acid more tainted than a mineral ascorbate?
The ascorbates are made from ascorbic acid and a mineral base. For example, sodium ascorbate from sodium bicarbonate and ascorbic acid. So they're as tainted as the source ascorbic acid they're sourced from.
 

Literally

Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2018
Messages
300
This is the thread that made me stop lurking, because I want to contribute what I know about a widely available source of Vitamin C.

And that is pine needle tea! I have seen sources indicating that a properly prepared cup contains several multiples (like 6 times, according on one source IIRC) of the Vitamin C in an orange. I've also seen multiple sources state that some Native Americans got their C this way. While I've never a really definitive/original source for either claim, I have been relying on pine needle tea for my Vitamin C, including times where I was eating very little fruit. After I made it several times I started periodically craving it.

Not all forms of pine are safe, although I understand most are. Where I am, the only pine we have with 5 needles to a bunch is White Pine and they are very abundant, and safe to brew. You need to do your own research and make sure you have identified a safe tree. There are warnings for some species for pregnant women. If people would like more info I can go through files and post some relevant stuff.

The procedure I use is:
Brew as you would a typical herbal tea, at a temp somewhat less than boiling for 10+ minutes. First rinse and inspect fresh needles well, removing any with bug eggs attached (unless you're into that kind of thing), along with any that are brown or sickly looking. Snip off the ends with scissors and discard. Snip the rest into short pieces with the scissors and brew, covered (to keep the Vitamin C from evaporating, apparently), using a teaball or other brewing device -- or just strain it when done.

It has a faint but distinct taste, which I find pleasant. I often brew it in combination with mint, rosemary, and a little white willow bark (only a little, because I see unpleasant visual interference if I use a lot of the willow bark). Overall I find that combination soothing.
 

Dave Clark

Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2017
Messages
1,978
@Dave Clark I lived in New Jersey as a kid for awhile in the 60s and they would come around in the evening with trucks and spray DDT, while we were outside playing. Wonder how much that f**ked my health up?! I'm lucky my son doesn't have fins for arms.

Rachel Carson was trying to shake sense into industry leaders then with, "Silent Spring."

They mocked her as a hysterical woman. Yeah right! Our eagles are just now starting to come back because the DDT made their egg's shells so thin they'd crack before the babies were born.
Funny you mentioned that,when I was a kid, also in the 60s, the municipality had a jeep that pulled a sprayer that sprayed out big clouds of fog (pesticides, not sure if it was DDT, probably was), and all of us kids thought that was neat, we used to run and play in the fog! Not even the adults back then had the knowledge or presence of mind to tell us not to do that. Sometimes I think if it wouldn't be for me being proactive with health these past few decades I would be more messed up, or even dead, considering the lead, mercury in my mouth, pesticides, xenoestrogens, etc. in foods. Yeah, those were the good ol' days, but they could of been better good ol' days had it not been for all those toxic poisons that are now effecting our health.
 

zewe

Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2018
Messages
265
@Literally : Thank you so much for your post! Are you an herbalist?
I was taught to gather [and grow some] and use herbs medicinally by my elders. At one time, I made decent supplemental cash brewing medicinal teas for people based on their complaints.

You've taught me something; I didn't know about using pine for vit. C. I've used the spring growth tips in my bath for aches and pains.

Interesting use of mint, rosemary and willow bark. Do you simmer the willow bark separately?

I've been planning to restock my cupboards with new herbs. It's harder for me to pick aymore; people build, ripping up the fields where I'd gathered.
 

Literally

Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2018
Messages
300
@zewe thanks for your comment. I would not consider myself an herbalist, but have studied some of the basics. I have learned to forage a few things.

I steep the willow bark along with everything else... did you ask that because it should be simmered longer or something?
 

zewe

Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2018
Messages
265
@Literally : Sorry I took so long to answer. Looks like I could use some pine needle tea....been having terrible respiratory issues.

I took the liberty to look up some info and not only are the pine needles super high in C [and vitamin A] but they can also be used as an expectorant.

To get that medicinal property,
* boil 1C H2O
* add 1 T chopped needles
* simmer 2 - 3 min
* remove from heat and let steep till cool.

You can also use that as an antiseptic wash.

You asked about the willow bark, which is the original asprin, BTW. Barks, roots and woody stems need to be simmered for extraction.

I'd simmer covered for about the same time as you'd steep leaves and flowers. If I was making a compound tea, and it had barks or hard dried roots included, I'd prepare these separately, then mix all together after straining.

Particularly hard roots like licorice, I like to pound with a hammer so as to get better surface area for extraction.

Mints should NEVER be boiled. Many times I used mint to enhance taste and also to act as sort of a catalyst for the other herbs.

Really cool you're into brewing, I've been in a few herb clubs and we never saw men there.

I've taught my son the ways too.

Please feel free to message me, anytime.
 

zewe

Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2018
Messages
265
Funny you mentioned that,when I was a kid, also in the 60s, the municipality had a jeep that pulled a sprayer that sprayed out big clouds of fog (pesticides, not sure if it was DDT, probably was), and all of us kids thought that was neat, we used to run and play in the fog! Not even the adults back then had the knowledge or presence of mind to tell us not to do that. Sometimes I think if it wouldn't be for me being proactive with health these past few decades I would be more messed up, or even dead, considering the lead, mercury in my mouth, pesticides, xenoestrogens, etc. in foods. Yeah, those were the good ol' days, but they could of been better good ol' days had it not been for all those toxic poisons that are now effecting our health.

@Dave Clark

The movie Tree of Life has a great scene re-enacting the way that children would frolick in the spray as the DDT trucks went by. Here are two screen shots from the trailer:



DDT was a pesticide marketed to housewives (and many others). I volunteered for the Rachel Carson Homestead and they had many posters such as these below.





DDT-laced wallpaper, from Copyranter:



 

Dave Clark

Member
Joined
Jun 2, 2017
Messages
1,978
@Dave Clark

The movie Tree of Life has a great scene re-enacting the way that children would frolick in the spray as the DDT trucks went by. Here are two screen shots from the trailer:



DDT was a pesticide marketed to housewives (and many others). I volunteered for the Rachel Carson Homestead and they had many posters such as these below.





DDT-laced wallpaper, from Copyranter:



OMG! Brings back memories, albeit bad ones. Isn't it amazing the toxic garbage they fed and sold to all of us unsuspecting people?! Problem is, as we learn what to stay away from, they keep coming out with new stuff to poison us, now EMFs. Do ya ever get the impression we're doomed, LOL! Great post though, validates what we were saying.
 

Waynish

Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2016
Messages
2,206
This back and forth drivel can be remedied by sending some vitamin C supplements to USP. Not very difficult, crowd funding the expense and publish the results...
 

Similar threads

Back
Top Bottom