Ideal Human State For Testing Of Hormones

RobertJM

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I’m running a load of hormone tests tomorrow and I’ve had no instructions by the way of needing to fast for any particular tests (or restrictions), so I assume I can eat tomorrow morning before doing it (if I chose to). But I’m just wondering what is optimal? What is the best way to do it? Go in there fasted on a empty stomach? What about juice?

I’m testing a lot of things, some of which are prolactin, testosterone, DHT, thyroid panel, cholesterol levels, plus many more.

I’ve deliberatly cut out all metabolic stimulants (including my heavy, heavy coffee habit), and so going into it as near to baseline as I can possibly be (I hope).

Any advice from any seasoned testers welcome
 
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RobertJM

RobertJM

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Ah that’s good then. I did mine fasted at 9.45am.

I’ll update my results here. Based on my symptoms, I’m expecting raised prolactin, low testosterone and high(ish) DHT. I think my body is under some kind of constant ongoing systematic stress. I will update here more on my own situation when my results have arrived. But yes, I wouldn’t describe myself as being in good health at all really. I’m your quintessential ‘how not to follow the work of Ray Peat and make it into a dietary approach’.
 

schultz

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Cool. It's always interesting to see bloodwork. If I may ask, what are your symptoms? I just want to see how it relates to your bloodwork once you post it.
 

schultz

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For how long should a person fast before the testing, do you know?

A fasted state assumes that you actually slept during the night for some amount of time and upon getting your blood drawn and you haven't had anything to eat or drink for 8-12 hours (excluding water I believe, but I bet even water could mess with results if you drank enough). If you eat right before bed and only sleep for 3 hours, that's not really a fasted state.

A lot of things could alter the results of the test, so I think if you're going to bother with blood tests and take the results seriously, then you need to be obsessive about your routine prior to getting your blood taken. Treat it like it's an actual study. Scientists attempt to control all variables. Getting several consistent tests would be helpful for interpreting the results. If you just get 1 test, it could be an outlier. If this outlier test showed low testosterone, it could affect you in a negative way (your mentality).

I think Haidut mentioned he doesn't drink alcohol for a few days before a test. Ah yes, found it here on the same thread I linked before Absolutely Horrible Lab Numbers !
 

Logan-

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A fasted state assumes that you actually slept during the night for some amount of time and upon getting your blood drawn and you haven't had anything to eat or drink for 8-12 hours (excluding water I believe, but I bet even water could mess with results if you drank enough). If you eat right before bed and only sleep for 3 hours, that's not really a fasted state.

A lot of things could alter the results of the test, so I think if you're going to bother with blood tests and take the results seriously, then you need to be obsessive about your routine prior to getting your blood taken. Treat it like it's an actual study. Scientists attempt to control all variables. Getting several consistent tests would be helpful for interpreting the results. If you just get 1 test, it could be an outlier. If this outlier test showed low testosterone, it could affect you in a negative way (your mentality).

I think Haidut mentioned he doesn't drink alcohol for a few days before a test. Ah yes, found it here on the same thread I linked before Absolutely Horrible Lab Numbers !

That makes sense, thanks.
 
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RobertJM

RobertJM

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As promised here are my results and some background information:

I’m not really sure why I made all of those silly predications earlier in the thread. I wasn't right about anything, other than prolactin! Of course, the company that I did the tests through, with their 'expert Doctors', think that my prolactin and estradiol are 'fine', because they are in range. Getting my DHT tested was just a curiosity thing, and at a £100 fee alone, it was the biggest waste of money (from these test results), as the result was (below) very uninteresting.


Albumin 41.8 g/L (Range: 35 - 50)
SHBG 32.3 nmol/L (Range: 18.3 - 54.1)
FSH 2.52 IU/L (Range: 1.5 - 12.4)
LH 3.23 IU/L (Range: 1.7 - 8.6)
Oestradiol 142 pmol/L (Range: 41 - 159)
Testosterone 14.1 nmol/L (Range: 8.64 - 29)
Free Testosterone - Calc. 0.297 nmol/L (Range: 0.2 - 0.62)
Free Androgen Index 43.65 Ratio (Range: 24 - 104)
Prolactin 303 mU/L (Range: 86 - 324)
DHEA Sulphate 4.460 umol/L (Range: 2.41 - 11.6)
Dihydrotestosterone 1.11 nmol/L (Range: 0.33 - 3.01)
TSH 1.73 mIU/L (Range: 0.27 - 4.2)
Free T3 5.79 pmol/L (Range: 3.1 - 6.8)
Free Thyroxine 14.200 pmol/L (Range: 12 - 22)
Thyroglobulin Antibodies 10.700 kU/L (Range: < 115)
Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies 9.46 kIU/L (Range: < 34)


Information and background:

37 years old
211 ibs
6ft



Current symptoms

Symptoms I have here in 2019: Gynecomastia developing; a fully formed gut and fat accumulation around the midriff (which doesn't shift); Non-existent sex drive; Erectile dysfunction; Protein leaking into urine (as confirmed through tests through my GP); Chronic bad back (which has been mostly resolved through my visits to an osteopath; easily the best thing I have ever done for my poor back)


My journey

I started 'Peating' at the end of 2013. My interpretation of it was to strive for a purist type of diet, whereby consumption of animal products would be the base, eliminating all starches and fibres (apart from carrot/bamboo), ensuring enough protein, not over-exercising (never been a problem, btw) and of course trying to live an interesting/enriched lifestyle with minimal stressors (easier said than done!). But also, along with these other things, I would always try to eat more carbs as opposed to fat to try and maximise co2.

My first two years of doing this were largely spent with milk as my base, and that was doing at least two quarts of milk each day. It is only the last two years where I no longer do milk, as it took me two years to finally realise that I couldn’t digest it properly. Giving it up was the best decision I ever made (although I still use small amounts for coffee).

I have been PUFA restricting since I started this whole Peat thing, although, annoyingly (for me), I have only found out within the last year from an email that Peat sent to another forum member that PUFA intake actually has to be lower than 4g per day if you want to truly deplete it from your tissues. The guidelines that I read back in 2013 from quotes from Ray quite clearly seemed to recommend 4g as a good figure to shoot for. Still, it's only a few years of my life that I've been doing it wrong. What is a few years between friends? (joke). No seriously though, had I known this back in 2013, I would have certainly had the enthusiasm back then to make that strict and stringent leap with my PUFA intake in a typical 'sticking to it' type of militant style fashion with my diet. What's the point I am making? Perhaps a different man would be sat here right now. If I had been doing 1.5g of PUFA per day for five years, maybe I would be leaner and in better health? That's just hypothetical conjecture though because what's done is done. And I cannot turn the clock back now. Ray Peat often changes his mind about things, suddenly announces that he’s going in a new direction, or is suddenly into something new. And that’s just what happens with Ray Peat, I guess. Or, perhaps unfortunately for me, he had always recommended the 1.5-2g figure of PUFA per day, and it was just me that followed other incorrect quotes/guidelines? I’m not butthurt about this, as everything in life is a learning experience. But moving on from this, do I have the enthusiasm to now shoot for 1.5-2g of PUFA per day, five years later here in 2019? Maybe I could even get back on the milk again LOL. No, I won’t be doing that. I am not sure to be honest. I have already given five years of my life (so far) to a diet (that I constructed) based on his work, and although it has improved a few parameters (pulse, temperatures, cognition), you can clearly see above in my health symptoms that my body is most definitely degenerating/declining. I mean, I don’t expect to be the incredible hulk with the energy of superman at the age of 37. You expect some age related decline at that age, but I was also hoping after all of these years of dedicating so much of my time and energy into my health that I would have not ended up like this. Poor libido and erectile dysfunction is about as embarrassing as it gets for any male, regardless of age. And being currently single, if my equipment isn't working, it pretty much just ruins everything.

I’ve recently split with my girlfriend and, for me, in how I am feeling, it is my lack of sex drive that was certainly a huge problem between us. At age 23 her sex drive was twice what mine was, and to rub it in even more, she was a vegan. Yes she's only 23 and her youth hormones are probably protecting her, and I was hypersexual myself (at times) at her age. And it probably won't last forever, and she should make the most of her 'honeymoon period'. I told her this many times, but of course, from her perspective, I'm the unhealthy one, so what do I know!

Maybe my high oestrogen/prolactin is from consumption of animal products that aren’t grass fed? And even if they are grass fed, aren’t they pumped full of hormones anyway? I once read from that whacky guy, David Wolfe, that he would never touch any animal products for as long as he has was on planet Earth because (his words) ‘you cannot trust the animal industry’. Yes I know David Wolfe is a bit of a clown, but those words always stuck with me because they seemed to ring true based on my what I’ve read into/learned about with animal products. I have asked so many ‘grass fed’ farmers about hormones being present in their products, and they either look sheepishly the other way or they would in fact just admit that of course the meats are pumped full of hormones because this is ‘necessary’ and protocol/procedure of the industry. So my interactions with them has hardly increased my confidence in what they are selling.

Why is that relevant? What I am ingesting over many years seems to be producing a stressed and unhealthy body. A big percentage of the food I eat is from animal products. And anyway, I’m just spouting what’s on my mind here. Would I actually give up animal products or just try to eat less? I don’t know. I’m thinking aloud, and just wondering what it is that I’m actually doing that just seems to be wrong.

So I now have no girlfriend and I certainly have no confidence/motivation to go and find a new one with my declining physical/sexual symptoms.

Before anyone asks I already do no fap. I see masturbation as a waste of my time unless I am seriosuly in the mood for it, and that, these days, is absolutely never.

Supplements don’t really do much. Back in the day I would get dramatic reactions from supplements. Nowadays my body’s homeostasis system seems to be very sharp. I may get extremely brief reactions of something apparently working, only for my body to then downregulate/upregulate whatever it needs to in order to maintain its perceived level of balance in my body.


What I eat today

Previously (prior to the lab results) I was eating: starches (potatoes, occasional rice, breads), greek yoghurts, fruit juices (at least a couple of quarts per day), meats/cheeses, gelatin, coffee.

My calories at least 3-4000 each day. Without food every few hours I get very hungry and stressed.

None of it is organic, grass fed, etc. I just buy whatever I have access of getting and then get on with my day.

At the moment (as of the last week and a half), I am experimenting with an Edward J Edmonds (former forum member) style of diet. So I am eating more fat with food mostly based on dairy, and less carbs. Protein has largely stayed the same. Why am I doing this? Because I want to spend the next few weeks free of starch and my gut has already improved hugely from cutting it out. Also, it eliminates fructose which may also be possibly responsible for this gut that I now have (perhaps my body just doesn't process fructose?). Fructose can bloat some people, and some people can't handle the stuff. So yes I am currently experimenting. But given my current situation, i am in a position to do so. What do I have to lose?
The fat around my mid-section has also leaned out (in appearance) since eating this way, but I still weigh the same (so no weight loss). I am averaging about 120g of carbs per day eating this way. The fat seems to buffer the insulinogenic spikes from the protein based meals. It's too early on in my experiment with this dietary approach to comment on any of my health parameters. The only thing I have noticed so far is that it's definitely cooling me down (extremeties are cooler) - which indicates that it is lowering thyroid or stress hormones.

Weight gain

From 15 years of age to 35 years of age I was a steady 180 ibs. I never had any weight gain in my life. Low body fat. The last two years I have put on a whopping 30 ibs. My body still looks muscular and perhaps that extra weight is now being carried as additional muscle? I have especially been working on my legs, so my thighs resemble tree trunks now. Maybe that explains the extra weight. Another theory I had was calcium supplementation making my bones denser and perhaps that resulting in me putting weight on, but I googled it and there doesn’t appear to be such a phenomenon. I just figured extra calcium = antagonizing of PTH = anabolic result and perhaps additonal body mass (from increaed bone density, etc) as a side effect of that.

Supplements of today

I occasionally take t3 and I always a notice an increase in temperature and pulse, but that reaction doesn't relieve any of my symptoms. Other than the t3 I sometimes take, I take magensium each night and sometimes vitamin K2. Other than that I don't take anything else because I believe that too many supplements are not a good thing.

IS ANYONE ABLE TO MAKE ANY COMMENTS ABOUT MY RESULTS THAT JUMPS OUT??? ANY COMMENTS WELCOME. ANYTHING LOOK HIGH OR LOW?

IT'S HARD FOR ME, A NOVICE, TO INTERPRET THESE RESULTS.
 
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