IBD, IBS, Gut Bacteria - What Works For You?

[jyb]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

I get sainsburys concentrate oj. IIRC all the others use flouridated water while sainsbury's doesn't. When I tried straining it, nothing came out, not sure if I did something wrong.

Re straining: I mentioned getting a lot of pulp strained but that's for the fresh pulp-free OJ bottles. In other produce you can't find pulp, though it doesn't mean its pulp free just finer.

It's useful information that sainbury's concentrate is not fluoridated, thanks. How did you found out?

Sent them an email.

Ok thanks. Why do you use the concentrate over the others? There's a non-concentrate (pasteurized) version, and a fresh one. The fresh one costs a lot more obviously.

 

[chris]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

It is the cheapest and I'm low on money. Peat drank a concentrate for years until they changed something and he couldn't tolerate it anymore. I drink the juice and feel ok, I don't have any reasons yet to change.

 

[Mittir]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

Can you not tolerate fiber or starch? They are two different things.

Starch was essentially killing me before Peat (I had all the symptoms of low-grade metabolic endotoxemia). When I switched to fruit it was like the difference between night and day.

Danny Roddy has popularized the strained orange juice idea, but he has clearly misinterpreted Peat. Peat says to strain OJ only if you suspect the company is adding enzyme treated pulp to the juice. Otherwise the non-fermentable fiber in fruit is beneficial -- I've found that I feel even better eating whole fruit instead of fruit juice.

I am sure RP mentioned several times in his audio interviews to get pulp free OJ and to strain home made OJ. He commented on enzyme treated OJ in which fiber does not separate from liquid like normal OJ does and to avoid these type . OJ fiber is rich source of pectin, a soluble fiber. He is ok with insoluble fiber like cellulose not soluble fibers,these are fermentable fibers.

Starch over all feeds bad bacteria but it is specially bad for people with SIBO problems. Pectin's role is mixed. it feeds both good and bad bacteria. So, you might get better result with fruits and not starch. I have serious problem with fibrous fruits and i can only tollerate well cooked rice. But i feel best when i avoid both soluble fiber and starch.

 

[jyb]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

It is the cheapest and I'm low on money. Peat drank a concentrate for years until they changed something and he couldn't tolerate it anymore. I drink the juice and feel ok, I don't have any reasons yet to change.

What's on your food list here in the UK? I'm looking for ideas to diversify esp. protein sources... On a daily basis I get

- fresh bottled OJ (from any store)
- concentrated OJ (Sainsburys)
- organic semi-skimmed milk (from any store)
- Parmesan certified (animal rennet)
- 1 organic egg
- a few tablespoons gelatin powder
- coffee
- salt (decided to have the Morton one shipped to avoid the ferrocyanide additive)
- supplements (incl. aspirin which I filter)
- weekly liver (organic butcher), and oysters but more irregularly

So I really rely a lot on the cheese to get protein. I find it hard otherwise to reach 90-100g. Problem is that in street stores I've only identified the parmesan as being made with minimal ingredients and animal rennet - so I'm getting a bit bored of it.

I probably don't get enough copper daily except days I eat liver. I don't eat chocolate bar, they give me acne. Instead I use a copper cup, which I hope leaches enough copper.

 

[tobieagle]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

jyb why dont you take some beef a few times a week? Relative cheap source of protein if you back it up with some gelatin.

 

[chris]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

jyb - I use milk for the majority of my protein needs, I aim to drink a full skim medium carton, 4 pints which gets ~70g protein. I add 1 or 2 eggs a day, perhaps I am a little low on protein thinking about it. I have been buying a few steaks and freezing them, eating a small amount on the odd day but not noticed anything different.

My food list is not drastically different to yours, where do you purchase oysters from? I've not found anywhere that I thought were good enough.

 

[jyb]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

jyb - I use milk for the majority of my protein needs, I aim to drink a full skim medium carton, 4 pints which gets ~70g protein. I add 1 or 2 eggs a day, perhaps I am a little low on protein thinking about it. I have been buying a few steaks and freezing them, eating a small amount on the odd day but not noticed anything different.

My food list is not drastically different to yours, where do you purchase oysters from? I've not found anywhere that I thought were good enough.

I go to the fishmonger. A fishmonger should have oysters, though not always. It's a good fishmonger, but I don't know how to judge their oysters. I've noticed that the oysters currently look greener and smaller, but I would have thought that's due to the winter season. Chains like Sainsburys sell canned smokedoysters in sunflower oil. Danny Roddy says canned is ok, but I don't trust these particular cans: you could rinse off the oil but its not perfect and the cans probably leach chemicals.

You found any other animal rennet cheese in commercial stores, apart from parmesan?

@tobieagle: If it's for protein, then milk and cheese as I do is probably better? Don't need gelatin nor to balance with calcium. But I think steak might be interesting for the extra vitamins.

 

[Beebop]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

You found any other animal rennet cheese in commercial stores, apart from parmesan?

Hey jyb, I posted this in another thread already but in case you didn't see it and you're still looking for cheese, Co-op does lots of animal rennet cheese (although sadly not organic - but at least it's easy to get!)

Emmental, Mozzarella, Gruyere, Manchego, a couple more all animal rennet only. I'm still looking for a medium cheddar personally, so if you know of one...

 

[Swandattur]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

I just want to add my own experience. Starch appears to be pretty much bad for me. I haven't done well with probiotics. In fact, now I think they cause depression for me. The carrot salad seems to help me a lot. Bell peppers and now maybe all peppers cause bloating for me, and so does cucumber. Don't know if it's good for me, but I love the pulp in freshly squeezed orange juice.
It seems like we come from different species with some people doing so well with probiotics and others not at all, and some doing well with the carrot salad and others not. My sister feels probiotics help her. She has some sort of trouble with starch or maybe it's just grains. She has an aversion to raw carrot. She has trouble with diarrhea and I have more trouble the other way. I wonder if bloating goes with constipation and not so much with diarrhea. Another sister has similar problems to the sister already mentioned. I finally lost most of my excess weight on low carb (and paid with new problems.) The excess weight I do and did have is not and wasn't in the hip area. My hips stay scrawny. :) When my sisters gain weight it is more in the hips. Just wonder if these things are related in some way.

 

[Dutchie]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

I just want to add my own experience. Starch appears to be pretty much bad for me. I haven't done well with probiotics. In fact, now I think they cause depression for me. The carrot salad seems to help me a lot. Bell peppers and now maybe all peppers cause bloating for me, and so does cucumber. Don't know if it's good for me, but I love the pulp in freshly squeezed orange juice.
It seems like we come from different species with some people doing so well with probiotics and others not at all, and some doing well with the carrot salad and others not. My sister feels probiotics help her. She has some sort of trouble with starch or maybe it's just grains. She has an aversion to raw carrot. She has trouble with diarrhea and I have more trouble the other way. I wonder if bloating goes with constipation and not so much with diarrhea. Another sister has similar problems to the sister already mentioned. I finally lost most of my excess weight on low carb (and paid with new problems.) The excess weight I do and did have is not and wasn't in the hip area. My hips stay scrawny. :) When my sisters gain weight it is more in the hips. Just wonder if these things are related in some way.

I wonder if the probiotics&depression migth be a good sign,as to what they love to call die-off in GAPS? I sometimes notice the same with gelatin,although I love my gummies. Usually some time after eating the gummies,or sometimes quickly after, I'm able to go to the toilet to 'dump' some stuff......after that I usually feel better/optimistic again. I noticed that I usually feel depressed/anxious,rapid heartbeat,sometimes consantly thinking of food rigth before I'm able to go to the toilet to do a #2. After it all has usually vanished and I'm fine. I wonder why this is?

Probiotics&gelatin do adress digestive&gut issues. And on a strict Peat diet one sort of minimizes bad gutflora by feeding it sugar,but you also don't adress feeding good bacteria since it's all very fiberless. So,yes your gut should be balanced with Peating but it's a very thin line and maybe that's also why people keep going back&forth in regards to tolerating/digesting foods especially if you're diet is devoid of probiotics and/or gelatin.

Just a thougth....

 

[pboy]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

technically every yeast and a lot of bacterias contains fiber in their cell wall, so even like...cheese with no fiber will add bulk to stools. In fact, about 75% of the solid mass of stool is shed skin cells and bacteria from the colon, so even if you eat no fiber at all you will still have solid formed stools if you're healthy (think about a cooked egg yolk, no fiber yet slightly solid and bulky but moves and slides easy...or a weiner for that matter). I can attest to this. Sometimes eating is actually necessary to have a bowel movement...its like when you put your finger on one end of a straw and the fluid stays in it even when you lift it out of the cup...adding pressure or relieving the valve on one end can cause whats inside to move....so adding pressure from water + sugar, protein, or salt to your stomach naturally puts some pressure on the intestine and pushes some air down which could facilitate a bowel movement. Drinking a couple cups of OJ or milk early in the morning is good to move...pure water not as much. Also, relieving pressure from your bowel can actually profoundly effect your ability to breath, and allow more free movement of everything else in your intestines and therefore you'll feel a lot better. When you're under stress or sense that you aren't in a place to relieve your bowel, you will subconsciously clench the bowel...so anything from environmental to lack of nutrition stress is really the issue behind bowel problems, not fiber or probiotics

 

[Swandattur]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

In reply to Dutchie: that is a thought, but I don't think I could stand the cure. Depression is just too bad. I would have to know for sure the probiotics were really helping and not ultimately causing worse problems. Gelatin causes me to have allergy problems. Every time I try some, I get some sort of unpleasant reaction. It seems like a histamine intolerance reaction. I'm just leery of both those things now. I ate some gummy bears the other day and it wasn't good. I have read that there are probiotic bacteria that don't produce histamine and maybe help dispose of it, I think. Maybe the people who have trouble with probiotics have histamine intolerance or already have too many histamine producing bacteria in the gut. I have read that a couple of signs a person may be histamine intolerant are being prone to motion sickness and (if you are female) having painful periods. I suppose those are equally signs of too much serotonin or is it estrogen?

 

[Jenn]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

Not everyone can handle a lot of gelatin. Too much can be hard on the kidneys, if they are overworked already. How it is eaten can affect how the body metabolizes it too (solid, liquid, dry). Just because something is "good" doesn't mean our body knows what to do with it.

 

[Swandattur]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

That's a good thing to keep in mind, and no sense beating one's head against a brick wall. Maybe, when I'm in better shape, it will be okay for me.

 

[Dutchie]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

In reply to Dutchie: that is a thought, but I don't think I could stand the cure. Depression is just too bad. I would have to know for sure the probiotics were really helping and not ultimately causing worse problems. Gelatin causes me to have allergy problems. Every time I try some, I get some sort of unpleasant reaction. It seems like a histamine intolerance reaction. I'm just leery of both those things now. I ate some gummy bears the other day and it wasn't good. I have read that there are probiotic bacteria that don't produce histamine and maybe help dispose of it, I think. Maybe the people who have trouble with probiotics have histamine intolerance or already have too many histamine producing bacteria in the gut. I have read that a couple of signs a person may be histamine intolerant are being prone to motion sickness and (if you are female) having painful periods. I suppose those are equally signs of too much serotonin or is it estrogen?

All of Peats written work about serotonin&estrogen is interesting,but the problem's that it's all too scientific for me so I actually have no idea what the theory is all about.
I wonder why I always feel so d*mn anxious/depressed/lethargic or whatever rigth before I can get to the toilet.......unfortunately I never read/seen someone experiencing the same and what it is all about. I know GAPS is all about bad gutflora,die-off&stuff and I have no idea if this is the case,badgutflora or other critters dying-off and steering me towards stuff in order to be alive or that it is something else.....
Like I said,I have no idea what Peat's thougths are on this. (Btw,I read people mailing him....can you just mail him with a problem and just ask or does he do paid consultations or what's the deal?)

As for the gelatinpowder, I've only used it to make gummies 3 times now but I do it kind of on a hunch not carefully measuring ingredients so that migth be the problem. Maybe I sometimes had too much water&maple syrup compared to gelatin...or maybe didn't grease the tray thorough enough with Coconut Oil....couldve been all kinds of things. Im not giving up the gelatin powder however bc I think it's an important part in gut&overall wellbeing....and I love the gummies/jello
Wish I could use the three jars of actual frozen lambgelatin to make gummies.....

 

[4peatssake]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

All of Peats written work about serotonin&estrogen is interesting,but the problem's that it's all too scientific for me so I actually have no idea what the theory is all about.

It's very difficult to apply Peat's ideas to your diet if you have no idea what his work is about. If you have difficulty reading his articles, then listen to his recordings. Trying to do this without having a basic understanding is a recipe for disaster in my opinion.

My suggestion is to read a portion of one of his articles every day - even if you understand only a little and listen to his recordings. Over time, you will understand and then can truly begin to put things into a workable practice.

I'd also suggest using positive affirmations to counter negative self talk. It is important to believe in yourself and take baby steps.

 

[Jenn]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

Summary:
Avoid PUFAs!!!!! plus tryptophan and isolated amino acids. (All "bad" things are harmful because of damage or interaction with PUFAs, no pufas and things like radiation or estrogen won't harm)

Most Protective (not in any particular order):
Coconut oil
salt
progesterone
gelatin

Not that there aren't other good or bad things too, but you can do a LOT of healing just adding coconut oil and enough salt in the diet....like stop cancer.

 

[Jenn]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

I agree the recordings are easier to understand. I think it's because he is answering specific questions. He may be brilliant, but he's a lousy writer when it comes to organizing his thoughts. IMO.

 

[HDD]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

All of Peats written work about serotonin&estrogen is interesting,but the problem's that it's all too scientific for me so I actually have no idea what the theory is all about.

It's very difficult to apply Peat's ideas to your diet if you have no idea what his work is about. If you have difficulty reading his articles, then listen to his recordings. Trying to do this without having a basic understanding is a recipe for disaster in my opinion.

My suggestion is to read a portion of one of his articles every day - even if you understand only a little and listen to his recordings. Over time, you will understand and then can truly begin to put things into a workable practice.

I'd also suggest using positive affirmations to counter negative self talk. It is important to believe in yourself and take baby steps.

I couldn't agree more, 4Peats. Dutchie, working at learning and understanding Ray Peat's writings and interviews is a very worthwhile endeavor. You are young and this is an education that can literally save your life and of those lives that you touch. I have been reading and listening for over a year and as I reread an article, I understand a little more. It has been a slow process but I am very grateful that we have his articles and this community to help us.

 

[HDD]

Re: I think gut bacteria is good for us...

I wonder why I always feel so d*mn anxious/depressed/lethargic or whatever rigth before I can get to the toilet.......unfortunately I never read/seen someone experiencing the same and what it is all about.


There have been several times when my son will say he doesn't feel well. I usually inquire about his b.m.'s and within a short while he will report that that was it. We don't go into much more detail than that because he thinks I am weird to ask. My other son always seems to "go" when he gets nervous about doing something. And just yesterday, the woman I take care of was a little down and thought she might need to see a Dr. A little later she "went" and after she commented that that must of been why she was feeling bad. I don't know the scientific reason but it seems it is not uncommon.

Do you eat the carrot salad?