I think I just ruined my thyroid forever with Iodine.

yerrag

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I think whoever started this high iodine craze should be ashamed of themselves. No telling who all this protocol has hurt. Thankfully this is one thing I never got caught up in. Just eat seafood, eggs, and occasionally use some iodized salt (once a week, maybe) and you'll never have to worry about iodine deficiency. Large dosages (in the milligrams) can wreck havoc.
No need for histrionics here.

Doctors in the past have used iodine successfully. Back when many doctors knew more than we do. We didn't have to experiment because there were doctors we could turn to.

It hasn't been the case for a long time now. Doctors are just being taught as technicians, and are not allowed to use iodine. Not because it doesn't work, but because with their dumbed down training they can't handle the nuances of using it.

There are risks involved, and not everyone can manage these risks. Some just rush headlong into something without rtfm, and some are impatient for quick results and often want to bite more than they can chew.

Because there are always people who get harmed by their lack of caution, that should not be a reason for you to think that the use of some substances should be banned..

You may be influenced very much by Ray Peat's thinking on iodine, in which he discourages its use. But I think Ray Peat, as a leader that has a cult following, is bound to the legalities and the politics of the current environment of blaming the messenger, and plays by those rules.

He also knows there are many followers who think in black and white, as can be gleaned from how he answers on interviews, which is addressed to the simple "yes or no" mindset of substandard American Talmudist-influenced educated graduates of the public school system.

He knows there are few who will read his books and newsletters and be able to fully internalize them, but to those who will and can, he probably knows the greater latitude of freedom to use substances outside the boundaries of the authoritarian medical regime, is a.necessary path in seeking health.
 

brightside

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I've research that topic long. When it came to idodine most orthomelecular experts, supplement-guys like Cohen (Selfhacked), Weston-A-Price foundation... long list... they are all cautious above ~ 200-500 µg / day. Especially if you don't know your thyroid status, you really can do yourelf a gigantic dis-service. Same with Selenium. I've seen blood-work in the 450-range (whole blood) only with brasil-nuts!

Milligram-doses of Iodine are not physiological - they are an emergency-measure.

10 mg Iodine (50 times 200 µg) is like taking 15 g magnesium, 750 mg iron, 150-200 mg copper, 5 mg Selenium. Nobody in their right mind would do that!

Best,
Hans
And yet, terrifyingly large doses or sodium and chloride are... perfectly safe. (say, 50-60g of salt. That's not quite 50x rda, but I think my point still stands)

I'm not defending taking gram doses for prolonged periods, but 10mg of KI is not something to be worried about. Especially if you are using it to treat fungal problems, for example.
 

AlaskaJono

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@yerrag
Thanks for the above. For the record when I did a macro-mineral top up at my 50th year, as did my wife, I did massive research, and one of the interesting things that came up in Iodine and lugol's research was that in the 19th century dosages of 250-500 mg were prescribed daily for a course of 10 days in extreme circumstances, AND for radiation poisoning 120 mg daily for some days/weeks is advised in recent time. (Do check for how long but.... it is up to you if a radioactive situation occurs).

If people are wimpy and afraid or truly hypersensitive it does not mean that the substance should be banned. Ridiculous. Yerrag is absolutely right in that cultish behaviour regarding Ray's information is not and should not be taken as Gospel. Otherwise you have farmed out your perception, and thinking! Much less acting.
Note:
(Yes people were much stronger in the old days. And 30 years ago the clients I had who were 75 y/o to 85 were much stouter in constitution for the most part than clients half their age. They had a diet rich in minerals and lacking in chemicals that did not exist then. My uncle died recently at 95 y/o and we spoke last in March 2021. He was sad that he had to give up his cigars then. He enjoyed them since his 20's, so I said he had 75 years of enjoyment. So that is fantastic. )
 

Jessie

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Lots of people. Flechas and Brownstein gave the tempate and lots of people copied it. If you look who has shares / ownership in Optimox (Iodoral), you become carefull.

Because when one does such a crazy thing there are tonns of things to do before including an monitoring of the thyroid. Idodine >>>> 1-2mg / day is a pharmalogical intervention, like 500-1500 mg Iron infusions which are equally crazy.
When you're unsure about something, all you really have to do is follow the money. That typically makes things much more clear.
 

Advocate2021

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Dr. Peat strongly opposes supplemental iodine just saying. I was put on iodoral many years ago (dont remember dose but it was on the lower end of that cult regimen) on my health travels and ended up with severe thyroiditis, my heart leaping out of my chest and feeling like i was orbiting off the planet. had to take medication to lower heart rate and drink cabbage juice even though i was never hyperthyroid. Iodine, Per Dr. Peat, is toxic to the gland, irritated it and cause mine to release ridiculous levels of t3 and t4 suddenly. it was extremely scary and i discussed with Dr. Peat and he is absolutely emphatic regarding iodine being toxic to the thyroid. i personally would never touch it again despite people here touting it. It is abundant in a good diet and thats how Dr. Peat said to get it.
 

h.c.

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When you're unsure about something, all you really have to do is follow the money. That typically makes things much more clear.
Do you mean: Abramas is owner of Optimox, which produces Iodoral? Also Abrahams financed the studies of Flechas and Brownstein? Or do you mean the P**rma-Complex which earns money by enhancing diseases by missinformation?

See here for the reference of my statements: The Great Iodine Debate - The Weston A. Price Foundation
 

yerrag

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Dr. Peat strongly opposes supplemental iodine just saying. I was put on iodoral many years ago (dont remember dose but it was on the lower end of that cult regimen) on my health travels and ended up with severe thyroiditis, my heart leaping out of my chest and feeling like i was orbiting off the planet. had to take medication to lower heart rate and drink cabbage juice even though i was never hyperthyroid. Iodine, Per Dr. Peat, is toxic to the gland, irritated it and cause mine to release ridiculous levels of t3 and t4 suddenly. it was extremely scary and i discussed with Dr. Peat and he is absolutely emphatic regarding iodine being toxic to the thyroid. i personally would never touch it again despite people here touting it. It is abundant in a good diet and thats how Dr. Peat said to get it.
I'm sorry that you were put in harm's way in using iodine. I don't know the specifics of your case and I don't want to second guess, but wonder about the rationale of using iodine to fix hyperthyroidism. Could this be a matter of bad doctor more than a case of iodine bad?

I agree with Peat in preferring to use thyroid instead of iodine for matters relating to low thyroid, but iodine has been used for microbial issues successfully and effectively.

As with anything good, there is a double edged sword in its nature, and it is in treating this nature with respect that we get deliverance.

I have used both Lugol's and SSKI and both were excellent in dealing with microbial issues.

I use 3 drops of SSKI amounting to 150mg in water as a mouthwash to help keep periodontal bugs away, and it has been very effective in keeping me from losing more teeth to the elusive periodontal bugs that hide in the crevices of my periodontal tissues.

And Lugol's was effective in reducing a developing edema, as well as in lowering LDH, a general marker of inflammation, which goes to show its systemic effect of lowering microbial proliferation.

And after trying out other "safe" ways, I am glad I did not ban it from myself because I believe I can respect iodine enough.
 

Advocate2021

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I'm sorry that you were put in harm's way in using iodine. I don't know the specifics of your case and I don't want to second guess, but wonder about the rationale of using iodine to fix hyperthyroidism. Could this be a matter of bad doctor more than a case of iodine bad?

I agree with Peat in preferring to use thyroid instead of iodine for matters relating to low thyroid, but iodine has been used for microbial issues successfully and effectively.

As with anything good, there is a double edged sword in its nature, and it is in treating this nature with respect that we get deliverance.

I have used both Lugol's and SSKI and both were excellent in dealing with microbial issues.

I use 3 drops of SSKI amounting to 150mg in water as a mouthwash to help keep periodontal bugs away, and it has been very effective in keeping me from losing more teeth to the elusive periodontal bugs that hide in the crevices of my periodontal tissues.

And Lugol's was effective in reducing a developing edema, as well as in lowering LDH, a general marker of inflammation, which goes to show its systemic effect of lowering microbial proliferation.

And after trying out other "safe" ways, I am glad I did not ban it from myself because I believe I can respect iodine enough.
I do not have hyperthyroidism. I was hypothyroid and they were using it to address that apparently. But it irritated my gland and made the glands secrete reticulous amounts of hormones making me look like I was hyperthyroid but I really wasn't it was just an irritation of the land that caused it to release excessive hormones and gave me the symptoms of hyperthyroidism. It caused an aggravation of the gland but it was being used to treat hypothyroidism not hyperthyroidism. As I've said elsewhere the proof is in the pudding. If something works for someone there's really no refuting that. I just share my own experience and I'm never touching the stuff again
 

AlaskaJono

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It is abundant in a good diet and thats how Dr. Peat said to get it.
(It being Iodine.) Yes we all can have reactions and severe reactions to supplements/herbs/medications that others do not. Or we are in the <1% category. I know from your prior posts that you have had a delayed hormonal situation in life, and that you particularly may need to be careful when adding 'new' elements (pun partially intended).

I had an allergic reaction to an herbal extract prescribed to me by my Naturopathic physician in the mid 1980's. I went anaphylactic in a matter of hours. If I did not go to the ER, and was not given steroids I would have died. Hundreds or thousands of people were given this product before with no negative effects. But I did find out a few years later that I was the third person to have a strong reaction, and particularly the company attribute the reaction to something in the bark of the plant. So they stopped production.

Iodine in diet: IF minerals and elements are not in the soil, one can never benefit from eating certain foods which are said to be rich in iodine, or potassium, etc.. . Tasmania has had a history of goiter and thyroid dysfunction, due to iodine deficient soil. Also Australia and New Zealand are both (overall) deficient in Selenium in the soil as well. There are generations of jokes about the "two headed Tasmania" because of prevalence of large goiters in the population in history.
People do eat seafood here, mostly fish and chips.....but it is not a large part of the diet, unless one has a fisherman in the family, and it is actually more expensive than meat. Sad.

Australia's FDA banned vitamin supplements with selenium in it as it was not deemed essential or vital for health, regardless of the scientific information from the rest of the planet. I know as I tried to get a friend's products (Dr. Russel Marz) into the country in 1992 and it was simply not possible. Now it is ok.
 

yerrag

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I do not have hyperthyroidism. I was hypothyroid and they were using it to address that apparently. But it irritated my gland and made the glands secrete reticulous amounts of hormones making me look like I was hyperthyroid but I really wasn't it was just an irritation of the land that caused it to release excessive hormones and gave me the symptoms of hyperthyroidism. It caused an aggravation of the gland but it was being used to treat hypothyroidism not hyperthyroidism. As I've said elsewhere the proof is in the pudding. If something works for someone there's really no refuting that. I just share my own experience and I'm never touching the stuff again
Sorry I misread that part about you being mistaken as hyperthyroid.

With your experience, it is best not to touch iodine and look for other options. With my experience using it, as I had shared, I can only recommend using it with care. It is not for everybody.
 

yerrag

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@yerrag
Thanks for the above. For the record when I did a macro-mineral top up at my 50th year, as did my wife, I did massive research, and one of the interesting things that came up in Iodine and lugol's research was that in the 19th century dosages of 250-500 mg were prescribed daily for a course of 10 days in extreme circumstances, AND for radiation poisoning 120 mg daily for some days/weeks is advised in recent time. (Do check for how long but.... it is up to you if a radioactive situation occurs).

If people are wimpy and afraid or truly hypersensitive it does not mean that the substance should be banned. Ridiculous. Yerrag is absolutely right in that cultish behaviour regarding Ray's information is not and should not be taken as Gospel. Otherwise you have farmed out your perception, and thinking! Much less acting.
Note:
(Yes people were much stronger in the old days. And 30 years ago the clients I had who were 75 y/o to 85 were much stouter in constitution for the most part than clients half their age. They had a diet rich in minerals and lacking in chemicals that did not exist then. My uncle died recently at 95 y/o and we spoke last in March 2021. He was sad that he had to give up his cigars then. He enjoyed them since his 20's, so I said he had 75 years of enjoyment. So that is fantastic. )
I'm happy to hear of your observations that bear witness to the resilience of humans in the not too distant past. Comparing to their present state of frailty, I wonder what all this hullabaloo is about progress.

Funny how modern cars are like us. A bit of flooding, and the electronics to be replaced cost a lot. Inverter air conditioners supposedly save electricity, only for the savings to be taken back by increased maintenance costs of the electronics.

Ray Peat talks of how impervious to allergenic insults a person with optimal metabolism is. I would extend that bulletproofness even to simple substances such as iodine.

Our biological resilience being so much watered down by the 'progress' of modern medicine and industrial agriculture, it is no surprise that what used to be good can be easily shunned, and in its place are a bunch of alternatives that doctors throw darts with.

William Tell would have a field day over our bunch of sissy doctors.
 

h.c.

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Thanks. Yeah that's exactly what I was talking about.
So everybody with "dough" in the game, be it a product, book, therapeutic offerings - is "un-truthful" to some degree eiter directly or indirectly?

I mean, how good would a book sell, that would be quite differentiated on high-dose iodine, or one which only tells you that you should not do it or when, then with a complicated process of things to do before? People want to hear great sucess-stories - only that the reality has lots of greys....
 

DonLore

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As iodine has been used for at least a 100 years? in large milligram doses and the anecdotes of side effects are rare, I think its only some 0.1% of people who get a strong, momentary negative reaction. Some even say they are iodine deficient, so its really the deficiency that is the problem, not the iodine per say
 

h.c.

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As iodine has been used for at least a 100 years? in large milligram doses and the anecdotes of side effects are rare, I think its only some 0.1% of people who get a strong, momentary negative reaction. Some even say they are iodine deficient, so its really the deficiency that is the problem, not the iodine per say
You find lots with high mg-doses in old literature - but in the same literature they treated people with arsenic and the like. Even mercury had its success-stories.

Issue that is documented lots is: People with a big deficiency and with thyroid issues like knots and the like have problem with abrupt high doses of iodine.

I do not think that the sledge-hammer method is the one to go. A sledge hammer is something for emergencies. Be it with copper, iron, selenium, vitamin D, retinol and lots of other stuff that accumulates in the body.

1-2 mg / day if all is o.k. as KI or Kelp or Wakame are o.k. for me - for more I see no data and especially no historical data at all.

Best,
Hans
 

Waynish

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Ya you damaged the thyroid tissue a little bit but it can regenerate. Just have lots of salt, sun, and work on your breathing and metabolism and rest. Will likely be better than before afterward.
 

Yucca

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I agree, it's somewhat crazy when you think about it. There's very little well done scientific reasoning backing those doses (that I've seen). Some people do experience resolution of some issues on these high doses, but in that case it's used as a pharmaceutical and not an essential mineral and comes with such risks.

Japanese are taking more than that (about 13-14mg) every day of their life. No worries at all. Even over 50mg/day. Just be careful to build slowly, but I was able to get 50mg within 2 weeks (from 0) , without any sides (just some more energy levels)
 

h.c.

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Japanese are taking more than that (about 13-14mg) every day of their life. No worries at all. Even over 50mg/day. Just be careful to build slowly, but I was able to get 50mg within 2 weeks (from 0) , without any sides (just some more energy levels)
This is untrue and typical stuff Ioddine-hyping people or authors have put into the world without any credible references. The average japanese intake is estimated at approx 1-3 mg/day. And basically every study reports that when there are thyroid-issues doses of >= 500µg go wrong. Approx 1 mg is also the consens regarding the real optimal intake if everything is o.k.

My sources:

[18] Assessment of Japanese iodine intake based on seaweed consumption in Japan: A literature-based analysis, Theodore T Zava and David T Zava, Thyroid Res. 2011; 4: 14.
[24] Clinical Evaluation of the lodide/Creatinine Ratio of Casual Urine Samples as an Index of Daily Iodide Excretion in a Population Study, Konno et al, Endocrine Journal 1993, 40 (1), 163-169
[36] The “Ideal” Daily Human Iodine Requirement., Ringsdorf WM, Chraskin E and Medfbird FH.
[33] The Great Iodine Debate, Sally Fallon Morrell, Weston A. Price Foundation, June 22, 2009
 
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joaquin

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I've taken too much before and now I take maybe one drop a week.

On a sidenote: I have a temp usually of about 97. I don't know if it will ever get higher than that. I've tried many things. High carb diet.. no pufas, low carb, keto, carnivore.. I don't like having a low temp. I'm not cold but I wish I were warmer.
 

h.c.

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I've taken too much before and now I take maybe one drop a week.

On a sidenote: I have a temp usually of about 97. I don't know if it will ever get higher than that. I've tried many things. High carb diet.. no pufas, low carb, keto, carnivore.. I don't like having a low temp. I'm not cold but I wish I were warmer.
My tipp: Check yout thyroid, fT3, fT4, Ultrasonic: size of lobes, tissue structure. If andthing is strange: rT3 and antibodies. Also: Take small doeses of iodine, ever one big dose at once. This is not physiological. If you mean 6,25 mg of iodine with "one drop", then this is crazy.

Best,
hans
 

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