I Don't Think I Can Recover, Suicidal| Mental Health Log

rmgwm

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Sep 6, 2015
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I don't think that's true. The reality is sick people would do anything to get well but I speak from personal experience still getting better from my own health issues 2 yrs later, that it's not possible to believe in miracle cures anymore, so that's why when someone says "just do this and you'll get better, I promise" you kinda roll your eyes and go yeah right, heard that 100x already. Not saying you don't have useful knowledge to impart on the OP, or that your advice won't work, but just that this is why people think this way. Like just the other day someone said "Just megadose Niacin man it will solve all your digestion and gut woes" well again, I've been here 2 yrs and still unwell so it's hard for me to believe this, considering this is just one of 100's of advice people have given me over the past 2 yrs, so yes, of course I'm skeptic lol. The advice may very well work, and it is quite possible I might try it in a week or two, but again, when you've tried 100 things already, you start to lose faith that #101 will finally do it lol.

Not to sound argumentative but I was just explaining what my experience has been, not claiming to know how most people behave. I literally knew of a diabetic who had their leg cut off and then years later died because they wanted to drink coke and continue to eat sugar. I have multiple stories like this. I think we agree though, 100% that it's difficult to take advice seriously when there is so much random, contradictory, and confusing advice on the board.
 

mrchibbs

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I don't think that's true. The reality is sick people would do anything to get well but I speak from personal experience still getting better from my own health issues 2 yrs later, that it's not possible to believe in miracle cures anymore, so that's why when someone says "just do this and you'll get better, I promise" you kinda roll your eyes and go yeah right, heard that 100x already. Not saying you don't have useful knowledge to impart on the OP, or that your advice won't work, but just that this is why people think this way. Like just the other day someone said "Just megadose Niacin man it will solve all your digestion and gut woes" well again, I've been here 2 yrs and still unwell so it's hard for me to believe this, considering this is just one of 100's of advice people have given me over the past 2 yrs, so yes, of course I'm skeptic lol. The advice may very well work, and it is quite possible I might try it in a week or two, but again, when you've tried 100 things already, you start to lose faith that #101 will finally do it lol.

It's also important to fight that mindset, because it can create a positive feedback loop of learned helplessness, which further compounds the problem(s).
I went from a near-death degraded state a year ago to a comfortable and near symptom-free situation now. Am I cured of everything? No I still have issues, but they're relatively minor and since I'm also tracking health data (like you!) I'm seeing a clear positive trend in all of the metrics I'm tracking.

It is important to stick with it because the more you learn, the more you can fine-tune your environment to make sometimes big improvements. For example, aspirin used to do little for me, but since I've started dissolving it in baking soda, I've had incredible improvements. A big factor I think is intestinal irritation. I know Ray has talked about it often, but recently he said something to the extent that we don't notice intestinal irritation during the day when blood sugar is elevated, but that it can be a root cause of many symptoms during the nighttime.

For me, recognizing that intestinal problems were becoming a fundamental issue even if I did not feel pain down there, was a big factor, and that's why for example, the carrot salad can be so important in the long run. It seems trivial and everybody here knows about it, but few of us do it, and there's even people saying it feeds bacteria now, which it absolutely does not.

Measuring the vitamin D levels and realizing how low they were, objectively was a big factor and this summer I've been getting more sun than I've had in a almost decade (coincidently, my health has been getting worse and worse since then).
 

milkboi

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Not to sound argumentative but I was just explaining what my experience has been, not claiming to know how most people behave. I literally knew of a diabetic who had their leg cut off and then years later died because they wanted to drink coke and continue to eat sugar. I have multiple stories like this. I think we agree though, 100% that it's difficult to take advice seriously when there is so much random, contradictory, and confusing advice on the board.

Yeah man, that evil sugar kills daily!!
 
OP
SuperStressed

SuperStressed

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I feel extremely confident I know what your issues are as well as how to greatly improve them. I know because I went through something extremely similar, it's not a coincidence that I guessed that you are jumpy and it hurts your nerves.

Your issues are almost entirely cortisol/adrenaline related and can get far better if you have discipline and will-power to correct them. However, in my experience people would rather continue feeling bad rather than giving up the habits which are causing the problems. I'm not saying that's you, it's just my experience.
What do you think I need to do?
 

Cirion

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Not to sound argumentative but I was just explaining what my experience has been, not claiming to know how most people behave. I literally knew of a diabetic who had their leg cut off and then years later died because they wanted to drink coke and continue to eat sugar. I have multiple stories like this. I think we agree though, 100% that it's difficult to take advice seriously when there is so much random, contradictory, and confusing advice on the board.

Sugar doesn't cause diabetes man you've been a member since before me you should know this..

But to address the point at hand, there's also probably a big difference between people who take charge of their health and those that don't. My main exposure to sick people is this forum, where most are very active in their recovery and absolutely not passive.
 

rmgwm

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Sugar doesn't cause diabetes man you've been a member since before me you should know this..

But to address the point at hand, there's also probably a big difference between people who take charge of their health and those that don't. My main exposure to sick people is this forum, where most are very active in their recovery and absolutely not passive.


I didn't say sugar causes diabetes, but someone who already has diabetes (as I explained above) should not be eating high amounts of sugar.

That's your experience with sick people, my experience is different.
 

rmgwm

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What do you think I need to do?

You will need to alter your diet and if you are taking any supplements you may need to stop some of those. Feel free to DM me your full regular diet, everything that you eat leaving nothing out, supplements too, I hope you're not addicted to coffee/caffeine because that will definitely be one of the first things to go. You can most likely start seeing improvements within two weeks time and then it will progressively get better - I gotta look at your diet first.

That drug can for sure screw up cortisol levels long term.
 

Cirion

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Sugar is the precise food that diabetics should be eating not avoiding.

Glucose and sucrose for diabetes.

If anything, dietary fat should be the macronutrient that diabetics should not be eating except for small amounts of coconut oil. I find this to be true for me, with my own health issues. Ample and unrestricted sugar is the only macronutrient I tolerate in large amounts, while dietary fat and protein both worsen my health.

High blood sugar is caused by elevated FFA's. Eating sufficient carbohydrates will actually decrease the blood sugar over time as the body stops sensing a lack of glucose relative to fats (either FFA's or dietary fats) in the diet.

When a normal person, or even a "type 2 diabetic," is given a large dose of sugar, there is a suppression of lipolysis, and the concentration of free fatty acids in the bloodstream decreases, though the suppression is weaker in the diabetic (Soriguer, et al., 2008). Insulin, released by the sugar, inhibits lipolysis, reducing the supply of fats to the respiring cells.
 

Cirion

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True or False: People with type II diabetes can eat/drink as much sugar as they want.

what's your answer

I know you directed this to @milkboi but since I'm already here...

I would say a diabetic should/can eat ad-libitum nutritious forms of sugars. I don't advocate unrestricted refined white sugar. But no limit to fruit, syrups, juices, honey, etc, and a few colas a day etc and some added sugar to coffee is fine as well (I personally have no refined sugar except one or two colas a day).

Sure, if all you eat is white refined sugar that's not smart, even for a healthy person. So this is kind of a trick question, as no one should be doing that, diabetic or not.
 

rmgwm

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Nutritional Ketosis for Weight Management and Reversal of Metabolic Syndrome. - PubMed - NCBI


A low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet to treat type 2 diabetes

A ketogenic diet can reverse insulin sensitivity and diabetes (type II). I have literally witnessed this first hand in my mother in law who had to take insulin for her type II diabetes (who by the way, decided she would rather eat sugar and once she started again had to get back on insulin [another example of people I know wanting to indulge instead of getting better]).

here is another in-depth analysis on "nutritional ketosis" reversing diabetes (there are countless accounts of this)

https://peterattiamd.com/type-2-diabetes-reversible-scale/

I have never read, nor heard of a single person ever reversing diabetes by eating bountiful amounts of sugar. Ever. Does a story exist? Probably, but I have never seen it.
 
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Cirion

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Man, clearly you are in the wrong forums lol. I'm not gonna derail this guys thread further so this will by my last post. Sorry @SuperStressed I just can't let this kind of stuff fly on a Peat forum of all things.

Keto can keep the symptoms at bay, but keto actually induces further insulin resistance. The moment you go off keto your insulin resistance is worse then ever. I know, because I did keto for two years and even 10 gram of carbs caused me major problems. Keto does not cure your metabolic rate. Yeah you can lose weight, but losing weight is not the same as curing your metabolism. I'm not gonna bother explaining, since Ray does it much better than I can anyway so read his articles. Posting things like this in a guys' log who is struggling and telling him that Peat is wrong and keto is the answer... On a Peat inspired forum is just poor form IMO. He's already confused and struggling enough. If you are looking for a famous example the Kempner diet is one of the most famous well known diet that reverses IR and obesity/diabetes and it is pretty much a purely carb diet (rice and fruit). The people you talk to likely mix carbs and fats and from the sound of it don't focus on nutritious foods full of B vitamins either so of course they won't get better. Then there is McDougal and the starch diet (which I'm not the hugest fan of necessarily, but it can work too). Very few people have the dedication to eat a high carb low to zero fat diet this is why you don't hear about it. People become diabetic for the precise reason of making it a habit of mixing high fat and high carb meals together, especially high PUFA fat and high carb meals. It's pretty much impossible to become diabetic on a high carb zero fat diet.
 
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redsun

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Nutritional Ketosis for Weight Management and Reversal of Metabolic Syndrome. - PubMed - NCBI


A low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet to treat type 2 diabetes

A ketogenic diet can reverse insulin sensitivity and diabetes. I have literally witnessed this first hand in my mother in law who had to take insulin for her type II diabetes.

here is another in-dept analysis on "nutritional ketosis" reversing diabetes

https://peterattiamd.com/type-2-diabetes-reversible-scale/

I have never read, nor heard of a single person ever reversing diabetes by eating bountiful amounts of sugar. Ever. Does a story exist? Probably, but I have never seen it.

It has less to do with the intake of fat or sugar and more to do with nutrient content of diet and lowering free fatty acids in the blood. It is elevated free fatty acids in the blood that is responsible for diabetes. Niacinamide and aspirin is good for this. Where did you come from? Keto is a bandaid, if one could truly cure their diabetic state from keto then they should be able to go back to eating carbs. Some can, especially carnivore dieters eating organs because organs provide the healing nutrients that is the groundwork for proper metabolism. High fat keto is generally crap. Why is it I have yet to hear of these Dr. Berg ketoers stereotypical ex-obese guys every going back to eating carbs? Because they can't. They never cured their insulin resistance or propensity for obesity, or other health issues, they merely painted over them with fat bombs and keto bars. Weight loss as well as a high carb low fat diet(which will induce fat loss anyway) is the recommended diet for insulin resistance, diabetes, obesity, etc...

This is not the correct thread to argue this regardless. Read Peat's work and read the countless studies posted by many members here on the roles of nutrients, carbohydrates, and certain compounds(e.g. niacinamide) in healing oxidative metabolism.
 

rmgwm

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Man, clearly you are in the wrong forums lol. I'm not gonna derail this guys thread further so this will by my last post. Sorry @SuperStressed I just can't let this kind of stuff fly on a Peat forum of all things.

Keto can keep the symptoms at bay, but keto actually induces further insulin resistance. The moment you go off keto your insulin resistance is worse then ever. I know, because I did keto for two years and even 10 gram of carbs caused me major problems. Keto does not cure your metabolic rate. Yeah you can lose weight, but losing weight is not the same as curing your metabolism. I'm not gonna bother explaining, since Ray does it much better than I can anyway so read his articles. Posting things like this in a guys' log who is struggling and telling him that Peat is wrong and keto is the answer... On a Peat inspired forum is just poor form IMO. He's already confused and struggling enough. If you are looking for a famous example the Kempner diet is one of the most famous well known diet that reverses IR and obesity/diabetes and it is pretty much a purely carb diet (rice and fruit). The people you talk to likely mix carbs and fats and from the sound of it don't focus on nutritious foods full of B vitamins either so of course they won't get better. Then there is McDougal and the starch diet (which I'm not the hugest fan of necessarily, but it can work too). Very few people have the dedication to eat a high carb low to zero fat diet this is why you don't hear about it. People become diabetic for the precise reason of making it a habit of mixing high fat and high carb meals together, especially high PUFA fat and high carb meals. It's pretty much impossible to become diabetic on a high carb zero fat diet.


I can't even finish reading that. You have constantly misunderstood or purposely put words in my mouth in every response you made.
 

JCastro

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Jun 8, 2016
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101
At the level of severity you are suffering with anxiety and depression, perhaps an MAOI like Parnate or Nardil would do you well. Ray has spoken favorably of them (in his serotonin article), which is partly how I discovered them. I don't know where I'd be without them, because I pretty much felt like you for a year until I got on Parnate, with similar causes (hydrocortisone and benzodiazepines).

Parnate, among other things, makes life tolerable for me while navigating my other health issues.

Regarding restlessness, agitation, and anxiety, pretty much all supplements worsen that for me, regardless of their documented mechanisms. Even things like magnesium, P5P, niacinamide, and aspirin can make me very depressed regardless of the brand or fillers. I think people like you who have very fragile physiologies need to keep things as simple as possible. Things will not effect you like they're "supposed" to, or how they effect most people.

The only "supplement-like" foods that seem to be helping long-term are coffee and collagen hydrolysate. These, along with Parnate, keep my anxiety very low
 

Light

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Oct 5, 2018
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304
In my current state I am so stressed and sensitive to stress that any kind of routine or attempt to follow any kind of lifestyle or dietary plan raises my stress to such unthinkable levels, the anxiety and obsessive thinking is just unbelievable and you can add chronic fatigue ontop of that.

I am aware of most of Peats views on diet but I am simply unable to implement them without freaking out, ive been stuck here for years. It has proven impossible to calm down because I cannot implement the long term changes that will get me better. The stress is too much and overwelming, it traps me in a state of obsessive anxious thinking and makes it hard to eat.

ofcourse I experience this stress even if im not trying to implement things but it just gets even worse if I try to. Life is unbearable.

Having to focus on anything will stress me out so much. I need a substance that can be taken on its own to lower stress.

Ive tried:
Aspirin
Taurine
Glycine
Gaba
Niacinamide
Theanine
B Vitamins
Alpha blockers
Clonidine (couldnt take significant dose as I got too dizzy)
T3
Progesterone
Pregnenolone
Methylene blue - up to 2mg
Cyproheptadine
Metergoline
Tianeptine
Antibiotics


Im sure theres stuff im forgetting but the point is, none of it seems to work at all.

Even taking my temperature creates a huge stress response, this makes temperature tracking seem pointless. I get stressed by the actual act of following a methodical approach. I don't think I get a temperature response to t3.
Hi @SuperStressed ,
I've had life long depression and tried a ton of meds and supplement.
In the end, what helped wasn't adding anything, but removing almost everything - I went vegan for a few months.
It may not be a plan for the long term, but if you do a PUFA-free vegan regimn it should reduce all inflammation significantly which will reduce depression.
By vegan I mean plant-based, so fruits of all kinds (including things like zucchinis, tomatoes, cucumbers etc. which aren't sweet), and root vegetables.
It didn't in any way get me high or cause euphoria, it just eliminated depression.

In a broader view of life, when you have enough energy for it - doing something for other people, being of service, is a very reliable way of finding purpose and feeling better. Altroism has true healing properties, it doesn't need to be something big, just little things for other people can make a big difference.

Don't give up hope - there is almost always a solution for depression, it's just a matter of trying different things until you find the right thing for you.
I hope it helps and I wish you well with all my heart.
 

gately

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Mar 29, 2013
Messages
305
What do you think I need to do?
You still around? Having just read this whole thread, and having recovered from a very similar state brought on by similar drugs many years ago, I have some ideas.

The first thought that jumps out at me is magnesium. You mention a high calcium / low magnesium diet, taking calcium supplements, and no mention of Magnesium as a supplement you’ve trialed. Form (and consistency) matters, with transdermal being the most optimal from what I’ve trialed thus far. Mag Glycinate also has its own calming properties but since you’ve tried Glycine with no response, I would go straight to transdermal: trialing a copious amount of transdermal magnesium chloride from ancient minerals on your legs twice a day. PM me if you’re still around and I’ll share with you some other ideas, I’d need some more info before suggesting much else.

Hang in there. You are not helpless. And I will try to help you beat this, if you reach out.

PS - The best piece of advice I received when I was suicidal was, “You can always kill yourself tomorrow.”
 
OP
SuperStressed

SuperStressed

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You still around? Having just read this whole thread, and having recovered from a very similar state brought on by similar drugs many years ago, I have some ideas.

The first thought that jumps out at me is magnesium. You mention a high calcium / low magnesium diet, taking calcium supplements, and no mention of Magnesium as a supplement you’ve trialed. Form (and consistency) matters, with transdermal being the most optimal from what I’ve trialed thus far. Mag Glycinate also has its own calming properties but since you’ve tried Glycine with no response, I would go straight to transdermal: trialing a copious amount of transdermal magnesium chloride from ancient minerals on your legs twice a day. PM me if you’re still around and I’ll share with you some other ideas, I’d need some more info before suggesting much else.

Hang in there. You are not helpless. And I will try to help you beat this, if you reach out.

PS - The best piece of advice I received when I was suicidal was, “You can always kill yourself tomorrow.”
Hi im still around, it wont let me PM you.
 

GelatinGoblin

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Apr 15, 2020
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Have you ever thought about seeking help for your anxiety and obsessive thinking? I don't have any experience with therapists but if you can find a good one that may be of help.

A few years back I would on a daily basis ruminate until I was crippled by cortisol and thought I was going insane. Psychological stress, anxiety, OCD etc can really **** you up.

Switching to a peaty diet has certainly helped me (had my worst episodes when I was doing IF and eating tons of pufa) but the big difference has been due to a gradual change in my perspective of myself, my own thoughts and feelings and finding peace in the present moment.

Eckhart tolle has some good stuff but he has a tendency of getting a bit too "theoretical", I prefer this mans more simple explanations . Good luck!


Ha, just discovered him yesterday.
 

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