Hypothyroidism Is Naturally Induced Chemo Therapy. Every Metabolic Stressor Is A Carcinogenic

Ableton

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So I have outlined this theory in like 2 threads and some people there who seem smart said they liked the meta-theory. So it's about time I lay it out here for you guys to discuss it and most likely refute it! Sorry, its a bit long.

To my person: Haven't read a whole lot of papers or stuff like that, just got most of my knowledge (which is basically non existent when it comes to micro-level stuff) from the forum. This is extremely meta theory level, and in a way surely very naive and over simplified (which arguably could have benefits as an approach, considering how science works nowadays).

One thing that has bugged me was the forums use of the word "stress". What does a stressor really do? The concept is too broad to understand anything with it. One user said "lack of energy" which I like.

Another thing I never understood was: Why do some of us keep being hypothyroid, even if we eat like 5000 calories for example and a highly nutrient dense diet? Meanwhile some people have a third of that fuel and ideal temperatures. I suppose this forums answer would be that the "stressors" like PUFA interact on a chemical level with our body compositions in a way that makes it impossible to raise temperature, even though we have the fuel to do so in this case (or do we not?). This forums answer, if I understand it correctly, would be that our bodies want to raise their temperatures, but can't, because of the stuff that happens on a cellular level stopping energy circulation. Hypothyroidism is thus rendered a disease.

My theory is that hypothyroidism (and any metabolically compromising reaction) is a response, not a disease. A response to a cancer threat induced by our carcinogenic environment.

Why do I believe this?

In order to heal from the damages hypothyroidism for example causes, we would have to re-enter an anabolic state, and well, stop being hypothyroid. Hypothyroidism is the exact reason we are not anabolic, and cannot heal. Yet we are unable to escape hypothyroidism and catabolism, sometimes even despite eating so much quality food, resting so much etc. Maybe there is a reason for that that doesn't come down to our bodies being completely helpless about overcoming it on a chemical/cellular level. Maybe, there is even further "stress" in regeneration/anabolism, maybe even potentially deadly stress?

catabolism = breaking down, hypothyroidism, low metabolism, but ultimately also starvation
anabolism = growth, regeneration, but ultimately also cancer (in presence of carcinogenics, which I theorize, every metabolic "stressor" directly or indirectly is)

When I looked into cancer more questions came up and I finally formed the following idea based on the anabolism/catabolism comparison above:

What if we are hypothyroid/metabolically compromised to keep cancer at bay? What if hypothyroidism induces a catabolic state as a form of natural, light chemo therapy to do that?

Anecdotally, I noticed that there seems to be a paradox in cancer: People who look young for their age (before being put on chemo) seem to be at higher risk of getting cancer to me, or at the very least, not at a lower risk than people looking older (which you would think indicates poorer health and thus higher cancer risk).
Makes sense, because looking young/healthy indicates anabolism (regeneration), and anabolism is not only necessary for regeneration, but also for regeneration gone wrong: cancer cell growth. Worse regeneration, no (or lower risk of) cancer.
What if these peoples response to the cancer threat our environments pose are not adequate in that they are kept in an anabolic state in which their metabolisms are great, but they are in turn at risk of getting a deadly disease?

Every attempt to methylate our DNA to rejuvenate it is a cancer risk, if carcinogenics are present.


What if not getting cancer is the reason we are hypothyroid? What if, evolutionary speaking, hypothyroidism is a response to a death threat in which not dying is priority 1, and having a highly functioning metabolism priority 2, that we have to allow by removing carcinogenics ("stressors")?

This would mean artificially boosting metabolism (e.g. through synthetic thyroid) despite not reducing "stressors"/carcinogenics (which would be the natural way of "allowing" higher metabolism and regeneration) would increase cancer risk.


Thyroid Hormones and Cancer: A Comprehensive Review of Preclinical and Clinical Studies
"However, a large body of evidence suggests that subclinical and clinical hyperthyroidism increase the risk of several solid malignancies while hypothyroidism may reduce aggressiveness or delay the onset of cancer."

T3 levels in relation to prognostic factors in breast cancer: a population-based prospective cohort study
"We have previously found a positive association between prospectively measured levels of triiodothyronine (T3) and breast cancer incidence as well as breast cancer mortality."

@lampofred also theorized that lower temperaturs keep pufa in tissue more stable

ray on methylation among other things:
Protective CO2 and aging



Feel free to not only criticize, but also expand on the theory.
 
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R J

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Cancer cells don’t behave like normal cells and have their own metabolisms and can source their own substrate for growth via deranged metabolisms . Benefit of euthyroid is more energized normal cell can deal with carcinogens and regenerate more easily.

You know more young healthy looking ppl who get cancer than opposite?
 

Ableton

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Cancer cells don’t behave like normal cells and have their own metabolisms and can source their own substrate for growth via deranged metabolisms . Benefit of euthyroid is more energized normal cell can deal with carcinogens and regenerate more easily.

You know more young healthy looking ppl who get cancer than opposite?

relative to their age bracket, yes. you can claim cherry pick of course, but chadwick boseman was like 45 and looked 28. My mom got cancer and looked 10 years younger.

If you are in a catabolic state (which will come with looking old), you are not getting cancer as easily. A tumor is not going to grow on a catabolic "living corpse". Cancer cells require energy after all. That person has a lot of problems, but getting cancer is likely not one of them. The data seems to support this.

Ever noticed how fat (not talking obese) people tend to look younger (not better of course) than their age?

And when they lose that weight, they look amazing, because that fat somehow seems to have kept them young.

They were anabolic all this time and are at a higher cancer risk too.
 
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gaze

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So I have outlined this theory in like 2 threads and some people there who seem smart said they liked the meta-theory. So it's about time I lay it out here for you guys to discuss it and most likely refute it! Sorry, its a bit long.

To my person: Haven't read a whole lot of papers or stuff like that, just got most of my knowledge (which is basically non existent when it comes to micro-level stuff) from the forum. This is extremely meta theory level, and in a way surely very naive and over simplified (which arguably could have benefits as an approach, considering how science works nowadays).

One thing that has bugged me was the forums use of the word "stress". What does a stressor really do? The concept is too broad to understand anything with it. One user said "lack of energy" which I like.

Another thing I never understood was: Why do some of us keep being hypothyroid, even if we eat like 5000 calories for example and a highly nutrient dense diet? Meanwhile some people have a third of that fuel and ideal temperatures. I suppose this forums answer would be that the "stressors" like PUFA interact on a chemical level with our body compositions in a way that makes it impossible to raise temperature, even though we have the fuel to do so in this case (or do we not?). This forums answer, if I understand it correctly, would be that our bodies want to raise their temperatures, but can't, because of the stuff that happens on a cellular level stopping energy circulation. Hypothyroidism is thus rendered a disease.

My theory is that hypothyroidism (and any metabolically compromising reaction) is a response, not a disease. A response to a cancer threat induced by our carcinogenic environment.

Why do I believe this?

In order to heal from the damages hypothyroidism for example causes, we would have to re-enter an anabolic state, and well, stop being hypothyroid. Hypothyroidism is the exact reason we are not anabolic, and cannot heal. Yet we are unable to escape hypothyroidism and catabolism, sometimes even despite eating so much quality food, resting so much etc. Maybe there is a reason for that that doesn't come down to our bodies being completely helpless about overcoming it on a chemical/cellular level. Maybe, there is even further "stress" in regeneration/anabolism, maybe even potentially deadly stress?

catabolism = breaking down, hypothyroidism, low metabolism, but ultimately also starvation
anabolism = growth, regeneration, but ultimately also cancer (in presence of carcinogenics, which I theorize, every metabolic "stressor" directly or indirectly is)

When I looked into cancer more questions came up and I finally formed the following idea based on the anabolism/catabolism comparison above:

What if we are hypothyroid/metabolically compromised to keep cancer at bay? What if hypothyroidism induces a catabolic state as a form of natural, light chemo therapy to do that?

Anecdotally, I noticed that there seems to be a paradox in cancer: People who look young for their age (before being put on chemo) seem to be at higher risk of getting cancer to me, or at the very least, not at a lower risk than people looking older (which you would think indicates poorer health and thus higher cancer risk).
Makes sense, because looking young/healthy indicates anabolism (regeneration), and anabolism is not only necessary for regeneration, but also for regeneration gone wrong: cancer cell growth. Worse regeneration, no (or lower risk of) cancer.
What if these peoples response to the cancer threat our environments pose are not adequate in that they are kept in an anabolic state in which their metabolisms are great, but they are in turn at risk of getting a deadly disease?

Every attempt to methylate our DNA to rejuvenate it is a cancer risk, if carcinogenics are present.


What if not getting cancer is the reason we are hypothyroid? What if, evolutionary speaking, hypothyroidism is a response to a death threat in which not dying is priority 1, and having a highly functioning metabolism priority 2, that we have to allow by removing carcinogenics ("stressors")?

This would mean artificially boosting metabolism (e.g. through synthetic thyroid) despite not reducing "stressors"/carcinogenics (which would be the natural way of "allowing" higher metabolism and regeneration) would increase cancer risk.


Thyroid Hormones and Cancer: A Comprehensive Review of Preclinical and Clinical Studies
"However, a large body of evidence suggests that subclinical and clinical hyperthyroidism increase the risk of several solid malignancies while hypothyroidism may reduce aggressiveness or delay the onset of cancer."

T3 levels in relation to prognostic factors in breast cancer: a population-based prospective cohort study
"We have previously found a positive association between prospectively measured levels of triiodothyronine (T3) and breast cancer incidence as well as breast cancer mortality."

@lampofred also theorized that lower temperaturs keep pufa in tissue more stable

ray on methylation among other things:
Protective CO2 and aging



Feel free to not only criticize, but also expand on the theory.

Well Ray doesnt just reccomend thyroid, but the body needs to be supported nutritionally. For example, hes said cholestrol needs to be high enough before taking thyroid, at least 100 grams of protein, enough carbs to burn as glucose, sufficient vitamin D. If thyroid is taken along with adequte nutrition, then it should be de stressing while improving the immune system. If its not properly supported, then the stress reaction is indeed pro-cancerous, because stress itself is what causes cancer by increasing levels of estrogen, endotoxin absorption, serotonin, and lactic acid. I think your theory would be better if you were to make the argument to not take fish oil, because the body has inflammation for a reason, and if you lower the immune system, then the cancerous things can get worse while giving you the illusion of temporary health. But raising the metabolism through thyroid, if its supported nutritionally (enough calories, protein, calcium, b vitamins), then its improving your immune system to be able to filter out the toxic things and provide the cells with good energy.
 

Ableton

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Well Ray doesnt just reccomend thyroid, but the body needs to be supported nutritionally. For example, hes said cholestrol needs to be high enough before taking thyroid, at least 100 grams of protein, enough carbs to burn as glucose, sufficient vitamin D. If thyroid is taken along with adequte nutrition, then it should be de stressing while improving the immune system. If its not properly supported, then the stress reaction is indeed pro-cancerous, because stress itself is what causes cancer by increasing levels of estrogen, endotoxin absorption, serotonin, and lactic acid. I think your theory would be better if you were to make the argument to not take fish oil, because the body has inflammation for a reason, and if you lower the immune system, then the cancerous things can get worse while giving you the illusion of temporary health. But raising the metabolism through thyroid, if its supported nutritionally (enough calories, protein, calcium, b vitamins), then its improving your immune system to be able to filter out the toxic things and provide the cells with good energy.
the billion dollar question is why supporting your thyroid nutritionally is often not enough on it's own, despite the great healing capacities our bodies potentially have.

I say, because the healing process in itself is cancerous when stressors are present. The stressors cause cancer, they do not cause low thyroid. Our bodies interfere with their own healing (but potentially also cancerous) regeneration through up-/or downregulation of their metabolisms.

Low thyroid is caused as a response so we dont get cancer which we would get in a regenerative state with stressors present. Removing carcinogenics allows your metabolism to flourish again, and to heal, because despite all the growth and dna regeneration, you will not be getting cancer without them.

Why are there people who on ideal diets are not able to reverse hypothyroidism? Their bodies clearly "want" them to be in a catabolic state, because their bodies have everything they need to leave it. They literally have all the building blocks for gr0wth, instead their bodies decide to break themselves down even further. The metabolic regeneration would come with increased cancer risk, since stressors are still there (pufa, emf, estrogens, air pollution).

I think if cancer was out of the picture, everyone would be able to reverse metabolic diseases with proper food intake regardless of other environmental factors.

It doesn't make a lot of sense to me that a person could eat a healthy 4k calory diet and still have low temperatures, if this persons body does not leave them in a catabolic state for a purpose (avoiding death).

Ray Peat: The decline in metabolism results in more cancer.

Me: The decline in metabolism is a response to cancer. If our metabolisms were not declining despite our carcinogenic environment, we would get cancer even more often.
 
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Ableton

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Can someone explain to me why our bodies often stay hypothyroid/metabolically impaired despite having enough proper fuel (evident by the fact that others are not metabolically impaired on a third of that fuel) to heal themselves?

Why are we hypothyroid if the hypothyroidism makes us sick in the first place while having enough nutritional building blocks to leave hypothyroidism/catabolism?

Why are out bodies starving themselves even if we feed them adequately?

How, exactly, is the "stress" we like to talk about here, causing this as a disease?

Why do we like to emphasize the great healing capacities of our bodies in the peat prism, yet we sometimes can't escape hypothyroidism on highly nutrient dense diets?

Could it be that hypothyroidism is a healing capacity in itself in that it saves us from not getting even sicker?
 
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rei

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Cancer is a last-ditch attempt for an organ at staying alive when normal oxidative metabolism has failed and the body is unable to support anaerobic metabolism sufficiently.

Hypothyroidism is an attempt to reduce nutritional and metabolic demand systemically.

Eating 5000 calories a day won't help if you are unable to absorb the nutrition and shift away from the chronic stress. In fact the excess calories will only stress you more.
 

Ableton

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Cancer is a last-ditch attempt for an organ at staying alive when normal oxidative metabolism has failed and the body is unable to support anaerobic metabolism sufficiently.

Hypothyroidism is an attempt to reduce nutritional and metabolic demand systemically.

Eating 5000 calories a day won't help if you are unable to absorb the nutrition and shift away from the chronic stress. In fact the excess calories will only stress you more.

whats stress? an energy deficit?

Hypothyroid people still are able to gain weight on 5000 calories, so how is absorption the problem?


The problem I see with this forums use of "stress" in particular is that we are beginning an argument with it, and we are ending an argument with it.

Hypothyroidism produces and is stress, which is produced by environmental stress, which doesn't let us get out of stress. Sounds like circular reasoning to me, especially if you never define stress.

I suppose our healing capacities are not that great after all if energy doesn't let us get out of an energy deficit for no greater purpose, like cancer avoidance for example.

Also, with "attempt" you are implying its a adaptation, not a disease? Why attempt to be hypothyroid if it only makes you sicker?
 
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rei

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Calories in many cases cannot be prevented from absorbing, but nutrients often need effort to be absorbed. Malfunctioning digestion results in excess calories but lack of nutrition.

Yes, cancer is emergency adaptation, and can be reversed by fixing the issue. Which is often postural damage /fascial tension that puts the organ under chronic mechanical tension/stress. How that translates into changes like thicker, more thrombin Thromin containing secretions and eventually malignancy is well explained under the mammalian stress response theory Mammalian Stress Mechanism - The Resurrection of Stress Theory
 
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ursidae

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Would that be why peat is so militant about pufa, he sped himself up artificially with thyroid and diet so the smallest mistake can spark a fire
 

Ableton

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Would that be why peat is so militant about pufa, he sped himself up artificially with thyroid and diet so the smallest mistake can spark a fire
data I found suggests that artificially speeding up metabolism increases cancer risk
I think pufa downregulates your metabolism though, so it doesn't spark a fire in itself albeit being a carcinogenic too. However, if you add thyroid to the PUFA, things might be different...
 

JudiBlueHen

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Fascinating thread. Might help me understand that while being technically hypothyroid (high TSH, normal T3/T4 labs), I do not seem to benefit from levothyroxine and in fact anything over 25 mcg gives me worse insomnia.
 
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