Hypothyroidism and some other problems

Unseen

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Jul 16, 2013
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BEWARE: THIS IS A LONG POST - ONLY READ IF YOU HAVE THE TIME. :D

Hello guys,

I'm new here and I want to tell you why I'm here.

My problems: I suffer from hypothyroidism for nearly 2 years now, acne and underweight. I'm 19 years old (20 in a few weeks). When I'm eating something, it goes out really quickly and my stomach always feels really really full.
Also a few hours after eating something I'm hungry again (probably because it's going out so fast?) and despite eating ~2700 kilocalories a day without being really active (unless I do sports and when I'm doing so I just eat more to compensate) I'm really, really underweight - I weigh around 123 pounds / 55 kilograms while being 1,8 meters / 5 ft 10 in tall.

What I'm eating currently: Until now I eat what people here would completely consider 'anti Ray Peat': a lot of PUFAs (100g nuts/seeds per day and fatty fish 1-2 times a week), a lot of grain (whole wheat bread, 150g oat flakes a day, a lot of pasta or rice for EVERY dinner), a lot of anti-thyroid lean meat (especially chicken breast nearly every day), some vegetables and legumes like kidney beans - and I'm completely missing milk for over one year now (thought it would be bad for my acne and it wouldn't hurt to withdraw it - I replaced it with a lot of calcium-rich mineral water) - however when I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism milk was a component of my diet.
The only 'good things' I eat (according to a Ray Peat-inspired 'diet') are fruits and especially orange juice (however, I only drink one glass a day)

My conclusion: So after finding out about Ray Peat and what he says about the thyroid - everything makes sense for me and now I completely understand why my TSH value (without taking any supplements) is so high and my thyroid so 'weak'. My endocrinologist wondered why my TSH value is so high, because he noticed nothing wrong on my thyroid - I don't have a (chronic) thyroiditis, no goitre, not any typical symptoms - even when I didn't take any hormones - in fact after finding out about my increased TSH value (I originally presumed the opposite - hyperthyroidism) I didn't take any hormones, only when ~8 months later my hair started to fall out.

Well now you probably know why I'm writing here - I definitely want to change my nutrition protocol, but obviously I can't go from 0 to 100.

Now I would like to hear your opinions about my 'clinical picture'. I definitely think everything is correlative and I hope that with my new nutrition, based on Ray Peats recommendations, I can solve my problems.

My plans: I thought about increasing the milk intake from around one glass a day to over a quart in a month, while gradually decreasing my grain consumption and instantly removing all PUFAs. I also want to eat more fruits and drink more orange juice, while adding gelatine to meat.
The difficult thing is that I can't afford to lose any more weight - so do you think I need to stay on 2700 kilocalories a day or can I afford to lower them when I'm not eating so much indigestive food like nuts, seeds, grain and legumes and more animal food.

And also some 'facts' about my acne: It seems that the more I eat, the worse it gets. I also only have it on my face and the severity is comparable to this guy: http://www.dermacaregainesville.com/gai ... _photo.jpg
 

Dan Wich

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Welcome, Unseen.

Just as encouragement, I had pretty similar problems (underweight, stomach feeling really full, high TSH) that were helped by Peat's approach.

Unseen said:
The difficult thing is that I can't afford to lose any more weight - so do you think I need to stay on 2700 kilocalories a day or can I afford to lower them when I'm not eating so much indigestive food like nuts, seeds, grain and legumes and more animal food.
If your maintenance was truly at 2700 kilocalories, you'll probably need to stay near that (barring serious digestive issues, you probably were still absorbing most of the calories in those foods). But 2700 may not be as hard as it sounds if you pound down a lot of cheese, ice cream, and whole milk.

Unseen said:
It seems that the more I eat, the worse it gets. I also only have it on my face and the severity is comparable to this guy: http://www.dermacaregainesville.com/gai ... _photo.jpg
Be warned that a lot of us here struggle with acne, so don't necessarily expect a cure with just a basic Peat diet.

But overall, I suspect you'll be happy with the results you get, even just trying the steps you mentioned.
 

Mittir

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You can consume 33 to 50 percent of your calories from sugar ( fruits, milk, honey, table sugar)
and sugar directly increases active thyroid hormone.
Daily raw carrot salad or cooked bamboo shoot lowers endotoxins and
increases thyroid hormone and other good hormones.
Weekly 3-6 oz liver is very important to get all the important vitamins and nutrient, especially
Vitamin A which plays a role in acne.
Weekly serving of seafood/shell fish for selenium and iodine. He does not recommend big dose iodine.
Once your thyroid is fixed you may need less calorie to maintain your weight.
You do not need to be worried about calories now. If you see you are loosing weight just eat more calories.
 

Unseen

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Thanks for the input, much appreciated.

Is eating liver occasionally really necessary for the vitamin A it provides (liver is also anti-thyroid) - I mean, if you drink a lot of milk (and that's what I want to do, I think I will tolerate it) you have a lot of vitamin A from it and raw carrots also provide it (although I know it's carotin).

@Dan: Did you take any thyroid hormones and if so, when did you stop it? Right now I'm having difficulties to 'time' everything and I don't want to 'damage' myself because of some stupid decisions. Because I ate so many PUFAs for a long time and my thyroid is 'weak' now it will probably take a long time to 'fix' these issues (if at all, but I'm optimistic), so I'm wondering if I should still take them or not.
 

Mittir

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Unseen said:
Thanks for the input, much appreciated.

Is eating liver occasionally really necessary for the vitamin A it provides (liver is also anti-thyroid) - I mean, if you drink a lot of milk (and that's what I want to do, I think I will tolerate it) you have a lot of vitamin A from it and raw carrots also provide it (although I know it's carotin).

Liver is quite important. Excess vitamin A is anti thyroid, whether it is in liver or supplement.
An average hypothyroid person usually need about 5000 IU vitamin A daily.
Egg yolk is a good source, but it is full of PUFA. Liver has lots of other nutrients.
He does not recommend carotene.
 

Jenn

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Using coconut oil reduces the need for vitamin A. The need for vit A is also dependent on your own personal metabolism. I don't eat liver ate all,except for the occasion liverwurst type meal. I eat eggs from my backyard, when available.

For me, acne is a pancreas/enzyme issue.
 

Dan Wich

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Unseen said:
@Dan: Did you take any thyroid hormones and if so, when did you stop it?

Unseen, I'll send you a PM about this in a few days when I have better internet access.
 

Mastemah

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Working with real people with hypothyroidism ,5000 is not the average amount of A needed. People are very individual. Ranges needed for hypothyroid people can be 5000 to 100,000 iu a day with the higher numbers more common in summer and sunnier areas.

Another important point there's no perfect level that just stays the same. You may need 4x as much in summer as in winter and as metabolism improves you may increase vit A or other nutrients multiple times as you reach a new plateau....
 

Bluebell

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Mastemah, hi! How do you tell how much Vitamin A you need, then, with the changing requirement?
 

Mittir

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Ray Peat mentioned that average hypothyroid person needs about 5000 IU of Vitamin A and excess vitamin A blocks
thyroid function. One can increase Vitamin A intake until it starts lowering thyroid function, that would be
blood test, temp, pulse etc. Here is a quote from RP

http://www.dannyroddy.com/main/2011/12/29/ray-peats-brain-building-a-foundation-for-better-understandi.html

VITAMIN A/DANDRUFF/ACNE

Yes, it's definitely hard to get them coordinated when there's an imbalance in one direction or the other. For several years, when I had an extremely high metabolic rate, I needed 100,000 units per day during sunny weather to prevent acne and ingrown whiskers, but when I moved to a cloudy climate, suddenly that much was too much, and suppressed my thyroid. The average person is likely to be hypothyroid, and to need only 5,000 units per day. Avoiding large amounts of carotene, and getting plenty of vitamin B12 to be able to convert any carotene that's in your food, helps to use vitamin A efficiently.

Yes, vitamin A and estrogen are antagonistic, and while estrogen promotes keratinization (shedding of skin cells), vitamin A opposes it. Since vitamin A is highly unsaturated, in excess it suppresses the thyroid, so it has to be balanced with the thyroid; the combination is effective for increasing progesterone and decreasing estrogen, slowing the turnover of skin cells, and making the skin cells function longer before flaking off. Plugged pores, combined with a local shift toward synthesizing inflammatory substances, foster bacterial infection. Bright light stimulates the production of steroids, and consumes vitamin A very quickly, but when the balance is right, the acne clears up in just a day or two. Cream, butter, eggs, and liver are good sources of vitamin A. When people supplement thyroid and eat liver once or twice a week, their acne and dandruff (and many other problems) usually clear up very quickly. It was acne and dandruff that led me into studying the steroids and thyroid, and in the process I found that they were related to constipation and food sensitivity.

I found that I had an extremely high vitamin A requirement, increased by stress or bright light, and that it related to thyroid function. Usually, thyroid and vitamin A are the supplements that stop acne.

I avoid carotene, because it blocks thyroid and steroid production, and very large, excessive, amounts of vitamin A, retinol, can do the same. I use halibut liver oil-derived vitamin A, or retinyl palmitate.

A solution of aspirin in water on the skin helps with the inflammation, and is mildly germicidal.

Vitamin A deficiency is a common cause of dandruff.
 

Mastemah

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And in speaking with Ray we discussed that it seemed strange that myself and my wife and I needed 100,000 iu and 40,000 iu (her/me) during the summer and wondered if that was dangerous. Ray asked if we were taking Vit D and we replied, 10,000 iu a day, that number based on studies showing that 9,700 iu of D protected against 250,000-300,000 iu of A. He said as long as our temps , hr, and diets were in line and symptoms reduced (we had a hard time initially with acne as our temps and heart rates increased) then it was fine. He said at certain points during the summer, he needed 50,000 iu.

2 years later, she needs about 40,000 iu in the summer and I only need about 10,000 iu (we're in the desert=very bright=need more A, also riboflavin).

So yes there are averages but those are just that-averages. Given the amount of people I talk to that still have skin issues, low A,needing higher doses until things stabilize, combined with thyroid ( low thyroid is why so many seem to "need" enzymes for good digestion), is an answer that's worth exploring.
 

Mastemah

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We tried 10,000 iu jumps up every 4-5 days and the up and down 5000 iu to fine tune. Needed 4x as much in summer. Our high numbers represent summer numbers. Also needed 4x the amount of T3 during summer. All of this decreased over time...
 
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