How to increase blood clotting or estradiol (prothrombin factors)?

Fredvanpeat

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So I just do some very basic health research on my own but I was wondering if any of you know how to increase blood clotting or estradiol in a practical way. It seems for blood clotting you must raise prothrombin factors and maybe some associated special proteins as well?

I obviously know vitamin k family and it’s foods or supplements increase prothrombin factors. But beyond that I’m not exactly sure. Possibly certain PUFAs? I also know to decrease the amount of blood thinning substances like salicylates in foods and basically about everything anti inflammatory like spices and herbs and fruit and some vegetables will likely have blood thinning substances. Even stuff like vitamin d.

I am convinced a lot of my health problems (joint pain, gut problems, tinnitus, and possibly brain fog) are from too many anti inflammatories or blood thinning substances. Anti inflammatories and blood thinners seem to be one in the same as anti inflammatories almost always seem to have the characteristic of thinning the blood, except for possibly vitamin k. They also seem to almost always lower estrogen especially estradiol again except for possibly just vitamin k which seems to lower estrogen and promote clotting.

In regards to vitamin k, it seems as though it can only increase a certain amount of the prothrombin factors 3-5 or so. I was wondering if there are practical ways to increase the others such as certain foods or tips.

Estradiol also seems to increase blood clotting, which I’m sure not everyone would want. This will be useful to know what is proven to raise estradiol though as well just as a way to further hone in on the details of my health besides the fact that it can promote blood clotting.

This can seem anti peat, but I believe it is more of a balance question and I have pushed it way in favor of blood thinning as opposed to blood clotting and I think I run into health problems when I consume more and more anti inflammatory containing substances or foods. I also think you need some of these other blood thinning substances as well or you run into problems that peat describes, my body chemistry just seems extremely sensitive to those right now. I am not a doctor so definitely don’t take it as advice to start looking to increase blood clotting. I’m sure many people don’t need to do that

Thanks for your responses
 
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Serene

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Whenever I take vitamin k my gums bleed. Not sure why I'm sure I could use some. I thought it was supposed to have the opposite effect.
 

AntiPUFA

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Blood clotting rom estrogens is not something you want. It can cause hypertension, heart attacks etc.

Vitamin K2 on the other hand decreases blood calcium while truely limits excess blood thinning.
 

Fredvanpeat

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@Serene I wonder if it is because it lowers estrogen and maybe somehow your body is more setup to estrogen increasing your blood clotting factors rather than vitamin K. It seems prothrombin factors and some other specialized proteins are responsible for blood clotting and vitamin k increases a select few of those factors and proteins, not all of them.

Too much blood clotting is definitely bad for you as Ray peat warns and could cause things like DVT. So too much estrogen is likely bad as well as it seems estrogen increases blood clotting. Ray extensively warns of estrogen obviously.

I think in my case given that I bleed quite often when consuming too many blood thinning substances now, and that my joints hurt and feel weak, that it is possible at times my estradiol is too low during these times. Vitamin k2 doesn’t seem to help my joints and it supposedly lowers estradiol as well. I never take aspirin anymore because it feels like my joints could rip apart and I bleed too easily even with vitamin k2. Aspirin seriously decreases estrogen.

I believe that joint strength/connective tissue strength seems to almost mirror the blood clotting process at least for me as a male. Estrogen is very good for joints it would seem. Estrogen is inflammatory and blood thickening. Anti inflammatories like aspirin all counter estrogen and thin the blood. Therefore since estrogen is good for the joint, anti inflammatories would be bad. Studies seem to back this up.

Again I’m not a doctor or researcher so don’t go avoiding anti inflammatory stuff because I said so. You gotta figure out the right balance and intake of substances that are appropriate for you (Which is certainly not an easy task). Too much estrogen and you will absolutely run into the problems Ray describes.
 

Fredvanpeat

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Blood clotting rom estrogens is not something you want. It can cause hypertension, heart attacks etc.

Vitamin K2 on the other hand decreases blood calcium while truely limits excess blood thinning.

I think too much estradiol is bad, but some is necessary. Especially given how you behave, like in sports and fitness you likely need estrogen to compensate for the severe stress your body incurs or else you will get injured. Vitamin K doesn’t seem adequate enough to fill estrogen’s role in my experience. Then again I have consumed an excess of anti inflammatories so maybe that increases my low estrogen symptoms.
 

Mito

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Whenever I take vitamin k my gums bleed. Not sure why I'm sure I could use some. I thought it was supposed to have the opposite effect.
 

Fredvanpeat

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@Mito
That’s pretty interesting thanks. I believe I’ve read Ray peat considers most vitamin C supplements to be contaminated with heavy metals. Do you have thoughts on this? It seems that most fruit end up having salicylates or other blood thinning compounds so idk if that would be the best source of vitamin C in my case. I also eat steamed broccoli which has some.

I probably am deficient in it if my needs for it increased because of how much anti inflammatory foods and substances I have consumed over the years. So maybe a supplement would be the best idea

Thanks for that study.
 

Mito

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@Mito
That’s pretty interesting thanks. I believe I’ve read Ray peat considers most vitamin C supplements to be contaminated with heavy metals. Do you have thoughts on this? It seems that most fruit end up having salicylates or other blood thinning compounds so idk if that would be the best source of vitamin C in my case. I also eat steamed broccoli which has some.

I probably am deficient in it if my needs for it increased because of how much anti inflammatory foods and substances I have consumed over the years. So maybe a supplement would be the best idea

Thanks for that study.
This one (Vitamin C - Quali-C by DSM) seems to have very low heavy metal content.

Have you tried glycine with the salicylates? In this video Masterjohn says that glycine neutralizes salicylate before it can have its biological effects.
 

Fredvanpeat

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This one (Vitamin C - Quali-C by DSM) seems to have very low heavy metal content.

Have you tried glycine with the salicylates? In this video Masterjohn says that glycine neutralizes salicylate before it can have its biological effects.


I may end up trying that supplement. I’ll do some more research on different supplements but that one looks pretty good I agree.

That was an intriguing video, I’ve always heard Masterjohn referenced but never watched or read any of his things. Seems like he knows his stuff.

That was interesting about the acetyl and salicylates having different effects and how salicylates can lead to more inflammation by not letting COX resolve the inflammation. I definitely get gut symptoms and joint pain from too much aspirin, orange juice or other anti inflammatories (though I’m not sure the other anti inflammatories are the same mechanism always but I think a lot of them do inhibit a COX enzyme). I always thought COX was only responsible for inflammation being there, didn’t know about it resolving it.

In regards to glycine, I have tried it but I’m not sure if it was with aspirin. Tried it in the form magnesium glyciante and collagen powder. Seems to relax me, but based on what I’ve read of Ray peat it would seem those are anti estrogenic so lately I’ve been avoiding them as I have been trying to increase estradiol as I think anti estrogen stuff has messed with my joints when lifting weights or during athletics and leads to serious gut irritation as well.

Have tried baking soda, not sure if with aspirin too, and it also seems to help relax me. But if I overdo it it’s like I start thinking and breathing too slowly. I’ve heard acidic means sped up metabolism and alkaline means lowered metabolism as a theory before, don’t know if that’s what’s going on. I also am afraid of milk alkali syndrome and the large amounts of sodium that comes with baking soda.

If I get vitamin C maybe that alone could resolve these symptoms and “anti-estrogenic effects” will be less of a concern. (although I can’t be completely sure low estrogen is what is causing it, just my working theory and others have suggested this)

I’ve become deterred from using supplements in general because it seems too hard to keep everything in balance, but who knows maybe vitamin C a the missing link.

Thanks for the info and suggestions!
 

Serene

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Thanks for sharing. Makes sense to me. Low C status probably. Under lots of oxidative stress.
 
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