How to hit all nutritional targets on a Peat diet?

[barbwirehouse]

Hey, I plugged in a typical peat diet on cronometer, and these are the results.

What should I eat to fix these deficiencies?

 

[Kasra]

You can get a ton of niacin from coffee, especially darker roasts. Alternatively, you could just eat some meat.

Salt obviously covers any sodium need.

The need for vitamin E is proportional to PUFA intake, so on a low-PUFA diet, you shouldn't need much. Interestingly, many of the food sources of vitamin E also have a lot of PUFA.

 

[Aspekt]

I wouldn't call that a typical peat diet. Far too few calories, and bananas and kale? Also take the cronometer RDAs with a pinch of salt.

 

[barbwirehouse]

I wouldn't call that a typical peat diet. Far too few calories, and bananas and kale? Also take the cronometer RDAs with a pinch of salt.

How on earth are bananas and kale not peat? Peat drinks kale broth and cooking it will definitely remove any nasty toxins. Peat says bananas are fine if you're not allergic.

You can get a ton of niacin from coffee, especially darker roasts. Alternatively, you could just eat some meat.

Salt obviously covers any sodium need.

The need for vitamin E is proportional to PUFA intake, so on a low-PUFA diet, you shouldn't need much. Interestingly, many of the food sources of vitamin E also have a lot of PUFA.

Thanks Kasra, I don't really drink coffee but I might start doing so. It seems it's hard to recommended amounts of vitamin e without eating a **** ton of food. http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tnam ... t&dbid=111

Ounces upon ounces of spinach to reach the RDA :? And if it really isn't needed without PUFA, why bother...

 

[Aspekt]

I wouldn't call that a typical peat diet. Far too few calories, and bananas and kale? Also take the cronometer RDAs with a pinch of salt.

How on earth are bananas and kale not peat? Peat drinks kale broth and cooking it will definitely remove any nasty toxins. Peat says bananas are fine if you're not allergic.

I didn't say they were 'not peat', I just said they weren't typical. 1500 calories is not much, so there are going to be gaps until you add more food. More difficult things like vitamin E you probably won't be able to get without supplements (I recommend one of haidut's formulas, estroban or stressnon for your daily E).

I don't get the connection between drinking kale broth being good and eating kale being good though. Most of the magnesium is in the water after cooking, and cooking won't remove all of the issues with eating greens. Epsom salt baths or topical magnesium oil is probably your best bet for magnesium if that's what you're after.

 

[Such_Saturation]

3.9g PUFA... Suuuure...

 

[answersfound]

That is definitely not enough calories. I would add in some ruminant meat and gelatin and potatoes for sure.

 

[mt_dreams]

Peat would probably not suggest 3 eggs a day. He would also probably suggest to cook those in coconut oil to increase the saturated fat, which would increase fat calories in the form of coconut oil.

Bananas if allowed to ripen to the max would be better options than some of the fruits high in seeds (pufa), but bananas do increase estrogen, so having 2 a day would probably eventually lead to a little more estrogen than is desired. That said, if you can digest starch, bananas are better than rice.

Looks like you would need to increase dairy protein if you are trying to avoid meat. Something like fresh mozzarella, or other soft or hard cheeses may be optimal. This would also warrant increasing sugar, hopefully using more fruit sugar, or honey. Going by the chart, sugar intake looks like its 700 calories (with 200 or so being from starch). I would bet that Ray himself eats more sugar than that, though I can't confirm it with a source.

Kale broth (removing the kale afterwards) is a great cheap way to get some vitamin K, as you don't have to use that much kale to hit the daily target. For people against synthetic supplements, It's the only surefire way to get vitamin K from a real source as you can never be fully sure just how much is in the dairy, even if the dairy k is possibly more bio-available. If you want to avoid above ground plants entirely, eating gouda cheese often is the best route as the bacteria used in the cheese making process will ensure a high level of vitamin K.

 

[barbwirehouse]

That is definitely not enough calories. I would add in some ruminant meat and gelatin and potatoes for sure.

Aren't potatoes starch though, which peat vows against? :?

3.9g PUFA... Suuuure...

If you have a better diet, I'd love to hear it.

Peat would probably not suggest 3 eggs a day. He would also probably suggest to cook those in coconut oil to increase the saturated fat, which would increase fat calories in the form of coconut oil.

Bananas if allowed to ripen to the max would be better options than some of the fruits high in seeds (pufa), but bananas do increase estrogen, so having 2 a day would probably eventually lead to a little more estrogen than is desired. That said, if you can digest starch, bananas are better than rice.

Looks like you would need to increase dairy protein if you are trying to avoid meat. Something like fresh mozzarella, or other soft or hard cheeses may be optimal. This would also warrant increasing sugar, hopefully using more fruit sugar, or honey. Going by the chart, sugar intake looks like its 700 calories (with 200 or so being from starch). I would bet that Ray himself eats more sugar than that, though I can't confirm it with a source.

Kale broth (removing the kale afterwards) is a great cheap way to get some vitamin K, as you don't have to use that much kale to hit the daily target. For people against synthetic supplements, It's the only surefire way to get vitamin K from a real source as you can never be fully sure just how much is in the dairy, even if the dairy k is possibly more bio-available. If you want to avoid above ground plants entirely, eating gouda cheese often is the best route as the bacteria used in the cheese making process will ensure a high level of vitamin K.

Thanks mt_dreams, I'll take your feedback into consideration

 

[Kasra]

Aren't potatoes starch though, which peat vows against? :?

"There isn't anything wrong with a high carbohydrate diet, and even a high starch diet isn't necessarily incompatible with good health, but when better foods are available they should be used instead of starches." - RP

 

[Amazoniac]

Kale broth (removing the kale afterwards) is a great cheap way to get some vitamin K, as you don't have to use that much kale to hit the daily target. For people against synthetic supplements, It's the only surefire way to get vitamin K from a real source as you can never be fully sure just how much is in the dairy, even if the dairy k is possibly more bio-available. If you want to avoid above ground plants entirely, eating gouda cheese often is the best route as the bacteria used in the cheese making process will ensure a high level of vitamin K.

The main purpose of consuming leafy green broth is for minerals. They are relatively dense and it removes the fibers, which Ray Peat is cautious about. But removing the fibers also removes beneficial fermentation and feeding of symbiotic gut microbes.
Also Vitamin K is fat-soluble, most of it will be discarted along with the leaf.

 

[Such_Saturation]

3.9g PUFA... Suuuure...

If you have a better diet, I'd love to hear it.

I don't know about the diet, but the data source does seem more appropriate. download/file.php?id=781

 

[mt_dreams]

The main purpose of consuming leafy green broth is for minerals. They are relatively dense and it removes the fibers, which Ray Peat is cautious about. But removing the fibers also removes beneficial fermentation and feeding of symbiotic gut microbes.
Also Vitamin K is fat-soluble, most of it will be discarted along with the leaf.

Good point, though I still believe some of the K makes its way into the broth as I've seen a bit of reflection off the top which would mean some of the fat from the kale has made its way into the broth. Using 100g of kale as a reference, even if only 10% makes its way into the broth, you will have hit your daily target of K for the day. You could also try adding a smidge of coconut oil to possible absorb some of the K, and possibly shredding the kale would allow for better releasing of the fat oils. That said, if you can afford & tolerate gouda, it's a more peat like option.

 

[tara]

Hey, I plugged in a typical peat diet on cronometer, and these are the results.
...
What should I eat to fix these deficiencies?

I sure hope this isn't a typical diet people follow thinking it is Peat-approved. If it were, the low protein and low calories alone might account for a lot of the problems people seem to experience.

I am not describing my own diet, or the only possible diet compatible with Peat' ideas, but one closer to what I've read suggested by Peat:
double the milk from 1l to 2l, (more protein, sugar, calcium)
increase OJ from 3 to 4 cups, (more potassium, magnesium, sugar)
reduce eggs from 3 to 2, (less PUFA)
vary the fruit - less than 2 bananas per day probably (less serotonin - may not be an issue for you, but is for some people)
add some gelatinous meat/stock/white fish/gelatine or if you prefer vegetarian, some cheese that suits your digestion (more protein, gelatine for improved amino-acid balance). If you are hypothyroid, 80-100 g protein; if euthyroid, more like 120-150g.
occasional liver (vit-B, A, protein, minerals)
salt to taste (sodium, chloride) and/or baking soda (sodium, alkalinising, CO2 - may be useful depending on your pH state)
More fruit/juice, honey, sucrose to get calories up to ~2500 (I'm guessing - I think you are female. More if you are male, early twenties or younger, or very physically active). This last one is not direct from Peat.

I have read Peat as recommending moderate to low starch in general, but zero starch for people with particularly difficult gut bacteria. He generally favours sugars over starches, but as starches go, potatoes have some good things going for them, such as good protein quality, some potassium and other minerals, as well as being higher calorie density - some people have trouble with too much liquid if they they try to get most of their carbs and protein from juice and milk. Some people do best to avoid potatoes if they are sensitive to nightshades.

 

[barbwirehouse]

Hey, I plugged in a typical peat diet on cronometer, and these are the results.
...
What should I eat to fix these deficiencies?

I sure hope this isn't a typical diet people follow thinking it is Peat-approved. If it were, the low protein and low calories alone might account for a lot of the problems people seem to experience.

Wow, thanks for the detailed reply tara. 2 litres of milk seems like a lot to drink in one day however, that's 14 litres a week.

Here's a good question for you. Assuming moderate money, access to all foods and no food allergies, what would be the perfect/optimal Peat diet?

 

[Such_Saturation]

what would be the perfect/optimal Peat diet?

Uh oh

 

[4peatssake]

what would be the perfect/optimal Peat diet?

Uh oh

 

[tara]

If 2litres of milk is too much liquid for you at this time, you can turn some of the milk into fresh cheese. You lose quite a bit of the calcium that way, but retain most of the good protein.

Have you looked at the pinned thread in the top of the diet subforum?
Peat suggests a diet based on lots of milk, fruit, eggs, occasional liver, shellfish, optional gelatinous meat, etc. He has several times suggested 2 l milk and one litre OJ as covering a lot of needs. If these foods work for you, you can make them the basis of your diet.

But he also suggests observing your own reactions and seeing what effects foods have on you. For instance, he suggests avoiding foods that irritate one's digestive tract. There are some common culprits, but what bothers each person also differs. He has also said that what is optimal depends on a particular person's needs.

It seems to me that there is unlikely to be a single strictly defined diet that will be optimal for everyone, especially given that we have gotten out of balance in somewhat different ways, and may already have various deficiencies we need to rectify.

If you read forum posts, you'll find some people claim to do better with very low fat, while others find their metabolism plummets if they reduce the (saturated) fat too far.
Some people seem to do well with potatoes as a staple, while others do best avoiding starch altogether.
Mittir wrote great posts about many things, including gut irritants (recommended reading from my PoV), but never found OJ that worked, and so designed a diet that worked really well that included apple juice.
I love milk, but I seem to at least sometimes have a lot of trouble with it, so I'm trying to work around that.

Figuring out what works for you is part of the process of recovering your health, understanding of your body, and your power to take care of yourself. While you can use Peat's and other people's ideas, it probably doesn't make sense to hand over responsibility for figuring out your own diet to anyone else.

 

[koganmj]

what would be the perfect/optimal Peat diet?

Uh oh

Ha ha ha, had to laugh at that

 

[LeeRoyJenkins]

Does anyone have any RDAs for cronometer? This isn't exactly a typical day I attached (I was going low fat, until nighttime when I gorged on some high-quality cheese as I was hungry despite eating a lot of calories). Curious everyone's input and if anyone has any RDA suggestions for someone in their early 30's.