How to enter the Smart Peat-ple Club? How to be among the liked, high status winners?

ScurveDream

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It seems you can't get away from dog-eat-dog world even on an obscure internet forum.

Basically I've noticed that here (and most other places) I'm always low status, importance, and within a group with others where they (the members) are always ahead in some way. If I try to speed up I am just the bumbling one who needs their hand held -- if I try to lead I am off-target and re-assessed to be either ignored or unconfidently followed.

In this forum even you have the upper rank, high status posters who everyone listens to more and likes, whereas I feel like I'm among some here in the dumb and ugly section. I don't even need to include anyone's names here since I'm very sure most in the "upper" positions know who they are -- and most in the positions under them know which group of like 10-30 members I'm speaking of.

This is not an attack -- it's merely an observation although I won't lie and say I've never heavily disagreed or disliked some ways members at times have expressed themselves (through text at least).

The point is we know people want to pretend these things don't exist or matter (whether in this forum or not) but denying placements in life, patterns and the obvious when dug deep enough would be like denying many of the things we know the "normie" or mainstream people do.

For example, a rich (or popular/well-liked) person will say, "Work hard so people like you." However, I feel I've worked pretty hard my whole life and almost no people like me much, even in a fictional-esque internet world while others are ignored, low-post, greyed out avatars who never get mentioned or talked to. Yeah it sounds stupid, but behind these profiles are people -- and people will be people, more or less, whether they are in front of you or behind a computer, showing the "natural" order of status, fondness and selectable nature of others.

Ultimately you can't seem to escape feeling inadequate, whether online or in real life, suggesting the problem is not merely an illusion or false belief but evident in seeing how people operate. I've always noticed that people either take lead, or walk away and let you pretend you're valid -- that's always the case with me.

I think to myself that maybe it's because I actually am stupid, but that's not entirely true -- people won't like you necessarily just because you are smart anyways. Yeah, it's obviously jealousy and it sounds ridiculous, but the fact of the matter is that reality is mimicked whether it's in front of a computer with people or in front of people/first-hand -- you always feel shortchanged. I have grown to the liking that if something continues to keep feeling true to you, on some level it must be. This post accomplishes nothing really -- it is a clear indication of the physiological state as of now. It's also a shame that this is behind a computer -- imagine the intensity if this was all face-to-face where some good punches can be thrown, sex to be had, and serotonin to continue rising.

And yes, this does seem to be a reach (I am admitting to jealousy, inadequacy and being a failure so hopefully someone else who reads this can be honest too) but I think I am the only one here (or few of) who will bring these subjects to light. I know how you can criss-cross this and that with metabolic function, health, whatever, but if one feels like a lesser, under-appreciated, lower valued person/man/woman/etc. then no amount of metabolic function directly helps that (at least that I know of). I've had my highs and lows, but deeply observed truths that hit home are hard to flip-flop on when it comes to feeling good or bad. For example, high metabolism doesn't make me less poor -- or hasn't yet at least. A good metabolism doesn't make people like me if the reasons for doing so are not necessarily internal. People judge books by covers, not by how well the writing can influence you alone/ignoring the overall impression of the book wholly. You can have a high thyroid function but unless you like being poor, miserable and lonely then I can't imagine how you can maximize life circumstances by maximizing health, otherwise people here would not stay stuck in constant swings of poor health -> decent health -> good health -> poor health so swiftly. I guess when some know their problems and have no way of fixing them it is a full circle sort of issue where you can't let yourself become healthy because it isn't optimal or necessary to be. Does someone running from a lion need a high thyroid? Does giving someone T3 when a lion is chasing after them help increase their chances of survival? Clearly some people are going to keep being in denial and some more open to the unfair truths evident everywhere, but I am not one who will pretend that life can simply be good for anyone just because they want it to be, regardless of physiological state.

Hell I know people who do nothing objectively meaningful & are well-liked, so being socially successful, liked, or valued isn't some objective measure of anything you do which seems that being liked is more a matter of pieces falling in place. It seems unjust to have the position of power and influence when you did nothing differently to deserve it than another, given the available tools, resources and circumstances you were born in to. I don't know -- maybe if I was born a few kilometers north I'd be selling and advertising underground steroids, metabolites and so on to hamsters on the internet? Maybe if I was born with helicopter parents I'd be making punny references to vitamins by adding relevant, humorous identifiers before or after each and every one? Lastly, maybe if I had some more chemical soup in the womb I'd be a tall, good looking guy sleeping with all of my female friends and liked merely for existing rather than for having to work your **** off for nearly nothing? Or maybe if I was born with slightly bigger chest and different anatomical structure south I'd be collecting simp coins on Twitch because boobs and woman. But alas you are born in the unfavorable position of struggle, so the most important thing to do regarding changing that is to take T3 and listen to people with 1,000+ post count who make hilarious references to vitamins -- that's it basically (maybe it is?) in order to achieve enlightenment. Or maybe some actual light is likely needed -- just don't shine it at some low count posters' faces as we all aren't that attractive/rich/liked. But I'll hand it to you -- you guys have mostly all been good, but no need to deny the truth anymore -- it's time to realize where you all stand.
 
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Whisper

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Apr 8, 2021
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Don't care so much about this my friend... does it truly matter to you? Is this what ultimately defines your happieness?
 

Sofia2020

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May 25, 2020
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200
I did found few of your posts very helpful. You forget that some members here have serious health problems, brain fog and partial dementia. But they try to get healthier.
 

jnklheimer

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Jan 9, 2021
Messages
77
if you can support how you feel physically, mentally it is easier to be happier and creative. if you are categorizing other users then you also can be categorized, so it is up to you how you perceive yourself and then the perception of you from others will follow. you can even be a different person to different people on any day, if you'd like.
 

shine

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Sep 27, 2018
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Just buy androsterone and take it before posting. Your perceived own high status will manifest itself in your posts. ;)
 

Vileplume

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Are there certain social circles in which you feel high status, or adequate? In some social groups, and on some days, I feel high status, and on other days, sometimes even in those same groups, I feel low status.

Not to oversimplify it, but it often feels related to my own metabolic state. When my metabolic state is high and I feel energized, others seem to naturally view me as a higher status type. When my health deteriorated in recent years, I found myself assuming a lower-status role in most of my social groups.

Although social hierarchies definitely are real, lately I've found myself not viewing power so linearly, like everyone lines up in a line, organized by "power points." Instead, I've realized that roles, personality traits, senses of humor, individual styles alter and complexify these hierarchies. For example, perhaps here I serve the role of questioning, of keeping things simple and understandable, of helping people who are new to Peat. Sometimes I just defer to Peat in my posts, and sometimes I make stupid jokes. I'm certainly not the role of expert, not the most experienced, not the most dominant, not the wittiest, not the ***hole, not one that undestands the science very well. Wihtout these things it's hard for me to rise to the top of a linear hierarchy, but I occupy a niche uniquely my own, and people's niches and roles can't be quantified linearly by "power" or "coolness" alone. The spectrum of roles that people can fill is 360 degrees, 3D.

I haven't read all your posts, but I would diagnose your niche, at least partially, as thoughtful, sensitive, but also gifted in an expressive sense. You communicate creatively, reflectively, and artistically. I enjoy reading what you write, and you certainly fulfill a unique role in the 3D hierarchy we have here on RPF.
 

prank

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Mar 14, 2016
Messages
13
This is a cool post because it's something that could be posted on any message board, but would only be found here. I like you for posting it, but beyond the title and a few lines I didn't get anything out of reading it. I can guess whom you mean by the high status posters, and I also will say that I don't derive much value from them--with some obvious exceptions like travis. I like the posters that are critical of ray peat or call out the higher status members like haidut. The ones that introduce some new perspective or idea in not too many words of which I'm familiar. It's also nice when to see posters that are cognizant of structure and realize diet is a meme.
 

Ben.

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I realy like how you write up your thoughts.

But personally i'd say what you describe depends heavily on how one sees him/herself. Not just on a easy superficial glance but deeply on an emotional level that is not describeable in words. Just as you described, i've worked so hard to be liked and gotten nowhere while for others who do nothing or who are even ***holes it seems to be second nature to be liked/adored/loved.

Breaking free of childhood traumas/teachings and other heavy influences in your life, starting to genuinely like, love and stand towards yourself (is highly influenced by your health too and requires tons,maybe even lifelong work), create new thought patterns/habits will change this significantly.

Dont let outside events or reactions determine who you are or who you want to be.

If you genuinely think without any doubt that your the greatest badass in the room, people will feel/notice this, even if its just on a subcontious level and even if they would challenge the belief or think otherwise, it would not break. This influences how you behave, think, move, speak/articulate yourself and thus it influences the perceptions of thoose seeing you. Their response in turn will confirm/reassure this (eventho you dont need it to). This is real confidence. Not the kind induced trough muscle mass from the gym but actual, deep seated confidence.

In terms of hirachy, i get what you mean. I can't even at the slightest compete with a Haidut or a Hans. The problem is not wether i can or not, i can contribute in my way, but the problem is wether i am personally having an issue with this. Would it be cool to be as knowledgeable about biochemistry and being able help/contribute more,to have more people listen to me? Would be a "cool" thing but i don't need that. I do not care about this "hirarchy".



I personally came to the conclusion that all that matters is what i want, where i would like to be and what goals/values/prioritys i have in life. You wont feel inadequate if you manage to achieve/work on the stuff that is important to you (and only you). It gets challenged often by the pressure of what society/other people/lifepartner deem as appropiate goals/situations, sure, but accepting/succumbing to thoose just leads to unhappiness.

The first and foremost thing this requires is to figure out ... who are you realy, who do you want to be and what do you realy need to be content with yourself?


Edit: Didnt read this before posting, says what i ment within one sentence, lol:

Your perceived own high status will manifest itself in your posts. ;)
 
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Belsazar

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May 16, 2016
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Certain people give you the feeling of "they know it all" or "they got to the core of peat's concepts", or "they got the solution for everyone and everything". But a good football player isn't necessarily a good football coach (a solution that worked in their context vs a context to create solutions). Use a catchy thread title and it will grab attention while good posts are buried in the noise. That something is off in this forum is no secret, but a lot off users are sick and desperate for help because they are left alone by the medical industry. Peat would shake his head if reading some posts from here, especially when its about throwing in supplements like there is no tomorrow. Even if certain people try to be "anti-authoritarian" so hard, they will end up as authoritarian figure. There are no valid protocols. First do no harm.
 

lampofred

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Feb 13, 2016
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3,060
This is an interesting post. As for "top" posters like Haidut, well he has really been on here for a while, when he does interviews you can tell he really spent time reading the studies he posted, and his business started off pretty organically (Estroban I think was his first product and it was sincerely something he thought would be new and useful, since there was demand for fat-soluble vitamins and he had the connections to make a quality product, he did it out of helpfulness & not greed).

As for you specifically, well if you want an honest answer I think you have insightful posts but in general they are way too long and take way too many words to convey what could be conveyed in much shorter ways. High cortisol, high serotonin, high estrogen will increase unnecessary verbosity. Thyroid (higher body temperature) will make your words pack more punch.

And as for life in general and why some people work so hard but get nothing whereas others have it so easy, in general I've noticed that life is cruel in general to cruel-natured people and is easy for easy-going people (cruelty/easy-going within one's heart, not how one portrays oneself to the world). I don't mean cruelty in terms of not following friendly social norms in the sense of ratting out your friend for personal gain or something like that, I mean cruelty in a biological sense. And cruelty in a biological sense = high cortisol resulting in high serotonin, tearing down your muscles. This is why autistic people (high 5ht, high cortisol) tend to have it so hard. Coconut oil, red light, and sugar (which increases "sweetness" and thus lowers "cruelty") lower cortisol. Milk instead of meat also lowers cortisol (I think phosphate, TSH, and probably excess iron relative to calcium raise cortisol).

In summary I think focusing on reducing cortisol/serotonin and raising body temperature via thyroid might help your situation.

Also check out this thread: I asked peat if he believed in luck, heres his response
 
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MrGilbert

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Sep 11, 2020
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Ultimately you can't seem to escape feeling inadequate, whether online or in real life, suggesting the problem is not merely an illusion or false belief but evident in seeing how people operate. I've always noticed that people either take lead, or walk away and let you pretend you're valid -- that's always the case with me.
You need to stop relying on external validation (and stop taking the forum so seriously).
 

CreakyJoints

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Mar 30, 2020
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I think just trying to take each post on its own merit is useful. Some of the people with the highest post-counts write the most dubious things, and likewise some of the most insightful comments here come from users with very few posts at all. Also, sometimes its just a matter of getting used to people, perhaps some of those users who annoy you are actually spewing gems of wisdom and you're just too caught up in whatever social hierarchy you perceive here to notice. I've done this myself, I actually blocked a user a while ago, only to find that recently they had made an interesting post about a subject I was reading into at the time. I've since unblocked them and told myself I ought to care significantly less about that sort of stuff - you can learn all sorts from all sorts.

Yes, it can sometimes be irksome when you post something quite informative and you're ignored because people are only interested in what the high-profile people say; yes, it's rather frustrating that some people here will defer totally to authority figures whilst totally suspending their own critical faculty; and yes, this way of conducting oneself is not especially in line with Ray Peat's work, but that's their loss and I don't think you shouldn't worry about it as much as you apparently do.

I admit, I've had similar issues, but you've given me valuable perspective on the subject, so thank you for that.

I've struggled with many mental health issues throughout my life, and I assure you that good metabolic function can help alleviate these in a massive way. It won't make people like you in itself, no, but maybe it will put you in a position where you are less anxious about people liking you in the first place (which might, ironically, make people like you). I hope you manage to find something that helps; but being on a forum doesn't presuppose you are enlightened or trying to spread enlightenment - in fact, I'd say that in most cases it suggests precisely the opposite. The majority of people probably wouldn't even be here if they didn't have questions in the first place.
 

Jessie

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Jul 9, 2020
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I think in the context of modern capitalism and wealth concentration no one on this forum is all that successful.
 

yerrag

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I don't exactly know what to say except that we all grow and develop. Positive enforcement helps but participation trophies don't. Hormesis plays a part as well in the sense that if you have to struggle to overcome something, you get to develop. But taking your success as you develop in stride makes you get along more with your peers, and gains you respect. By that I mean you lose the chip on your shoulder, you don't have to feel like you have something to prove, you are happy to see someone getting better in life and even outpace you while not losing sight of your competitive spirit. You value having people smarter than you around, as well as people you can guide. You are both student and teacher at the same time.

I have to say I was very quiet growing up. At one time, I remember having no opinion on anything. I was afraid to be criticized for being wrong, and I always felt no matter what, I would say the wrong thing. It's a shell I have to grow out from, and I'm thankful I did. I don't know how I managed. People would tell me to be myself. Oh, that was hard when I had no self at all. Yeah, in time, though, I develop a self.

I'd say to keep at it. Observe. Learn from others. Be a student or follower first before you can teach or lead.
 
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Hugh Johnson

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Who cares? The posters I appreciate are the people who contribute. Just give more. That is the secret to life, give more. Don't take ***t, don't be a martyr, but give as much as you can. That is why Peat, haidut, Hans etc are so highly regarded.
 

Runenight201

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Feb 18, 2018
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I like your writing style, and I like how you focus intensely on the social hierarchy. I've felt at many points in my life the sting of jealousy from observing others being more successful than me. It was never about money because I was raised to not value it as the highest priority. The jealousy came from witnessing my peers be more liked than me, having others want to be around them more than me, being unable to have any sort of meaningful positive sexually charged interaction with girls I was attracted to and seeing other guys able to do so.

My go-to defense mechanism was to retreat. Passify myself with thoughts of eternal salvation, fantastical delusions, imaginative dreams where I was the person I envied the most. Even up to this day I still have to admit that I'm trying to create a person who is well-liked, attractive, and capable.

I'm not sure in what culture you grew up, and there will always be a truth to our primal instinctual reaction to others forming all sorts of psychological barriers or connections, aversion or interactions, however I do think that we can get to a place where the primal is overcome by the ideal. Can I get to the point, as many other humans have been able to, the saints of humanity, where I see a crippled, dimunitive, dumb human and still manage to perserve their value as someone who deserves equal respect, treatment, and dignity as the most uprighteous, attractive, charistmatic, thoughtful, individual. And even if I can for a second empathise with them, can I get so far as to sacrifice my own well-being, as I would do for certain other individuals, to then assist this fellow biological being in having a good life. Our society in no way encourages such an equivalency of values, at least in any meaningfully powerful way, to which it then becomes normalized for everyone to under the surface place us all in hierarchies and then treat each other accordingly. We're all much too sick and confused to reside in such a place of being.

I wish I could direct you to a group of people who could see you as you are and fulfill the acceptance I think you may be seeking. I hope you don't lose hope and I hope you develop in a meaningfully good way.
 

dfspcc20

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Dec 9, 2015
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I agree that things can get clique-y, and for the most part you're better off avoiding that, lest you get sucked into potential groupthink/echo chamber/filter bubble.

Maybe it's the way forum software like this operates- threads with the most comments bubble to the top page, often pushing stuff I'm really interested in to the 2nd, 3rd, ... pages. "Preponderance of communication" doesn't always correlate with the most valuable communication. It would be nice if there were ways to hide specific subforums.

And maybe there is some solace in knowing there is probably some order of magnitude more lurkers than actual posters. They're generally not going to come out of the woodwork just to agree with a post or offer validation.
 

Explorer

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Oct 7, 2020
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I have noticed this too that I feel like whenever I am in any community irl or online that I never seem to be taken that fully seriously or sort of attain the perceived highest status social ranking even when being active and talking about interesting things while there are people who for some reason seem to naturally attract others and give off confidence that makes others fully believe in them 100%

I am not sure though how much of it is a perceptionb thing vs how much it is real

I have always wondered if there is a biochemical factor behind specific successful people who just automatically seem to easily gain support/rapport/interest/fame and meanwhile what is the reason for those types of people that despite having good ideas/activity/personality still for some reason seem to make others feel repulsed or at the best do not gather that automatic interest/attraction/fame from others that some people just seem to get just by existing as long as their presence is around anyhwere

Could DHEA/Pregnanolone/Thyroid/Cortisol/Serotonin/Dopamine/Androsterone levels be the main involvement in this phenomenon?
 

Broken man

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Sep 11, 2016
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It seems you can't get away from dog-eat-dog world even on an obscure internet forum.

Basically I've noticed that here (and most other places) I'm always low status, importance, and within a group with others where they (the members) are always ahead in some way. If I try to speed up I am just the bumbling one who needs their hand held -- if I try to lead I am off-target and re-assessed to be either ignored or unconfidently followed.

In this forum even you have the upper rank, high status posters who everyone listens to more and likes, whereas I feel like I'm among some here in the dumb and ugly section. I don't even need to include anyone's names here since I'm very sure most in the "upper" positions know who they are -- and most in the positions under them know which group of like 10-30 members I'm speaking of.

This is not an attack -- it's merely an observation although I won't lie and say I've never heavily disagreed or disliked some ways members at times have expressed themselves (through text at least).

The point is we know people want to pretend these things don't exist or matter (whether in this forum or not) but denying placements in life, patterns and the obvious when dug deep enough would be like denying many of the things we know the "normie" or mainstream people do.

For example, a rich (or popular/well-liked) person will say, "Work hard so people like you." However, I feel I've worked pretty hard my whole life and almost no people like me much, even in a fictional-esque internet world while others are ignored, low-post, greyed out avatars who never get mentioned or talked to. Yeah it sounds stupid, but behind these profiles are people -- and people will be people, more or less, whether they are in front of you or behind a computer, showing the "natural" order of status, fondness and selectable nature of others.

Ultimately you can't seem to escape feeling inadequate, whether online or in real life, suggesting the problem is not merely an illusion or false belief but evident in seeing how people operate. I've always noticed that people either take lead, or walk away and let you pretend you're valid -- that's always the case with me.

I think to myself that maybe it's because I actually am stupid, but that's not entirely true -- people won't like you necessarily just because you are smart anyways. Yeah, it's obviously jealousy and it sounds ridiculous, but the fact of the matter is that reality is mimicked whether it's in front of a computer with people or in front of people/first-hand -- you always feel shortchanged. I have grown to the liking that if something continues to keep feeling true to you, on some level it must be. This post accomplishes nothing really -- it is a clear indication of the physiological state as of now. It's also a shame that this is behind a computer -- imagine the intensity if this was all face-to-face where some good punches can be thrown, sex to be had, and serotonin to continue rising.

And yes, this does seem to be a reach (I am admitting to jealousy, inadequacy and being a failure so hopefully someone else who reads this can be honest too) but I think I am the only one here (or few of) who will bring these subjects to light. I know how you can criss-cross this and that with metabolic function, health, whatever, but if one feels like a lesser, under-appreciated, lower valued person/man/woman/etc. then no amount of metabolic function directly helps that (at least that I know of). I've had my highs and lows, but deeply observed truths that hit home are hard to flip-flop on when it comes to feeling good or bad. For example, high metabolism doesn't make me less poor -- or hasn't yet at least. A good metabolism doesn't make people like me if the reasons for doing so are not necessarily internal. People judge books by covers, not by how well the writing can influence you alone/ignoring the overall impression of the book wholly. You can have a high thyroid function but unless you like being poor, miserable and lonely then I can't imagine how you can maximize life circumstances by maximizing health, otherwise people here would not stay stuck in constant swings of poor health -> decent health -> good health -> poor health so swiftly. I guess when some know their problems and have no way of fixing them it is a full circle sort of issue where you can't let yourself become healthy because it isn't optimal or necessary to be. Does someone running from a lion need a high thyroid? Does giving someone T3 when a lion is chasing after them help increase their chances of survival? Clearly some people are going to keep being in denial and some more open to the unfair truths evident everywhere, but I am not one who will pretend that life can simply be good for anyone just because they want it to be, regardless of physiological state.

Hell I know people who do nothing objectively meaningful & are well-liked, so being socially successful, liked, or valued isn't some objective measure of anything you do which seems that being liked is more a matter of pieces falling in place. It seems unjust to have the position of power and influence when you did nothing differently to deserve it than another, given the available tools, resources and circumstances you were born in to. I don't know -- maybe if I was born a few kilometers north I'd be selling and advertising underground steroids, metabolites and so on to hamsters on the internet? Maybe if I was born with helicopter parents I'd be making punny references to vitamins by adding relevant, humorous identifiers before or after each and every one? Lastly, maybe if I had some more chemical soup in the womb I'd be a tall, good looking guy sleeping with all of my female friends and liked merely for existing rather than for having to work your **** off for nearly nothing? Or maybe if I was born with slightly bigger chest and different anatomical structure south I'd be collecting simp coins on Twitch because boobs and woman. But alas you are born in the unfavorable position of struggle, so the most important thing to do regarding changing that is to take T3 and listen to people with 1,000+ post count who make hilarious references to vitamins -- that's it basically (maybe it is?) in order to achieve enlightenment. Or maybe some actual light is likely needed -- just don't shine it at some low count posters' faces as we all aren't that attractive/rich/liked. But I'll hand it to you -- you guys have mostly all been good, but no need to deny the truth anymore -- it's time to realize where you all stand.
Didnt read it all but I am doing job where experience, practical skills and being smart is needed, I can tell you that all you need Is to have energy and will to do or learn something new. I think high status Is consequence of this traits. Playfulness Is the best Word for this. If you Will learn it somehow, people will notice it. For me, combination of T and DHT is the trick.
 
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David PS Ray Peat Interview All things hormones, metabolism and health with Dr Ray Peat & Emma Sgourakis Interviews 3
Cloudhands I asked peat if he believed in luck, heres his response Ask For Help or Advice 90
H All things hormones, metabolism and health with Dr Ray Peat & Emma Sgourakis Interviews 1
GelatinGoblin Has Peat talked about Euthyroid Sick Syndrome? Ask For Help or Advice 1
S Histamine intolerance explained through a Ray Peat prism Cortisol, Serotonin, Histamine 49
P How to get in contact with Ray Peat himself Ask For Help or Advice 4
Blaze Ray Peat dissed by Dr. Tom Cowan on Patrick Timpone show Ask For Help or Advice 28
A New to ray peat, trying a lot of haidut and Ray’s recommendations but what am I missing? Metabolism 10
C Ray Peat breakfast ideas? Diet 5
RyanHeeney I'm starting a website based on the metabolism and Dr. Ray Peat's ideas. Ray Peat Topics 28
J Fungal Acne - New product. Peat approved? Skin 0
meatbag OtBoaT Ray Peat Day 1 Transcript-Personal Background, Influences, and View of Reality and Organisms Audio Interview Transcripts 1

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