How to counter Cypro's anti-histamine effects?

[laleto12]

I started cyproheptadine to reduce serotonin and catecholamines. I will use 1 to 2 mg a day. But I dont really want to reduce histamine too much since its a powerful anti-histamine drug, i need counter it.

How do I increase histamine effectively?


Thanks.

 

[Charger]

L-Histidine and Kutaj Bark are the first two supps that come to mind.

 

[laleto12]

L-Histidine and Kutaj Bark are the first two supps that come to mind.

Would you take L-histidine on empty stomach or with meals? Unfortunately I dont have access to kutaj bark in my country
Could folic acid be useful in increasing histamine?

 

[redsun]

I started cyproheptadine to reduce serotonin and catecholamines. I will use 1 to 2 mg a day. But I dont really want to reduce histamine too much since its a powerful anti-histamine drug, i need counter it.

How do I increase histamine effectively?


Thanks.

There's virtually no point to taking histamine enhancing supplements if you are taking cypro which will just block receptors so you really can't counteract that effect. Once you get off cypro the receptors will just start working again and may even be more sensitive for a little while.

A higher choline diet is generally pretty effective at reducing higher catecholamines. Its even more important for men to get plenty of choline because we dont have much PEMT activity because of lower estrogen which is what allows us to make our own choline when we don't get enough. If you can't do eggs you can try choline supplements such as alpha-GPC, CDP choline, sunflower lecithin, etc. I would aim for 800mg daily if your choline intake is currently quite low.

 

[Beastmode]

What's driving the histamine response in the first place that requires the cypro?

 

[laleto12]

There's virtually no point to taking histamine enhancing supplements if you are taking cypro which will just block receptors so you really can't counteract that effect. Once you get off cypro the receptors will just start working again and may even be more sensitive for a little while.

A higher choline diet is generally pretty effective at reducing higher catecholamines. Its even more important for men to get plenty of choline because we dont have much PEMT activity because of lower estrogen which is what allows us to make our own choline when we don't get enough. If you can't do eggs you can try choline supplements such as alpha-GPC, CDP choline, sunflower lecithin, etc. I would aim for 800mg daily if your choline intake is currently quite low.

Oh, then trying increasing histamine is pointless.
Actually, one of the reasons that I started cypro is its anticholinergic effects because I suspect I have too much acetylcholine. Any time I try to increase egg yolks and/or B-Vitamins I get extreme sweaty armpits and vivid dreams. I ate a lot of egg yolks and I took a lot of B-vitamin supplements in the last couple of years.

 

[redsun]

Oh, then trying increasing histamine is pointless.
Actually, one of the reasons that I started cypro is its anticholinergic effects because I suspect I have too much acetylcholine. Any time I try to increase egg yolks and/or B-Vitamins I get extreme sweaty armpits and vivid dreams. I ate a lot of egg yolks and I took a lot of B-vitamin supplements in the last couple of years.

Do you supplement zinc or get a lot of zinc in your diet? Zinc generally enhances cholinergic activity especially in excess. Its GABA-A antagonism tends to also promote stress.

I actually dealt with the same issue that I figured was due to excess acetylcholine. I dropped Bs and lowered my choline intake to below the RDA in hopes of fixing it. Eventually it got even worse somehow. I then surmised that it was a stress issue and possibly an upregulation of acetylcholine receptors because my choline intake was so low. Eating a few eggs actually ended up reducing how much REM sleep I got and improved me sleep. The B-vitamins themselves seem to enhance. Eggs are also rich in vitamin A which reduces acetylcholine synthesis so even though they are rich in choline, they still somewhat reduce acetylcholine synthesis because of the retinol.

What I would suggest for you is to try to at least get the daily value of choline (550mg) because it is still very important for reducing excess adrenaline even though it exacerbates your apparent high acetylcholine and then supplement a small dose of vitamin A daily for a little while (5000IU). See if this reduces excess acetylcholine symptoms. If it does this then it should improve choline tolerance allowing to consume more choline. Eggs are also very rich in cholesterol which is potently anti-stress. All the B-vitamins and vitamin E dose-dependently enhance acetylcholine synthesis. Maybe what you need is some vitamin A to tilt your system the other way and reduce Ach synthesis. Choline itself would mildly increase Ach levels but it depends on B-vitamins more so. I know in the past you also complained of muscle tension which also can be due to excess acetycholine so this should reduce as well with vitamin A.

 

[laleto12]

Do you supplement zinc or get a lot of zinc in your diet? Zinc generally enhances cholinergic activity especially in excess. Its GABA-A antagonism tends to also promote stress.

I actually dealt with the same issue that I figured was due to excess acetylcholine. I dropped Bs and lowered my choline intake to below the RDA in hopes of fixing it. Eventually it got even worse somehow. I then surmised that it was a stress issue and possibly an upregulation of acetylcholine receptors because my choline intake was so low. Eating a few eggs actually ended up reducing how much REM sleep I got and improved me sleep. The B-vitamins themselves seem to enhance. Eggs are also rich in vitamin A which reduces acetylcholine synthesis so even though they are rich in choline, they still somewhat reduce acetylcholine synthesis because of the retinol.

What I would suggest for you is to try to at least get the daily value of choline (550mg) because it is still very important for reducing excess adrenaline even though it exacerbates your apparent high acetylcholine and then supplement a small dose of vitamin A daily for a little while (5000IU). See if this reduces excess acetylcholine symptoms. If it does this then it should improve choline tolerance allowing to consume more choline. Eggs are also very rich in cholesterol which is potently anti-stress. All the B-vitamins and vitamin E dose-dependently enhance acetylcholine synthesis. Maybe what you need is some vitamin A to tilt your system the other way and reduce Ach synthesis. Choline itself would mildly increase Ach levels but it depends on B-vitamins more so. I know in the past you also complained of muscle tension which also can be due to excess acetycholine so this should reduce as well with vitamin A.

Thanks for your detailed response. I stopped supplementing zinc altogether because of some copper deficiency symptoms so I might have had some excess zinc in my body since I eat red meat daily as well.
Actually I've been wanting to experiment with increasing egg yolks so I might due that. I will just drink some 4-5 a day maybe? I eat eggs couple a days a week but I really like raw egg yolks.

Also what do you think of supplementing pregnenolone redsun? I was thinking of lots of egg yolks and pregnenolone to increase chlosterol and steroid production? Do you think thats a good idea? I really wanna just get rid of the anxiety and high-serotonin symptoms. I wanna become stress resilient like I used to be when I was just a kid.

 

[redsun]

Thanks for your detailed response. I stopped supplementing zinc altogether because of some copper deficiency symptoms so I might have had some excess zinc in my body since I eat red meat daily as well.
Actually I've been wanting to experiment with increasing egg yolks so I might due that. I will just drink some 4-5 a day maybe? I eat eggs couple a days a week but I really like raw egg yolks.

Also what do you think of supplementing pregnenolone redsun? I was thinking of lots of egg yolks and pregnenolone to increase chlosterol and steroid production? Do you think thats a good idea? I really wanna just get rid of the anxiety and high-serotonin symptoms. I wanna become stress resilient like I used to be when I was just a kid.

Pregnenolone is actually a GABA-A antagonist so if you want to reduce symptoms of stress it may be counterproductive unless it gets converted into inhibitory neurosteroids.

Yes I think egg yolks may be a good idea to try. Ideally try to slowly work your way up to that many egg yolks and observe how you feel from them. If you still get high acetylcholine after awhile of eating them then try more vitamin A but I think the vitamin A content of the eggs should be enough and it should work well in the end for you.