How To Change Facial Features And Skull Shape

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dreamcatcher

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It activates osteocalcin and increases testerone expression in the face by partitioning bone mass appropriately.
Yeah and I might be sensitive to androgens hence my hair loss despite of normal levels of androgens on blood test.
 
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dreamcatcher

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Excellent first post on this topic @Nick W. However, I disagree with your ALF description. I have upper and lower ALFs (I'm 35, have had them for 1.5 years). Aside from where they hook onto your first molars, they do not touch your teeth. Have you ever held an ALF? It offers less resistance than a twist tie. Whatever it's doing, it is not moving the teeth by brute mechanical force. It has to be some sort of neurological stimulus.

After traditional braces and poor maxilla development resulted in my teeth tipped inwards, I actually wish the ALFs would tip them out more! My teeth have shifted into a much broader arch, but I wish they would tip out more within the arch. I went to a "normal" dentist for a cleaning the other day and brought pre-ALF x-rays with me. They insisted on taking new x-rays, and when they compared them, the dentist flat out didn't believe my pre and post x-rays were of the same person.

I originally got ALFs because of severe airway restriction and TMJ compression/displacement, not to change my looks, and I don't think they have changed my overall facial structure besides my jaw. Mike Mew said that adults need to be expanded at least 1mm per week to generate sufficient force to impact cranial bones outside of the jaw, and ALFs cannot do that. So while I wouldn't suggest ALFs to anyone who wants to widen their overall craniofacial structure, they are life changing for those with compressed airways, and I'm quite sure that they do more than tip teeth. When I get my final CT scan, I will share it here. My ALF dentist thinks my airway has about doubled so far.

p.s. to add to Nick's first post, I would add that ROLFing is a great way to restore overall posture and shift neurological range of motion. Second to that would be manipulation by a good osteopath.
Thank you for sharing your experience, @Lecarpetron
Well to my question, Ray Peat replied the following:
"The upper jaw can adjust its breadth, and an important factor in its progressive broadening with age is the pressure of the tongue against the palate and upper teeth, during sleep or inactivity. Some therapists say that people with sleep problems can develop a narrowing of the jaw by breathing through the mouth at night. The dry mouth also favors tooth decay. Vitamin D and calcium are important for good sleep; a vitamin D blood level of 60 to 80 ng/ml is said (Stasha Gominak) to be optimal for sleep. I think milk and cheese are the best foods for good tooth development."
 
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It activates osteocalcin and increases testerone expression in the face by partitioning bone mass appropriately.

But this would assume that we are all genetically meant to be wide faced with chiseled jaws, and the only reason we’re not is because of insufficiently activated osteocalcin and low testosterone. Which can’t be true.
 

Arrade

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But this would assume that we are all genetically meant to be wide faced with chiseled jaws, and the only reason we’re not is because of insufficiently activated osteocalcin and low testosterone. Which can’t be true.
How is that “can’t be true” when the reason we don’t get mk4 is because we artificially feed cows and chicken corn instead of grass/free range?

The wider your face, the more room for your teeth to sit properly.
What’s your evidence it “can’t be the case.”

Regardless, it actually does what we say it does, so to my aesthetic advantage I’ll utilize mk4
 
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How is that “can’t be true” when the reason we don’t get mk4 is because we artificially feed cows and chicken corn instead of grass/free range?

The wider your face, the more room for your teeth to sit properly.
What’s your evidence it “can’t be the case.”

Regardless, it actually does what we say it does, so to my aesthetic advantage I’ll utilize mk4
+1 the more nutrient dense diet, the better facial development.
 
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How is that “can’t be true” when the reason we don’t get mk4 is because we artificially feed cows and chicken corn instead of grass/free range?

Because it ignores the fact that people are of a huge variety of shapes and appearances. And because it implies that being ugly is an automatic result of a nutritional deficiency. Which obviously is not true.

Changing the shape of an adult man’s skull with a vitamin....come on man. That’s a snake oil science. Show me one piece of evidence this has ever been done, aside from the anecdotal wishful thinking of a few people.
 
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Elephanto

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Allright.
Do you have any idea's how to reduce excessive collagen synthesis, maybe?

Reducing TGF-Beta (inflammatory cytokine resulting from liver damage and promoting further damage) : Taurine, Zinc, Milk Thistle, Emodin, Olive Oil, Vitamin D, Ginger and Curcumin. Reducing Hypoxia (CO2 protects against it, cardio can help), stress, Serotonin (5-ht2a), il-6, alcohol, cannabis, estrogen, oxidation from smoking, endotoxins which all increase it.

Reducing Estrogen in general which promotes excessive collagen synthesis. A moderate amount of UV-B radiation, which can lessen many skin conditions by inhibiting keratinocytes proliferation.

Retinol (Vitamin A) markly reduces fibroblast proliferation and collagen synthesis.

Peat says this :
When cells are stressed, they form extra collagen
So basically anything that restores proper glucose metabolism and ATP production and reduces oxidation.
 
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Reducing TGF-Beta (inflammatory cytokine resulting from liver damage and promoting further damage) : Taurine, Zinc, Milk Thistle, Emodin, Olive Oil, Vitamin D, Ginger and Curcumin. Reducing Hypoxia (CO2 protects against it, cardio can help), stress, Serotonin (5-hta2), il-6, alcohol, cannabis, estrogen, oxidation from smoking, endotoxins which all increase it.

Reducing Estrogen in general which promotes excessive collagen synthesis. A moderate amount of UV-B radiation, which can lessen many skin conditions by inhibiting keratinocytes proliferation.

Retinol (Vitamin A) markly reduces fibroblast proliferation and collagen synthesis.

Peat says this : So basically anything that restores proper glucose metabolism and ATP production and reduces oxidation.
I would add methylene blue which also helps restoring glucose metabolism.
 
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Elephanto

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I

I would add methylene blue which also helps restoring glucose metabolism.

Good point, Methylene Blue is also a potent Nitric Oxide scavenger. Nitric Oxide both increases collagen synthesis and TGF-Beta levels (conflicting studies on TGF, some show promotion and inhibition, but conditions with high NO always correlate with high TGF-Beta). While verifying for this, I also saw that PGE-2 also increases TGF Beta, so minimizing Omega 6 intake is another factor to add (on top of being Estrogenic).

From the list I posted before; Zinc, Emodin, CO2, reducing endotoxins, alcohol, smoke oxidation, Serotonin/5-ht2 also reduce NO. Probably others too.
 
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@Elephanto @Rosie Excellent, thank you! I will concentrate on Reducing TGF-Beta. I think im good with restoring glucose metabolism.

I have milk thistle and methylene blue on my wish list. I want to try it after I've traveled back home.

What I drink is milk with 1/2 teaspoon ginger powder, sweetened with sugar. Actually very nice taste !
 

Arrade

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Because it ignores the fact that people are of a huge variety of shapes and appearances. And because it implies that being ugly is an automatic result of a nutritional deficiency. Which obviously is not true.

Changing the shape of an adult man’s skull with a vitamin....come on man. That’s a snake oil science. Show me one piece of evidence this has ever been done, aside from the anecdotal wishful thinking of a few people.
Well no one has studied it as far as I know, I imagine there are studies revolving around osteocalcin.
I don’t think you can disprove it with studies
 

Arrade

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Because it ignores the fact that people are of a huge variety of shapes and appearances. And because it implies that being ugly is an automatic result of a nutritional deficiency. Which obviously is not true.

Changing the shape of an adult man’s skull with a vitamin....come on man. That’s a snake oil science. Show me one piece of evidence this has ever been done, aside from the anecdotal wishful thinking of a few people.
Height can be altered by nutrition and metabolism.
The body breaks down and remakes all of its bone over time, just like it replaces its skin.
Plus K vitamin is the carrier that places calcium where it is supposed to go.
I don’t really have a aesthetic need to take mk4 I’m just saying the idea looks entirely relies on genetics and not conscious /unconscious genetic and environmental expression is naive
 
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@Elephanto @Rosie Excellent, thank you! I will concentrate on Reducing TGF-Beta. I think im good with restoring glucose metabolism.

I have milk thistle and methylene blue on my wish list. I want to try it after I've traveled back home.

What I drink is milk with 1/2 teaspoon ginger powder, sweetened with sugar. Actually very nice taste !
@General Orange I would recommend methylene blue made by MITOLAB
 

Nick W.

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Mike Mew said that adults need to be expanded at least 1mm per week to generate sufficient force to impact cranial bones outside of the jaw, and ALFs cannot do that. So while I wouldn't suggest ALFs to anyone who wants to widen their overall craniofacial structure, they are life changing for those with compressed airways...
My ALF dentist thinks my airway has about doubled so far.

...ROLFing is a great way to restore overall posture and shift neurological range of motion.

Hello Lecarpetron,

Holy smokes, congrats on the airway change! Thanks for a description of the ALF, sounds bizarre! I admit I couldn't conceive of expansion as anything other than pushing the teeth or palate apart. Nice that it works, but disappointed it won't tilt (as I also had braces), or open the suture.

I've heard of Rolfing, if money were not an issue I'd try so many of these bodywork therapies and let everyone know what was the real deal, and what's not worth it. Fascial release is definitely near the top of my list to experiment with next.


Well to my question, Ray Peat replied the following:
"The upper jaw can adjust its breadth, and an important factor in its progressive broadening with age is the pressure of the tongue against the palate and upper teeth, during sleep or inactivity. Some therapists say that people with sleep problems can develop a narrowing of the jaw by breathing through the mouth at night. The dry mouth also favors tooth decay. Vitamin D and calcium are important for good sleep; a vitamin D blood level of 60 to 80 ng/ml is said (Stasha Gominak) to be optimal for sleep. I think milk and cheese are the best foods for good tooth development."

Thanks for sharing Rosie!
 
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Chew and Mew is your only option.

Masetic gum (falium) in a 5-7 peice wad. Where your teeth don't touch. Evenly chew hard for about one minute or until gum is soft. Take out and set next to your desk repeat. It's high weight(hard gum) low reps.

Using regular gum and high reps leads to TMJ.

This will strengthen masesters muscles and create strong closed mouth.

Now

Place tongue on the roof of mouth focusing on the back third of the tongue. Like your pushing up with your tongue.

3-5 months, will se better under eye orbitals and pushed foward maxmilla. couple years and there will be real change.
 

cheesecake3

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After puberty (or some age) there's not much you can do about
bone structure on your body. Only aging and stress can do that (but in a negative way)

Yes, K2 can make some change on bone structure via calcium metabolism, especially on your face. Vitamin D works synergistically with it. Magnesium also works synergistically with K2/D3.

Although it's not recommended by Peat Estradiol (E2) makes face more rounded. More feminine look, less jaw defined.

Maybe you can try Estriol (E3) cream on your face. A weak but beneficial, progesterone like estrogen. I'm not sure it will create a huge difference.

Some MTF's are also reporting that Progesterone makes face more rounded and feminine. Again I'm not sure about that.

BTW You have a really nice face. I wouldn't even try to change my face if I were you. You are good.


is that save? to use estriol cream on the face?
 

cheesecake3

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LIFT.

there was an article i read a while that talked about how insulin has an influence on bone growth.

i've noticed many a pregnant women tend to get a man jaw from all the insulin and it goes back to normal after child birth and some weight loss. my sister had it for a while but after she lost all the baby fat she looked like she was 19 again.

but lifting weights and then triggering insulin response after will help with bones and muscle but you also need to make sure you eat enough protein for the amino acids, collagen, and sulphur for joints.

But how does lifting help with the face. What influence does insulin have on bone growth?
 

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