How to be seen as the "alpha male" sorta guy other than with looks?

[OccamzRazer]

Ah! Just now a young 'Christian' woman sitting across the room from me said she wants to slap her significant other sometimes.

Even if you are an alpha/omega/sigma/delta/super-male who can take your pick of such women...is it worth it?

In North America it is not.

Okay, will stop spamming this thread now.

 

[grapes]

@OccamzRazer , can't agree more, double standards and men's discrimination are the real problem, not how to become an "alpha".

 

[SamYo123]

the ability to make a womans vagina tingle is what makes you seen as 'alpha' by woman

you'll knows whos alpha in other men, when it comes to work environments quickly..

 

[Nomane Euger]

Speaking of coffee shops, here's another glaring disparity between the sexes.

I go to coffee shops every day. Occasionally a female barista will write their number on the coffee cup they give me.

Even if I don't find the woman particularly attractive, they still earn a little bit of admiration/respect for their boldness. In other words, if a woman takes the initiative toward me, I appreciate it!

But Lord have mercy on a male barista that tries this. If the female customer receiving affection doesn't appreciate the male's gesture - in other words, if they don't find him attractive! - they are liable to complain via a dramatic TikTok. Or complain directly to the coffee shop's manager. The unsuccessful male may then be shamed.

most men are awkward to varying degree when they approach a woman,the man being awkward make most women feel the awkwardness too.even ugly or mediocre men that i have seen talk to women in the street,as long as they were not feeling too awkward,and therefore not making the woman feel it,they didnt get bad reactions.also the fact that some men when they talk to a woman in the street there seems to be a degree of forcing her to listen to their first approach,thats also disturbing for most women specifically if they have 0 interest at the first sight and they just want to walk away.most men get flatters if women approach them in the street and it happens very rarely for most men,unless the man perceive the woman as very very ugly and there is his mates it could make him feel unconfortable.even if the woman feel shy and unconfortable,a lot of men would enjoy that and it would flatter their egos,on the other hands akwards shy mediocre looking men approching women in the street,most women wont get the same feeling in most cases.men tend to be more stoic and less sensitive than women also

 

[FocusedOnHealth]

Speaking of coffee shops, here's another glaring disparity between the sexes.

I go to coffee shops every day. Occasionally a female barista will write their number on the coffee cup they give me.

Even if I don't find the woman particularly attractive, they still earn a little bit of admiration/respect for their boldness. In other words, if a woman takes the initiative toward me, I appreciate it!

But Lord have mercy on a male barista that tries this. If the female customer receiving affection doesn't appreciate the male's gesture - in other words, if they don't find him attractive! - they are liable to complain via a dramatic TikTok. Or complain directly to the coffee shop's manager. The unsuccessful male may then be shamed.

Notice a trend here?

In N. America being an outgoing man is frowned upon - unless said man is subjectively perceived as attractive.

What I did is get rid of my cell phone. Now I have no way to contact these double-standard-ing women. Problem solved!

You have a point. I really don’t understand why certain women feel the need to post their whole life on social media. Like who cares? Is your life that empty that you feel the need to tell the whole world what you do every waking minute? What you eat, what you wear etc. etc.? Their life, as you mentioned, is reduced down to a TikTok video. Kudos on you getting rid of your cell phone.

 

[OccamzRazer]

most men are awkward to varying degree when they approach a woman,the man being awkward make most women feel the awkwardness too.even ugly or mediocre men that i have seen talk to women in the street,as long as they were not feeling too awkward,and therefore not making the woman feel it,they didnt get bad reactions.also the fact that some men when they talk to a woman in the street there seems to be a degree of forcing her to listen to their first approach,thats also disturbing for most women specifically if they have 0 interest at the first sight and they just want to walk away.most men get flatters if women approach them in the street and it happens very rarely for most men,unless the man perceive the woman as very very ugly and there is his mates it could make him feel unconfortable.even if the woman feel shy and unconfortable,a lot of men would enjoy that and it would flatter their egos,on the other hands akwards shy mediocre looking men approching women in the street,most women wont get the same feeling in most cases.men tend to be more stoic and less sensitive than women also

The example I gave (giving one's number on a coffee cup) doesn't leave much room for awkwardness.

Regardless, just because a man is awkward doesn't mean it's okay for a woman to shame him!

Also, many women are awkward when they approach men.

It really sounds like you are blaming this problem on men.

It would be funny how often that happens, if it weren't so sad...

 

[OccamzRazer]

You have a point. I really don’t understand why certain women feel the need to post their whole life on social media. Like who cares? Is your life that empty that you feel the need to tell the whole world what you do every waking minute? What you eat, what you wear etc. etc.? Their life, as you mentioned, is reduced down to a TikTok video. Kudos on you getting rid of your cell phone.

Thanks for the kind words!

But IMO the real problem here isn't social media- tho social media has definitely amplified things.

The real problem is that many women shame men for being, well, men, unless such men have the rare combo of looks + confidence needed to excuse their behavior.

 

[Nomane Euger]

The example I gave (giving one's number on a coffee cup) doesn't leave much room for awkwardness.

Regardless, just because a man is awkward doesn't mean it's okay for a woman to shame him!

Also, many women are awkward when they approach men.

It really sounds like you are blaming this problem on men.

It would be funny how often that happens, if it weren't so sad...

no,men shouldnt be shame about that as long as they didnt force the woman to listen despit her trying to get away and as long as the men stayed respectfull and wasnt to salacious.i said it,some women are also akward when they approach men,men approach women way more often that women approach men,women are more use to get average looking akward men approching them,its way rarer for men do get approach by women,and a lot of men do appreciate a woman beeing akward and shy with them,it flatter their egos that the woman is akward because she is interested by the man.on other hand,most women do not appreciate getting approach by akward men that sometimes want to force them to listen to their speech even if the woman has 0 interest for him,and is trying to walk away,plus some of them have an innapropriate degree of hornyness in their tone of voices.the problem is multi factorials,not soly on men ackwardness.i dont blame neither men or women,men dont choose to feel and be awkward when they approach women

 

[Nomane Euger]

The real problem is that many women shame men for being, well, men, unless such men have the rare combo of looks + confidence needed to excuse their behavior.

no,an male biological gender person approaching a woman in a awkardness way to the point here she feel bad,thats not "being a man".if you make a woman feel bad when you approach her in the street you probably didnt pay attention to the signs of interest/disinterest,and there was a disparity between the interest/disinterest she manifested and the way you approached her.again it doesnt justify in most cases shaming,unless she feel really bad about it and she deemed the man approach totally iinapropriate and disrespectfull.

i purpose you a more extreme exemple in the street,if a woman approach a man in the street and the woman start to be very salacious despit the man showing disinterest,the man could insult her,if its to much,and i have witnessed it

explicit the situation you witnessed in the coffee shop.because from my experience you dont need a rare combo of looks/confidence,just to not be too akward and you wont get bad reactions in most cases.

 

[OccamzRazer]

@OccamzRazer , can't agree more, double standards and men's discrimination are the real problem, not how to become an "alpha".

Exactly :)

Men should get as strong/successful/confident as they can, by all means, but that won't really fix such a pervasive problem.

 

[FocusedOnHealth]

Thanks for the kind words!

But IMO the real problem here isn't social media- tho social media has definitely amplified things.

The real problem is that many women shame men for being, well, men, unless such men have the rare combo of looks + confidence needed to excuse their behavior.

Is that what you are seeing out in the dating world? A lot of women shaming men? That’s sad if that is the case. Maybe it comes from the
educational institutions where they teach women to demand their rights in an obnoxious way. How much does them sitting on a sidewalk linking hand in hand, and screaming at the top of their lungs accomplish anything? It justs promotes hatred of them. And I can understand it. Not condoning the hatred, but I understand their behavior is a big turnoff.

 

[Nomane Euger]

Exactly :)

Men should get as strong/successful/confident as they can, by all means, but that won't really fix such a pervasive problem.

how do you know that if most men feel really powerfull,confident and non awkwards,that it wont solve the problem?

 

[Wagner83]

Oh and one more thing about coffee shops. Take a minute to refrain from work (or forum posting) and observe the conversations around you.

If there are women talking, I bet that at some point you'll hear them talk badly about a man who loves them.

I don't hate women - far from it! - but I hate how Western culture has indoctrinated them and set them up for relational failure.

A few days ago in the train, a small group of female friends were talking out loud and giggling. One was proud to tell her friends how she beat up the guy she was dating but still sent him a message later in the day to ask him to come over for the night. For the latter part she impersonated an innocent, naive high-pitched girl voice. Thankfully, head issues like those are not the average.

 

[MetabolicTrash]

Oh and one more thing about coffee shops. Take a minute to refrain from work (or forum posting) and observe the conversations around you.

If there are women talking, I bet that at some point you'll hear them talk badly about a man who loves them.

I don't hate women - far from it! - but I hate how Western culture has indoctrinated them and set them up for relational failure.

I often hear women usually talking about other guys. One reason why I dislike the whole "PUA" thing is that it expects you to "sell yourself out" to every woman -- like a pushy salesperson -- as if this is what gets you buys or "wins" ultimately. These "advices" are akin to the shoddy, pushy, generally un-liked used car salesman stereotype. He will tell you anything you want to hear -- try to "work around your words" -- try and question your sanity if you doubt his cars. The cars are not flying off the lot because nobody wants to buy them -- not because he doesn't know how to sell 'em. If the analogy can apply to cars & their appeal to another, why not with humans too?

Does Häagen-Dazs have to come to your door to tell you they have ice cream for you to buy? No, you go to where you know it's sold and buy it when you want it. Do people go door-to-door selling much of anything anymore? Even the classic "speed dating" events are mostly dead now thanks to the internet and such at this point.

I don't want to waste energy trying to put up some insane "front" and become a habitual liar or dark triad psychopath in order to attract some few women -- that's both wrong and far from optimal output from the energy you'd have to put in. Some guys are naturally these shifty, dark triad types that MIGHT sometimes have some success with women, but that's innate or becomes them over-time AKA they don't even do this to "pull" or try to seduce women or whatnot. So the idea of "becoming a man who can pick up women" doesn't really make sense to me ... If no one's buying despite your best efforts to look good/sellable/presentable, nobody is interested then.

Not only is PUA largely ineffective, but people disregard all they have to put in for the very little they tend to get out of it (usually most guys just get rejected 99% of the time). Think about that ... If you're a guy & getting rejected 99.9% of the time, what does that tell you? It tells me you're not very desirable, so why humiliate yourself further if one already knows that? It's almost like people want men to go out and humiliate; embarrass; waste energy and weaken themselves by trying to force things that just are supposed to be organic/natural processes and knowable, not contrived/forced/"pushed" or scripted/faked interactions to "score" this way, which often fails I'd say.

I don't know about any other guy, but if I'm expected to be a pushy salesman who mindlessly tries to shovel something in the face of others who never make any interest in wanting it despite it being right in front of them clear and visible, then it's no wonder the dating world in particular seems anti-male at its core. You can't tell me to "be the hunter" while then shaming the man for hunting; you don't tell him to "chase to win" for him to chase and mostly (or always) lose. The best thing for people is "positive reinforcement" sometimes ... And I doubt many guys are going to get anything but that along with egos destroyed by hounding/"chasing" girls to get rejected left & right.

 

[FocusedOnHealth]

Not that my opinion matters all that much ( even though I AM opinionated on some things) a guy wrote this article on women sleeping around with several partners, and how he’s not down with it. He pretty much confirms/echos what I have written in this thread- albeit, from a guy’s perspective and style. Which will probably be more easily understood and accepted coming from a guy. Which I get

And I agree with the overall gist of what he says because, well, it’s true.

Return Of Kings Is Closed

Have at it…..

Edit, I don’t necessarily agree with everything he wrote but he does make some valid and blunt points.

 

[ironfist]

i did not ask because i considered my self ignorant on this,i asked so he could explicit the foundations of his faulty claims.traits that make you attractive and traits that make you be a "**** hole" are not the same,a man can have both simply. being an "**** hole" is not men attractive features taken to far.

[/QUOTE]

I was explaining it because this is a frequent misunderstanding that a lot of guys, perhaps some reading this thread, feel bewildered by at first.

Knowing why chicks hate "nice guys" but love "**** holes" is vital. But understanding WHY they pick the "**** holes" (when they really don't like them) is significant.

I wasn't suggesting you didn't understand.

Invariably, in these threads, in every forum on every website, somebody who understand why women don't like "nice guys" doesn't understand why they like guys who are "**** holes."

It can save guys a lot of time to understand the reason.

i didnt imply in my comments thats its about thinking or overthinking,quite the contrary,you can reach a state where you know what peoples feel just by seeing and hearing them,it can be feelings,it can be ideas manifesting in your head,and often both can be intertwined.its not about trying to overthink and ignore your feelings/instincts.as you know how they feel,and as you have experienced these feelings in the past,you know wich kind of thoughts are usually intertwined with these feelings

Yeah, I was expanding for the folks in this thread.

The basic reaction of myriad guys is to "try and think harder to solve the issue." That's the wrong way to do it.

When I am out of practice, or when I get stuck in my head, I ask myself similar questions:

1) What is the male equivalent of a chick who enters a room and is SO HOT every guy stares at her?

2) What is the difference between the quiet loser guy people never want to talk to, and the quiet high status guy females approach constantly?

These are two questions I know the answer to, but I only know the answer sometimes. When I am frustrated at myself, I do not know the answer. I try to think my way upon the solution.

When I am avoiding "logical mode," I know the answers.

 

[ironfist]

Ohhh, this is a great post.

I often hear women usually talking about other guys. One reason why I dislike the whole "PUA" thing is that it expects you to "sell yourself out" to every woman -- like a pushy salesperson -- as if this is what gets you buys or "wins" ultimately. These "advices" are akin to the shoddy, pushy, generally un-liked used car salesman stereotype. He will tell you anything you want to hear -- try to "work around your words" -- try and question your sanity if you doubt his cars. The cars are not flying off the lot because nobody wants to buy them -- not because he doesn't know how to sell 'em. If the analogy can apply to cars & their appeal to another, why not with humans too?

[/QUOTE]

You are correct while you are referring to old school PUA, think Mystery Method.

Mystery Method implies women are higher value than men from the commencement. This is why men must do things to raise their value while with that lowering the woman's value; think negs.

Mystery Method is a good place to start if you are without anything else, but in my experience it wasn't the best way to do things. Too much thinking.

Does Häagen-Dazs have to come to your door to tell you they have ice cream for you to buy? No, you go to where you know it's sold and buy it when you want it. Do people go door-to-door selling much of anything anymore? Even the classic "speed dating" events are mostly dead now thanks to the internet and such at this point.

I don't want to waste energy trying to put up some insane "front" and become a habitual liar or dark triad psychopath in order to attract some few women -- that's both wrong and far from optimal output from the energy you'd have to put in. Some guys are naturally these shifty, dark triad types that MIGHT sometimes have some success with women, but that's innate or becomes them over-time AKA they don't even do this to "pull" or try to seduce women or whatnot. So the idea of "becoming a man who can pick up women" doesn't really make sense to me ... If no one's buying despite your best efforts to look good/sellable/presentable, nobody is interested then.

[/quote]

Having had a lot of time in the community, I can tell you that traditional PUA type things are not going to attract the type of woman you want to date.

Does it work? Yup.

But you're going to get a LOT of cluster b type women.

There are multiple counterarguments to this, but this is basically my opinion.

Not only is PUA largely ineffective, but people disregard all they have to put in for the very little they tend to get out of it (usually most guys just get rejected 99% of the time). Think about that ... If you're a guy & getting rejected 99.9% of the time, what does that tell you? It tells me you're not very desirable, so why humiliate yourself further if one already knows that? It's almost like people want men to go out and humiliate; embarrass; waste energy and weaken themselves by trying to force things that just are supposed to be organic/natural processes and knowable, not contrived/forced/"pushed" or scripted/faked interactions to "score" this way, which often fails I'd say.

Real, internal PUA, furthermore this is the reason why a lot of guys get into self development from PUA, solves a lot of these problems.

Permit me to put it this way... internal PUA (aka self development) gets you to where whatever you do is fun, you are having fun doing whatever you are doing and you don't need a woman's validation to have fun. WHEN YOU GET HERE (and not before), you will attract more women than you ever have in your life. It will be less than the amount of women you can get with the other style of PUA, but they will be much greater fits for you.

If you're rejected 99.9% of the time, you might be going after the wrong kinds of women anyway. If you're approaching every woman you see, you'll probably get rejected 99.9% of the time. But why are you approaching every woman you see? Pay attention to the answer, then you will learn the reason: IF YOU ARE DOING IT BECAUSE YOU WANT TO "GET LAID" YOU WILL FAIL. You are sending away gross needy vibes and will only attract bad women. See my point above. Guys who go out because "I need to meet women" are already putting off the wrong energy. That's why no one wants to talk to them. PEOPLE CAN FEEL VIBES.

If you are talking to them because you're in a good mood, and it's fun, and you're having fun, your success rate will be way better than 99.9%.

(Most) PUA doesn't address this. "Hey guys, buy this book and get laid" sells. "Fix yourself, and when you're not gross anymore women will like you" doesn't.

I don't know about any other guy, but if I'm expected to be a pushy salesman who mindlessly tries to shovel something in the face of others who never make any interest in wanting it despite it being right in front of them clear and visible, then it's no wonder the dating world in particular seems anti-male at its core. You can't tell me to "be the hunter" while then shaming the man for hunting; you don't tell him to "chase to win" for him to chase and mostly (or always) lose. The best thing for people is "positive reinforcement" sometimes ... And I doubt many guys are going to get anything but that along with egos destroyed by hounding/"chasing" girls to get rejected left & right.

If you're doing it like a pushy salesman, you're not doing it right.

But different point, being a pushy salesman can work, so... (are you attracting the best style of women for yourself though)?

 

[ironfist]

@OccamzRazer you say ladies put their phone number of the cup.

Something I've read women complain about is, "well, he hit on me, he probably hit on every girl he sees..."

Do you ever think she puts her phone number on every guys' cup?

 

[BearWithMe]

And why would I or anyone else want you in my circle? You sound like a person I would attempt to exclude from my social circles.

Do you prefer hanging around people that do good deeds not for the sake of doing good deeds, but to get someting in return (in this case, alpha status)?

 

[Hugh Johnson]

Do you prefer hanging around people that do good deeds not for the sake of doing good deeds, but to get someting in return (in this case, alpha status)?

I only hang with people who don't care about that and focus on being of service. Unless forced by circumstances.