How Do Permanently Lower Prolactin?

[Sospian]

To*

Alright

Did gear a few years back. Prolactin went really high during PCT, which caused issues for months after.

4 years on my libido is still low. I know dopamine is the issue because the peptide PT-141 temporarily fixed my problems for a few days. My prolactin is on the high range and no matter what I do I can't seem to bring it down permanently.

Zinc; Tribulus, and Vitamin E don't seem to help much, and nor does Progesterone. I tried Cabergoline but my prolactin levels went back up after I came off.

L-Dopa/L-Tyrosine aren't good long-term.

I was considering Vitex but then read some negative stuff on here about how it can damage the testicles.

Considering mega-dosing Vitamin B6 p5p (I read 500mg once or twice a week max is fine), is good but I'm still concerned about it not working permanently.

I do a lot of Peat stuff for my E2, so I know that's not the problem. Stress isn't much of an issue. I'm also taking Niacinamide & Glycine daily to lower Serotonin.

So how can I permanently lower Prolactin & increase Dopamine permanently?

 

[Fidelio]

Sunlight, hydration, avoid dairy, avoid opiods.

 

[marcar72]

How's your salt intake? Adequate salt intake is probably gonna be one of the bigger levers in lowering prolactin. Focus on getting enough salt w/o really worrying too much about potassium since it's ubiquitious.

Here's a couple pertinent Ray Peat articles that cover salt:

Water: swelling, tension, pain, fatigue, aging

Salt, energy, metabolic rate, and longevity

 

[YourUniverse]

Vitamin D and coffee

 

[Sospian]

Sunlight, hydration, avoid dairy, avoid opiods.

I do all of those. I train topless at a park in the Sun.

How's your salt intake? Adequate salt intake is probably gonna be one of the bigger levers in lowering prolactin. Focus on getting enough salt w/o really worrying too much about potassium since it's ubiquitious.

Here's a couple pertinent Ray Peat articles that cover salt:

Water: swelling, tension, pain, fatigue, aging

Salt, energy, metabolic rate, and longevity

I add a high amount of salt to my jacket potatoes and use pink Himalayan salt in my water flask while I train.

 

[Sospian]

bump

 

[Jing]

bump

What about other hormones? What is your test level?

 

[JKX]

Inhibitory Effect of Calcium on Serum Prolactin - PubMed

 

[TheSir]

Celibacy.

https://sites.tufts.edu/emotiononth...oital-neurochemistry-the-blues-and-the-highs/

 

[Sospian]

What about other hormones? What is your test level?

I've been naturally raising my T levels since October. Started off 450ng/dl and was at 640ng/dl by January.

Although I haven't done bloods since, I'm more than certain I'm sitting on a minimum of 850ng/dl just based on how I feel. I've been working extremely hard at raising it in spite of a varicocele.

Right now I have a fire in my chest that just wants me to get up and go, which is something I have only experienced at very high levels of T (I did roids foolishly a few years back).

 

[Sospian]

Inhibitory Effect of Calcium on Serum Prolactin - PubMed

Very interesting. I supplement 500mg of calcium twice a day because I have low intake (considering putting eggshells in my protein shakes).

Celibacy.

https://sites.tufts.edu/emotiononth...oital-neurochemistry-the-blues-and-the-highs/

My dopamine is so low that I have very little sexual desire. I still get wet dreams because of my high T levels, but the libido just isn't there. I know it's 100% dopamine because PT-141 (dopamine agonist) made me insatiably horny for a week, despite its short half-life.

 

[Roni123@]

I've been naturally raising my T levels since October. Started off 450ng/dl and was at 640ng/dl by January.

Although I haven't done bloods since, I'm more than certain I'm sitting on a minimum of 850ng/dl just based on how I feel. I've been working extremely hard at raising it in spite of a varicocele.

Right now I have a fire in my chest that just wants me to get up and go, which is something I have only experienced at very high levels of T (I did roids foolishly a few years back).

what did you do to increase your testosterone?

 

[Sospian]

what did you do to increase your testosterone?

Day: Tribulus; ; Tongkat Ali (5 days on 2 days off); Boron (2 weeks on 1 week off); Panax ginseng; Alcar; Calcium; Intermittent Fasting (pretty sure none of those break Fast); Niacinamide; CDP Choline

Pre-workout: Bromelain (prevents drop in T from exercise); Caffeine; Horny Goat Weed; Vitamin C; Creatine Monohydrate; B-complex; Ginko Biloba

Post-workout: Magnesium (moved from before bed); 2.5g Pine pollen powder; Ashwaghanda (cycled 1 week on 1 week off); Zinc; 2g Cistanche; Taurine; Cynomorium; Cold shower

--Meal 1 -- (Eggs; two jacket potatoes; two 100% beef burgers; butter; shopska salad; half an onion; Organic whey isolate

Post-meal 1: 2.5g pine pollen powder; Vitamin D3 with K2; L-Reuteri; Ginko Biloba

--Meal 2 -- (Whatever fits my macros & calories)

Post-meal 2: 2.5g pine pollen powder; Omega 3; Niacinamide; Vitamin C

Night: 2.5g Pine pollen powder; 2g cistanche; lysine; 1 whole raw carrot; Tribulus; Tongkat Ali; Cynomorium; Meditation; Red-light therapy; Vitamin E oil; Iodine

1. Everything emboldened affects Testosterone; Androgens, or AR-signalling in some manner
2. It's more important to focus first on fixing deficiencies prior to herbal supplementation
3. Pine Pollen powder > Pine Pollen tincture. I found the powder to give a noticeable boost in drive without side effects, whereas tinctures shut me down.

 

[Roni123@]

I believe that eliminating nutritional deficiencies and reducing stress is a huge lever for increasing testosterone, followed by training the most androgenic parts

 

[Lokzo]

This calls for heavy Dopamine regenerative compounds like this:




and also this:
Bromantane (Ladasten): The Drug That Permanently Increases Your Zest For Life.

 

[Jessie]

I've only been studying Peat for 4-5 months, but from what I've gathered prolactin, estrogen, and cortisol seem to closely gravitate around serotonin. So serotonin seems like the axis or center that all these stressors are attached too. If you can antagonize serotonin, it's likely to reverse the inflammatory catabolic state. The question then becomes what causes elevated serotonin?

The biggest factor is definitely endotoxin. The calcium/phosphate ratio is also important as well as avoiding low protein diets.

What causes the intestinal endotoxin to increase? Lots of things could, but the most common one is a sluggish thyroid and impaired glucose metabolism.

What causes an impaired metabolism? Most common thing is polyunsaturated fats that cause electron leakage and block the thyroid and vitamin D transporter proteins.

So considering this whole stress state is almost like a domino effect, a "reverse domino" treatment would likely be effective. Focus on reducing serotonin to mitigate immediate symptoms, correct the bacterial overgrowth to improve liver health, then more T4 starts to get converted into T3, T3 (according to Peat) is the best regulator of serotonin, and continue avoiding the dangerous catabolic fats to keep metabolism strong and healthy.

 

[Sospian]

This calls for heavy Dopamine regenerative compounds like this:




and also this:
Bromantane (Ladasten): The Drug That Permanently Increases Your Zest For Life.

Perfect. Time to break out the protein shake and learn something new

 

[baccheion]

How's your salt intake? Adequate salt intake is probably gonna be one of the bigger levers in lowering prolactin. Focus on getting enough salt w/o really worrying too much about potassium since it's ubiquitious.

Here's a couple pertinent Ray Peat articles that cover salt:

Water: swelling, tension, pain, fatigue, aging

Salt, energy, metabolic rate, and longevity

What ratio of sodium to potassium and how much sodium at 12 cups water per day? What if black (said to need less sodium; 1.5g vs. 2.4 as the RDA, for example)?

 

[Sospian]

I've only been studying Peat for 4-5 months, but from what I've gathered prolactin, estrogen, and cortisol seem to closely gravitate around serotonin. So serotonin seems like the axis or center that all these stressors are attached too. If you can antagonize serotonin, it's likely to reverse the inflammatory catabolic state. The question then becomes what causes elevated serotonin?

The biggest factor is definitely endotoxin. The calcium/phosphate ratio is also important as well as avoiding low protein diets.

What causes the intestinal endotoxin to increase? Lots of things could, but the most common one is a sluggish thyroid and impaired glucose metabolism.

What causes an impaired metabolism? Most common thing is polyunsaturated fats that cause electron leakage and block the thyroid and vitamin D transporter proteins.

So considering this whole stress state is almost like a domino effect, a "reverse domino" treatment would likely be effective. Focus on reducing serotonin to mitigate immediate symptoms, correct the bacterial overgrowth to improve liver health, then more T4 starts to get converted into T3, T3 (according to Peat) is the best regulator of serotonin, and continue avoiding the dangerous catabolic fats to keep metabolism strong and healthy.

I've been paying a lot more attention to PUFAs as of recently. I would say that for the past year, my diet has been good. I'm gluten-free and lean towards paleo whenever I can. PUFAs are something I discovered to be harmful more recently, but I've been avoiding them as much as possible since.

 

[Jessie]

I've been paying a lot more attention to PUFAs as of recently. I would say that for the past year, my diet has been good. I'm gluten-free and lean towards paleo whenever I can. PUFAs are something I discovered to be harmful more recently, but I've been avoiding them as much as possible since.

That's really good. I think Peat recommends to keep PUFA consumption at, or under, 4 grams daily. This is typically doable if your fat sources are from coconut oil, butter, dairy, cacao, pastured egg yolks, ruminant meats, etc.

The benefits of cutting out polyunsaturated fat seem to be a long term process, it's not like something you're going to notice from just 30 days of abstaining. Also, for me personally, even cutting out PUFAs didn't completely cure me. I think for many people, once PUFA has blocked thyroid function to the point that your digestion has slowed, and is now developing bacterial overgrowth, simply removing PUFA may not be enough. My metabolism wasn't fully healing until I started to focus on the LPS/bacteria.

I think PUFA is what sets everything in motion, but once it degrades your metabolism to the point that endotoxin and serotonin becomes an issue, I think these continue to exert a very profound excitatory and inflammatory response despite keeping dietary PUFA low.