It's my understanding that he actually increased his salt intake during that time. In one interview he talks about the cook adding extra salt to his morning porridge. If I find the interview I will post it.
Edit - here is the interview clip
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High-Salt Augments Aldosterone Toxicity Despite Lowered Plasma-Readings
- Thread starter Tristan Loscha
- Start date
Edit - here is the interview clip
It's my understanding that he actually increased his salt intake during that time. In one interview he talks about the cook adding extra salt to his morning porridge. If I find the interview I will post it.
Edit - here is the interview clip
That's the one - however he did not stay on the high salt porridge. He told the cook he had been prescribed a low salt diet, and commented on how he then didn't have crystals of sweat in his eyebrows.
You are right he said that to avoid the extra salt (a tablespoon which is a lot) but I don't interpret that as him being on a low salt diet. He was just avoiding getting extra.
He goes on to say that in the long run sodium is protective
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True, I think the main thing is to keep in mind just salting everything isn't an elixir even if it does taste and feel good.
To be honest, I am still not confident about using salt liberally.
If you listen to the rest of the interview he talks more about low salt diets. He does say that other minerals are protective against a low salt diet.
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I originally found it in this thread. Some good arguments "For" and "Against". I doubt there is one solution for all people. I'm just going to cut back, but not out.
Biochemical Health Reduction And Oxidation, Politics And Science, 2015
Even Ray has admitted salt can accumulate in diseased cells and cause them to swell. Gerson found a way of releasing this intracellular salt with fresh juices. i see, so the intracellular sodum level is raised. and ray also says co2 is a big factor to push calcium and sodium out of cells.
Thank you . It's been helpful to listen to this interview again.I originally found it in this thread. Some good arguments "For" and "Against". I doubt there is one solution for all people. I'm just going to cut back, but not out.
Biochemical Health Reduction And Oxidation, Politics And Science, 2015
Even Ray has admitted salt can accumulate in diseased cells and cause them to swell. Gerson found a way of releasing this intracellular salt with fresh juices. i see, so the intracellular sodum level is raised. and ray also says co2 is a big factor to push calcium and sodium out of cells.raypeatforum.com
I will repost the section of the interview here because it will be useful for future readers
RP: About aldosterone: one of my first physiological experiment was on myself; when i worked in the woods, our cook was cracked on the idea that hard physical labor meant you sweated a lot and needs to replenish your salt. And so he would put about a tablespoon of salt in everyone’s porridge in the morning. If you didn’t eat your porridge, you didn’t get your ham and eggs and steak. So everyone was doing it. And within a few days of doing that, i found that the sweat that gripped down my forehead was leaving salt crystal trails on my glasses, and my eyebrows looked like they were coated with snow from the salt crystals. And i thought of the trick of saying that i had been put on a low salt diet. So i got normal porridge from then on. And immediately i could sweat distilled water. And on the high salt diet, i had to take salt pills at about 11 o’clock in the morning, otherwise i started to getting feint; i needed to replenish the salt which was pouring out so fast. But after the low salt diet, i never needed after any salt pills again.
JB: You mean the overdose of salt stopped your body from being able to regulate it properly ?
RP: Yeah. And when you’re cutting back on the sodium, one of the first reactions is that your aldosterone is increased. And aldosterone lets you retain the sodium; but it does it at the expense of losing some potassium and magnesium. So if your diet is high in calcium and magnesium, and potassium, then there isn’t any problems with the low sodium intake. But chronically, that high aldosterone has a pro-inflammatory effect. And so, chronically, getting more of all of the alkaline minerals (mainly: calcium, magnesium, sodium and potassium) than you really need is a safety precaution that will suppress your aldosterone, and protect your heart from inflammation and fibrosis and hypertension and so on. So, in the long run, sodium has this protection against cell swelling, inflammation, fibrosis.
JB: And if taken in reasonable amounts, it tastes good too, right ? What about “can salt ingestion trigger migraines in some predisposed people” ?
RP: Yes. When you’re already on a low salt diet and take salt, one of the common physiology experiments is to have people drink a quarter of plain water or a quarter of plain water with a heaping teaspoon of salt added to it. And at the end of the physiology lab, everyone who got the unsalted warm water would have formed about a quart of urine. And the ones that got the salt didn’t have any extra forming. It took usually a couple of days for that excess water to come out. So if you take a sudden dose of salt, it makes you swell up and retain water, until your aldosterone has adjusted downward.
JB: I see; so it just takes a while to adjust to it.
RP: Yeah. And you’ll notice that anything that’s susceptible will swell up; your fingers and toes and lips and eyelids and such might swell up in the first day after eating lots of salt. But people who, for example, on a long airplane trip would always got swollen feet; if they adjusted 2 or 3 days in advance by eating extra salt and some baking soda, they didn’t get the swollen feet from sitting still anymore.
JB: So you’re retaining the liquid then in a different place ? Or..
RP: No. You’re suppressing the aldosterone, so it gets the water out of you. And one of the ways sodium works is the albumin molecule is full of negative charges, and it holds the sodium in association. So you get a cloud of positive-negative charges which hold under water. It keeps the water osmotically held in your bloodstream. If you’re low in either albumin or sodium, your blood itself loses the osmotic quality. And the water stays in your cells and extra-vascular spaces. But when the combination of albumin and sodium is present in the blood, water flows out of the tissues into the blood. And blood passing through the kidneys then can get rid of the water that otherwise would sit around in your tissues. And that same situation impairs circulation, because your blood volume is low, and the fluid volume outside the blood vessels is too high. And the anti-diuretic hormone (ADH: vasopressin) is another side of this. But it’s a lot more complicated than a response to stress, estrogen and a lot of other things, for the aldosterone is pretty closely related to the mineral balance.
JB: And what is the anti-diuretic hormone ?
RP: It’s a pituitary hormone that causes water retention with sodium loss. And a low thyroid person...old people, people after accidents, anyone in serious stress...they call it “Inappropriate secretion of anti-diuretic hormone syndrome”. And that’s very common where edema is what is really harmful. The brain swells up, for example, because the body has too much water and not enough salt. And the remedy for that is just adding sodium. But that’s not fundamental; and if you do it too fast, you disturb the balance in the different compartments. But the basic reason for it is that you aren’t producing the carbon dioxide from a thyroid deficiency. And the absence of the high production of the carbon dioxide means that you’re enable to retain the sodium in your kidneys, as the water passes through. And so, the low thyroid person loses sodium, because the reverse of the process that happens in other cells. In the kidneys, carbon dioxide allows the cells to catch and retain sodium.
JB: That’s fascinating. Anything you want to add about staying healthy and keeping your oxidation working well ?
RP: Just keeping stress down and fun up. Judging food by largely how it tastes rather than by what the experts say.
JB: Thank you Ray.
@Peatress reading it again, I realise what it was that I picked up on - Ray agreed with the tablespoon of salt in porridge as being an overdose. I'm sure he didn't think it was actually an overdose, more of an 'excess', but still, one tablespoon.
If you are replete in the other 3, it seems fine to just take enough salt to keep aldosterone at a healthy level. Not spoons and spoons of it.
If you are replete in the other 3, it seems fine to just take enough salt to keep aldosterone at a healthy level. Not spoons and spoons of it.
Yes, a tablespoon is overkill - I can't imagine how dreadful that porridge tasted. I think the role of other minerals is significant, you did mention that earlier.
What still confuses me is why some people swell with extra salt and others resolve swelling by adding extra?
Salting to taste is not as easy as it sounds.
Here Dr. Peat says that even 30g of salt is compatible with good health - I can't imagine eating that much salt. I struggle to tolerate 5g
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Maybe the extra salt addresses aldosterone in some, lowering anti-diuretic hormone, but in others they go into excess, as they haven't got enough K/Ca/Mg so it's like when people puff up with carbs...a sort of 'simple' retention via osmosis. (I'm just mulling, I have no real idea)
Mulling is good - potassium is important too. 4000mg/day is not easy to get if one isn't drinking juices or milk.
Also, thyroid helps retain magnesium - so many of us have low thyroid.
Dave Clark
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An interesting salt to use if you want to increase magnesium, and to lower sodium intake"
ancientlakesmagnesium.com.au
Magnesium Enriched | Natural Lake Salt 425g
ancientlakesmagnesium.com.au
who eats pure refined salt... Ive always has it as a part of a meal which contains an innumerable amount of other compounds. Im supposed to believe that the minor micro minerals (and myriad of contaminants) in overpriced gourmet salt make a world of difference when mixed into a dish thats a cornucopia of many other compounds?
probably has the same pH disturbing issues as Mg Chloride, not to mention the contamination of such lakes with heavy metals.An interesting salt to use if you want to increase magnesium, and to lower sodium intake"
Magnesium Enriched | Natural Lake Salt 425g
Dave Clark
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I have read some on this forum complaining about magnesium chloride. Please elaborate why magnesium chloride has PH disturbing issues any more than sodium chloride. if it is the chloride that is the problem, I am not sure why then it would be any different than regular salt, which is sodium chloride.
Sodium chloride is neutral, whereas magnesium chloride is slightly acid, taking enough to meet your dietary need for Mg is a burden on pH homeostasis. It gives me heartburn and irritates my urinary tract.
Dave Clark
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Interesting. I suppose that context has much to do with ultimate acidity, etc., since from what I gathered reading some things on a search, that other things that are alkaline can influence the Ph when mixed or in contact with the MgChl2. Many things that are embraced on this forum, such as coffee, orange juice {and other citrus}, which have Ph levels of 4 or below, can still be healthy in effect. Apple cider vinegar is another low Ph item that has given positive health effects to people.
Having said this, I agree that I would not use the magnesium chloride as my sole source of magnesium, but I don't think a pinch or two of the Ancient Lakes in a gallon of filtered water would be a problem to bring up the mineral content, and could easily neutralized with a pinch or two of sodium bicarbonate {baking soda}.
I dont think its harmful in that context. Nor if cycled with other forms of Mg.
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