High Blood Pressure. concerned

[BingDing]

....my first reading is always the highest.

Mine too, always. The second reading can drop 20+ systolic. I always use an average of at least two tests; the general range doesn't change, though.

 

[leo]

Yes I always average out 3 readings. First one is always highest.

I notice your bp has come down nicely and that you dont have high diastolic. What do you think is working?

Every time I try something different it seems to work only briefly.

I have one more week to make this happen as I have a cardio appt next week. Ugh

Latest Peat email says to dump the milk of magnesia as it is poorly absorbed and to drink oj or milk in middle of night to decrease viscosity of blood.

We' ll see.

 

[leo]

http://www.webmd.com/hypertension-high- ... pirin-help

I don't usually read webmd, but googled "aspirin high blood pressure" and found this. It's interesting because before Peating I never took aspirin, but did start on day one of Peating. Two days ago I decided to suspend all supplements and aspirin, in my search for the cause of my high bp. I was taking the aspirin in the a.m, because I read here that at night it might interfere with sleep.

Their findings: aspirin in am...slightly higher bp

no aspirin....slightly lower bp

aspirin in pm.... significantly lower bp

This coincides with me so far since yesterday I took no aspirin at all and bp has come down somewhat.

I will try aspirin tonight to see if it comes down more.

 

[j.]

There is a paper, I don't know if it's complete bull**** or not, but the paper says that aspirin at night is better.

 

[HDD]

"I notice your bp has come down nicely and that you dont have high diastolic. What do you think is working?"


It is hard for me to pinpoint any one thing. I tend to do everything at once that might help. I used to take 1 v. K daily now I take 2 , but not every day. I have been sipping on club soda. I have taken small amounts of magnesium citrate with baking soda in OJ before bed a few times this week. I am using cronometer to make sure I get enough calcium. Sometimes supplement with calcium carbonate. I take aspirin in the a.m. and occasionally at night. Increased amount of coffee using instant in milk.

 

[4peatssake]

"I notice your bp has come down nicely and that you dont have high diastolic. What do you think is working?"


It is hard for me to pinpoint any one thing. I tend to do everything at once that might help. I used to take 1 v. K daily now I take 2 , but not every day. I have been sipping on club soda. I have taken small amounts of magnesium citrate with baking soda in OJ before bed a few times this week. I am using cronometer to make sure I get enough calcium. Sometimes supplement with calcium carbonate. I take aspirin in the a.m. and occasionally at night. Increased amount of coffee using instant in milk.

HDD, what is this from? Peat??

Thanks!

 

[Mittir]

" I am using cronometer to make sure I get enough calcium. Sometimes supplement with calcium carbonate.

RP recommends 1500 mg of calcium to lower PTH. You need to make sure your phosphorus intake is lower than calcium intake. In the 'Milk in context" article RP mentioned that injecting calcium lowered blood pressure in people.
He speculated that calcium injection lowered PTH and that lowered BP. This study shows
how quickly calcium and D lower PTH. (Calcium alone can lower PTH in hours too). it is important that your calcium
intake is adequate everyday.

Influence of daily calcium and vitamin D supplementation on parathyroid hormone secretion.
Reginster JY, Zegels B, Lejeune E, Micheletti MC, Taquet AN, Albert A.
Source

Bone and Cartilage Research Unit, University of Liège, CHU Centre Ville, 45 Quai Godefroid Kurth, 4020 Liège, Belgium.
Abstract

Calcium and vitamin D supplementation have been shown to reduce secondary hyperparathyroidism and play a role in age-related osteoporosis. In order to define the optimal regimen of calcium and vitamin D supplementation to produce the maximal inhibition of parathyroid hormone secretion, we compared the administration of a calcium-vitamin D supplement as a single morning dose with the administration of two divided doses at 6-hour intervals. Twelve healthy male volunteers were assigned to three investigational procedures, which were alternated at weekly intervals. After a 'blank' control procedure, when they were not exposed to any supplements, they received one of two calcium-vitamin D supplement regimens: either two doses of Orocal D3 (500 mg calcium and 400 IU vitamin D3) with a 6-hour interval between doses, or one water-soluble effervescent powder pack of Cacit vitamin D3, taken in the morning (1000 mg calcium and 880 IU vitamin D3). During the three procedures (control and the two calcium-vitamin D supplementation protocols), veinous blood was drawn every 60 minutes for up to 9 hours, for serum calcium and parathyroid hormone measurements. The order of administration of the two calcium and vitamin D supplementation regimens was allocated by randomization. No significant changes in serum calcium were observed during the study. During the first 6 hours following calcium-vitamin D supplementation, a statistically significant decrease in serum parathyroid hormone was observed with both regimens, compared with baseline and the control procedure. During this first period, no differences were observed between the two treatment regimens. However, between the 6th and the 9th hour, serum parathyroid hormone levels remained significantly decreased compared to baseline with the twice-daily Orocal D3 administration, while they returned to baseline values with the once-daily Cacit D3 preparation. During this period, the percentage decrease in serum parathyroid hormone relative to baseline was significantly greater with Orocal D3 than Cacit D3 (p = 0.0021). We therefore conclude that the twice-daily administration of 500 mg calcium and 400 IU vitamin D3 at 6-hour intervals provides a more prolonged decrease in serum parathyroid hormone levels than the administration of the same total amount of calcium and vitamin D, as a single morning dose in young healthy.

 

[ratcheer]

I have high blood pressure, most of my life. Though I've wondered, could there be "good" hbp and "bad" hbp? Like, with an increased metabolic rate and pulse, wouldn't a higher blood pressure reading be reasonable? That would be the difference between an amped-up metabolism simply moving more blood, vs the heart having to push harder because of constricted vasculature...?

Very little has made a noticeable difference. Bag breathing does nothing, for instance (which is one reason I wonder about the good v bad thing).

HOWEVER, one thing that consistently makes a big difference is Cyproheptadine. This is not surprising because it's a serotonin antagonist.

I have a problematic relationship with Cypro however; it totally knocks me out, to the point of narcolepsy, even with one tiny nibble off one small tablet. This would be fine if it was just overnight, but the effect seems to be strongest the next day. At work I have to find an empty conference room and fall asleep in a chair, and hope nobody notices! But after a few days of this my blood pressure consistently drops down into "perfect" territory.

Cypro seems to have a wide range of effects in people, and it's probably related to their dopamine/serotonin status.

Edited: first to say, I didn't read many of the posts in the middle, so some of this might have already been discussed. And, here's the Wiki link for Cypro:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyproheptadine

 

[HDD]

"I notice your bp has come down nicely and that you dont have high diastolic. What do you think is working?"


It is hard for me to pinpoint any one thing. I tend to do everything at once that might help. I used to take 1 v. K daily now I take 2 , but not every day. I have been sipping on club soda. I have taken small amounts of magnesium citrate with baking soda in OJ before bed a few times this week. I am using cronometer to make sure I get enough calcium. Sometimes supplement with calcium carbonate. I take aspirin in the a.m. and occasionally at night. Increased amount of coffee using instant in milk.

HDD, what is this from? Peat??

Thanks!

I have always taken one Super K since I take aspirin. Since RP recommended K to messtafarian for high blood pressure, I started throwing in an extra K a few times a week. I drink the club soda for the sodium bicarbonate and potassium. I don't have any rigid amounts with this, just like it for water when I want some. I add OJ to it. I take a very small amount of magnesium citrate with calcium carbonate in OJ at bedtime. This was to increase calcium if I am lacking and the magnesium is to help with relaxing. I had the magnesium citrate with baking soda because someone on peatarian takes Epsom salts with baking soda to help sleep, so I tried it with the citrate. The magnesium citrate is something Rayser or Peatarian mentioned using a bit of occasionally.

So, in response to your question, I would say no, Peat did not advise this. I am just trying to adjust to my needs. I don't supplement with calcium or magnesium every day.

I am increasing my intake of well cooked greens to increase my minerals with food instead of supplementing.

From RP-
"Foods with a higher, safer ratio of calcium to phosphate are leaves, such as kale, turnip greens, and beet greens, and many fruits, milk, and cheese. Coffee, besides being a good source of magnesium, is probably helpful for lowering phosphate, by its antagonism to adenosine (Coulson, et al., 1991).

Although increased phosphate generally causes vascular calcification (increasing rigidity, with increased systolic blood pressure), when a high level of dietary phosphate comes from milk and cheese, it is epidemiologically associated with reduced blood pressure (Takeda, et al., 2012)."

And from the same article -
" Another important effect of carbon dioxide is in the regulation of both calcium and phosphate, by increasing the absorption and retention of calcium (Canzanello, et al., 1995), and by increasing the excretion of phosphate. Increased carbon dioxide (as dissolved gas) and bicarbonate (as sodium bicarbonate) both increase the excretion of phosphate in the urine, even in the absence of the parathyroid hormone. Below the normal level of serum bicarbonate, reabsorption of phosphate by the kidneys is greatly increased (Jehle, et al., 1999). Acetazolamide increases the body's retention of carbon dioxide, and increases the amount of phosphate excreted in the urine.

http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/ph ... ging.shtml

 

[4peatssake]

"I notice your bp has come down nicely and that you dont have high diastolic. What do you think is working?"


It is hard for me to pinpoint any one thing. I tend to do everything at once that might help. I used to take 1 v. K daily now I take 2 , but not every day. I have been sipping on club soda. I have taken small amounts of magnesium citrate with baking soda in OJ before bed a few times this week. I am using cronometer to make sure I get enough calcium. Sometimes supplement with calcium carbonate. I take aspirin in the a.m. and occasionally at night. Increased amount of coffee using instant in milk.

HDD, what is this from? Peat??

Thanks!

I have always taken one Super K since I take aspirin. Since RP recommended K to messtafarian for high blood pressure, I started throwing in an extra K a few times a week. I drink the club soda for the sodium bicarbonate and potassium. I don't have any rigid amounts with this, just like it for water when I want some. I add OJ to it. I take a very small amount of magnesium citrate with calcium carbonate in OJ at bedtime. This was to increase calcium if I am lacking and the magnesium is to help with relaxing. I had the magnesium citrate with baking soda because someone on peatarian takes Epsom salts with baking soda to help sleep, so I tried it with the citrate. The magnesium citrate is something Rayser or Peatarian mentioned using a bit of occasionally.

So, in response to your question, I would say no, Peat did not advise this. I am just trying to adjust to my needs. I don't supplement with calcium or magnesium every day.

Thanks HDD. I was trying to figure out who you were quoting in your post. I surely understand about tweaking things to suit individual needs.

 

[HDD]

I was quoting Leo asking me. Ha. Sorry for the confusion.

 

[4peatssake]

I was quoting Leo asking me. Ha. Sorry for the confusion.

No problem.

 

[HDD]

http://www.webmd.com/hypertension-high-blood-pressure/news/20050915/high-blood-pressure-nightly-aspirin-help

I don't usually read webmd, but googled "aspirin high blood pressure" and found this. It's interesting because before Peating I never took aspirin, but did start on day one of Peating. Two days ago I decided to suspend all supplements and aspirin, in my search for the cause of my high bp. I was taking the aspirin in the a.m, because I read here that at night it might interfere with sleep.

Their findings: aspirin in am...slightly higher bp

no aspirin....slightly lower bp

aspirin in pm.... significantly lower bp

This coincides with me so far since yesterday I took no aspirin at all and bp has come down somewhat.

I will try aspirin tonight to see if it comes down more.

This is from RP -

"The continuing accumulation of polyunsaturated fats in the tissues is undoubtedly important in the changing relationship between the pancreas and the adrenal glands in aging. Aspirin, which is antilipolytic, decreasing the release of free fatty acids, as well as inhibiting their conversion to prostaglandins, lowers the production of stress-induced aldosterone, and helps to lower blood pressure, if it's taken in the evening, to prevent the increase of free fatty acids during the night. Aspirin increases insulin sensitivity. A low salt diet increases the free fatty acids, leading to insulin resistance, increasing free fatty acids in the blood, and contributing to atherosclerosis (Prada, et al., 2000; Mrnka, et al., 2000; Catanozi, et al., 2003; Garg, et al., 2011)."
http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/ed ... enia.shtml

(bold mine)

 

[Jenn]

I always take it at night and have never had it affect my sleep adversely.

 

[leo]

Thanks...interesting. Especially that Peat and webmd are in agreement.

I haven't taken any, in the day or at night for the past few days. I've dumped all supplements and am just playing around with my food intake. BP came down to normal for about 2-3 days...then is a tad higher today. We ate out today and I have not followed my Peat schedule too tightly today.

When I introduce it again, I will definitely take it at night now.

 

[leo]

Hello again....an update:

I quit Peat last week in an effort to control the blood pressure and weight gain. I did low carb about 3 days and immediately got rid of about 2-3 lbs and blood pressure came back down to normal. I decided to go ahead and add fruit and see....no weight gain and no high bp. Then I added milk/sugar at night to try to get back the good sleep and it worked....again, no changes in bp nor weight. The only thing I have not added back in is the orange juice, because Peat had thought the citric acid in the commercial brand might be affecting bp.

In the meantime I visited my cardiologist and we openly discussed it all. He did not grimace at all when I explained what I have been doing. His opinion was the extremely prior low sugar and then sudden high sugar might have been affecting my neurotransmitters. Anyway check up was fine and as long as bp continues to come down, after going up, he does not feel a need to medicate.

I also had some labs done. I would appreciate anyone's comments on them if something appears wrong. I don't know much about the ferritin issue, but tested because everyone on this forum seems to put a lot of importance on iron buildup. I also am interested to hear if my minerals are ok....I do see mag is low as always....but sodium seems high.

Sodium: 142 (137-145)

Potassium: 4.5 (3.6-5.0)

Chloride: 107 (98-107) ** what is this?

Co2: 27 (22-30) **does this mean I don't need to bag breathe?

Calcium: 9.7 (8.4-10.2)

Magnesium: 1.9 (1.6-2.3) *always tests low, despite epsom/mag oil and greens

Ferritin: 79.1 (11.1-264)

Iron Serico: 123 (37-170)

Transferrin: 282 (250-450)

%Saturation: 43.6% (20-55)

FT3: 4.91 (2.77 -5.27)

Thanks for any insight!

 

[leo]

no one care to comment?

 

[jyb]

Note that if you have enough money, you don't have to rely on commercial juice if you think its causing problems. You can easily juice and filter 2L of orange and be done for the day in about 15-30 minutes everything included with a manual juicer (pulp filtering and wash up).

 

[leo]

Yes....I have been buying commercial because there are no sweet oranges where I live until January when the rainy season ends. In other words....out of season. They are very acidic now and Peat told me not to drink them that way even when I told him I could add sugar.

So for now oj juice and will retry in our summer.

thank you

 

[j.]

Yes....I have been buying commercial because there are no sweet oranges where I live until January when the rainy season ends. In other words....out of season. They are very acidic now and Peat told me not to drink them that way even when I told him I could add sugar.

So for now oj juice and will retry in our summer.

thank you

Try another brand slowly?