Helpless And Hopeless

[Orion]

I've been taking approx. 1000-1500 mg., but spread out through the day. Yeah, I need to order the topical mg.

Can be very inexpensive to buy bulk MgCl flakes by the pound and make your own. I do this and make a large spray bottle for daily full body coverage, bottle will last a few weeks.

 

[Terma]

Hey I saw your thread earlier this year. You're not alone by the way, I have a cartoonishly monstrous medical history that happens to include accutane and fluoroquinolone poisoning. Fluoroquinolone poisoning is in a class of its own and if you got hit very hard it can take many years to heal. I'm 4 years out, many of the symptoms are resolved but the skeletal damage is evidently permanent, but I got hit harder than others on that front, I'm not trying to scare you. I can tell you, all of the non-skeletal symptoms eventually do heal, it takes time that's all.

Some of the acute damage happens through Nitric Oxide / peroxynitrite overload together with excess NMDA and glutamate. The tendon damage may be because of enhanced Matrix Metalloproteinase expression, but that doesn't have that much to do with the other symptoms. There's liver damage somewhere in there.

All this happens strongest during the drug exposure and then again during relapses. Once your body has these well under control you slowly start to heal if you do your part. I don't normally need to target those pathways anymore and I don't get any relapses.

I'm out of time, but I wanted to say I get you and it's truly brutal. I think the only worse drug reaction out there is severe Stevens-Johnson Syndrome.

 

[Dhair]

I may ask my endo to try HCG, even though it scares the ***t out of me.
I don't even know why I'm so messed up anymore. I think I may have PFS AND Flouroqinolone poisoning. But how can I know? The flouroqinolone effects would be masking the PFS. Labs don't tell me much other than very low T.
Flouroqinolones have to be the most dangerous synthetic poison known to man, even worse than finasteride. My body literally cannot produce steroids. For a year and a half now. Unbelievable.
Big pharma needs to be stopped at all costs. God, every day is hell. My life is passing me by. I can't work, can't love, can't live. I think suicide may be the only way out.

 

[Dhair]

God forgive me for being so weak.

 

[milk]

Have you tried progesterone on testicles?

 

[Owen B]

Dhair....I just replied to your post on the other site (Kyle M)? Thanks again.

sorry now to see how you're doing. don't give up hope.

for the other posters on this thread this is how I got here.

Rat had been doing Estroban and Gonadin when I noticed my libido tanking and aches and pains everywhere. I would have bet money at that time that the problem was hormonal. since those chemicals are aromatase inhibitors (phytol too, in the Gonadin) I thought I had gone hypogonadic. like weightlifters who do a lot of AIs like arimidex. They drive E down to zero. I'm not sure what happens to their T but i would have guessed mine was low.

Labs came back normal. today.

But when I saw your post on the other thread my blood ran cold. At the same time as the Estroban and Gonadin I got a urinary tract infection and was given Cipro. Two week protocol.

My usual stretching program that I've been doing for years leaves me hardly able to get out of a chair and i strained a ligament in a toe with a stretch that I've been doing for years. Can hardly get an erection, no sensation in gonads with climax. But the labs, which I have not yet seen (only over the phone) supposedly were normal.

And now that I think of it, I can remember 10 years or so ago when I was driving a school bus I kept getting killer bronchitis from all the diesel. Eventually i had to quit. But the MD at that time gave me Cipro twice.

Around the same time I noticed i was getting swellings on my back that seemed hard, maybe fibrotic, but with fluid. They have gradually spread. My rheumatoid factor is high. Perhaps it is a scleroderma or scleredema. But maybe it is associated with all the damn Cipro I did at the time.

Holy hell! What an awakening.

I've got to regroup and start researching. But this Cipro thing puts a lot of things in focus.

Dhair......don't give up hope.

 

[Dhair]

Dhair....I just replied to your post on the other site (Kyle M)? Thanks again.

sorry now to see how you're doing. don't give up hope.

for the other posters on this thread this is how I got here.

Rat had been doing Estroban and Gonadin when I noticed my libido tanking and aches and pains everywhere. I would have bet money at that time that the problem was hormonal. since those chemicals are aromatase inhibitors (phytol too, in the Gonadin) I thought I had gone hypogonadic. like weightlifters who do a lot of AIs like arimidex. They drive E down to zero. I'm not sure what happens to their T but i would have guessed mine was low.

Labs came back normal. today.

But when I saw your post on the other thread my blood ran cold. At the same time as the Estroban and Gonadin I got a urinary tract infection and was given Cipro. Two week protocol.

My usual stretching program that I've been doing for years leaves me hardly able to get out of a chair and i strained a ligament in a toe with a stretch that I've been doing for years. Can hardly get an erection, no sensation in gonads with climax. But the labs, which I have not yet seen (only over the phone) supposedly were normal.

And now that I think of it, I can remember 10 years or so ago when I was driving a school bus I kept getting killer bronchitis from all the diesel. Eventually i had to quit. But the MD at that time gave me Cipro twice.

Around the same time I noticed i was getting swellings on my back that seemed hard, maybe fibrotic, but with fluid. They have gradually spread. My rheumatoid factor is high. Perhaps it is a scleroderma or scleredema. But maybe it is associated with all the damn Cipro I did at the time.

Holy hell! What an awakening.

I've got to regroup and start researching. But this Cipro thing puts a lot of things in focus.

Dhair......don't give up hope.

Please don't upset yourself too much, Owen. Some people really do just need a few weeks and things go back to normal. For others it's longer. I'm sure your issues will reverse in time. Don't start telling yourself stories about why certain things are happening to your body or why you feel this way. The anxiety is a disease in and of itself. Just relax and remember we have a head start on things like this because of the work of Dr. Peat.

 

[Owen B]

Please don't upset yourself too much, Owen. Some people really do just need a few weeks and things go back to normal. For others it's longer. I'm sure your issues will reverse in time. Don't start telling yourself stories about why certain things are happening to your body or why you feel this way. The anxiety is a disease in and of itself. Just relax and remember we have a head start on things like this because of the work of Dr. Peat.

I think you're probably right about the duration. I hope. And I'm a little worried about those swellings. Like a lot of people I took a lot of Cipro over the years. it sounds like you took a lot continuously. is that right? And the accutane? Is that the same kind of antibiotic?

If i were to go to the doctor and have him run some numbers is there anything that you think he should definitely do?

Of course I'm the last person on this forum to be giving advice to people (obviously) but how about some different kind of advice?

I'm not criticizing you for being stressed out. I can see that your anxieties are genuine. But you are sounding really overwhelmed.

I have two traumas in my system (family and TBI) and the overload is very heavy. There are not a lot of good answers out there. And I agree with you that having RP is a big plus. I'm in a similar position as you.

How about a different direction? A lot of people are helped by mindfulness meditation (or some kind of meditation). When one does mindfulness, you focus on sensations, feelings and ideas and let them go. The objects of our consciousness are always fragmented; but consciousness is not. That is very easy to forget. As one meditates, he gradually becomes less identified with the fragments and more identified with the unbroken space in which the fragments are occurring. The fragments don't go away, they just begin to lose the seemingly exclusive hold they have on our selves. The hold they have on us makes them seem both infinitely alluring and infinitely threatening. But it doesn't have to be that way.

If a person is relatively healthy emotionally, if they are not super overstressed by emotional or social events, meditation like this can help a person acquire an equanimity about the fragments.

Also, I'm sure you've seen that there are scores of studies out there that show that meditation has a beneficial effect on overstressed HPA systems.

Maybe it could be a win-win for you.

Hang in there.

 

[Dhair]

I think you're probably right about the duration. I hope. And I'm a little worried about those swellings. Like a lot of people I took a lot of Cipro over the years. it sounds like you took a lot continuously. is that right? And the accutane? Is that the same kind of antibiotic?

If i were to go to the doctor and have him run some numbers is there anything that you think he should definitely do?

Of course I'm the last person on this forum to be giving advice to people (obviously) but how about some different kind of advice?

I'm not criticizing you for being stressed out. I can see that your anxieties are genuine. But you are sounding really overwhelmed.

I have two traumas in my system (family and TBI) and the overload is very heavy. There are not a lot of good answers out there. And I agree with you that having RP is a big plus. I'm in a similar position as you.

How about a different direction? A lot of people are helped by mindfulness meditation (or some kind of meditation). When one does mindfulness, you focus on sensations, feelings and ideas and let them go. The objects of our consciousness are always fragmented; but consciousness is not. That is very easy to forget. As one meditates, he gradually becomes less identified with the fragments and more identified with the unbroken space in which the fragments are occurring. The fragments don't go away, they just begin to lose the seemingly exclusive hold they have on our selves. The hold they have on us makes them seem both infinitely alluring and infinitely threatening. But it doesn't have to be that way.

If a person is relatively healthy emotionally, if they are not super overstressed by emotional or social events, meditation like this can help a person acquire an equanimity about the fragments.

Also, I'm sure you've seen that there are scores of studies out there that show that meditation has a beneficial effect on overstressed HPA systems.

Maybe it could be a win-win for you.

Hang in there.

These are some good points.
Regarding the swellings, I'm not sure blood tests or doctors will tell you much. I find skin problems to be scary but transient in general. There is certainly no shortage of Peaty supplements that are extremely beneficial for skin health.
As far as meditation is concerned, I think it's a bit of a catch-22. You have to mediate to alleviate stress, but it's almost impossible to sit down and meditate if you're under extreme stress. It's not something that I've seriously pursued. How has meditation helped you?

 

[Ashoka]

Hey, I read part of your story, forgive me for not reading the entire thread. All I’m going to say is you might be surprised by how you can heal. I never took the cipro, but I took accutane and finasteride. Quite a combo, I assure you! Perhaps you wouldn’t be surprised at the horror at which I responded to my symptoms and my initial sense of despair and hopelessness, even after a year passed. Pessimism was almost universal online and the general belief was that circumstances were permanent. But now, only four years later, people are more sanguine about improvements and recovery. Gradually I found what it took to believe that the body could recover when its needs were met. I also recognized that others found success when they tried “unorthodox” approaches like progesterone. I am not perfectly back to normal, but it’s been nearly four years and I experience joy quite regularly. Things are not so linear. I believe if I was given the right environment and conditions I would have already recovered. But the first step is believing that it’s possible, and Peat opens that door.

 

[Dhair]

Hey, I read part of your story, forgive me for not reading the entire thread. All I’m going to say is you might be surprised by how you can heal. I never took the cipro, but I took accutane and finasteride. Quite a combo, I assure you! Perhaps you wouldn’t be surprised at the horror at which I responded to my symptoms and my initial sense of despair and hopelessness, even after a year passed. Pessimism was almost universal online and the general belief was that circumstances were permanent. But now, only four years later, people are more sanguine about improvements and recovery. Gradually I found what it took to believe that the body could recover when its needs were met. I also recognized that others found success when they tried “unorthodox” approaches like progesterone. I am not perfectly back to normal, but it’s been nearly four years and I experience joy quite regularly. Things are not so linear. I believe if I was given the right environment and conditions I would have already recovered. But the first step is believing that it’s possible, and Peat opens that door.

Thanks for the post.
I have found things that help, but they are inconsistent. I have recently tried expirementung with progesterone, pregnenolone and cyproheptadine, and these have been revelatory. I'm starting to see serotonin antagonism, particularly 5-HT3 antagonism as a huge key to getting out of the state I'm in. I'm very cautious with most of this stuff since I have already messed myself up with thyroid.
Man, 4 years is a long time. I've been at this since March/April 2016 and I feel like my life is just passing me by. Work eventually became too overwhelming. I'm really anxious to get these issues fixed. I can't imagine going another 3 years like this...

 

[Ashoka]

Man, 4 years is a long time. I've been at this since March/April 2016 and I feel like my life is just passing me by. Work eventually became too overwhelming. I'm really anxious to get these issues fixed. I can't imagine going another 3 years like this...

That’s because you’re still facing the initial shock of dealing with this. And I don’t imagine you will go through another 3 years in your current state. I said that I believe things will improve for you if you do the right kinds of things over time.

 

[Sobieski]

I'm sorry to hear of your situation. I know it isn't ideal but as a temporary measure have you looked in to TRT? Or even clomid to get some androgens working? Progesterone is also known to reverse CNS damage but I don't wish to give out too much unqualified advice. I would just like to offer some sort of info if it helps in any way.