Help! My Facial Features Changed From Taking Progestorone, Pregnenlone And Dhea

[Mr.Tayto]

@reality @rei thank you for your constructive feedback. I am working out but finding it harder to put on muscle since all of this even though my Total T is 27 and Free T 585. The highest its been since ive ever been tested. Im going to keep raising it naturally hopimefully can get to about 750 and if not significant changes maybe intermittently hop on TRT for a bit.

@rei ive been off all those horomes for 2 years now and was hoping changes would happen faster. Im 30 but people keep thinking im 25 but not in a good way if that makes sense. Have more of a boyish look about myself now. But ya i definitley have more on of understanding of my body now aswell and thank for the positivity i.e. coming out of this with a new found understanding. Next time a doctor suggests anything i will research DEEPLY. I dont trust doctors since they ****88 me with ssris and now this ***t.

 

[R J]

If something changed you one way, androgens will change back other.

 

[SonOfEurope]

Progesterone is not an exclusive female hormone, a healthy young man's testis producing 1,5 or 2 mg of it per day, released alongside the 5-6mg of testosterone makes that very clear.

I've been on 30mg for two years plus a bit of DHEA and trust me, I've not become more feminine in any way... Quite the contrary.

In fact, without it's presence most of your testosterone would aromatise, Adrenal androgens would take over and wreck havoc... sperm would not mature properly, leydig cells would start dying under E2's toxicity and the DHT loop mechanism would go so out of harmony you would turn into a mess.

This is all secondary to the fact that.... Without progesterone.... You would not even have proper brain function at a fundamental level and adequate brain protection from Estrogen and glutamate anti-gaba exitocxicity and your heart would be compromised.

I warn people to not pass the 5-6mg DHEA per day dose or you'll raise E2 in excess.... Haidut, I am aware... Recommends up to 30mg a day with no less than 150mg Progesterone for Anabolic results but that is if you are actively training heavy and bringing your body to that demand for the androgenic pathway while the progesterone opposes cortisol and reduces aromatase.

Stop taking them go a few weeks and everything will come back to normal, I doubt you irreversibly damaged testicular cells by overdosing dhea. Give it some time and take Low dose aspirin+k2... You'll be alright.

 

[tankasnowgod]

From your other thread-

I started taking progesterone in 2016 (for fatigue) and completely got my numbers mixed up for 2 weeks i was taking something like 80-100mg of progesterone (not under doctor supervision).
Then i found a doctor who specialises in fatigue. She put me on 20mg of progesterone a day and 65mg dhea/pregnenolone. I was naive and though more was better so would take 2 pumps of progesterone (40mg) a day every now and again. My testosterone was 440 ng/dl in 2016 (i was 26yrs old) im now 29 years old and i had my T test last week and it is 290 ng/dl. I feel completely ***t and my body is completely loosing it shape, double chin, fat at hips, soft muscle, my libido is gone and my penis has shrunk a little.
Prior to this i was always quite solid and muscley, square jaw...now i just look skinny fat.
I stopped taking progesterone in late to mid 2017 and stopped Dhea/pregnenolone in Sept 2018. Im worried ive completely ****88 myself from the progesterone..
..what can i do to get my test back up naturally?
Please tell me this can be reversed?
Please help!!!

I only found out recently progesterone is what trans use to lower their T....Wtf!!!!

So, you started Progesterone in 2016, and test was at 440 ng/dl.
In 2017 (around Jul-Oct), you stop Progesterone.
In Sept 2018, you stop taking DHEA and Preg.
Then around May 2019, your Test is at 290 ng/dl.

Why do you think Progesterone lowered Testosterone levels 18 months or so after you stopped taking it? There are any number of things that could be responsible for that drop in that time range. If anything, the timeline seems to suggest the exact opposite- that Progesterone supplementation was INCREASING your testosterone.

Also, while it's true that Trans Women do use Progesterone, that's not what they use to suppress testosterone. There's a range of anti androgens that they use, including 5 alpha reductase inhibitors.

 

[Mr.Tayto]

@tankasnowgod Ive attached the correct actual results as thumbnails to this post.
My T was all good before i ever started taking these hormones. I had a theory that because pregnenlone is a precursor to alot of horomes once i came off (doctors orders were just to stop cold Turkey, i should have known myself to tapper off but i didnt) my body was shocked and didnt really know what to do with itself. My body would have been dealing with the loss of other hormones too, not just T.....just a theory. So thats way my t was still low . I think it was more the pregnenlone/dhea mix now really...and progesterone was mitigating the negative effects.

@SonOfEurope i think you are right. I think the pregnenlone/dhea mix was estrogenic and that has caused more has harm than the progesterone.

I think i just want to reverse these changes faster. These last few years have i been depressed everytime i look in the mirror m, people here might think im exaggerating this whole thing but i definitely not.
I take k2 but hasnt really done much.

 

[tankasnowgod]

@tankasnowgod Ive attached the correct actual results as thumbnails to this post.
My T was all good before i ever started taking these hormones. I had a theory that because pregnenlone is a precursor to alot of horomes once i came off (doctors orders were just to stop cold Turkey, i should have known myself to tapper off but i didnt) my body was shocked and didnt really know what to do with itself. My body would have been dealing with the loss of other hormones too, not just T.....just a theory. So thats way my t was still low . I think it was more the pregnenlone/dhea mix now really...and progesterone was mitigating the negative effects.

Every result for T you had was within the range, and all mid range or upper mid range at that. It's possible that progesterone was lowering testosterone a little bit..... but it's also possible these are just normal lab variations. Or, that it's simply declined with age.

If T was all good, and I'm assuming most other things were as you were young....... why did you even take any of these hormones in the first place?

 

[Mr.Tayto]

@tankasnowgod i had chronic fatigue from ssris and a messed up gut. Went a heap of different doctors, they all ran bloods, they all said "its all in your head" your all good but i definitely was not all good and felt like ***t. Finally found a doctor who listen to me and then she ends up putting me on all of this stuff and in the long run making things worse...and alot of $$$$ out of pocket later.

 

[tankasnowgod]

@tankasnowgod i had chronic fatigue from ssris and a messed up gut. Went a heap of different doctors, they all ran bloods, they all said "its all in your head" your all good but i definitely was not all good and felt like ***t. Finally found a doctor who listen to me and then she ends up putting me on all of this stuff and in the long run making things worse...and alot of $$$$ out of pocket later.

Well, if you think it's "long term damage" from some substance....... why not the SSRIs? They are a pretty horrific class of drug. I would think the SSRIs a more likely culprit than bio identical youth hormones that your body naturally produces anyway. Personally, I have seen nothing but benefits (so far) from pretty high dose progesterone supplementation.

 

[SonOfEurope]

@tankasnowgod i had chronic fatigue from ssris and a messed up gut. Went a heap of different doctors, they all ran bloods, they all said "its all in your head" your all good but i definitely was not all good and felt like ***t. Finally found a doctor who listen to me and then she ends up putting me on all of this stuff and in the long run making things worse...and alot of $$$$ out of pocket later.

They almost destroyed mine with SSRI and made me dependant on Benzodiazepines at 22 y.o.

This why I've used a larger dose of Progesterone only to help my brain re-adapt and heal while tapering off over the past two years from 2mg of Clonazepam to less than 0.25 mg.

Progesterone doesn't also interfere with testosterone metabolism unless you take MASSIVE doses of over 150mg a day... Quite the zombie that would make you .. What it does do is slightly lower DHT by nature of Competition with testosterone for the enzyme 5-Ar, nothing to fear as it's converted into positive neurosteroids.

It did reduce my libido a bit at the start and when I attempted 45mg a day... So I went back to 28/30mg and I've adjusted to it especially with the weekly 300mg Pregnenolone and daily 1,5 mg DHEA I added this spring.

Once I come off I'll lower the progesterone to a maintenance of 6mg.. Not far from what the make body produces on its own.

Still, Progesterone cannot mess with the HPTA Axiis so it can momentarily neuter you in a massive dose (100mg+) not a destruction of testicular tissue (which estrogen does) - the opposite, your gonads are very well protected from any damage (all organs) and libido should come back stronger than ever when stopped.

Pregnenolone and especially DHEA, the precursor of both the androgen and estrogens may have varying effects depending on how stressed your organism is.

SSRI can **** you up terribly, I was on Paxil for a while and then Prozac and I lost myself - I was an empty shell that could still remember who I used to be but unable to connect with the emotions and internal humanity of before, thankfully my doc was kind enough to listen to me and switch me to Mirtazapine (the only one by big pharma I wouldn't call atrocious ) though it's long been replaced by a peatish lifestyle and diet.

Last time I tested myself my Test. Was 574 and my E2 only 16... Not surprised as the progesterone tank it but I feel good and most importantly I'm making it out of a deep hole that ate up 5 years of my life.

BTW, I divide the progesterone morning/night 14mg each. 300mg Pregnenolone only once per week and 2mg DHEA every-other day... I lift weight and do sprints.

What brand K2 are you taking?

 

[Mr.Tayto]

@tankasnowgod @SonOfEurope

The ssris ****88 me up in 2012, i stopped taking them in 2012 aswell. then had a gap of 3 years where i couldnt afford medical supplements doctors etc to fix me from ssris, so didnt do anything. I did notice some changes from the ssris then but drastic facial changes came from using the hormones. Most definitely agree my problems all stemmed from ssris in the first place which lead me to seek a doctor, who then put me of those hormones which threw things waaayy off. If i thought things were bad after the ssris, those hormones made things worse. Tbh honest its not really that my health is that bad anymore its actaully depression from not being/feeling as good looking as what i feel i should be from taking those horomones. I know it sounds silly but that how i feel.

Ived used thornes k2 and hadiuts version of k2.

Im actually going to a brain training institute in a few months (theyre fully booked) to train my brain again from the damage the ssris caused. Which will hopefully help.

 

[TheBeard]

This whole this is effecting my mental health. I dont recognise the person in the mirror any more and havent for a long time. I dont look as manly and have lost my big jaw masculine look...


The progesterone/pregnenolone/dhea has change my facial features so much its causing me major depression....

My head is fried. Ive had to take a month off work to clear my head.

My question is....
Since the above hormones changed my facial features so much, does anybody here think that if took TRT it would help reverse the changes some what, i know this would take time but i be willing to do it if i knew i could get a result.

My total T at the moment is 26,(no libido though) but i havent seen my face change back to becoming more manly again at all really....

I think all the horomes down regulated my androgen receptors so im thinking boosting my T further would help bring about more masculine features again....

P.s. ive had numerous people mention how different i look, ive noticed it and its evident from pictures. So that part isnt a theory.

Buy some testosterone cream and try it scrotally, let us know, no one can say for sure.

 

[TheBeard]

It replenish muscle glycogen nearly as effectively as starch, and they can have an effect on how big your muscles look. Less muscle in the neck/traps will narrow your jaw and effect the face shape. Not to mention there are muscles on the face...

Are you working out? Have you gained/lost weight?

TRT will most likely masculinise your face [...] and by promoting lower body fat so your features will be noticeable

That's the theory and it doesn't apply in the real world for most of us using testosterone: we usually get facial bloat that only goes away upon cessation.

 

[TheBeard]

65mg of DHEA is going to convert to estrogen. That is your problem not progesterone. Unless you were using some synthetic analogue.

Estrogen is masculinizing in the presence of androgens, and whether taking DHEA or Test you will always have more androgens than estrogens as way less than 50% of the androgen aromatizes.
Progesterone is most likely the culprit.

 

[JacquelineNZ]

65mg of DHEA is going to convert to estrogen. That is your problem not progesterone. Unless you were using some synthetic analogue.

Maybe you can guide me too, I used the prohestE and did well for 3 days then had major systems crash and lost all ability to sleep when I used it, I did loading to stop conveesion to oestrogen because my system is so unwell I hoped it would help byt it got extrem.
Im no doubt high oestrogen already.
Can it be used slower as my liver is so out of balance and I have undetactive thyroid and waited a month for the product to arrive hoping it would help my insomnia but things got extreme and there was no way I could continue with days of no sleep entirely.
I really believe in it but have no idea how to use it with my body, liver is so bad it mustnt be able to dumo the excess oestrogen. Im doing carrot salad now seeing if that helps. Any suggestions Im grateful for.

 

[Hugh Johnson]

Estrogen is masculinizing in the presence of androgens, and whether taking DHEA or Test you will always have more androgens than estrogens as way less than 50% of the androgen aromatizes.
Progesterone is most likely the culprit.

But it was also in the presence of lots of progesterone and probably not that much testosterone.

I and many other men have used large amounts of progesterone with no issues. Maybe slight feminisation, but I could care less.

Estrogen is also a stress hormone, and while it may be androgenic in low quantity, in large amounts it is not.

 

[Hugh Johnson]

Buy some testosterone cream and try it scrotally, let us know, no one can say for sure.

Do not do this. This would mess you up.no steroids should be applied to the scrotum.

 

[Frankdee20]

Do not do this. This would mess you up.no steroids should be applied to the scrotum.

Can you elaborate as to why that is a bad idea ? I know Ray thinks so, but many on this forum apply topicals down there, including me, but I’ve done it maybe 4-5 times

 

[R J]

Do not do this. This would mess you up.no steroids should be applied to the scrotum.

I’ve heard t gel rubbed on gonads is a good way of doing it. Can you give more info

 

[SonOfEurope]

Doesn't Mister Peat take low-dose T as of late? Something quite low was I think 2mg?

He balances this with, if I'm not mistaken, 6mg Progesterone and 4mg DHEA right?

But he's over 80 years old, a younger man even naturally produces over 5mg T per day, if anyone can find his quote on the scrotal application that'd be great and I will email him on the reason he thought it's a bad idea.... If he ever replies.

 

[Hugh Johnson]

Can you elaborate as to why that is a bad idea ? I know Ray thinks so, but many on this forum apply topicals down there, including me, but I’ve done it maybe 4-5 times

From what I understand, the high concentration makes the balls shut down T production. You want the balls to react to whole body T, not the excessive amounts that would be present where it is applied.