Has Anyone Reversed Their Type II Diabetes Following RP Advice?

[Kelj]

These quotes really bother me honestly.

So all of the additives which are not "food" like carrageenum gum, food coloring, brominated vegetable oil, poor quality synthetic added vitamins, "natural flavors", plastics, (and many more I could list), none of this matter? Some ultra-processed foods have as much as one hundred or more ingredients that are either synthetic or proven goitrogens/toxins. Look at "Food Babe". She wrote a great book about the toxic ingredients in our foods and how she only made recovery from her health issues removing, not adding, these ingredients to her diet. Sorry, but that just loses all credibility in my head. This stuff indeed makes digestibility worse, not better. How can one, in a sane mind, say that toxic additives are "better" than unprocessed foods? Does all of the research Ray Peat do not count for anything? To say that food selection "does not matter" or worse yet to say "processed foods are better than health foods" is horribly misguided IMO. There absolutely is a massive difference between grain fed meat and grass fed meat (as a random example), and to tell people "just eat the grain fed meat because, orthorexia" is silly and to ignore the effects of things like estrogens in grain fed meat (as example) is folly.

But if by refined you mean like refined coconut oil that removes the fiber, then I am on board with that, and that's different. Refined sugar even maybe has some benefits, but its devoid of minerals.

Now one thing is that people eating a refined diet DOES have going for it as they are less likely to be deficient in calories, that is true. And if someone does have a history of caloric restriction, I can see the value in it. I sincerely doubt anyone is constantly eating "junk" food each and every day and in optimal health though. Sure, I acknowledge that some people ate these for a time and found recovery. But here's the thing -- maybe they started off eating foods like this in order to get out of a hypo-caloric condition, but eventually they start to switch to better, higher quality foods and its at this point that full recovery occurs.

[

Food Fears I: Food, Family and Fear — The Eating Disorder Institute

"In this context, processed food refers to any number of alterations we regularly apply to raw foods: cooking, pickling, canning, jarring, drying, smoking…"

"Ultra-processed foods are best identified as almost everything found along the inner-aisles of a grocery chain store: things in boxes, packages and bags. They are also the foods offered at any fast-food restaurant and also many chain restaurants where the food is shipped pre-prepared and frozen to the various restaurant outlets."

"Ultra-processed foods are ideal in the early phases of recovery where the body seeks to reverse huge energy deficits as efficiently and quickly as possible. However, once energy-balanced, you will not continue to have the same marked preference for these types of foods and will naturally veer back towards a broad omnivore diet that includes predominantly processed foods, a significant intake of raw and unprocessed foods, and a modest intake of ultra-processed foods."

"The hierarchy of beneficial foods during recovery will be: ultra-processed foods, processed foods, and an incidental amount of raw foods. The hierarchy of beneficial foods in remission (and for non-ED folk) will be: processed foods, raw foods, and incidental ultra-processed foods. You don’t have to consciously manage the shift from recovery to remission—these are things your body will identify for you."

"In controlled trials, there is clear evidence that trans fats negatively impact the ratio of high-density to low-density lipoproteins (HDL/LDL). Unfortunately the evidence that this then translates into an increased risk for coronary heart disease is not conclusive [RM Krauss, 2010; GA Francis, 2010; WR Ware, 2003]. Given that the average American diet gets about 2-3% of its energy from ultra-processed trans fats, and the rate of coronary heart disease has steadily decreased from 1960 to 2006 [Heart Disease and Stroke Statistics—2010 Update] it seems that whatever increased risk may or may not be present with the addition of trans fats in ultra-processed foods it is not measurable within the overall trend in the lowering of both the incidence and mortality of cardiovascular disease."

"an eating disorder is a deadly chronic condition to the point where you and your medical team may not be able to consider removal of foods from your diet when managing your secondary chronic condition (such as rheumatoid arthritis) because it drives progressive restriction and hastens overall disability and early death as a result."

An eating disorder trumps most things in its deadliness. Most people presenting in their doctors offices with puzzling and/or common chronic illnesses have these illnesses as a result of calorie restriction whether from an eating disorder (14-33% of the population) or repeatedly dabbling in restrictive behaviors.

Of course, it is not the addition of gums and preservatives that contribute to the health restoring effects of ultra- processed foods. It is just that a well-nourished body handles these things better than we think. It is the abandonment of food fear, allowing a person to access vital calories that is health restoring. If you can eat enough of "health" food and grass-fed beef to exceed your body's minimum calorie requirement, fine. Remember net calories, though. Deficits of energy must be rectified. The sooner the better. Maybe you are privileged to have a kitchen, to know how to cook, to be able to afford grass-fed beef. Not everyone is. Those folks can restore health too, if they can access the minimum calorie requirement.

I would hardly call misguided a path to complete wellness and weight optimization.

I wouldn't call it insane, either. Those of us who have restored our health have never felt more sane. And considering how the brain is effected by calorie restriction, it's no wonder.

 

[mbachiu]

@Kelj I have been reading through many of your replies on this thread. I think I’ve figured out that I’m in a quasi-recovered state. I have still been restricting many foods in order to improve after restricting calories & overexercising for about the last decade. I also appreciate you being willing to share parts of your recovery as well as others. At some point I think I read that you had some lipofuscin. Did that clear after you recovered? I have some pretty severe melasma, so am interested. I also read that you drank many of your calories? I also prefer liquid calories at the moment (mostly from milk & soft drinks). But, with my elevated blood sugar, I’m finding I am urinating a lot. Once recovered, does this need go down? I’m assuming once the body realizes that the famine is over & the blood sugar balances again, the urge to urinate will go down significantly. Thanks for any insights.

Btw, the blogs you’ve linked to the eating disorder institute are VERY helpful. I can’t believe how much fatigue & pain I am in. Good to know that this is the process of regeneration & not degeneration. Thanks for your very helpful insights.

 

[Cirion]

Calories absolutely matter, on that we both agree, and I think we both agree that most people (I would dare-say even most people on these forums) are under-consuming calories. Just can't get on board with the food selection choices is all. There's a complete night and day difference in how I feel if I eat say 4,000 calories of natural foods vs. 4,000 calories of pizza and hot dogs (just random example) so selection completely matters. Everyone I have talked to (without exception) has told me when they've gone from the typical ultra-processed foods rich diet to something like Whole 30, they feel immediately better. Clearly, processed foods just doesn't work for 90% of people. It's too simplistic to break it down only to calories. Yes, again, they matter - but it's only part of the picture. Macros matter. Micros matter. Toxins in food (or not) matter. One cannot ignore these three aspects in light of calories at all costs. I'm not saying micros matter at the expense of calories, don't get me wrong. I've experienced first hand that micros without sufficient calories also doesn't work. You should get micros AND macros AND calories AND remove toxins from the diet. All four. I just get the impression that the ED guidelines promote calories as the only thing that matters, maybe I'm wrong.

Let's take one random example why just eating more food won't necessarily fix a problem: Magnesium. Magnesium is a mineral that is essentially 100% impossible to get from food anymore due to soil depletion, even with 6,000 calories of foods a day including many magnesium rich foods so even eating the insane calorie guidelines recommended during recovery would *still* leave you deficient. I would link an article, but it got taken down -- the guy said at 1,000 mg a day, specifically focusing on magnesium rich foods, like two pounds of spinach a day, he was still deficient. The situation is even more grim if you're like most people who actively avoid foods rich in magnesium, the average person doesn't even get RDA (which is like 300 mg I think). Without magnesium, you can eat until you're stuffed to the gills, it won't matter, since magnesium is needed to form ATP (was just listening to a podcast form Georgi), keep stress in line, etc.

 

[Watubi]

Very poor ideas. Fasting makes diabetes worse.

Intermittent fasting for three months decreases pancreatic islet mass and increases insulin resistance in Wistar rats | ECE2018

Introduction: It is known that fasting causes several physiological changes in the endocrine pancreas, such as insulin secretion, pancreatic islet metabolism and beta cells redox state. However, there is still no consensus about the effects of intermittent fasting (IF), a fad diet widespread by the media and adopted by individuals seeking rapid weight loss. In the present study, we sought to study the effects of the IF diet for three months in an animal model.

Methods: Thirty-day-old female Wistar rats were submitted to IF for three months. During this time body weight and food intake were recorded. After the treatment the animals were killed, and pancreatic islets, perigonadal white adipose tissue, extensor digitorum longus muscle tissue and liver were collected for different analyses.

Results: IF decreased body weight and food intake. The stomach was greatly increased in size. There was an increase in adipose tissue and a decrease in muscle tissue. IF caused elevation of plasmatic insulin levels, both baseline and after glucose administration. In vitro, IF pancreatic islets had increased insulin secretion, glucose metabolism and net reactive oxygen species production, while decreased their mass. In addition, impairment in AKT phosphorylation was observed in peripheral tissues indicating insulin resistance.

Discussion: Previous studies showed an increase in orexigenic neurotransmitters production in IF, inducing hunger and hyperphagia in the ad libitum feeding days. Our experiments demonstrate that, despite the weight loss, IF treatment induces undesirable effects on tissue homeostasis. Therefore, the hyperinsulinemia registered in vivo and in vitro, associated with the impairment of glucose tolerance and the decrease in AKT phosphorylation, make clear the occurrence of peripheral insulin resistance. The increased metabolism of pancreatic islets dispersed cells, after IF treatment, indorses the higher insulin secretion. Furthermore, the decrease in the pancreatic islet mass indicates that three months of IF treatment cause severe impairment in glucose homeostasis. In conclusion, intermittent fasting diet may not be healthy to be adopted by individuals seeking rapid weight loss.

Wow! confirming some of my N=1 suspicions. I have been IF for years and didn't realize it was harming more than helping my yoyo diabetes.

 

[ecstatichamster]

Probably if we lacked stored PUFA fats, and therefore liberated saturated free fatty acids, we would not end up with type 2 diabetes. The problem today is huge because fasting among the things such as stress, exercise and fatty liver, results in high free fatty acids that are PUFA fats and that destroy energy production in the cell and result in low energy production and high inflammatory lactic acid.

 

[Kelj]

Calories absolutely matter, on that we both agree, and I think we both agree that most people (I would dare-say even most people on these forums) are under-consuming calories. Just can't get on board with the food selection choices is all. There's a complete night and day difference in how I feel if I eat say 4,000 calories of natural foods vs. 4,000 calories of pizza and hot dogs (just random example) so selection completely matters. Everyone I have talked to (without exception) has told me when they've gone from the typical ultra-processed foods rich diet to something like Whole 30, they feel immediately better. Clearly, processed foods just doesn't work for 90% of people. It's too simplistic to break it down only to calories. Yes, again, they matter - but it's only part of the picture. Macros matter. Micros matter. Toxins in food (or not) matter. One cannot ignore these three aspects in light of calories at all costs. I'm not saying micros matter at the expense of calories, don't get me wrong. I've experienced first hand that micros without sufficient calories also doesn't work. You should get micros AND macros AND calories AND remove toxins from the diet. All four. I just get the impression that the ED guidelines promote calories as the only thing that matters, maybe I'm wrong.

Let's take one random example why just eating more food won't necessarily fix a problem: Magnesium. Magnesium is a mineral that is essentially 100% impossible to get from food anymore due to soil depletion, even with 6,000 calories of foods a day including many magnesium rich foods so even eating the insane calorie guidelines recommended during recovery would *still* leave you deficient. I would link an article, but it got taken down -- the guy said at 1,000 mg a day, specifically focusing on magnesium rich foods, like two pounds of spinach a day, he was still deficient. The situation is even more grim if you're like most people who actively avoid foods rich in magnesium, the average person doesn't even get RDA (which is like 300 mg I think). Without magnesium, you can eat until you're stuffed to the gills, it won't matter, since magnesium is needed to form ATP (was just listening to a podcast form Georgi), keep stress in line, etc.

There are 64 mg of magnesium in 1 oz of dark chocolate. There are 58 mg in one medium-sized avocado. There are 82 mg in 1 oz of cashews. One cup of blackbeans contains 120 mg. One ounce of pumpkin seeds contains 150 mg. Ray says coffee is a good source of magnesium with 7 mg in 8 oz of coffee. There is 24-27 mg of magnesium in 8 oz. of milk, depending on whether you drink whole milk or 2% milk.
So, it is pretty clear that if a person is orthorexically restricting food variety and insisting on getting all their magnesium requirement from spinach, that may be impossible. Trying to meet one's calorie requirements will also be difficult with a diet that is trying to meet nutritional needs from greens and other vegetables, since there are only 209 calories in 2 lb. of spinach.

Taco Bell nachos contain 52 mg magnesium.
McDonald's McDonaldland chocolate chip cookies contain 40 mg magnesium.
McDonald's French fries contain 37 mg.
Taco Bell taco salad contains 143.91 mg of magnesium.

It is often claimed we cannot provide our nutrient needs through diet alone by those interested in selling us supplements. Mind you, I am not saying a supplement is never justified under under any circumstances, in case you were interested in going there. What I am saying is, when available nutrients in a diet are calculated from a 2000 calorie perspective and from the perspective of a diet which eliminates many nutritious foods, it can be difficult to meet minimum nutrient requirements. Anyone who has pushed through to recover from restrictive eating patterns has been able to meet all there nutrient requirements from food and achieve good health.
It is simply inaccurate to say ultra-processed foods are devoid of nutrients. Giving up fear of food is the defining characteristic of not being eating disordered. If one takes the clamps off of their eating and allows the body to choose food, one will be absolutely well nourished nutrient-wise. I know I am.

There are 28 mg of magnesium in a package of Reese's Peanutbutter Cups (2 cups). That's considerably better than a cup of coffee.....and you get 232 calories to speed you on your way to addressing your energy deficit.

 

[somuch4food]

Calories absolutely matter, on that we both agree, and I think we both agree that most people (I would dare-say even most people on these forums) are under-consuming calories. Just can't get on board with the food selection choices is all. There's a complete night and day difference in how I feel if I eat say 4,000 calories of natural foods vs. 4,000 calories of pizza and hot dogs (just random example) so selection completely matters. Everyone I have talked to (without exception) has told me when they've gone from the typical ultra-processed foods rich diet to something like Whole 30, they feel immediately better. Clearly, processed foods just doesn't work for 90% of people. It's too simplistic to break it down only to calories. Yes, again, they matter - but it's only part of the picture. Macros matter. Micros matter. Toxins in food (or not) matter. One cannot ignore these three aspects in light of calories at all costs. I'm not saying micros matter at the expense of calories, don't get me wrong. I've experienced first hand that micros without sufficient calories also doesn't work. You should get micros AND macros AND calories AND remove toxins from the diet. All four. I just get the impression that the ED guidelines promote calories as the only thing that matters, maybe I'm wrong.

Let's take one random example why just eating more food won't necessarily fix a problem: Magnesium. Magnesium is a mineral that is essentially 100% impossible to get from food anymore due to soil depletion, even with 6,000 calories of foods a day including many magnesium rich foods so even eating the insane calorie guidelines recommended during recovery would *still* leave you deficient. I would link an article, but it got taken down -- the guy said at 1,000 mg a day, specifically focusing on magnesium rich foods, like two pounds of spinach a day, he was still deficient. The situation is even more grim if you're like most people who actively avoid foods rich in magnesium, the average person doesn't even get RDA (which is like 300 mg I think). Without magnesium, you can eat until you're stuffed to the gills, it won't matter, since magnesium is needed to form ATP (was just listening to a podcast form Georgi), keep stress in line, etc.

The thing is @Kelj mentions that as you recover you will naturally shift towards less processed foods and that has been my experience. Some days, I want high energy foods aka processed foods and other days I need more raw unprocessed foods. There is a time for each type of food IMO. Sometimes, gummy bears give me a nice boost and on other days they just drain me. Trying to make sense of that is complicated since the body chemistry is constantly changing. Relying on intuition is relieving in my case since I do not fuel my perfectionist brain with that approach. That's exactly how children operate until their instinct are broken down by adults. My toddler does not want to eat veggies most of the time, but once in a while he finds raw celery and broccoli delicious. There are also days that all he wants is dessert. He can eat something every day for a while and then not want it the next day. Sometimes, he eats 3 chicken drumsticks in one sitting and other times he barely touches one. Diet should be fluid in my opinion and choices should be made in accordance with cravings and needs.

For example, I do not eat huge amounts of chips/fries since I know I won't be feeling good digestion wise and it will affect me for multiple days, but I will still eat a few when offered since I like the taste. I have also started to notice that the feeling in my stomach changes when I've had enough of a food/meal. It tightens up, but if I eat something else that feeling immediately disappear. A clear sign that we are geared toward a varied diet. The brain also reacts immediately to the stuff that you put in your mouth another indication of whether or not you should pursue eating said food.

I think you would fare better if you put the analytical energy you have towards advancing your early retirement plan and relaxed more on the diet front since in most cultures around the world eating is seen as a pleasure and a way to relax and that attitude helps digesting food better.

 

[Kelj]

@Kelj I have been reading through many of your replies on this thread. I think I’ve figured out that I’m in a quasi-recovered state. I have still been restricting many foods in order to improve after restricting calories & overexercising for about the last decade. I also appreciate you being willing to share parts of your recovery as well as others. At some point I think I read that you had some lipofuscin. Did that clear after you recovered? I have some pretty severe melasma, so am interested. I also read that you drank many of your calories? I also prefer liquid calories at the moment (mostly from milk & soft drinks). But, with my elevated blood sugar, I’m finding I am urinating a lot. Once recovered, does this need go down? I’m assuming once the body realizes that the famine is over & the blood sugar balances again, the urge to urinate will go down significantly. Thanks for any insights.

Btw, the blogs you’ve linked to the eating disorder institute are VERY helpful. I can’t believe how much fatigue & pain I am in. Good to know that this is the process of regeneration & not degeneration. Thanks for your very helpful insights.

It is relieving to know that the symptoms will soon be over with persistent rest and refeeding and you will be healthier at the end of it. The important thing to count is calorie intake. Make sure you always eat over the minimum. The more you eat over the minimum, the more energy your body has for repairs.
The thing you can follow your body's desire for is what you eat and drink. Soda can be very therapeutic in recovery, but be attentive to times when your body is asking for something with minerals in it, like fruit juice or tea or coffee. I did and still do get a lot of calories from liquids. The body is regulating, all the time, its water to electrolyte ratio. When we try to commandeer this system by forcing water drinking and supplementation, we are constantly overshooting in one direction or other. Just do what your body is indicating. The urinary frequency will wax and wane and gradually become more normal. The blood sugar will be what it needs to be. Just nourish yourself consistently. Of course, any moment you feel low blood sugar symptoms is an eating emergency.
Yes, the lipofuscin will gradually fade and initially leaves a little divot in the skin. Gradually the skin becomes smoother.

 

[Kelj]

The thing is @Kelj mentions that as you recover you will naturally shift towards less processed foods and that has been my experience. Some days, I want high energy foods aka processed foods and other days I need more raw unprocessed foods. There is a time for each type of food IMO. Sometimes, gummy bears give me a nice boost and on other days they just drain me. Trying to make sense of that is complicated since the body chemistry is constantly changing. Relying on intuition is relieving in my case since I do not fuel my perfectionist brain with that approach. That's exactly how children operate until their instinct are broken down by adults. My toddler does not want to eat veggies most of the time, but once in a while he finds raw celery and broccoli delicious. There are also days that all he wants is dessert. He can eat something every day for a while and then not want it the next day. Sometimes, he eats 3 chicken drumsticks in one sitting and other times he barely touches one. Diet should be fluid in my opinion and choices should be made in accordance with cravings and needs.

For example, I do not eat huge amounts of chips/fries since I know I won't be feeling good digestion wise and it will affect me for multiple days, but I will still eat a few when offered since I like the taste. I have also started to notice that the feeling in my stomach changes when I've had enough of a food/meal. It tightens up, but if I eat something else that feeling immediately disappear. A clear sign that we are geared toward a varied diet. The brain also reacts immediately to the stuff that you put in your mouth another indication of whether or not you should pursue eating said food.

I think you would fare better if you put the analytical energy you have towards advancing your early retirement plan and relaxed more on the diet front since in most cultures around the world eating is seen as a pleasure and a way to relax and that attitude helps digesting food better.

This is all so true. We often remark, in our house that

 

[Kelj]

Continued...
That we can push away our entree, feeling stuffed, but suddenly have our interest in eating revived by dessert and be able to eat it.

 

[mbachiu]

It is relieving to know that the symptoms will soon be over with persistent rest and refeeding and you will be healthier at the end of it. The important thing to count is calorie intake. Make sure you always eat over the minimum. The more you eat over the minimum, the more energy your body has for repairs.
The thing you can follow your body's desire for is what you eat and drink. Soda can be very therapeutic in recovery, but be attentive to times when your body is asking for something with minerals in it, like fruit juice or tea or coffee. I did and still do get a lot of calories from liquids. The body is regulating, all the time, its water to electrolyte ratio. When we try to commandeer this system by forcing water drinking and supplementation, we are constantly overshooting in one direction or other. Just do what your body is indicating. The urinary frequency will wax and wane and gradually become more normal. The blood sugar will be what it needs to be. Just nourish yourself consistently. Of course, any moment you feel low blood sugar symptoms is an eating emergency.
Yes, the lipofuscin will gradually fade and initially leaves a little divot in the skin. Gradually the skin becomes smoother.

Thank you!

 

[_lppaiva]

5 cups of coffee

Does coffee have something to do with helping diabetes, or do you drink such high amounts for other reasons (Caffeine for liver health for instance)?

 

[Hildy]

OR..... you could just fast every other day or every three days...and cut the rest of all those protocols out. How is your vitamin D? I agree on cutting the iodine. Looks like you are taking too much, drinking too much water too. Skip breakfast at least and forget all those fats. Coffee con leche for breakfast , then eat Peat stuff from 11-5. ( get enough calories , sugar, salt etc ) go to sleep at 9-10 ish. Dump all the supplements and go to a suntan bed or really get some bright sun. Epsom salt baths at night . Wake up later like 9 am. Sleep later to help with high cortisol. Easy work outs like gentle yoga, swimming, walking.

I agree with you especially about the sleep part. Going to bed at a decent hour: 9,10-11 pm seems to be the best healing modality and in turn you have less inflammation- something I have to be more diligent about because the last couple of nights I have been up to late ( 12 o'clock) reading the forum.
I do best when I go to bed early. I really do think it's a big factor in getting your body to work properly.

 

[Zpol]

Ray Peat says:

"Diabetics typically have elevated lactate, which shows that glucose doesn’t have a problem getting into their cells, just getting oxidized.” -Ray Peat, PhD

"Glucose is said to not be able to enter the cell in diabetes, but the presence of lactic acid suggest glucose is entering the cell but is being wasted, producing lactate via inefficient and stress promoting glycolytic metabolism."

So, it is incorrect that glucose does not enter the cells. If it did not, lactic acid could not be produced, but as Methylenewhite correctly says, diabetics produce a lot of lactic acid. This is not because of yogurt eating. It is due to a lack of energy to properly oxidize glucose in the cell and produce carbon dioxide. All of it is due to lack of energy. That is why I suggest never eating below what normal people do eat to support health and normal weight.
Intermittent fasting is often touted as Baccheion suggests, however, there is no way that going so long without eating every day is not going to trigger a cortisol rise. The cortisol rise is the trigger for catabolism and blood sugar rise. This practise is predicated on the notion that glucose comes purely from the diet, which is what people thought before the discovery of cortisol and its catabolic effect, which also raises blood glucose. Since experimentation is useful, we tried intermittent fasting, and it did cause a continuous rise in blood glucose.

All of the ways suggested in this thread probably do work, at least temporarily, to lower blood glucose, but the amount of glucose in the blood is not the essence of the problem. As ecstatic hamster says, the high blood glucose is not what is going to hurt you. But it is a warning, a symptom that your metabolism is being rearranged by your brain because you are starving your body.

As this letter, to be copied and given to the doctors of eating disordered patients because doctors are generally uninformed about the cause of the diseases with which their patients are presenting, states:

Dear Doctor: Your patient has an eating disorder. — The Eating Disorder Institute

"If you treat these symptoms in the absence of getting the patient to re-energize with enough food to rectify the energy deficit, then you will be pushing the living system and overriding its inherent life-saving energy usage reduction mechanisms. 13"

The "high" blood sugar is a result of life-saving adjustments on the part of the body. What happens if we try to override this mechanism instead of addressing the real issue...the starvation. Whether it's Metformin or insulin or any other substance used to force a lower blood sugar, our bodies will respond by raising the glucose even more, if there is the tissue to use. We are trying to override what the body is doing for itself.

Dealing with a "high" blood sugar level is all about your understanding and comfort with the science. Anxiety is the usual outcome of these kinds of diagnoses. Anxiety is the basic reason for an eating disorder. In working with your doctor, you might show him/her this information and suggest a wait and see approach. In the case of even type I diabetes, the pancreas can be regenerated by refeeding. Ray mentions this:

Glucose and sucrose for diabetes.

"Animals that have been made diabetic with relatively low doses of the poison streptozotocin can recover functional beta-cells spontaneously,"

"In 1857, M. Piorry in Paris and William Budd in Bristol, England, reasoned that if a patient was losing a pound of sugar every day in 10 liters of urine, and was losing weight very rapidly, and had an intense craving for sugar, it would be reasonable to replace some of the lost sugar, simply because the quick weight loss of diabetes invariably led to death. Keeping patients from eating what they craved seemed both cruel and futile.

Budd described another patient, a young man who had become too weak to work and who was losing weight at an extreme rate. Budd's prescription included 8 ounces of white sugar and 4 ounces of honey every day, and again, instead of increasing the amount of glucose in the urine, the amount decreased quickly as the patient began eating almost as much sugar as was being lost initially, and then as the loss of sugar in the urine decreased, the patient gained weight and recovered his strength."

Phases of Recovery From An Eating Disorder Part 5 — The Eating Disorder Institute

"If you are a reader of the The Eating Disorder Institute forums, then you are likely well aware of the fact that many people struggle greatly through the process of healing. Some have even had full-blown medical crises: pancreatitis, diabetic attacks, worsening of preexisting conditions (eczema, allergic reaction, digestive distress, inflammatory responses of one kind or another) and one or two have even faced re-feeding syndrome."

From the same article this truth:

"Swelling (edema) is also a fundamental body defense to protect the body from further damage or infection and to facilitate healing. The process of healing involves natural cell death (apoptosis); reabsorption and excretion; cell growth and division; and cell differentiation and movement. Macrophages are a dedicated cell type responsible for chomping up damaged cells, triggering fluid ingress and retention, and producing insulin-like-growth-factor-1 to speed up cellular growth and division. 5 The side effects of their presence in our bodies are, of course, swelling and pain.

However the absence of macrophages will result in an equivalent absence of restoration and healing. "

The inflamed pancreas is a healing pancreas. You may need your doctor to help you through some symptoms of healing. For example, "refeeding syndrome", in the early days of upping calorie intake, which causes dangerously low phosphorous levels, a concern about the levels of which was mentioned in this thread.

Also, the gut microbiome is mentioned in the above article:

"As with everything else in your body, those friendly bacteria have suffered huge losses thanks to restrictive eating behaviors. The bacterial colonies will be restored with continued re-feeding, but initially their low colony counts due to starvation can mean diarrhea, gas, bloating, poorly digested foods, and also systemic signs that the gut lining is allowing the wrong things through to the bloodstream (skin rashes and itchiness). 14"

As you can see, in each case, addressing the energy intake of your body, addresses all these issues. Ray Peats articles are invaluable in explaining what is going on.

Thanks for this @Kelj . This really restores my hope. I have one issue that might be preventing me from benefiting from all additional calories I am consuming, that is severe villous atrophy. My diagnostics show the villi in my digestive tract are bent over and flattened out. My doctor says this is why all my healthy eating has not shown improvements. I will definitely show her the note you linked about refeeding next time I see her.

 

[blabla123]

Def. had diabetes 2/hypothyroid symptoms.. e.g. chronic: cold-sweats, pruned fingertips, either too high or low blood sugar ... I don't really know what stopped it but it was in the same period I dropped fructose, replaced bread with potatoes and started eating liver again.

 

[Kelj]

Thanks for this @Kelj . This really restores my hope. I have one issue that might be preventing me from benefiting from all additional calories I am consuming, that is severe villous atrophy. My diagnostics show the villi in my digestive tract are bent over and flattened out. My doctor says this is why all my healthy eating has not shown improvements. I will definitely show her the note you linked about refeeding next time I see her.

This article might help.

Tummy Troubles — The Eating Disorder Institute

One quote:

"If a patient has been bed ridden for some time due to severe illness, the muscles may not even support her swinging her legs to the side of the bed. Resolving muscle atrophy is not achieved by avoiding use of those muscles and the same holds true for gastrointestinal atrophy as well."

 

[Zpol]

"If a patient has been bed ridden for some time due to severe illness, the muscles may not even support her swinging her legs to the side of the bed. Resolving muscle atrophy is not achieved by avoiding use of those muscles and the same holds true for gastrointestinal atrophy as well."

Good point!

This article might help.

Tummy Troubles — The Eating Disorder Institute

\

Thanks I will check it out!

 

[lampofred]

Does coffee have something to do with helping diabetes, or do you drink such high amounts for other reasons (Caffeine for liver health for instance)?

Coffee consumption is pretty strongly inversely related to incidence of type 2 diabetes and the effect is dose dependent.

 

[Vileplume]

people eating high sugar low fat often fix their blood sugar problems in a few weeks.

How critical do you think low fat is to this improvement? For example, would full-fat milk be preventing blood sugar problems from improving, while a switch to low fat milk might fix it?

 

[TibRex]

For me, one of the biggest things that helped in normalizing blood sugar was lowering body iron stores. As with so many degenerative diseases, high iron is present in diabetes, and the iron itself is causal. You should consider getting an iron panel with TSAT and ferritin. Blood sugar regulation really improved as I got near deficiency, as did energy and mental clarity. This is discussed many places on the forum, as well as in the work of E.D. Weinberg and Dr. Fachinni. Even so called "high normal" ferritin levels can cause blood sugar and other issues, so don't just pay attention to lab ranges.

Magnesium supplementation also seemed to help lower high blood sugar levels, but it was not as dramatic as getting my iron levels near deficiency.

Thanks for the tip on Iron level in the body as a causative factor... could you suggest some simple ways of lower iron levels... I know some folks go for blood letting, blood donation and all that stuff but I'd rather go for a simpler method that can be applied at home. Can one supplement with iron antagonist minerals like copper and zinc instead and will they work?