Has Anyone Reversed Their Type II Diabetes Following RP Advice?

Watubi

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Sep 17, 2019
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I am new to the Ray Peat forum. I have type II diabetes with elevated blood glucose averaging 220. Beta T cell tests show they are producing but going hard core keto made no difference in my numbers and made me feel sluggish with brain fog. I went strict vegan for 3 months and wrecked my health with no significant changes to glucose numbers. I follow the Plant Paradox diet to reduce inflammatory response, felt better but A1c is still high. Now I am following the EPI-Paleo RX diet (by Jack Kruse) feeling fine but my blood sugar is still above 200 on average. Every diet change I stick to for 3 months followed by blood tests. I am not overweight, exercise every day, drink nothing but mineral water eating at sunrise and only again right after sun down. Nothing is working. I need hope that the Ray Peat guidance has worked for someone like me with type II diabetes. Please.. has anyone been able to normalize their high blood sugar using Ray Peats advice?
 

Cirion

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Keto will only alleviate the symptoms of diabetes, not cure diabetes. In fact keto induces even more insulin resistance in the long run. But since people are typically interested in quick fixes, that's why keto is all the craze these days.

High blood sugar, counterintuitvely enough, is not caused by eating too much glucose, typically it is either one or several of the following

-- Eating too *little* glucose (the body raises blood glucose when it senses a deficiency in the cells)
-- Poor glucose storage capabilities typically due to sluggish/fatty liver
-- Interference of glucose uptake to the cells (aka, insulin resistance)
-- Large amounts of free fatty acids (FFA's) in the blood, too much fatty acid oxidation (FAO), and/or too much PUFA in the bloodstream, eating too high of a fat diet compared to carbs

I'm not gonna tell you there's a quick fix because there isn't (I've very slowly chipped away at my own health issues, and am slowly making progress finally but it takes time).

It's good that you're not overweight, that makes things a little easier. I say that because excess body weight increases FFA's/FAO and lactic acid production. We need more information to better gauge some (possible) action plans though...

- Waking temps/pulses
- Calorie intake
- Macros/micros (typical day of eating)

But it sounds like your diet currently is not so good, are you eating anything or just only drinking mineral water? Fasting increases FFA's and is not the answer. Fructose is useful in diabetes as it bypasses the insulin response. You say you were vegan, I like some things about vegan, but typically vegans will be a tad bit too low on protein. Without some protein, carbohydrates won't be utilized correctly. Carbohydrates ingested alone without protein typically will increase stress markers like serotonin.

Glucose levels like I say, will paradoxically remain high until you feed the body glucose/fructose/sucrose like it wants. There was a woman from Kentucky who recently proved that glucose is NOT the cause of inflammation in diabetes. This isn't new news, but nice that it's being rediscovered:

What Drives Inflammation in Type 2 Diabetes? Not Glucose, Says New Research
 

lampofred

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Feb 13, 2016
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My fasting blood glucose went from 150 to 120 to 88 over 2 years due to a RP diet (mainly PUFA and iron depletion along with high calcium intake) and 2 aspirins, 5 cups of coffee, and vitamin K daily, and it's probably even lower now. It has been over a year since I checked. I used to get tired after eating even a moderately carb heavy meal but now I can take in 400 g of sugar in one go with no noticeable negative issues at all. Definitely am not recommending doing that, but just wanted to provide an example showing that there has been a clear improvement in my glucose tolerance.

I would recommend reading RPs articles on diabetes, unsaturated oils, iron, aspirin, and caffeine on his website at raypeat.com. Here are a few (#1 and #4 are different even though the title is the same):

Glucose and sucrose for diabetes.
Diabetes, scleroderma, oils and hormones
Glycemia, starch, and sugar in context
Glucose and sucrose for diabetes.
 
Last edited:

Tarmander

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Apr 30, 2015
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Peat diet (OJ +Milk variations)will probably help a small percentage of people who are T2D. I do not think the risk is worth the reward. Incorporating some Peat Principles into your life would probably help, along with making sure you aren't exposed to a lot of EMF.
 

Cirion

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Peat diet (OJ +Milk variations)will probably help a small percentage of people who are T2D. I do not think the risk is worth the reward. Incorporating some Peat Principles into your life would probably help, along with making sure you aren't exposed to a lot of EMF.

Yeah, I have gotten to the point where I don't want to tell people exactly what to do, in particular impressionable new posters. But I would certainly at least try milk and OJ and see how you do with it, if you don't do well, well at least you tried it.

Experiment for yourself is key. Do not blindly follow anyones' advice, least of all mine. This is a mistake I made early on in my journey and caused a lot of pain I could have avoided and I am now paying the price for even today. You will get lots of opinions here, and it can be easy to be overwhelmed, so don't trust any of it 100% but DO add them as potential things to experiment with. Only you know your own level of health. There is no objective truth to what foods you should eat or how much. Only you can figure this out. The only mostly universal truths are things such as

-- Measure body temps, pulses
-- Measured CO2 levels using capnograph
-- Subjective measurements of mood, libido, energy, sleep quality, overall well being
-- Measure vitamin/mineral levels, blood tests, thyroid labs etc
-- Body weight, glucose levels, blood pressure, any other marker of interest

Manipulate your diet such all of these are optimized. This then is your optimal diet.
 

Watubi

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My body temperature is usually 97.5 within 10 minutes of waking.
My typical daily routine is as follows:

Morning
1. Wake up to see the sunrise and do Qi-gong morning exercises barefoot in the grass
2. Within 30 minutes of waking Eat a high fat and/or protein meal (50 – 75 grams) (usually our farm eggs and steak, seafood or bacon)
3. Within 30 minutes of waking eat fermented food and raw garlic
4. Drink 1–3 tablespoons of apple cider vinegar
5. Immediately drink 16-32oz of ice-cold water (with iodine). DO NOT drink more than 32oz.
6. Exercise cold thermogenesis and DO NOT let skin temperature fall below 50-55 degrees (up to 1 hour)
7. Take D3, K2 (in the form of MK7), Magnesium, Omega 3, DHEA, Selenium, Iodine, PQQ (aka pyrroloquinoline quinone), B Vitamin complex, CoQ10, Turmeric (with black pepper), Vitamin C and Vitamin A
8. Use Vielight (intra-nasal red light therapy) for 25 minutes on the car drive into work

Afternoon
1. Take probiotics (usually in the form of homemade kombucha)
2. Walk with as much skin exposed to sunlight as possible for as long as possible during lunch
3. Drink 2 -3 bottles of water (with iodine) throughout the afternoon
4. Use FSM (Frequency Specific Microcurrent) on the car drive back home
5. Use Vielight for 25 minutes on the car drive back home

Evening
1. Exercise cold thermogenesis and DO NOT let skin temperature fall below 50-55 degrees
2. High Intensity Training (HIT) weight lifting for 30 minutes (after 5pm)
3. Eat a high protein meal with salad and/or vegetables (fiber) allow 4-5 hours between dinner and bedtime
4. 1 hour after meal drink 1 - 3 bottles of water (with iodine)
5. Take 2 – 3 ounces of coconut (or MCT) oil
6. Watch sunset then reduce exposure to blue light and eliminate blue light sources after 2 hours
7. Before bed take prebiotics and probiotics (Del-immune V)
8. Go to bed in time to ensure 7 to 8 hours of sleep
 

S-VV

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Jul 23, 2018
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Have you measured your 24h urinary and morning cortisol? Also, what's your diet in macros?
 

Cirion

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St. Louis, Missouri
I'm not a fan of that cold therapy that Kruse recommends. Yeah it technically might boost your metabolic rate, but by increasing stress/cortisol, not by increasing T3/androgens, and is unlikely to help you reach ideal body temps and will probably worsen them.

I really like your sunlight and working out outside barefoot though.

Maybe consider a higher carb breakfast instead of high fat. Glucose stores are depleted in the morning and should be replenished as soon as possible.

Probiotics are controversial here, with some saying all are bad, so be careful there.

+1 on removing fish oils.

It looks like overall your diet is lacking in carbohydrate. Some people do better with fats in the diet, some don't, so you don't necessarily need to remove fats (but that might help, especially lowering PUFA's) but definitely increase carbs, especially sugar (don't fear the sugar) from nutritious sources. I'm also getting the feeling your overall calorie intake is probably really low, but I don't know for sure without seeing the numbers.

Seems like you are taking a lot of iodine. I think iodine can have its uses (Ray would disagree with me), but I'd check to see if you actually have some deficiencies if you haven't already first.
 
D

danishispsychic

Guest
OR..... you could just fast every other day or every three days...and cut the rest of all those protocols out. How is your vitamin D? I agree on cutting the iodine. Looks like you are taking too much, drinking too much water too. Skip breakfast at least and forget all those fats. Coffee con leche for breakfast , then eat Peat stuff from 11-5. ( get enough calories , sugar, salt etc ) go to sleep at 9-10 ish. Dump all the supplements and go to a suntan bed or really get some bright sun. Epsom salt baths at night . Wake up later like 9 am. Sleep later to help with high cortisol. Easy work outs like gentle yoga, swimming, walking.
 

ExCarniv

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Joined
Aug 5, 2019
Messages
479
My body temperature is usually 97.5 within 10 minutes of waking.
My typical daily routine is as follows:

Morning
1. Wake up to see the sunrise and do Qi-gong morning exercises barefoot in the grass
2. Within 30 minutes of waking Eat a high fat and/or protein meal (50 – 75 grams) (usually our farm eggs and steak, seafood or bacon)
3. Within 30 minutes of waking eat fermented food and raw garlic
4. Drink 1–3 tablespoons of apple cider vinegar
5. Immediately drink 16-32oz of ice-cold water (with iodine). DO NOT drink more than 32oz.
6. Exercise cold thermogenesis and DO NOT let skin temperature fall below 50-55 degrees (up to 1 hour)
7. Take D3, K2 (in the form of MK7), Magnesium, Omega 3, DHEA, Selenium, Iodine, PQQ (aka pyrroloquinoline quinone), B Vitamin complex, CoQ10, Turmeric (with black pepper), Vitamin C and Vitamin A
8. Use Vielight (intra-nasal red light therapy) for 25 minutes on the car drive into work

Afternoon
1. Take probiotics (usually in the form of homemade kombucha)
2. Walk with as much skin exposed to sunlight as possible for as long as possible during lunch
3. Drink 2 -3 bottles of water (with iodine) throughout the afternoon
4. Use FSM (Frequency Specific Microcurrent) on the car drive back home
5. Use Vielight for 25 minutes on the car drive back home

Evening
1. Exercise cold thermogenesis and DO NOT let skin temperature fall below 50-55 degrees
2. High Intensity Training (HIT) weight lifting for 30 minutes (after 5pm)
3. Eat a high protein meal with salad and/or vegetables (fiber) allow 4-5 hours between dinner and bedtime
4. 1 hour after meal drink 1 - 3 bottles of water (with iodine)
5. Take 2 – 3 ounces of coconut (or MCT) oil
6. Watch sunset then reduce exposure to blue light and eliminate blue light sources after 2 hours
7. Before bed take prebiotics and probiotics (Del-immune V)
8. Go to bed in time to ensure 7 to 8 hours of sleep


"Fish oil, which is extremely unstable in the presence of oxygen and metals such as iron, produces some of these dangerous products very rapidly. The polyunsaturated “essential fatty acids” and their products, arachidonic acid and many of the prostaglandin-like materials, also produce them." Ray Peat.

Drop the fish oil.
 

Watubi

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Thread starter
Joined
Sep 17, 2019
Messages
29
Location
Alabama
OR..... you could just fast every other day or every three days...and cut the rest of all those protocols out. How is your vitamin D? I agree on cutting the iodine. Looks like you are taking too much, drinking too much water too. Skip breakfast at least and forget all those fats. Coffee con leche for breakfast , then eat Peat stuff from 11-5. ( get enough calories , sugar, salt etc ) go to sleep at 9-10 ish. Dump all the supplements and go to a suntan bed or really get some bright sun. Epsom salt baths at night . Wake up later like 9 am. Sleep later to help with high cortisol. Easy work outs like gentle yoga, swimming, walking.
I take about 10,000 IU of D3 every day. I am starting to look at full spectrum infra red sun beds (especially for winter when there is not as much sunlight). I didn't know that sleeping later would help lower cortisol levels. thank you for your advice!
 

Watubi

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Thread starter
Joined
Sep 17, 2019
Messages
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Location
Alabama
"Fish oil, which is extremely unstable in the presence of oxygen and metals such as iron, produces some of these dangerous products very rapidly. The polyunsaturated “essential fatty acids” and their products, arachidonic acid and many of the prostaglandin-like materials, also produce them." Ray Peat.

Drop the fish oil.
Ok, thank you very much
 

Watubi

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Thread starter
Joined
Sep 17, 2019
Messages
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Location
Alabama
I'm not a fan of that cold therapy that Kruse recommends. Yeah it technically might boost your metabolic rate, but by increasing stress/cortisol, not by increasing T3/androgens, and is unlikely to help you reach ideal body temps and will probably worsen them.

I really like your sunlight and working out outside barefoot though.

Maybe consider a higher carb breakfast instead of high fat. Glucose stores are depleted in the morning and should be replenished as soon as possible.

Probiotics are controversial here, with some saying all are bad, so be careful there.

+1 on removing fish oils.

It looks like overall your diet is lacking in carbohydrate. Some people do better with fats in the diet, some don't, so you don't necessarily need to remove fats (but that might help, especially lowering PUFA's) but definitely increase carbs, especially sugar (don't fear the sugar) from nutritious sources. I'm also getting the feeling your overall calorie intake is probably really low, but I don't know for sure without seeing the numbers.

Seems like you are taking a lot of iodine. I think iodine can have its uses (Ray would disagree with me), but I'd check to see if you actually have some deficiencies if you haven't already first.
I have only just started the cold therapy and it is not fun. Not hard to talk me out of that especially if there is science indicating it is harmful. I am curious to know if Ray Peat is a fan of only eating fruits when they are seasonally available in the local area or if he recommends them all year around. I have been looking but haven't seen any mention of that so far. I am trying to wrap my head around the differences in dietary approach coming from my current paleo approach. Thank you so very much for your time and help. V/r
 

Watubi

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Thread starter
Joined
Sep 17, 2019
Messages
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Location
Alabama
My fasting blood glucose went from 150 to 120 to 88 over 2 years due to a RP diet (mainly PUFA and iron depletion along with high calcium intake) and 2 aspirins, 5 cups of coffee, and vitamin K daily, and it's probably even lower now. It has been over a year since I checked. I used to get tired after eating even a moderately carb heavy meal but now I can take in 400 g of sugar in one go with no noticeable negative issues at all. Definitely am not recommending doing that, but just wanted to provide an example showing that there has been a clear improvement in my glucose tolerance.

I would recommend reading RPs articles on diabetes, unsaturated oils, iron, aspirin, and caffeine on his website at raypeat.com. Here are a few (#1 and #4 are different even though the title is the same):

Glucose and sucrose for diabetes.
Diabetes, scleroderma, oils and hormones
Glycemia, starch, and sugar in context
Glucose and sucrose for diabetes.
Your success following RP advice gives me hope. Thank you very much for that. I know everyone is different but the personal testimonial of success is better than anything second hand and helps me see that if someone else can do it then so can I. Again, thank you.
 

tara

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Joined
Mar 29, 2014
Messages
10,295
Peat talked about his father resolving diabetes by practically living on brewers yeast for a few weeks. I'm not saying you should do that, just reporting a possible success:
Ray Peat, PhD on Brewer’s Yeast – Functional Performance Systems (FPS)

Experiment for yourself is key. Do not blindly follow anyones' advice, least of all mine.
+1
None of us knows exactly what you will need.

I would recommend reading RPs articles on diabetes, unsaturated oils, iron, aspirin, and caffeine on his website at raypeat.com.
+1
I am curious to know if Ray Peat is a fan of only eating fruits when they are seasonally available in the local area or if he recommends them all year around.
He seems to favour ripe fruit. Or if you can't get that, stewing it sometimes helps.
You might want to see how you do with well cooked root veges, too.

I'll add that if you are considering making major changes to your diet, such as to more carbs/less fat, you might want to change gradually so that your system has more chance to adapt.
If you haven't put your diet through cronometer or similar to see roughly what nutrition you are getting from it, it could give useful clues.
 

tankasnowgod

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Joined
Jan 25, 2014
Messages
5,051
I am new to the Ray Peat forum. I have type II diabetes with elevated blood glucose averaging 220. Beta T cell tests show they are producing but going hard core keto made no difference in my numbers and made me feel sluggish with brain fog. I went strict vegan for 3 months and wrecked my health with no significant changes to glucose numbers. I follow the Plant Paradox diet to reduce inflammatory response, felt better but A1c is still high. Now I am following the EPI-Paleo RX diet (by Jack Kruse) feeling fine but my blood sugar is still above 200 on average. Every diet change I stick to for 3 months followed by blood tests. I am not overweight, exercise every day, drink nothing but mineral water eating at sunrise and only again right after sun down. Nothing is working. I need hope that the Ray Peat guidance has worked for someone like me with type II diabetes. Please.. has anyone been able to normalize their high blood sugar using Ray Peats advice?

For me, one of the biggest things that helped in normalizing blood sugar was lowering body iron stores. As with so many degenerative diseases, high iron is present in diabetes, and the iron itself is causal. You should consider getting an iron panel with TSAT and ferritin. Blood sugar regulation really improved as I got near deficiency, as did energy and mental clarity. This is discussed many places on the forum, as well as in the work of E.D. Weinberg and Dr. Fachinni. Even so called "high normal" ferritin levels can cause blood sugar and other issues, so don't just pay attention to lab ranges.

Magnesium supplementation also seemed to help lower high blood sugar levels, but it was not as dramatic as getting my iron levels near deficiency.
 

Lokzo

Member
Joined
Mar 26, 2016
Messages
1,690
Location
Melbourne
My fasting blood glucose went from 150 to 120 to 88 over 2 years due to a RP diet (mainly PUFA and iron depletion along with high calcium intake) and 2 aspirins, 5 cups of coffee, and vitamin K daily, and it's probably even lower now. It has been over a year since I checked. I used to get tired after eating even a moderately carb heavy meal but now I can take in 400 g of sugar in one go with no noticeable negative issues at all. Definitely am not recommending doing that, but just wanted to provide an example showing that there has been a clear improvement in my glucose tolerance.

I would recommend reading RPs articles on diabetes, unsaturated oils, iron, aspirin, and caffeine on his website at raypeat.com. Here are a few (#1 and #4 are different even though the title is the same):

Glucose and sucrose for diabetes.
Diabetes, scleroderma, oils and hormones
Glycemia, starch, and sugar in context
Glucose and sucrose for diabetes.

This is pretty amazing, nice work!


How do you achieve high calcium intake?
 
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