Has anybody successfully lowered Rt3?

[jomamma007]

And if so, how?

Everything I read just says stress elevates it, but that’s not very useful as we can only mitigate so much with diet and supplementation.

Also, what’s the optimal level, or is the ratio between t3 and Rt3 more important?

 

[mostlylurking]

And if so, how?

Everything I read just says stress elevates it, but that’s not very useful as we can only mitigate so much with diet and supplementation.

Also, what’s the optimal level, or is the ratio between t3 and Rt3 more important?

Ray Peat says it's high cortisol that causes reverse t3
Here are a couple of clips about rt3:

View: https://youtu.be/95wfldTYSfA?t=3131


and

View: https://youtu.be/5-t5vgHW8gM?t=2857


I found these clips using this search engine: Bioenergetic Search and searching for Reverse t3. There were more clips than these two. You might want to do the search yourself and spend some time listening to the clips that come up. You could also search for Cortisol to find out how to lower it.

 

[jomamma007]

Ray Peat says it's high cortisol that causes reverse t3
Here are a couple of clips about rt3:

View: https://youtu.be/95wfldTYSfA?t=3131


and

View: https://youtu.be/5-t5vgHW8gM?t=2857


I found these clips using this search engine: Bioenergetic Search and searching for Reverse t3. There were more clips than these two. You might want to do the search yourself and spend some time listening to the clips that come up. You could also search for Cortisol to find out how to lower it.

Thanks, I actually did the same thing with bioenergetic and watched every video relating to it over the past weekend. My issue is that saying cortisol is the problem, aka stress, is practically useless. Georgi said it could be stressors of cancer, infection, Alzheimer's etc causing it to be elevated, so just thinking of stress as life stress and not internal stress doesn't seem to be the way to look at things, especially if someone has already incorporated many peaty principles to lower cortisol etc...

 

[mostlylurking]

Thanks, I actually did the same thing with bioenergetic and watched every video relating to it over the past weekend. My issue is that saying cortisol is the problem, aka stress, is practically useless. Georgi said it could be stressors of cancer, infection, Alzheimer's etc causing it to be elevated, so just thinking of stress as life stress and not internal stress doesn't seem to be the way to look at things, especially if someone has already incorporated many peaty principles to lower cortisol etc...

I agree, it's important to understand that the problem is internal physical stress. Something isn't working right. Trying to blame the problem on your personal life situation doesn't help.

Have you looked into possible hypothyroidism? For me, addressing my hypothyroidism and getting my thyroid supplement optimized was key to solving the problem. Hypothyroid people tend to run on adrenaline which increases cortisol.

 

[Dr. B]

Thanks, I actually did the same thing with bioenergetic and watched every video relating to it over the past weekend. My issue is that saying cortisol is the problem, aka stress, is practically useless. Georgi said it could be stressors of cancer, infection, Alzheimer's etc causing it to be elevated, so just thinking of stress as life stress and not internal stress doesn't seem to be the way to look at things, especially if someone has already incorporated many peaty principles to lower cortisol etc...

if its elevated and stress is too high it seems taking T3 doesnt help either, the T3 either turns to more reverse t3 or raises cortisol somehow. the stress does mean physical stress, not mental stress like worrying about paying the bills or a relationship or something.

I agree, it's important to understand that the problem is internal physical stress. Something isn't working right. Trying to blame the problem on your personal life situation doesn't help.

Have you looked into possible hypothyroidism? For me, addressing my hypothyroidism and getting my thyroid supplement optimized was key to solving the problem. Hypothyroid people tend to run on adrenaline which increases cortisol.

what do you do for cushings? how to heal cushings? is there excess cortisol produced because of hypothyroidism? or something else

 

[mostlylurking]

what do you do for cushings? how to heal cushings? is there excess cortisol produced because of hypothyroidism? or something else

Bromocriptine Lowers Cortisol, Suppresses ACTH​

and

Vitamin A Lowers High Cortisol Levels (Cushing Disease)​

I searched for "Cushings" using the search engine at the top of this page. Search results

 

[5a-DHP]

Exogenous testosterone use reliably and repeatedly reduces my rT3 from slightly above-range (my sport requires endurance training, so my body is under chronic stress) to bottom-range — last set of labs whilst using test:

Not saying that you should use testosterone, but it does support the notion of cortisol being the main driver given androgen's general glucocorticoid antagonism.

 

[Dr. B]

Exogenous testosterone use reliably and repeatedly reduces my rT3 from slightly above-range (my sport requires endurance training, so my body is under chronic stress) to bottom-range — last set of labs whilst using test:

View attachment 25880

Not saying that you should use testosterone, but it does support the notion of cortisol being the main driver given androgen's general glucocorticoid antagonism.

do you get side effects from testosterone?
does estrogen also reduce reverse t3/how does estrogen affect cortisol.
which sport are you doing, why not just quit the sport entirely?
is it true the more anti glucocorticoid something is the more anabolic is? so technically any substance whether a drug or supplement or herb, the more it drops cortisol the more muscle growth it allows?

 

[5a-DHP]

do you get side effects from testosterone?
does estrogen also reduce reverse t3/how does estrogen affect cortisol.
which sport are you doing, why not just quit the sport entirely?
is it true the more anti glucocorticoid something is the more anabolic is? so technically any substance whether a drug or supplement or herb, the more it drops cortisol the more muscle growth it allows?

1.) depends what you define as a side effect.
2.) estrogen promotes cortisol production, and cortisol promotes rT3 production; exogenous testosterone use generally leads to a net decrease in cortisol if the androgen to estrogen ratio is favorable, which it always is for me.
3.) combat sport — it's my main pleasure in life, so I'd rather arm my body with the resources required to attenuate the stress versus avoiding the stressor altogether, which for me would be extraordinarily unfulfilling.
4.) yes, which is why trenbolone - a progestin with extremely potent antagonism at the GR - is the most anabolic AAS.

 

[Dr. B]

1.) depends what you define as a side effect.
2.) estrogen promotes cortisol production, and cortisol promotes rT3 production; exogenous testosterone use generally leads to a net decrease in cortisol if the androgen to estrogen ratio is favorable, which it always is for me.
3.) combat sport — it's my main pleasure in life, so I'd rather arm my body with the resources required to attenuate the stress versus avoiding the stressor altogether, which for me would be extraordinarily unfulfilling.
4.) yes, which is why trenbolone - a progestin with extremely potent antagonism at the GR - is the most anabolic AAS.

why does trenbelone cause side effects, apparently liver damage too doesnt it?
hair loss, nipple tenderness, aromatization from the testosterone? if cortisols already high doesnt it simply boost estrogen

 

[5a-DHP]

Cortisol antagonism doesn't mean a substance will be inherently protective if said substance also acts through numerous other mechanisms, which tren does.
It isn't clear how hepatotoxic tren is — it's not as toxic as 17 alpha-alkylated orals, but it can and regularly does causes cholestasis, raised liver enzymes, etc., in those who take it.

No, I don't get any of those side effects.
If your body is under stress but you're still in good metabolic health overall, exogenous testosterone use will not lead to excessive increases in estradiol — even when I run high w/o any form of AI use, my serum estradiol (and prolactin, a decent marker of systemic estrogenicity) remains low.

 

[Dr. B]

Cortisol antagonism doesn't mean a substance will be inherently protective if said substance also acts through numerous other mechanisms, which tren does.
It isn't clear how hepatotoxic tren is — it's not as toxic as 17 alpha-alkylated orals, but it can and regularly does causes cholestasis, raised liver enzymes, etc., in those who take it.

No, I don't get any of those side effects.
If your body is under stress but you're still in good metabolic health overall, exogenous testosterone use will not lead to excessive increases in estradiol — even when I run high w/o any form of AI use, my serum estradiol (and prolactin, a decent marker of systemic estrogenicity) remains low.

calcium lowers prolactin, does this mean any calcium antagonists like magnesium, phosphorus raise it indirectly
interesting stuff