H-pylori?

Discussion in 'Digestion' started by Lianda, Jan 29, 2013.

  1. Lianda

    Lianda Member

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    I wrote before and good good advice about adding baking soda to the OJ because it was burning my stomach. But I still have "heartburn" and I think I may have an ulcer and/or H-pylori. I've understood from alternative health sources, that burning in the stomach is mostly because of too little stomach acid, but is it the same if you have an ulcer?
    (I'm going to have a blood test and find out if I have h-pylori)

    I have incredible pain when lying on my right side, but not my left. And I've been taking raw honey which seems to sooth my stomach a little. But nothing lasts very long.

    I know if you have H-pylori, that you need to take antibiotics -and most of the allopathic sites say you have to take stomach reducing meds as well. Does anyone know about this? My doctor is strictly allopathic, and I don't want to get worse.

    I appreciate your help so much!
     
  2. Dan Wich

    Dan Wich Member

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    You could experiment with Vitamin C and E supplementation to see if they help (see this article for details from a study).

    However, unlike Vitamin E, I don't recall Peat ever supporting Vitamin C supplementation. Maybe he would encourage food sources instead of supplements for that.
     
  3. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    IIRC, Ray Peat seems to think we get plenty of vitamin C from our foods.
     
  4. Dan Wich

    Dan Wich Member

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    Oh, and there's a post by Charlie in the related topics about coconut oil fighting H. Pylori:
    viewtopic.php?f=10&t=280
     
  5. Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

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    The effect of vitamin D deficiency on eradication rates of Helicobacter and pylori infection

    "In the present study, we have evaluated the possible association between vitamin D levels and H. pylori infection. Our study primarily investigates the relationship between H. pylori eradication rates and low vitamin D levels. In this study, we found the H. pylori eradication rates to be significantly lower in patients with low vitamin D levels. In addition, the number of patients with deficient vitamin D levels was significantly higher in the eradication failure group compared to the successful group. A potential pathogenic mechanism explaining the observed association between vitamin D status and eradication rates is the impairment of the vitamin D signal immune function, which may lead to inadequate immune response. Vitamin D deficiency may be a risk factor associated with H. pylori infection treatment failure and may lead to a need for supplementation of vitamin D before H. pylori eradication therapy.

    "The link between vitamin D deficiency and susceptibility to infection has been suggested for longer than a century, with the early observation that children with nutritional rickets were more likely to experience infections of the respiratory system, leading to the coining of the phrase “rachitic lung”.14 Recently, one of the most interesting reports on vitamin D by Guo et al. 15 has shown that vitamin D demonstrates an antimicrobial effect against H. pylori. Guo et al.15 found that vitamin D plays an important role in gastric mucosa homeostasis and host protection from H. pylori infection."

    "Besides its effect on bone metabolism, vitamin D may reduce inflammatory markers such as CRP, TNF‐α, IL‐6, and IL‐18, and the level of anti‐inflammatory cytokine IL‐10 may increase.16 Vitamin D is also known to regulate the expression of AMPs cathelicidin and β‐defensin, which kill the bacteria. Although the effect of cathelicidin has been demonstrated only in macrophages infected with Mycobacterium tuberculosis, antibacterial action against Gram‐negative and Gram‐positive bacteria has also been reported.17 In a vitamin D‐deficient state, the infected macrophage is unable to produce sufficient 1,25‐(OH)D2 to upregulate the production of cathelicidin and β‐defensin, thus rendering them unable to kill the H. pylori strains. More recently, epidemiological studies have demonstrated strong associations between seasonal variations in vitamin D levels and the incidence of various infectious diseases, including septic shock.18 Emerging evidence suggests that vitamin D might be a good prophylactic and possibly therapeutic antimicrobial agent for the control and eradication of H. pylori."

    "Comparison between eradication success and eradication failure rates of Helicobacter pylori eradication in relation to the vitamin 25(OH)D levels":

    [​IMG]
     
  6. Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

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  7. Kyle Bigman

    Kyle Bigman Member

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    I have a similar problem. I went to the doctor for bad right quadrant pain and got a CT scan, and there was nothing wrong with liver or gallbladder. I assume it is a duodenal ulcer. Recently, I have been taking aspirin, and developed pain in the stomach area as well, so I assume I have some small ulcers, and since I have GERD when stressed, likely have H. Pylori too.

    Currently trying the coconut oil (3 teaspoons per day) diet to get rid of it. Some other good substances to take, besides Vit. C and D as mentioned above, are green tea, ginger, garlic, broccoli, and Manuka honey. For ulcers, glycine is extraordinarily helpful. I take collagen powder – around 10 tablespoons a day if my stomach is hurting. Other good therapies are Ceylon cinnamon. Some have said that if your problem is ulcers then baking soda might help as well, but as I will state below, I believe my issue, and maybe yours too as you said, is most likely low not high stomach acid. Antibiotics are the traditional mainstream therapy. Usually 7-14 days amoxicillin/clarithromycin combo, I believe. Funnily enough, aspirin is h. pylori inhibiting. But for people with h. pylori they can't tolerate aspirin.


    I think the important thing though is figuring out why we are prone to h. pylori. While addressing H. Pylori and ulcers is good, we should also address the underlying reason for h. pylori infection in the first place. It is thought that H. Pylori causes ulcers. If it doesn't, then I believe that at least it is the same condition that leads to both h. pylori and ulcers. Either way, you should try to get rid of the h.pylori and also fix the underlying problem (this is arguably more difficult if the issue is hormonal or something).

    I did a baking soda test this morning (1/4 teaspoon on empty stomach) and did not burp at all within five minutes. So basically this shows I have low stomach acid. Haidut has mentioned elsewhere that low stomach acid is caused by inflammation. I believe that it is highly possible that low-stomach acid can lead to h. pylori infection. I began to get these problems more when I started taking finasteride as well, however, almost like my immune response was weakened to respond to the h. pylori, or some other hormonal change exacerbated the problem, by triggering less production of stomach acid.

    Other note: I posted elsewhere that h. pylori is actually somehow protective in people with GERD in preventing them from getting Barrett's esophagus – or at least, the people who got Barrett's had a syndrome that was different entirely from h. pylori. If any of you have theories on this would be interesting to hear.
     
  8. tankasnowgod

    tankasnowgod Member

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    One thing to look at is all supplemental and free iron in your diet. Not iron found naturally in foods, but iron added by supplementation. A lot of iron added by fortification is basically scrap metal, tiny iron shavings. For any treatment to H. Pylori, a strict supplemental iron avoidance diet would help accelerate any treatment (or may even work on it's own). I just recently found a video by Dr. Thomas Levy, who makes the best distinction with added iron types I've seen so far-



    Of course, when dealing with any sort of viral/bacterial/potential pathogen, it's a good idea to measure body iron levels and aim to get them down to near deficiency levels.
     
  9. Kyle Bigman

    Kyle Bigman Member

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    Interesting. I don't eat many fortified foods. Most of my iron comes from red meat, and since I consume coffee frequently throughout the day – always within a couple hours of meals – I would be surprised to have iron toxicity. Also, I recall having low ferritin in a blood test a few years back which made my doc think I was actually anemic. She put me on iron for a while, but I wasn't really consistent with that and haven't touched an iron pill for years.
     
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