Gut Protocol For Insulin Resistance, Metabolism, And Energy

[Tarmander]

Thanks! I'm going to try it.

One other question, I could not find it on his site in the demo part. After you upload the data from the stool test to his site, you'll get recommendations. When I click on them, I can't seem to get a specific dosage. Is it just experimentation to see how much you need to relieve some symptoms? How do you approach the recommendations. Do you try them each in isolation or do a combination of a couple together ?

thanks again for this great information!

Yeah no dosages, just suggestions. Experiment and see how it goes, take notes. My pleasure

I’ve sort of done this. I did white chocolate in high amounts, and got gut problems.

I was very badly constipated.

I took Mutaflor several months. Resolved the constipation largely.

Then I was taking azithromycin, and doxycycline, and then levoquin.

Now my gut health seems good.

I think taking an antibiotic, then Mutaflor, perhaps something else, etc., may be a sound strategy.

guh how did you get on levoquin?

 

[ecstatichamster]

Yeah no dosages, just suggestions. Experiment and see how it goes, take notes. My pleasure


guh how did you get on levoquin?

pneumonia that was resistant to other antibiotics.

 

[Ledo]

@Tarmander Glad you've been helped by the protocol, good going!

Are you still on it and how will you use it going forward. Playing by ear?

Disrupting biofilms and improving microbial diversity implies improved mucous barrier and brush border performance due to lowered LPS burden. This could improve systemic cell metabolism by lowering insulin resistance leading to the lower steadier blood sugar and efficient use of insulin.

So why did you use herbs? Whats the logic there? Do you think they are helping at the brush border against the bacteria somehow or acting in some demand side way systemically over the body? If the latter that is not very peaty and likely estrogenic no?

Did you do it because that is what work over at the cfs forum? Just wondering if stripping out the herbs would lead to same benefit.

BTW, I believe you said you were weightlifting? Do you think you gained muscle even though you lost overall weight while eating more calories? Nice feat if so. Thanks

 

[Tarmander]

Couple updates on this:

-After finishing the first loop of the protocol, I went back to do another loop through. I got through a couple weeks of Tulsi and then got onto the bifido probiotic. Oddly, I did not notice the effects like I did the first run through. Did not have any herx reaction. I really think the antibiotics are a crucial part of this protocol. It seems they make the herbs and probiotics work better. With this protocol, you are really looking for the herx reaction in the first couple days of something new, and the antibiotics are what make that work.

-Lost another 4 pounds or so in the last month. Just slowly coming off me. I still walk a couple times per day and would say exercise intolerance has slowly creeped back in since stopping this protocol, but still pretty good.

-I did an experiment to raise Akkermansia levels. If you don't know Akkermansia is the king of bacteria that lowers insulin resistance and decreases endotoxin load in the body. Ken Lassesen’s website said there were studies showing polyphenols from cranberries and maybe pomegranates would increase Akkermansia...polyphenols are kind of like their food.

So I took cranberry pills and drank cranberry juice for around a month and a half. I timed it so I started the cranberry right after my last microbiome test so my next test would show if it worked at growing akkermansia.

I personally have low Akkermansia levels of around .001%. Normal levels are .018%, so it is not like I am that far off.

After doing the cranberry for a month and a half, I did a gut test at the end of April and found my Akkermansia levels had risen from .001% to .002%...so not that impressive to be honest. Here is my gut test:

I will say, often bacteria grow in exponential ways. So if I continue on with the cranberry and my next test shows my levels at .004%...well that means it just takes awhile for the little guys to get going. Overall though, don’t expect cranberry to magically cure low levels of Akkermansia.

I am also looking into this probiotic called Pendulum which HAS Akkermansia in it. The only one I have found on the market. It is a little spendy though, so deciding whether it is worth it at the moment.

Overall, with some distance from the protocol. I am glad I did it. I think it really helped my health, my ability to exercise, and my energy levels. During the protocol, there were a lot of reactions, herx, and all that. But now that it has been a couple months, everything has calmed down.

 

[Tarmander]

oh, I used this cranberry if you are interested: amzn.to/3bsD1WV

 

[Bart1]

I've done the stool test as well and I'm very low in almost all bacteria. I've bought some of the probiotics that are recommended. I get very tired and also bloated from it, so I decided to quit after 2 days, I couldn't handle it. Could be a herx reaction from it ? I did not do a antibiotics course recently. Also one of the recommendations is to take inulin, however if I take that again I'm dead tired. Do you just push through it ? It's difficult for me to know what is what

 

[Tarmander]

I did a podcast on this gut protocol and released it today

Along with an overview of the protoc0l, I share some crucial updates in the months since stopping it.

Ep. 64 A New Gut Protocol For Insulin Resistance, Metabolism, And Chronic Fatigue Syndrome - Quax Podcast

 

[Tarmander]

I wanted to throw this in here for anyone who finds this thread in the future:

•The Microbiome matters so much. If you are operating under a sterile understanding of health, you are missing a huge part of the picture and no wonder sometimes substances do the exact opposite of what they should.

Most of Peat substances do not agree with me. They cause the opposite of what they are "supposed" to do.

Here is a "quick suggestion" of items to stop from my last microbiome report

Is it any wonder that Peat's strategies fell flat for me?

Now the interesting question is, if I got B vitamins or some of these other things from IV, and bypassed the gut, would I then react well to them? Turns out usually the answer is yes. IV B vitamins feel much different then oral B vitamins

 

[Tarmander]

I've done the stool test as well and I'm very low in almost all bacteria. I've bought some of the probiotics that are recommended. I get very tired and also bloated from it, so I decided to quit after 2 days, I couldn't handle it. Could be a herx reaction from it ? I did not do a antibiotics course recently. Also one of the recommendations is to take inulin, however if I take that again I'm dead tired. Do you just push through it ? It's difficult for me to know what is what

I didn't see this response. Check out Drill down into Irritable Bowel Syndrome about inulin. It sometimes get a recommendation when it shouldnt.

 

[Bart1]

I wanted to throw this in here for anyone who finds this thread in the future:

•The Microbiome matters so much. If you are operating under a sterile understanding of health, you are missing a huge part of the picture and no wonder sometimes substances do the exact opposite of what they should.

Most of Peat substances do not agree with me. They cause the opposite of what they are "supposed" to do.

Here is a "quick suggestion" of items to stop from my last microbiome report

Is it any wonder that Peat's strategies fell flat for me?

Now the interesting question is, if I got B vitamins or some of these other things from IV, and bypassed the gut, would I then react well to them? Turns out usually the answer is yes. IV B vitamins feel much different then oral B vitamins

View attachment 19107

I couldn’t agree more with you. It does not only fall flat for you, it’s the same for me!

Not eating starch to limit or reduce endotoxin does not do much for me. I think if you can’t handle starch it’s an indication to work on the gut. We can’t have sterile guts, so better to get the environment right and make sure pathogens are not welcomed.

I want to thank you pointing me in this direction. I have some serious issues that came out of the stool test and I’m trying to work on them. Most food items that were suggested to increase are not well tolerated. I’m doing more kill work atm and try later to introduce these things

thanks for the link you sent in your nextt reply, will read it!

 

[Tarmander]

I couldn’t agree more with you. It does not only fall flat for you, it’s the same for me!

Not eating starch to limit or reduce endotoxin does not do much for me. I think if you can’t handle starch it’s an indication to work on the gut. We can’t have sterile guts, so better to get the environment right and make sure pathogens are not welcomed.

I want to thank you pointing me in this direction. I have some serious issues that came out of the stool test and I’m trying to work on them. Most food items that were suggested to increase are not well tolerated. I’m doing more kill work atm and try later to introduce these things

thanks for the link you sent in your nextt reply, will read it!

my pleasure

If I can give any kind of reco it is focus on the things that cause herx for short term periods (1-4 days) but feel better the longer you do them.

For me, it took multiple microbiome tests to start getting an idea of what was going on and the direction to take...and I still do not quite understand in a way that is satisfying. But some of the changes are the best changes that have occured in years.

People ask me if they should try a microbiome test and I usually say, "try one? No, but 3-4 after some experimentation will maybe start giving you some ideas."

 

[SQu]

Focusing on shifting the microbiome seems to give permanent results. Ray Peat is right about keeping gut bacteria down...but it's not just an important aspect...it may be the most crucial part of his writings

I agree, have chosen to tackle most things at gut level because it's where it all begins. Currently take doxy 50mg with charcoal and coconut oil about twice a week, more if I feel I'm fighting off an infection or coming down with something. That and methylene blue 1mg daily in a gargle are doing wonders, but I am interested in looking closer at this protocol with adjustments for what is easiest to find, as I too have a CFS background. Thanks for all this info and feedback, glad you are making good progress.

 

[Tarmander]

I just did an interview with Dr. Jason Hawrelak that I think is very important to listen to.

I do not normally push my episodes, but this really explains some things about the microbiome and adds nuance to Peat's approach with antibiotics and endotoxin that are important.

Ep. 72 Interview Dr. Jason Hawrelak: The Last Microbiome Episode You Will Ever Need - Quax Podcast

 

[YourUniverse]

@Tarmander , I listened to your interview with Dr. Hawrelak. It was a good one, thanks. His approach seems to be more food based, lots of prebiotics, inulin FOS. I'm a total microbiome noob and have almost no idea what a lot of the things you discussed were.

From my notes it seems cranberry/pomegranate/garlic/chitosan/reutereii(?), burdock root, and inulin FOS in general are good. If someone like me wants to fix their microbiome, what would be the most bang-for-my-buck things? I eat no vegetables, and very little fruit other than OJ. Typical meat, milk, eggs, butter, rice, OJ, also apples, carrots, pineapple once in a while... Peaty, sorta. Should I include a fruit of every colour to start?

Of note, he talked about extinctions. In my life I've done all sorts of willpower-fueled diets, like keto and fasting and veganism. If I had some extinctions, is a probiotic supplement the way to reintroduce them? Can you recommend one?

 

[Tarmander]

@Tarmander , I listened to your interview with Dr. Hawrelak. It was a good one, thanks. His approach seems to be more food based, lots of prebiotics, inulin FOS. I'm a total microbiome noob and have almost no idea what a lot of the things you discussed were.

From my notes it seems cranberry/pomegranate/garlic/chitosan/reutereii(?), burdock root, and inulin FOS in general are good. If someone like me wants to fix their microbiome, what would be the most bang-for-my-buck things? I eat no vegetables, and very little fruit other than OJ. Typical meat, milk, eggs, butter, rice, OJ, also apples, carrots, pineapple once in a while... Peaty, sorta. Should I include a fruit of every colour to start?

Of note, he talked about extinctions. In my life I've done all sorts of willpower-fueled diets, like keto and fasting and veganism. If I had some extinctions, is a probiotic supplement the way to reintroduce them? Can you recommend one?

So I hate to suggest spending money, but if you can afford the tests, it may be worth biting the bullet and buying a thrive microbiome test for 80$ or so. At least one, and if you can swing it, doing 3 of them over a 6-8 month period would be very useful

I say that because its worth knowing what you are dealing with in your gut. Those things you listed may be beneficial, or they may literally do the opposite of what you want. If you have no idea of direction, you end up just throwing supplements up against the wall and wasting your money that way. I tried Burdock for a couple days 2 weeks ago thinking it might be good and it wrecked my blood sugars for 3 days. So even recommendations that look solid can have no effect, or even negative.

I have been studying the microbiome this whole year and its definitely a Pandora's box, but it solves some issues, like sleep for me, better then any other modality.

Ken Lassesen also has a good interview on Quax that will give you direction on what to do with a test if you choose to go that way.

His website will narrow down the recommendations on probiotics, herbs, etc that may be beneficial for you.

Basically what I did was try those recommendations(some work some don't), and stick with the ones that make you feel bad for a couple days and then better after that. If you think you have a really sticky issue like CFS, you can go the antibiotic route like I did. Retest in 2 months, get new recommendations, rinse and repeat. I have solved sleep issues, restless leg, exercise intolerance, and a bunch of other small things this way. At the beginning of this year, I literally had trouble walking more then 20 minutes and now walk 1.5 hours per day and work out too. So it can be very powerful.

 

[Tarmander]

Wanted to drop this here if anyone is still curious

Inulin FOS raises Akkermansia way way better then Cranberry and Pomegranate

That steep incline at the end was cran/Pom with Inulin FOS added in. I did not stop the cran/pom

 

[YourUniverse]

Wanted to drop this here if anyone is still curious

Inulin FOS raises Akkermansia way way better then Cranberry and Pomegranate

That steep incline at the end was cran/Pom with Inulin FOS added in. I did not stop the cran/pom

View attachment 20690

Whats your inulin source? This link (High Inulin Foods and Inulin Health Benefits) shows stevia as being quite high, and chicory is fun to eat

 

[Tarmander]

Whats your inulin source? This link (High Inulin Foods and Inulin Health Benefits) shows stevia as being quite high, and chicory is fun to eat

I used Jarrow's at 2 scoops per day:

Amazon product ASIN B001BAA15C

 

[YourUniverse]

@Tarmander have you noticed any changes in gas since or during this prebiotic protocol?

 

[Perry Staltic]

Have you tried bacillus coagulens? Supposedly helps with blood sugar and insulin.

2) Blood Sugar & Insulin​

B. coagulans containing a synbiotic decreased blood insulin levels; HOMA-IR and HOMA-B in pregnant women [19].

Consumption of synbiotic bread with B. coagulans reduced insulin levels, improved blood lipid profile and increased good cholesterol (HDL-C) in type 2 diabetes (T2D) patients [20, 21, 22].

Similarly, consumption of the synbiotic bread with B. coagulans improved NO and MDA levels in T2D patients [23].

Synbiotic containing B. coagulans improved insulin, hs-CRP, uric acid and plasma total GSH levels in diabetic patients [24].

B. coagulans, inulin and beta-carotene coadministration decreased insulin, HOMA-IR, HOMA-B, triglycerides, VLDL-cholesterol levels, and total-/HDL-cholesterol ratio. This treatment also elevated plasma nitric oxide (NO) and glutathione (GSH) [25].

9 Promising Health Benefits of Bacillus coagulans - SelfHacked

B. coagulans is being researched for cholesterol, IBS, arthritis, and muscle recovery. Read on to learn about this promising probiotic.

selfhacked.com