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Gut Dysbiosis May Cause Autism Through Cortisol And Serotonin

haidut

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Mar 18, 2013
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USA / Europe
The bad news about cortisol and serotonin just keep on coming. Aside from causing liver cancer and tinnitus, now these two chemicals have also been implicated in autism. Well, the link between serotonin and autism is not new and I posted a few studies in the past showing that serotonin antagonists may treat the condition. However, the link between gut microbiome imbalance and its effects on cortisol is not something that has been discussed before (to my knowledge). This study also points out that for people struggling with high cortisol the issue may simply be overpopulation of their gut with pathogenic bacteria. Now I know why in human studies ingesting activated charcoal lowered serum cortisol - i.e. charcoal has a known antibacterial and anti-endotoxin effect, both of which affect cortisol/serotonin.

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/19490976.2017.1353849?scroll=top&needAccess=true&
Researchers study piglets to help connect gut microbes to brain

"...Gut microbes have been in the news a lot lately. Recent studies show they can influence human health, behavior and certain neurological disorders, such as autism. But just how do they communicate with the brain? Results from a new University of Illinois study using 1-month-old piglets suggest a pathway of communication between certain gut bacteria and brain metabolites, by way of a compound in the blood known as cortisol. Unexpectedly, the finding provides a potential mechanism to explain the characteristics of autism."

"...The researchers found predictive relationships between the fecal microbiota and serotonin and cortisol, two compounds in the blood known to be influenced by gut microbiota. Specifically, Bacteroides was associated with higher serotonin levels, while Ruminococcus predicted lower concentrations of both serotonin and cortisol. Clostridium and Butyricimonas were not associated strongly with either compound."

"...Again, Mudd says, the results supported previous findings related to ASD. “Alterations in serum serotonin and cortisol, as well as fecal Bacteroides and Ruminococcus levels, have been described in ASD individuals.”"
 

Dobbler

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Jun 19, 2016
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650
I suffer from constant bloating and fullness all the time and defenitely have problems with stress/anxiety etc. I think (and hope) im making slow progress with Ray Peat inspired SCD/GAPS diet (no lactose / sucrose but cheese is allowed). Do you think that eating very easily digested diet with high SAFA / low PUFA ratio can fix these problems over time? Only antibiotic im using is raw carrots and CO. Im also eating 60g of gelatin daily.
 

Waynish

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Oct 11, 2016
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There really doesn't seem to be a consistent & universal protocol yet. There are obviously some factors everyone is ignoring. The general idea seems to be 1) reduce bacteria / sibo / dysbiosis 2) keep dysbiosis at bay 3) increase metabolism and/or repopulate with correct flora.

Many people follow this and seem to need to go back to step #1 often, but why? Most on this forum usually point to failure of #2 or #3. Due to the difficultly of achieving #3 completely after one has been compromised for a lifetime, then we should recommend the safest long-term methods for achieving #1. In terms of things that are powerful enough & safe enough - it seems like cyproheptadine is most renowned on these forums, but I don't see the expected amount of raving cypro reviews...
 

dand

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Jul 3, 2014
Messages
249
There really doesn't seem to be a consistent & universal protocol yet. There are obviously some factors everyone is ignoring. The general idea seems to be 1) reduce bacteria / sibo / dysbiosis 2) keep dysbiosis at bay 3) increase metabolism and/or repopulate with correct flora.

Many people follow this and seem to need to go back to step #1 often, but why? Most on this forum usually point to failure of #2 or #3. Due to the difficultly of achieving #3 completely after one has been compromised for a lifetime, then we should recommend the safest long-term methods for achieving #1. In terms of things that are powerful enough & safe enough - it seems like cyproheptadine is most renowned on these forums, but I don't see the expected amount of raving cypro reviews...

I find cyproheptadine to be an absolutely incredible drug. Have you never tried it? Experimentation/experience is the best way to know if it makes sense for you as context is everything. Anecdotally, I have turned a ton of my friends onto it and they absolutely love it. The clinical data, having nothing to do with this forum, also happens to be overwhelmingly positive.
 

passivity

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Nov 22, 2016
Messages
123
I find cyproheptadine to be an absolutely incredible drug. Have you never tried it? Experimentation/experience is the best way to know if it makes sense for you as context is everything. Anecdotally, I have turned a ton of my friends onto it and they absolutely love it. The clinical data, having nothing to do with this forum, also happens to be overwhelmingly positive.
What dose do you use?
 

docall18

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Dec 11, 2013
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LA
I agree most find cypro good only short term before weight gain and sluggishness develop.

I believe serotonin & cortisol go high for an important reason ie. remove endotoxin quickly from gut and suppress gut inflammation.

Therefore just reducing serotonin or cortisol without addressing the root issue, results in higher endotoxin levels and damage to the gut.
 

haidut

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Mar 18, 2013
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I agree most find cypro good only short term before weight gain and sluggishness develop.

I believe serotonin & cortisol go high for an important reason ie. remove endotoxin quickly from gut and suppress gut inflammation.

Therefore just reducing serotonin or cortisol without addressing the root issue, results in higher endotoxin levels and damage to the gut.

True, that is why Peat does not recommend cypro as primary treatment but instead says carrot salad and charcoal should be tried first and also avoiding resistant starches that feed the bacteria.
 

Lee Simeon

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Mar 3, 2017
Messages
439
True, that is why Peat does not recommend cypro as primary treatment but instead says carrot salad and charcoal should be tried first and also avoiding resistant starches that feed the bacteria.
Why would cypro cause weight gain though? I thought and increase in metabolism and a decrease in serotonin and gut bacteria would cause weight loss?
 

haidut

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Why would cypro cause weight gain though? I thought and increase in metabolism and a decrease in serotonin and gut bacteria would cause weight loss?

The official explanation is through antagonism on 5-HT2C and H1 but I gaining weight is not necessarily a bad thing as long as it is not fat. It is given to people with cachexia for that reason and they do not gain fat on it.
 

Sam321

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Jan 27, 2021
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586
Never felt autistic ever.
Messed up my gut with penecillin and felt auty af.
 

sugarbabe

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Sep 13, 2012
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Never felt autistic ever.
Messed up my gut with penecillin and felt auty af.
Thanks for this, antibiotics could be one reason for the huge increase in autism. I took them a lot as a kid and then had to be on bactrim (which is a folate synthesis inhibitor) for an entire month for a breast abscess after I had my son and so he was getting a small amount in my breast milk. He is on the spectrum and I also have had major issues with anxiety
 

Sam321

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Joined
Jan 27, 2021
Messages
586
Thanks for this, antibiotics could be one reason for the huge increase in autism. I took them a lot as a kid and then had to be on bactrim (which is a folate synthesis inhibitor) for an entire month for a breast abscess after I had my son and so he was getting a small amount in my breast milk. He is on the spectrum and I also have had major issues with anxiety
Could be for sure.
I'm gonna venture to say that post-industrial digital hell world and stressed parenting causes autism.
 
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