Low Toxin Diet Grant Genereux's Theory Of Vitamin A Toxicity

[Kram]

I think Grant is right in that initial response can be really positive and that subsequent detox cycles can be more toxic. It cam be very confusing and concerning. I thought this might have been resolved by adding back pure VA. Maybe it is essential after all.

IT WAS NOT.

I agree. I had a lot of improvements during my first two weeks on low A and then everything got way worse from weeks 3-8 (intense depression, anxiety, vertigo / blurry vision, memory problems, fatigue). I am now on week 10 and believe things are moving in the right direction. Not much changes in my life on a day to day basis these days so I'm just guessing all these symptoms that come and come go are related to the detox (at least that's my hope). I'm pretty sure I was extremely toxic, as it felt like something was eating my body alive the past few years (at least..) from the inside out.

Below is a picture of my hand from last year. Not even sure if it was eczema but my skin was literally burning off.

 

[Pet Peeve]

Holy moly! Before and after 20 years on the carnivore diet, she's 45!

Joe Andersen on Twitter

Edit: btw, have any of you considered bile supplementation to get va out of liver? I take bile and if I take too much I get bile diarrhea. Maybe bile with a nice bottle of wine?

 

[Louise]

Holy moly! Before and after 20 years on the carnivore diet, she's 45!

Joe Andersen on Twitter

Edit: btw, have any of you considered bile supplementation to get va out of liver? I take bile and if I take too much I get bile diarrhea. Maybe bile with a nice bottle of wine?

She wasn't unattractive before.

 

[Pet Peeve]

She wasn't unattractive before.

I disagree, zoom in on the face, it's a massive change. She's eaten only beef steak for 20 years, she couldn't even handle minced meat, let alone liver. She stopped working out pretty soon because she was getting too muscular.

 

[Louise]

I disagree, zoom in on the face, it's a massive change. She's eaten only beef steak for 20 years, she couldn't even handle minced meat, let alone liver. She stopped working out pretty soon because she was getting too muscular.

That doesn't mean she was ugly or unattractive before. I've been aware of her journey and am impressed with all the changes in her health. I guess I am sick of the emphasis society puts on women's looks. There are very attractive women out there that have disease in them. How attractive you are doesn't always equal how healthy you are.

 

[Pet Peeve]

How attractive you are doesn't always equal how healthy you are.

I don't want to hurt anyones feelings but I think health is the very definition of attractiveness. The point of attractiveness is to make you procreate, the more healthy and fertile the other person is the more you want to "grab the chance" to get healthy offspring, it's a strong and basic urge. The only other explanation for attraction that's caught my attention is Jung's, but that's more esoteric. Women get a lot of attention put on their looks "aka. health", this is because it's the woman who carries the baby so she needs to be as healthy as possible. The man on the other hand doesn't carry the baby, so he doesn't need to be that physically healthy to be attractive, he does however need to be mentally healthy, aka ambitious, content and self assured - which signals success - because those are the qualities the woman wants her offspring to have. You could say women are pressured on their looks, but men are pressured on their success/performance. Women have to deal with bikini models on magazines and advertisements, men have to deal with men getting killed in movies as entertainment. I don't think the before picture shows an attractive 25 year old, more like average 35 year old. In the after picture she could pass as a healthy 22 year old.

Edit: +1 to Peat (pufa depletion, no fiber), -1 to Peat (vitamin A depletion, no calcium intake, no sugar)

 

[Louise]

I don't want to hurt anyones feelings but I think health is the very definition of attractiveness. The point of attractiveness is to make you procreate, the more healthy and fertile the other person is the more you want to "grab the chance" to get healthy offspring, it's a strong and basic urge. The only other explanation for attraction that's caught my attention is Jung's, but that's more esoteric. Women get a lot of attention put on their looks "aka. health", this is because it's the woman who carries the baby so she needs to be as healthy as possible. The man on the other hand doesn't carry the baby, so he doesn't need to be that physically healthy to be attractive, he does however need to be mentally healthy, aka ambitious, content and self assured - which signals success - because those are the qualities the woman wants her offspring to have. You could say women are pressured on their looks, but men are pressured on their success/performance. Women have to deal with bikini models on magazines and advertisements, men have to deal with men getting killed in movies as entertainment. I don't think the before picture shows an attractive 25 year old, more like average 35 year old. In the after picture she could pass as a healthy 22 year old.

As I said there are many attractive women with disease so your argument is full of holes. Yes, men have pressure but the pressure on women to do unhealthy things is greater and more damaging in my opinion. I don't reduce men to their "success" and I resent men reducing women to how attractive the man thinks they are.

 

[Louise]

I had a friend who was considered very beautiful and fit. She died in her thirties after a diagnosis of cancer.

 

[Pet Peeve]

I had a friend who was considered very beautiful and fit. She died in her thirties after a diagnosis of cancer.

Ok, I've met a very, very attractive girl who was 19 who had cancer and crippling reumatoid arthritis, at work. She cried and said she wanted to die. Cancer is the result of an underactive immune system, so then you'd have very litte inflammation, at least of the autoimmune kind. You can't really see cancer until its too late. Allergies is the opposite, no cancer because your immune system is too engaged.

I feel like ***t, when I look in the mirror I see a pile of ***t, not like 5 years ago when I liked what I saw in the mirror. The before and after I posted made me so happy, because it gave me hope that extreme change for the better is possible, I have never seen anything close to this.

 

[InChristAlone]

It's crazy that family has only eaten steak for that long. That takes true dedication. I'm sure they have slipped up on occasion. And if she had two kids and breastfed them both, doesn't that prove vitamin A deficiency doesn't exist?

 

[tankasnowgod]

As I said there are many attractive women with disease so your argument is full of holes. Yes, men have pressure but the pressure on women to do unhealthy things is greater and more damaging in my opinion. I don't reduce men to their "success" and I resent men reducing women to how attractive the man thinks they are.

Attractiveness certainly isn't the be all end all, but a lot of traditional standards of beauty also correlated with good health. A tan for example would tend to indicate a healthy amount of sun exposure and vitamin D levels. Of course, there are all sorts of tricks that can be used nowadays to "game" that system, from plastic surgery, makeup, photo shop, fake tanner, and what have you.

 

[Tarmander]

Holy moly! Before and after 20 years on the carnivore diet, she's 45!

Joe Andersen on Twitter

Edit: btw, have any of you considered bile supplementation to get va out of liver? I take bile and if I take too much I get bile diarrhea. Maybe bile with a nice bottle of wine?

I think she is lying. Probably a bunch of plastic surgery as well. Believing people's stories like this one will make you confused.

She looks good but it is not smart to do an extreme diet like carnivore because of one person. Go listen to Danny's talk with Kyle about it he just put out.

The only reason Grant is different is all of the success stories from people copying him. Otherwise he would be just another hack like these people and their BS 20 year carnivore diet.

 

[Pet Peeve]

I don't reduce men to their "success" and I resent men reducing women to how attractive the man thinks they are.

Sure, I don't think a woman I find utterly sexually unattractive couldn't be the best judge, professor, or even president of the USA. A woman's worth in society doesn't correlate to my sexual attraction to her. There are many women I admire as much as the most admirable men I know, but that doesn't mean I have any sexual feelings for them. Its a completely separate issue. However, there are MORE admirable men, precisely because men have to rely on developing their personality to become attractive to women. Women CAN develop and mature their personalities, maybe even more than men are capable of, but they don't because they're used to being courted by men.

 

[InChristAlone]

I think she is lying. Probably a bunch of plastic surgery as well. Believing people's stories like this one will make you confused.

She looks good but it is not smart to do an extreme diet like carnivore because of one person. Go listen to Danny's talk with Kyle about it he just put out.

The only reason Grant is different is all of the success stories from people copying him. Otherwise he would be just another hack like these people and their BS 20 year carnivore diet.

I agree on not copying an extreme diet. From the sound of her health problems it seems as though vitamin A may have been the poison.

"My list of health conditions grew: eczema all over my hands (to the point of second degree burns), tinnitus, worsening depression, worsening fatigue (fell asleep at work all the time, at meetings, at church, and driving a car), lower back/pelvic and sciatic nerve pain (couldn’t sit at all, worked standing up, constant pain with occasional howling-pain spasms; MRI revealed degenerative disc disease in 3 areas), systemic edema, blurry vision (eyeglasses were worn beginning in high school, worsening every year), paralyzation at times in hands and feet working its way into my torso (Joe had to be called to carry me out of work several times), allergies/sensitivities to all things (food, pollens, chemicals), continued amenhorrea, weight gain (at my heaviest 50 pounds overweight), inability to concentrate (couldn’t understand a sentence spoken to me in time to hear the next in a conversation), diagnosed with cervical dysplasia (treated with cryotherapy), migraines, heart pains, indigestion/reflux, bingeing (and at the end, vomiting – luckily only a few times), muscle twitching (over 100 twitches in 1-minute’s time), lumps in my breasts I was too afraid to have checked out, and one of the last but most difficult for everyone around me was my irritation and rage (a complete reversal of my laid back and sweet nature everyone knew me to have growing up)."

She also had cystic acne.

"I also started unmasking the low carb foods (vegetation especially), which would send me into terrible fatigue spells."

"As SOON as I switched to animal fat as my fat source instead of “healthy” oils, I ovulated and had a period two weeks later. I couldn’t believe it!!!"

"We experimented with pork only to find that it activated symptoms. Ground meats, no matter what type also did."

"I grew up loving organ meats, but as I started unmasking foods (especially when I gave up all vegetation), I noticed inflammation with organ meats. My body didn’t tolerate them well. So, I listened as I did with everything else. I know organs have mega doses of nutrients, but ribeye has just what I need in the perfect amounts."

"Sunshine and getting outside helped a lot through the “die off” period. "

"Growing up and in my early 20s I ate a “healthy diet” of low fat, lean meats, LOTS of veggies, whole fruit, legumes, nuts/seeds, low-fat yogurt, and whole grains."

"1) Cheeses and eggs – both produced massive migraine headaches that lasted, along with other symptoms like digestive issues, eczema flare-ups, and fatigue to name a few."

"For the first year or so going all meat, Joe and I ate nothing but grass fed/finished. Eventually, we developed nutritional deficiency symptoms. We made the switch to grass fed/grain finished (grain finished for the last 2-3 weeks of their life). Immediately we felt better and have never gone back to grass finished beef."

"It took some time, but over a year of grass fed/finished, Joe and I developed tendencies toward bleeding (gums or quick to bleed when scraped), previous injuries-sores/bruises Joe had started reappearing, both of us were easily bruised, and a few conditions that had reversed initially for me started to come back gradually (poor sleep and restless leg mainly, so not my most critical symptoms, but conditions not to be unnoticed). We did notice a shift toward being more irritated and more fatigued (not as mentally sharp or physically strong). These last two issues are markers I always look for whenever we are testing something."

Charlene Andersen - Meat Heals
ETA there are stories on her blog about carnivore and a lot of the symptoms all seem to have something in common!

 

[Pet Peeve]

if she had two kids and breastfed them both, doesn't that prove vitamin A deficiency doesn't exist?

Unless she was lying in any way, definitely yes...

 

[postman]

I think she is lying. Probably a bunch of plastic surgery as well. Believing people's stories like this one will make you confused.

She looks good but it is not smart to do an extreme diet like carnivore because of one person. Go listen to Danny's talk with Kyle about it he just put out.

The only reason Grant is different is all of the success stories from people copying him. Otherwise he would be just another hack like these people and their BS 20 year carnivore diet.

 

[Pet Peeve]

I think she is lying. Probably a bunch of plastic surgery as well. Believing people's stories like this one will make you confused.

I don't think she's lying right now, but the results are so amazing that I'm keeping the possibility open.

 

[Tarmander]

I agree on not copying an extreme diet. From the sound of her health problems it seems as though vitamin A may have been the poison.

"My list of health conditions grew: eczema all over my hands (to the point of second degree burns), tinnitus, worsening depression, worsening fatigue (fell asleep at work all the time, at meetings, at church, and driving a car), lower back/pelvic and sciatic nerve pain (couldn’t sit at all, worked standing up, constant pain with occasional howling-pain spasms; MRI revealed degenerative disc disease in 3 areas), systemic edema, blurry vision (eyeglasses were worn beginning in high school, worsening every year), paralyzation at times in hands and feet working its way into my torso (Joe had to be called to carry me out of work several times), allergies/sensitivities to all things (food, pollens, chemicals), continued amenhorrea, weight gain (at my heaviest 50 pounds overweight), inability to concentrate (couldn’t understand a sentence spoken to me in time to hear the next in a conversation), diagnosed with cervical dysplasia (treated with cryotherapy), migraines, heart pains, indigestion/reflux, bingeing (and at the end, vomiting – luckily only a few times), muscle twitching (over 100 twitches in 1-minute’s time), lumps in my breasts I was too afraid to have checked out, and one of the last but most difficult for everyone around me was my irritation and rage (a complete reversal of my laid back and sweet nature everyone knew me to have growing up)."

She also had cystic acne.

"I also started unmasking the low carb foods (vegetation especially), which would send me into terrible fatigue spells."

"As SOON as I switched to animal fat as my fat source instead of “healthy” oils, I ovulated and had a period two weeks later. I couldn’t believe it!!!"

"We experimented with pork only to find that it activated symptoms. Ground meats, no matter what type also did."

"I grew up loving organ meats, but as I started unmasking foods (especially when I gave up all vegetation), I noticed inflammation with organ meats. My body didn’t tolerate them well. So, I listened as I did with everything else. I know organs have mega doses of nutrients, but ribeye has just what I need in the perfect amounts."

"Sunshine and getting outside helped a lot through the “die off” period. "

"Growing up and in my early 20s I ate a “healthy diet” of low fat, lean meats, LOTS of veggies, whole fruit, legumes, nuts/seeds, low-fat yogurt, and whole grains."

"1) Cheeses and eggs – both produced massive migraine headaches that lasted, along with other symptoms like digestive issues, eczema flare-ups, and fatigue to name a few."

"For the first year or so going all meat, Joe and I ate nothing but grass fed/finished. Eventually, we developed nutritional deficiency symptoms. We made the switch to grass fed/grain finished (grain finished for the last 2-3 weeks of their life). Immediately we felt better and have never gone back to grass finished beef."

"It took some time, but over a year of grass fed/finished, Joe and I developed tendencies toward bleeding (gums or quick to bleed when scraped), previous injuries-sores/bruises Joe had started reappearing, both of us were easily bruised, and a few conditions that had reversed initially for me started to come back gradually (poor sleep and restless leg mainly, so not my most critical symptoms, but conditions not to be unnoticed). We did notice a shift toward being more irritated and more fatigued (not as mentally sharp or physically strong). These last two issues are markers I always look for whenever we are testing something."

Charlene Andersen - Meat Heals
ETA there are stories on her blog about carnivore and a lot of the symptoms all seem to have something in common!

I have read her story before, it is great.

I don't think she's lying right now, but the results are so amazing that I'm keeping the possibility open.

People lie all the time online, and it is naive to believe her. Maybe she isn't lying, and if not I would apolagize, but for your own peace of mind you shouldn't believe her.

 

[Spokey]

Neither believe nor disbelieve. Then it's harder to become dogmatic either way.

 

[Tarmander]

Neither believe nor disbelieve. Then it's harder to become dogmatic either way.

disbelieve is not a state, but a lack of state. There is only state and lack of state. If you do not believe, you disbelieve. You cannot do both at the same time.