gonna consider thyroxine soon, advice required

Discussion in 'Supplements, Pharmaceutical Drugs' started by yoshiesque, Feb 21, 2015.

  1. yoshiesque

    yoshiesque Member

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    hey all,

    a long time ago when i was feeling better i had high T4, decent T3 and TSh lingering between 1 and 1.4.

    Now my TSH is around 2.3, T4 is at lower end of normal and i dont know about T3.

    my doc is afraid to try T3, also because its not easily available in Australia. So we are gonna start with T4. TO my understanding, T4 could also raise T3, thats if you dont have any issues converting T4 to T3. So could you guys please tell me what the pros/cons are of taking Thyroxine, coz i know RP has said that its not the same thing or something along those lines.

    thanks!
     
  2. HDD

    HDD Member

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    You could try it and see if it makes you feel better. The liver's ability to convert t4 to t3 is important.

    "And the liver happens to also be the source, as Broda Barnes discovered, of the most active thyroid. He said it's about two thirds of the thyroid used by the body is produced in the liver. And if your liver isn't getting enough sugar, enough glucose, or if it doesn't have enough selenium, it is unable to convert thyroxin into T3. If you can completely knockout the liver, and your thyroid will excrete about this ratio of 3 parts of thyroxin to 1 part of T3, and so as long as your thyroid is working, your liver will be getting a little bit of T3 and will be able to keep functioning, other things being equal. But if you are under stress for example, don't have anything to eat for about 24 hours, or are exerting too much energy in proportion to what you are eating, your liver isn't getting enough glucose to convert the 3 parts of thyroxin produced in your gland into the active T3, and so you will have this drastic decrease in production of the active triiodothyronine (T3), most of which comes from the liver when it's well fed with sugar. If the doctor prescribes only T4, it will work fine in anyone who doesn't need it (such as 25 year old healthy men). But women, because of their higher estrogen level, have many times the incidence of thyroid problems and liver problems than men do. And it's because of the centrality of the liver to the activation of thyroid hormone, and the liver's essentiality for eliminating estrogen, that a little problem with either thyroid or estrogen means that your liver will allow estrogen to increase in the body as it decreases its production of active thyroid hormone. And that in turn slows the liver even more so it has a vicious circle."

    (from East West Healing interview transcript, "The Thyroid")
     
  3. OP
    yoshiesque

    yoshiesque Member

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    Ah yes i get all that but RP also said the following:

    "Most hypothyroid people can successfully use a supplement that contains four parts of thyroxine for each part of T3, but some people need a larger proportion of T3 for best functioning."
    (from http://www.thyroid-info.com/articles/ray-peat.htm)

    So i want to experiment with thyroxine since T4 is low too. I will experiment for a bit and see if T4 AND T3 increases. if only T4 increases, then I guess i need to consider T3 as well.

    But my question is, any drawbacks or issues with taking thyroxine?
     
  4. HDD

    HDD Member

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    The conclusions will be false, as they are when T4 is measured, and T3 ignored. Thyroid-dependent processes will appear to be independent of the level of thyroid hormone; hypothyroidism could be caller hyperthyroidism.


    The serum's high ratio of T4 to T3 is a pitifully poor argument to justify the use of thyroxine instead of a product that resembles the proportion of these substances secreted by a healthy thyroid gland, or maintained inside cells. About 30 years ago, when many people still thought of thyroxine as "the thryoid hormone," someone was making the argument that "the thyroid hormone" must work exclusively as an activator of genes, since most of the organ slices he tested didn't increase their oxygen consumption when it was added. In fact, the addition of thyroxine to brain slices suppressed their respiration by 6% during the experiment. Since most T3 is produced from T4 in the liver, not in the brain, I think that experiment had great significance, despite the ignorant interpretation of the author. An excess of thyroxine, in a tissue that doesn't convert it rapidly to T3, has an antithyroid action. (See Goumaz, et al, 1987.) This happens in many women who are given thyroxine; as their dose is increased, their symptoms get worse.

    T4 acts by being changed to T3, so it tends to accumulate in the body, and on a given dose, usually reaches a steady concentration after about two weeks.
    http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/thyroid.shtm

    T4 alone can be anti thyroid.
     
  5. tara

    tara Member

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    Based on reading, including HDD's posts above, not from personal experience, I'd be thinking to start with a very small dose, and only increment after 2-4 weeks if you get a noticable improvement but not yet up to optimal temperature. If things get worse, stop. If you can get a whole thyroid supp, that would probably be better. Looks like there might be one or more compounding pharmacies in oz that supply thyroid extract containing both T4 and T3, though probably with dodgy fillers.
     
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