babadook

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How confident can we be that the latest formulation doesn't have any estrogen promoting effects? Looking at some of the comments RP has made about flavonoids in the past, there is quite a bit of ambiguity in his own position. I heard him make a comment in an Herb Doctors episode that these chemicals may either promote or diminish estrogen based on how close the benzene ring is to the keto oxygen group? The closer it is, the more likely it is to promote estrogen. I found that remark interesting, however, I admit that I had some difficulty understanding just how to determine proximity when looking at, say, 7,8-benzoflavone vs an isoflavone. I'm also curious to know how he came to that conclusion. Is there something about the positioning (say a structural similarity to another chemical) that would make RP think that? Or maybe it's just from a careful reading of the available literature.

I've been taking ~4 drops per day (orally) and noticed the following effects:

1. Pro-libido effects that reminded me a lot of the effects I get from bromocriptine and possibly aspirin at higher doses. Much better blood flow and sex drive.

2. Ability to focus on something for a longer period of time and with a euphoric, childlike interest.

3. A very slight headache two days in a row that was gone by the third. Not confident that it's related to gonadin administration, but worth mentioning.

4. Also noticed some incoherent thinking / talking. I went out to dinner with some friends and my thoughts just weren't flowing as naturally as usual and I was having trouble constructing sentences. Again, this is a very subjective observation and probably unrelated, but worth mentioning.

5. Skin felt more hydrated, complexion looked better.

These are all pretty random observations and other factors could be involved, but together (and with the combined observations of others on this forum), they may help paint a better picture of the effect that these substances have. The pro-libido effects I've been getting are strong and clear enough to make me think this substance is pushing the hormones in the right, general direction.

Some questions for @haidut and others:

1. How did you determine the dosage per serving? Do we have any sense of how this compares to drinking a few glasses of orange juice per day? Or eating marmalade?
2. When you say that the flavanone in this product is the unsubstituted flavanone, what does that mean? I was thinking flavanone was a group of chemicals, naringenin, for example, being a type of flavanone. Is the unsubstituted flavanone something found in nature? Or a "synthetic" that is modified to have no substituents at any position? Any more details on this specific chemical in your product? And why was this chosen over, say, naringenin?
 

Wagner83

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Oct 15, 2016
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So after using this product more, I can confirm gonadin had nothing to do with stress reactions/digestive issues. I think this is a potent "adaptogen", but need to experiment more to confirm. Helps with stress levels and feeling good, more grounded and masculine (perhaps too chilled in the morning). I don't know what to pick between oral and topical route (haven't tried navel much). My one complaint so far : two servings of this product per day feel nice, but then it's crazy expensive.
@haidut, is it possible to have the possibility to buy a 30ml bottle with a reduction on the price per ml ? Is there one of these ingredients which is a lot more expensive than the others ? If so, have you considered selling a "gonadin-" wihtout it, at a cheaper price (if it still works as intended) ?
 

swarrior

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Jun 22, 2017
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If anyone can read through my thread to comment on my results of using pansterone, gonadin, energin and kuione
The results were somewhat confusing (hormone lab tests).


thanks!!
 

A.R

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Because DHEA can bind to the estrogen receptors in the growth plates with way more affinity than estrogen itself, shutting it like estrogen would, and quickly as well. The only time it doesn't happen is if you use a SERD like Faslodex, SERDs basically degrade estrogen receptors, preventing anything from binding to it. hence it's being used to treat breast cancer and in some cases prostate cancer. Using the strongest AI wouldn't help either, since DHEA can bind to ERs, inhibiting estrogen synthesis will not be able to nullify the effect

The reason Ray Peat grew taller on DHEA is because he's older and hence DHEA increased his androgens significantly, which contributed to better overall posture and better cartilage health and spinal disk hydration, he never actually grew longer bones, that's impossible at his age. In a young guy, you won't see much height growth from DHEA, and if not used with SERD, might even close your window of growth.

And before someone here misrepresents my points, this is no way trying to discredit Ray Peat, I'm just sharing my opinion
How did you get on with restarting your hormone production? Also, if you don’t mind me asking, what is your age?
So after using this product more, I can confirm gonadin had nothing to do with stress reactions/digestive issues. I think this is a potent "adaptogen", but need to experiment more to confirm. Helps with stress levels and feeling good, more grounded and masculine (perhaps too chilled in the morning). I don't know what to pick between oral and topical route (haven't tried navel much). My one complaint so far : two servings of this product per day feel nice, but then it's crazy expensive.
@haidut, is it possible to have the possibility to buy a 30ml bottle with a reduction on the price per ml ? Is there one of these ingredients which is a lot more expensive than the others ? If so, have you considered selling a "gonadin-" wihtout it, at a cheaper price (if it still works as intended) ?
In the podcast Haidut mentioned that the flavones get broken down very quickly in the digestive track, so might be a better option to use Gonadin topically, maybe on wrists, to increase the half life, thus needing a lower dose of the product, making it last longer.

Also, since Gonadin has so much potential to be used synergistically with so many other Idealabs products, to get your desired effects, you might want to stack Gonadin with another product, to potentiate each other’s effects, which again, would also mean you would need to use a lower dose, making the bottle last longer.
 

TheCedar1

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How did you get on with restarting your hormone production? Also, if you don’t mind me asking, what is your age?
After I last posted here, i waited 5-6 weeks after to contact my doctor and ask for a blood work, since I showed them proof that I had low T. They tested my TSH, LH, Total T, SHBG, Calcium, vitamin B12, and then some general blood assement like my hematocrit and hemoglobin etc.

My Total T was over 605 ng/dl, with an LH of 1,4 IU/L and an SHBG of 41 nmol/l. Safe to say, I recovered smoothly without PCT, though my LH concerned me as It was flagged low in my bloodwork, but I still produce that much T relative to my LH levels. My TSH was 2, which when researching on this forum, apparently I have bad levels

I'm 20 years old.
 

A.R

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After I last posted here, i waited 5-6 weeks after to contact my doctor and ask for a blood work, since I showed them proof that I had low T. They tested my TSH, LH, Total T, SHBG, Calcium, vitamin B12, and then some general blood assement like my hematocrit and hemoglobin etc.

My Total T was over 605 ng/dl, with an LH of 1,4 IU/L and an SHBG of 41 nmol/l. Safe to say, I recovered smoothly without PCT, though my LH concerned me as It was flagged low in my bloodwork, but I still produce that much T relative to my LH levels. My TSH was 2, which when researching on this forum, apparently I have bad levels

I'm 20 years old.
So it seems your body was in very good shape before being shut down, so you was able to naturally recover much faster without any hindrance.

Do you think you got any benefits from taking the andractim? Was it worth it?
 

TheCedar1

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Do you think you got any benefits from taking the andractim? Was it worth it?
Let's just say, I had higher expectations of the compound. It did help me grow my **** a lot, but as far as the mental benefits goes, not so much. It did however lower my e2 significantly, but that was about it.

Doing more research on it, I wasn't surprised it wasn't as effective for anything else other than **** growth. Stanalone is considered a partial androgen due to its very high affinity to 3α-HSD, basically converting the DHT into a weaker metabolite, so with muscle performance, it didn't help anything in the gym.
Plus, taking it in gel form only makes like 10% of the dose available to use, and given my high SHBG, most of that were bound to it. So yeah, would I recommend it? If you want to grow your wang, then go ahead, mine is now very large. But if you want any mental or muscular benefits of this, its unfortunately not worth it.
 

A.R

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Let's just say, I had higher expectations of the compound. It did help me grow my **** a lot, but as far as the mental benefits goes, not so much. It did however lower my e2 significantly, but that was about it.

Doing more research on it, I wasn't surprised it wasn't as effective for anything else other than **** growth. Stanalone is considered a partial androgen due to its very high affinity to 3α-HSD, basically converting the DHT into a weaker metabolite, so with muscle performance, it didn't help anything in the gym.
Plus, taking it in gel form only makes like 10% of the dose available to use, and given my high SHBG, most of that were bound to it. So yeah, would I recommend it? If you want to grow your wang, then go ahead, mine is now very large. But if you want any mental or muscular benefits of this, its unfortunately not worth it.
Lol it’s good to know it helped in growing your wang 😂

But seriously I think it would be good for you to make a testimonial thread, and document your experience with Andractim, because I’m sure a lot of people are looking to grow their penis.
 

TheCedar1

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Lol it’s good to know it helped in growing your wang 😂

But seriously I think it would be good for you to make a testimonial thread, and document your experience with Andractim, because I’m sure a lot of people are looking to grow their penis.
I might actually do a thread on it, seeing as my results were quite significant, it could help people to give out a testimonial
 

Motorneuron

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I might actually do a thread on it, seeing as my results were quite significant, it could help people to give out a testimonial
This is something to use locally like those products (legitimate or fake?) For sale on Russian (UK) star peptides.
 

A.R

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I might actually do a thread on it, seeing as my results were quite significant, it could help people to give out a testimonial
Was you also using Gonadin at the same time of the experiment? Or have you ever used Gonadin?
 

golder

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I might actually do a thread on it, seeing as my results were quite significant, it could help people to give out a testimonial
How much did you apply each time? Presumably it wasn’t in the flaccid state (forgive the crudeness)
Did it burn at all?
 
OP
haidut

haidut

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This is something to use locally like those products (legitimate or fake?) For sale on Russian (UK) star peptides.

Wow, thanks for sharing! Russian peptides are actually copying directly my products and posts from this forum and are not even bothering to modify what they steal. Look at the following products, their ingredients and the references they provide. Not only the ingredients almost identical, but the references are 100% carbon copy, down to the bolding/underlining and even abbreviations I used for various compounds (EP - ethyl pyruvate, EA - acetoacetate, etc). I might actually email them ask they credit at least the forum as while the references are public work, the actual extracts, highlights, etc are my work and are copyrighted and they can at least provide some credit as it costs them nothing. Lol, they even took some text where I wrote stuff in the first person and pasted it there directly:): See quote under the first link below.

Btw, what product did you see there that was similar to Gonadin?

@A.R

"...Some people may wonder why I added benzoic acid. Well, it looks like benzoic acid has a number of cool properties. First, it uncouples mitochondria in extremely low concentrations (less than 1 picoM/L) and that uncoupling capacity does NOT increase much with dosage. So, it has a much higher therapeutic index (e.g. ratio of effectiveness / risk) compared to drugs such as DNP which can kill you if you miscalculate the dosage just a bit. Benzoc acid also reduces ammonia levels by chelation and is approved as an ammonia-reducing drug called Ucephan."

 
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TheCedar1

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How much did you apply each time? Presumably it wasn’t in the flaccid state (forgive the crudeness)
Did it burn at all?
I put enough to cover my finger, and I administered it on my wang locally, and let it dry for 5 minutes.

It did feel a bit burn, but that's no problem, its bot harmful, and the androgen receptors in your wang binds to the dht
 

Jing

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Feb 18, 2018
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I put enough to cover my finger, and I administered it on my wang locally, and let it dry for 5 minutes.

It did feel a bit burn, but that's no problem, its bot harmful, and the androgen receptors in your wang binds to the dht
How much did it grow and how long did it take?
 

Hitchens

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Jan 27, 2019
Messages
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At 19, more moronically than today, I took Winstrol, without test and within two weeks I got gyno etc and flushed the 'Winnie'. In that time, I remember the desire to squeeze my muscles, if that makes any sense, Gonadin has a similar feeling. I also believe the euphoria is very similar to a low low dose of psilocybin. I dont have the agro, im going to beat up the next potential alpha I see, but there was a sense of joy tonight, walking my dog down the street and I was able to compartmentalize my stressors and do an inventory of pos neg in real time. I am 6'6 220 pounds, looking forward to the gym today to see if I notice anything. On 'Winnie' I PRd my lifts for reps on the first day and was laughing at myself in the mirror doing overhead dumbbell presses and not feeling lactic acid fatigue. Curious if anyone has seen significant, or noticeable changes to body composition. Also, curious if Gonadin effects steriodogenesis in a negative way. I dont want to dumb myself down on Gonadin, gaba agonist it is.
 
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