Glycine Powerfully Lowers Cortisol

[Luann]

Ok. too bad there's no drugstore variety! but thanks haidut +1

 

[yoshiesque]

can you overdose on glycine? I was going to get it cheap at pure bulk but i hate how the serving size is so tiny. id rather just get a teaspoon of it, and ignore how much glycine it is.

 

[DrJ]

can you overdose on glycine? I was going to get it cheap at pure bulk but i hate how the serving size is so tiny. id rather just get a teaspoon of it, and ignore how much glycine it is.

Doses of 80-100g of glycine have been used to treat schizophrenics. I've personally experimented with taking 60g glycine in orange juice (I'm ~76kg), and the only ill effect was bowels moving too quickly for about half a day. However, for the next 3+ days, I felt extremely calm but alert, mentally sharp, and my temperature stayed high and stable. It did also seem like my muscle tone had an improved appearance, but it's hard to make that quantitative.

 

[jyb]

Doses of 80-100g of glycine have been used to treat schizophrenics. I've personally experimented with taking 60g glycine in orange juice (I'm ~76kg), and the only ill effect was bowels moving too quickly for about half a day. However, for the next 3+ days, I felt extremely calm but alert, mentally sharp, and my temperature stayed high and stable. It did also seem like my muscle tone had an improved appearance, but it's hard to make that quantitative.

That's...a lot of glycine.

 

[kitback]

I love glycine! I have had a lifelong issue with sleep. I am overweight, diabetic, age 63, and no doubt have chronically elevated cortisol. At this stage of my life, I am lucky to be able to sleep more than two hours at a time without awakening and then I can't get back to sleep for an hour or more. I tried cyproheptadine and that helped with the sleep issue but I did not like the zombie effect or the issues with memory loss I developed after a few weeks.

I tried glycine and it was love at first sight. With the glycine, I can sleep for six hours straight! Amazing! I also feel mentally sharper and physically stronger.

I read on some thread in the forum that Ray Peat does not recommend long-term use of glycine but the poster did not mention why. I know Ray has concerns about the manufacturing process but does anyone know if he has mentioned specific health complications due to long-term use of glycine?

 

[Giraffe]

I tried glycine and it was love at first sight. With the glycine, I can sleep for six hours straight! Amazing! I also feel mentally sharper and physically stronger.

How much glycine do you take for sleep? And at what time? Directly before you go to sleep?

 

[kitback]

I take 3 g just as I am going to bed.

 

[Maddy17]

Haidut - I have just joined the forum, but have been reading for over a year and have learned a huge amount, so I thank you for your contributions. On the post below about Glycine reducing cortisol, do you think it is safe to assume that it lowers ACTH? Or do you think it inhibits one of the enzymes in cortisol synthesis pathway (17a-hydroxylase >> 21-hyroxylase >> 11B-hydroxylase)? I have a child who has chronic migraine, and their cortisol is always top of range or a few points over. Docs keep saying not a big deal if it is a.m. Well, yes I know it is not cushings, but it is not "normal" either. Affects insulin, and a whole cascade. Some things like phosphatidyl serine I think must block a cortisol specific enzyme, but doesn't affect DHEA and catecholamines and other adrenal output....and that causes major major headache in short order that last days (the cortisol/DHEA ratio important in immune function balance for sure living proof). That is just from experience. Holy Basil, wow, sleep soundly, 3 days and just a slight hint of the faintest headache...many report this herb lowers cortisol. Again, not sure if it is via enzyme inhibition or if it works via ACTH inhibition. The latter is what I am seeking. Inhibition or lowering of ACTH. Thanks so much.

I have long suspected that inhibitory amino acids suppress cortisol release. The reason is that most of these inhibitory amino acids like glycine, taurine, beta alanine, theanine, etc are all GABA agonists. GABA agonist pharma drugs are used to treat Cushing syndrome and are very effective at lowering cortisol. However, up until today I did not have much evidence for such an effect of amino acids with the possible exception of theanine.
This study shows that glycine can acutely lower cortisol to about 20% of controls (i.e. 80% reduction). The study was done in chickens, so unfortunately the dosage conversion is a bit difficult to come buy but I think the results are valid given that glycine has also been shown to stop aging-related muscle loss and even cancer cachexia, both of which are mediated at least partially through elevated cortisol. So, if somebody knows how to convert doses from chicken to rodent or human please chime in. I have included a link that talks about doses of specific drugs for rodents, pigs, cats, dogs and birds and based on that conversion it looks like the effective dose in humans to achieve the cortisol-lowering effect could be as low as 70mg/kg. This dose is surprisingly close to the 1mmol/kg (75mg/kg) glycine that acutely lowered the glycemic response in humans by more than 66% without changing insulin levels. As you can see from the screenshot, glycine also lowered cortisol in chickens without changing insulin. In general, anything that lowers cortisol will lower blood sugar, so it is quite plausible that the cortisol-lowering effects of glycine are behind its beneficial effects on blood glucose, diabetes, obesity, bone health, and aging which I have posted about in separate threads on this forum.


Effects of orally administered glycine on myofibrillar proteolysis and expression of proteolytic-related genes of skeletal muscle in chicks. - PubMed - NCBI
"...The plasma corticosterone concentration was also decreased by glycine, but the plasma insulin concentration was unaffected. These results indicate that orally administered glycine suppresses myofibrillar proteolysis and expression of proteolytic-related genes of skeletal muscle by decreasing the plasma corticosterone concentration in chicks."


The domestic animals drug conversion link:
Veterinary Formulary

Another substance that also powerfully lowers cortisol is niacinamide and thus can synergize well with glycine to block the stress response.
Niacinamide Lowers Cortisol | Ray Peat Forum

 

[haidut]

Haidut - I have just joined the forum, but have been reading for over a year and have learned a huge amount, so I thank you for your contributions. On the post below about Glycine reducing cortisol, do you think it is safe to assume that it lowers ACTH? Or do you think it inhibits one of the enzymes in cortisol synthesis pathway (17a-hydroxylase >> 21-hyroxylase >> 11B-hydroxylase)? I have a child who has chronic migraine, and their cortisol is always top of range or a few points over. Docs keep saying not a big deal if it is a.m. Well, yes I know it is not cushings, but it is not "normal" either. Affects insulin, and a whole cascade. Some things like phosphatidyl serine I think must block a cortisol specific enzyme, but doesn't affect DHEA and catecholamines and other adrenal output....and that causes major major headache in short order that last days (the cortisol/DHEA ratio important in immune function balance for sure living proof). That is just from experience. Holy Basil, wow, sleep soundly, 3 days and just a slight hint of the faintest headache...many report this herb lowers cortisol. Again, not sure if it is via enzyme inhibition or if it works via ACTH inhibition. The latter is what I am seeking. Inhibition or lowering of ACTH. Thanks so much.

I think it is more related to glycine upregulating the 5-AR enzyme and also being GABA agonist. It may have other effects through which it lowers cortisol but these two are proven to lower the levels of the "active" cortisol, which is the one most labs test for when they analyze the blood.

 

[Maddy17]

I think it is more related to glycine upregulating the 5-AR enzyme and also being GABA agonist. It may have other effects through which it lowers cortisol but these two are proven to lower the levels of the "active" cortisol, which is the one most labs test for when they analyze the blood.

aaaaahhh.....upregulates 5-AR? being female, we are not looking to elevate DHT... Any suggestions for supplements which would target ACTH directly or AVP? If glycine upregulates 5-AR, and assuming the type which deactivates cortisol, wouldn't the faster deactivation of cortisol lower the feedback to ACTH and wind up increasing cortisol in rebound? Our bodies are just way too darn smart...and too interdependent... adrenals are a big challenge.

 

[whodathunkit]

I know Ray has concerns about the manufacturing process but does anyone know if he has mentioned specific health complications due to long-term use of glycine?

I'd like to know the answer to this, too, if anyone has any idea.

I have had the same experience with glycine and sleep but am not consistent with taking it. I use it symptomatically.

It's hard for me to get glycine from gelatin...gelatin is gross, even the hydrolyzed collagen, and I wish I didn't feel that way. But I can taste and smell barnyard feet in it almost no matter what. Reminds of the cow shed at my grandparent's. Coffee with sugar is okay but coffee just doesn't agree with me if I use it daily, and sugar causes weight gain so I try to do fruit and honey instead.

 

[haidut]

aaaaahhh.....upregulates 5-AR? being female, we are not looking to elevate DHT... Any suggestions for supplements which would target ACTH directly or AVP? If glycine upregulates 5-AR, and assuming the type which deactivates cortisol, wouldn't the faster deactivation of cortisol lower the feedback to ACTH and wind up increasing cortisol in rebound? Our bodies are just way too darn smart...and too interdependent... adrenals are a big challenge.

The 5-AR enzyme is crucial for females as well. It's what gives you allopregnanolone and that is the neurosteroid protecting both men and women from depression. You won't make much DHT as its synthesis depends on how much T you make and women make a lot less than men. So, the higher 5-AR is not a concern. I am not aware of any woman growing stache from using glycine/gelatin.

 

[tomisonbottom]

I love glycine! I have had a lifelong issue with sleep. I am overweight, diabetic, age 63, and no doubt have chronically elevated cortisol. At this stage of my life, I am lucky to be able to sleep more than two hours at a time without awakening and then I can't get back to sleep for an hour or more. I tried cyproheptadine and that helped with the sleep issue but I did not like the zombie effect or the issues with memory loss I developed after a few weeks.

I tried glycine and it was love at first sight. With the glycine, I can sleep for six hours straight! Amazing! I also feel mentally sharper and physically stronger.

I read on some thread in the forum that Ray Peat does not recommend long-term use of glycine but the poster did not mention why. I know Ray has concerns about the manufacturing process but does anyone know if he has mentioned specific health complications due to long-term use of glycine?

This is great. Would you mind sharing what brand you use? And also do you take it with sugar? How do you take it? Thanks!

 

[tomisonbottom]

Doses of 80-100g of glycine have been used to treat schizophrenics. I've personally experimented with taking 60g glycine in orange juice (I'm ~76kg), and the only ill effect was bowels moving too quickly for about half a day. However, for the next 3+ days, I felt extremely calm but alert, mentally sharp, and my temperature stayed high and stable. It did also seem like my muscle tone had an improved appearance, but it's hard to make that quantitative.

Was that just 1 time you tired that or multiple times? Do you consider yourself hypo at all? Do you mind sharing what brand you used?
`

 

[DrJ]

@tomisonbottom I've actually done that 3 different times now. Yes I consider myself hypo but it seems to be largely driven by a weak digestive system, so if I'm careful I can manage that and feel awesome most of the time. I but the BulkSupplements brand off Amazon.

 

[tomisonbottom]

@tomisonbottom I've actually done that 3 different times now. Yes I consider myself hypo but it seems to be largely driven by a weak digestive system, so if I'm careful I can manage that and feel awesome most of the time. I but the BulkSupplements brand off Amazon.

Cool. Thanks!

 

[Ella]

I have a child who has chronic migraine, and their cortisol is always top of range or a few points over. Docs keep saying not a big deal if it is a.m. Well, yes I know it is not cushings, but it is not "normal" either

I would try and work out why her cortisol is high. Blood sugar drops, inadequate calories, allergies, gut issues, is she cycling - hormonal imbalances. Stress or worries at school, friends, bright lights from iphone, computer etc when she should be sleeping.

If cortisol is high am, then I would expose her to bright light - morning sunshine powerfully lowers cortisol. Proper scheduled meals and scheduled chill time. Children need lots of chill time as opposed to scheduled activities. Otherwise, we turn them into adrenaline driven adults later on. Is her schedule packed with activities rushing from one activity to another, eating meals and snacks on the run. This is the norm for many children, teenagers and adults these days?

If she was my baby girl, lots of cuddles and touch, massage. Long soaks in the bath with lavender, magnesium flakes etc. A little lavender in her pillow at night or PJs.

I know older children can be porcupines and think they are too old for cuddles. My 21 yo can be a prickly pear and thinks she is too old for cuddles. When her cortisol levels are elevated she comes to mamma for her cuddles and feels all is right with the world again. Oxytocin is the bonding hormone and powerfully lowers cortisol. Yes, we all need more time for loving and nurturing.

Migraines can be a real puzzle to figure out. Start with the basics such hydration. Is she a high energy sporty child; then, hydration is a big factor to consider. It is not just water, you need to work out if she is getting adequate electrolytes for her activity. Many parents have children competing at elite level, without even considering electrolyte replacement. Water is not enough. Dehydration on its own will cause high cortisol. Check pee colour after activities.

Snuggle Science: Why Cuddling Is Good for Your Health

 

[lollipop]

Snuggle Science: Why Cuddling Is Good for Your Health

Great article @Ella! Thank you for sharing

 

[Ella]

Lisa, I have been looking a cortisol for such a long time and I have gone from seeing cortisol as the enemy to cortisol as the messenger that alerts us that changes need to be implemented to restore balance in our lives. The answer is not to shoot the messenger, but to take heed and work on addressing those imbalances.

We stress so much and yes I am more than a little OCD about food, however, regardless of what food is eaten, if it is cooked to taste delicious and shared with happy, loving and nurturing company with plenty of laughter and jolly then cortisol is low and oxytocin is high. To me, there is nothing more powerful than touch. I love that my husband alway grabs my hand every single time without fail when we cross the road. I know it sounds quaint, but it reminds me that I am precious to him and it his natural instinct to protect me. We have been married such a long time that you would think he knows that I am perfectly capable of crossing the road on my own. It is only a small gesture, however, it makes me feel special that another being would care this much.

Migraines may need more than cuddles though as they can be terribly crippling and disabling, so it is important to start with basics. I think Peat suffered with them and found milkshakes able to help. In females, it is usually around day 21 and just before their period, when they are more prone to migraines. Certain foods can trigger them. For me, it is certain types of chocolate, may be due to contamination with fungal metabolites. Migraine from chocolate can last for a week if I don't jump onto it. I find vitamin C, or lots of freshly squeezed orange juice with sugar cuts it short. Activated charcoal also helps too if due to any sort of toxin, endotoxins etc., lots of fluids to flush out. Carrot, bamboo, mushroom to help remove build up of excess hormones from poor or inadequate diet.

 

[lollipop]

I love that my husband alway grabs my hand every single time without fail when we cross the road. I know it sounds quaint, but it reminds me that I am precious to him and it his natural instinct to protect me. We have been married such a long time that you would think he knows that I am perfectly capable of crossing the road on my own. It is only a small gesture, however, it makes me feel special that another being would care this much.

OH @Ella - my husband does as well I LOVE it ❤❤