Gelatin/collagen = endotoxin reaction?

[Tim Lundeen]

I am concerned about fluoride content of gelatin, which could cause the symptoms you experience. If you take iodine, do you get the same? Iodine displaces fluoride, so causes fluoride detox symptoms if your tissues have high fluoride.

You could try the Aji glycine, I use that and it seems to be ok. It's made by fermentation, so should be low fluoride (high fluoride would kill the bacteria, although it possibly could be added during purification). Swanson sells this as a bulk powder.

 

[aniciete]

I am concerned about fluoride content of gelatin, which could cause the symptoms you experience. If you take iodine, do you get the same? Iodine displaces fluoride, so causes fluoride detox symptoms if your tissues have high fluoride.

You could try the Aji glycine, I use that and it seems to be ok. It's made by fermentation, so should be low fluoride (high fluoride would kill the bacteria, although it possibly could be added during purification). Swanson sells this as a bulk powder.

I do not take iodine, but have started taking a couple mg of boron to detox fluoride.

 

[L_C]

Yes lots of milk coffee and maple syrup. When I have histamine reactions, I usually get a red/puffy face. With this, my scalp itches and I developed tiny red pimples on my neck. I dug this chart back up and I’m thinking the fluoride could a be big issue.

I normally eat Zint gelatin and have no histamine reaction at all. Recently, I switched to perfect supplements gelatin and itchy all over. Give zint gelatin a try.

 

[Lord Cola]

If you are using gelatin powder, it needs to soak up moisture for a few minutes before it is heated and dissolved. Otherwise it can cause gas. Great Lakes porcine gelatin causes bad reactions for me no matter what. I use only bovine gelatin when I use their gelatin powder.

 

[IPlayDart]

Have you tried a raw primal diet?

 

[Dr. B]

I have similar problem and a bad response to gelatin. I don't have it when I make it myself.

Someone from the forum said: "It doesn't matter what the animals were fed. Gelatin is generally made from the skin of the animals. Decaying skin is an ideal environment for gram negative bacteria, and so all gelatin products are going to contain a significant amount of endotoxin, even if the animals were fed organic grass, and roamed freely under the open sky."
Q: Can the gelatin be boiled and endotoxins reduced this way?
FORUM: No, endotoxin is heat stable.

I also think that he said that chicken feet could bypass these problems.

Impact of Endotoxins in Gelatine Hydrogels on Chondrogenic Differentiation and Inflammatory Cytokine Secretion In Vitro

endotoxin can be killed with I think 180 degrees for 3 hours or 250 or 230 degrees for 30 minutes.

After starting back up on gelatin, I’ve developed red eyes, itchy scalp, nausea and diarrhea. Could this be an endotoxin reaction? I’ve felt horrible the last couple mornings and my sleep has been bad. On top of this my tongue is now coated.

do you know if gelatin directly boosts endotoxin, or is it because it's slow and hard to digest that it promotes more endotoxin? like how bread can promote endotoxin

Oral Administration of Lipopolysaccharides for the Prevention of Various Diseases: Benefit and Usefulness

It is well known that intravenous administration of lipopolysaccharide (LPS) induces severe toxicity in mammals. The maximum tolerated dose of intravenous administration of LPS in humans is reported to be only 1 to 4 ng/kg body weight. However, oral administration of a high dose of LPS caused no...

ar.iiarjournals.org

"Oral administration of LPS demonstrates completely different results when compared to parenteral administration. Oketani et al. stated that oral administration of LPS is not harmful to animals. Schryvers et al. found no evidence of LPS toxicity with 20 μg/ml intake after 40 days in mice. Illyés et al. reported that repeated oral administration of high doses of Escherichia coli LPS had no demonstrable effect on small intestinal structure and cell proliferation in rats. We found that high doses of single oral administration of Pantoea agglomerans LPS (600 mg/kg) had no side-effects in rats. Moreover, oral administration of 300 mg/kg of this LPS, which was almost 30,000 times more than the recommended amount of LPS (10 μg/kg) in animals (human, chicken and fish), for 28 days showed no evidence of hepatotoxicity, nephrotoxicity, inflammation, or weight decrease in rats. These findings demonstrate that oral administrations of LPS are quite safe for animals."


Some papers even suggest it can be beneficial when consumed...

Oral administration of lipopolysaccharides for the prevention of various diseases: benefit and usefulness - PubMed

It is well known that intravenous administration of lipopolysaccharide (LPS) induces severe toxicity in mammals. The maximum tolerated dose of intravenous administration of LPS in humans is reported to be only 1 to 4 ng/kg body weight. However, oral administration of a high dose of LPS caused no...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"Moreover, several experiments have reported that oral administration of LPS had preventative and curative properties against various diseases, including allergic, and lifestyle-related diseases."

Ray has mentioned that a little bit of endotoxin is a positive thing (since we live in a world with bacteria).

endotoxin causes obesity, cancer, diabetes, autoimmunity etc. even on a low pufa high metabolic diet. you have to reduce its production, increase its excretion, and possibly block its effects. vitamin A and D blokc its effects.
vitamin C might boost its excretion. charcoal and orange juice help excrete it.