Gallbladder: Living Without It?

[seano]

Thoughts on mitigating the issues which result from not having a gallbladder?

p.s. It's already removed. Nearly 10 years ago (in my 20s) through a cholecystectomy. Though it was perfectly healthy at the time. Doctors mis-diagnosed a pinched duct, but took it out anyway. Changing my life forever.

 

[extremecheddar]

how is life without one?

 

[seano]

post 113225 how is life without one?

Not so great. Worse for men than women due to poor estrogen clearance. All sorts of other detail I can share, though it's well documented throughout the internet.

 

[extremecheddar]

They want to remove mine. I'm really considering it because the pain has gotten too bad.

 

[Derek]

post 113063 Thoughts on mitigating the issues which result from not having a gallbladder?

p.s. It's already removed. Nearly 10 years ago (in my 20s) through a cholecystectomy. Though it was perfectly healthy at the time. Doctors mis-diagnosed a pinched duct, but took it out anyway. Changing my life forever.

Eating relatively low fat, and if you do eat fat consume ox bile, or some other product with digestive enzymes/bile acids. Also, applying trans dermal fat solubles might be necessary, but that would depend on blood tests.

 

[Peata]

post 113352 They want to remove mine. I'm really considering it because the pain has gotten too bad.

Do you have symptoms of high estrogen?

When I had pain with my gb it would be soothed by eating apples. Some people swear by ACV.

 

[seano]

Eating relatively low fat, and if you do eat fat consume ox bile, or some other product with digestive enzymes/bile acids. Also, applying trans dermal fat solubles might be necessary, but that would depend on blood tests.

@Derek - Eating "low fat" doesn't make a difference for me. Nor did ox bile. But it likely works for others whose bodies adapted differently to the removal.

Oddly I went 3+ months on a very high protein (2g/lb!), high fat diet, low carb diet with carb re-feed once a week. I felt great on it. Most issues went down during the time. But it wasn't sustainable and I had concerns of such high protein in the long-term.

My primary issues are:

- the big issue which causes social stigma: large cysts on back of neck and flaky scalp. Looks like severe acne but it's actually follicles. 1 day of slowed digestion or bad sleep will result in a cyst within hours. And it can just as quickly disappear (though scars/inflammation remains for a week or more)
- need for 5 sleep cycles (~9 hours) to feel normal.
- other issues which are clear signs: cuticles always torn/rough, bags under eyes (sign of k2 issues), ...
- libido has never changed, but performance has decreased ...

Most of my focus currently is on mitigating:
- the slow transit time from not having a gallbladder
- ^ resulting in poor clearance of estrogen & toxins, and inadequate nutrient absorption
- gallbladder plays a major role in k2

Recently I learned that the gallbladder is important in the Vitamin K2 cycle, and in clearing estrogens. (1) (2)

 

[seano]

Side note:

A few months back I started taking "Dr. Christopher's Lower Bowel Formula".

Turns out it's main ingredient is:

Cascara Sagrada Bark, Barberry Bark, Cayenne Pepper, Ginger Root, Lobelia Herb, Red Raspberry Leaves, Turkey Rhubarb Root, Fennel Seeds & Goldenseal Root

Initially it helped, but then not as much. Adding it back in now, but will cycle instead of taking continually.

Triphala also helps on the days where I feel my digestion has stopped up. But I don't like taking laxatives all the time.

 

[seano]

post 113358 Also, applying trans dermal fat solubles might be necessary

Thanks. I've not heard this before. Do you have more detail/links?

Update: Ahh, I misunderstood. You meant taking fat-soluble vitamins transdermal/topically to ensure absorption.

 

[extremecheddar]

post 113352 They want to remove mine. I'm really considering it because the pain has gotten too bad.

Do you have symptoms of high estrogen?

When I had pain with my gb it would be soothed by eating apples. Some people swear by ACV.

Yes,
Estrone 86 pg/ml HIGH *************
Estradiol 30.2 pg/ml (increased since last labs, within range) **********
Testosterone total 581 ng/dl Free 11.6 pg/ml
DHEA-Sulfate 473 ug/dl normal
Cortisol AM 16.8 ug/dl 16.8 Normal top of range is 19.4

I drink a fair amount of apple juice, I don't notice anything from it though. I have tried ACV but I don't like the taste at all.

 

[Derek]

post 113431

post 113358 Also, applying trans dermal fat solubles might be necessary

Thanks. I've not heard this before. Do you have more detail/links?

You need bile to absorb fat soluble vitamins. Without a gallbladder it may be difficult, so if you're deficient via blood tests; it may be a good idea to apply them transdermally.

 

[Peata]

post 113433

post 113352 They want to remove mine. I'm really considering it because the pain has gotten too bad.

Do you have symptoms of high estrogen?

When I had pain with my gb it would be soothed by eating apples. Some people swear by ACV.

Yes,
Estrone 86 pg/ml HIGH *************
Estradiol 30.2 pg/ml (increased since last labs, within range) **********
Testosterone total 581 ng/dl Free 11.6 pg/ml
DHEA-Sulfate 473 ug/dl normal
Cortisol AM 16.8 ug/dl 16.8 Normal top of range is 19.4

I drink a fair amount of apple juice, I don't notice anything from it though. I have tried ACV but I don't like the taste at all.

If you can lower your estrogen you may see improvement. I did.

Though it's still not perfect -I haven't got my hormones 100% worked out yet. But it's so much better than before. Some days of the month I will notice the slight ache or "movement" of the gb. At times, if I eat a heavy meal/fat heavy meal after dark, I get diarrhea and cramps, and this may be gb related.

Overall almost no problems like I had before (flu-like symptoms, extreme sickness from gb), and I hope to continue fixing my hormones.

 

[Klaudia]

I've already lived 20 years without it. Happy and free of pain. And in the meantime I've tried many different eating protocols. Nothing hurt me (even a high fat diet).

 

[extremecheddar]

If you can lower your estrogen you may see improvement. I did.

Though it's still not perfect -I haven't got my hormones 100% worked out yet. But it's so much better than before. Some days of the month I will notice the slight ache or "movement" of the gb. At times, if I eat a heavy meal/fat heavy meal after dark, I get diarrhea and cramps, and this may be gb related.

Overall almost no problems like I had before (flu-like symptoms, extreme sickness from gb), and I hope to continue fixing my hormones.

What has helped you most with estrogen?

 

[seano]

Bumping this as I've not seen Ray asked about living without a gallbladder (removal via cholecystectomy).
Anyone have further experience?

I'd like to ask Ray his opinion but not seeing how to contact him. I'm guessing he became overloaded.

 

[lindsay]

@seano - I don't have a gallbladder either. I took a prescription drug in college for IBS that caused all sorts of long term issues for me - including gallbladder disease, depression, etc. I didn't realize I was battling serotonin & estrogen for all those years until I discovered RP and read his article on serotonin and digestive issues.

That being said, Ox Bile is amazing, if you haven't tried it. When doctors say gallbladders are not necessary, it's a giant lie. It made my digestion worse having it removed, I think. Someone from the site formerly Peatarian (I think it was Anon - that was actually a vocal person there), sent me a private message and recommended I try Ox Bile to help me with the lack of gallbladder. I can now eat a good number of foods that I couldn't. I think it's main action is to help support the secretion of old/dirty bile. I take it 30 minutes or so before eating my evening meal and then I eat. It tends to cause a comfortable bowel movement sometime after that (time varying according to what I eat in the morning and at night) and I always feel better after this. Essentially, it feels like it gets the digestive juices flowing and things moving.

Anyhow, that is one suggestion I would make. I take nutricology brand Ox Bile - 500 mg capsules. I take usually one or two per day, depending on if I feel it's needed.

 

[seano]

@lindsay - Yeah. I've used Ox Bile since the removal (nearly a decade). We should share notes to find the common patterns. It seems the removal affects people differently.

Also my gallbladder & digestive system was perfectly healthy before. I simply had a pinched duct, likely from getting hit playing sport or being thin.
- The doctor diagnosed as a failed gallbladder, but the surgeon noticed the duct problem while I was knocked out for surgery.
- Then proceeded to take it out anyway! Because "you don't need it".
- True, you can "survive" without it. I can also survive without my arm, eyes, penis, ... but I'd rather not.

 

[BibleBeliever]

@lindsay - Yeah. I've used Ox Bile since the removal (nearly a decade). We should share notes to find the common patterns. It seems the removal affects people differently.

Also my gallbladder & digestive system was perfectly healthy before. I simply had a pinched duct, likely from getting hit playing sport or being thin.
- The doctor diagnosed as a failed gallbladder, but the surgeon noticed the duct problem while I was knocked out for surgery.
- Then proceeded to take it out anyway! Because "you don't need it".
- True, you can "survive" without it. I can also survive without my arm, eyes, penis, ... but I'd rather not.

Pretty enraging. Innumerable failures in modern medicine.