Gallbladder Issues--I Think I Passed A Gallstone

[narouz]

Iceland is a weird cold place, at least in the winter. :S

I usually mixed ACV with water. Dilution would depend on how much ACV I thought I needed. Never sweetened it(didn't really hate the taste), but I always drank it through a straw to protect my teeth.

Personally I would start off with very diluted and then experiment with stronger solutions if you feel like it is too diluted. It's a bit learn as you go along.

I just got some, SG,
and mixed (as per the instructions on the both)
2 TBS in a cup of water (with a little maple syrup).
Still darn sour:)
Will see how it goes...thanks!

 

[narouz]

I'm not sure how this apparent gallbladder episode fits into the puzzle of my health
I've been trying to figure out.

One of my more minor symptoms
has been an odd sensation with my feet.
It started off with only my right foot,
and it would get sortuv tingly/numbish/hotish/coldish or something like that
Rarely it would be intense enough to be a bit unpleasant--
mostly then it would feel like that foot was too hot inside my shoe,
so I would take my shoe off--which did make it feel much better

That would come and go,
and I linked it to my lower backache/hip ache--which was mainly on the right side.

In recent months,
as I've experimented with switching from NDT to a T3 only
and at the same time (just to make sure I will have no chance to scientifically figure out what causes what:))
done some very intense anti-fungal strategies (Nystatin, Pau D'Arco, Undecylenic Acid, Capylic Acid, anti-Candida enzymes, and more)...

...I've had significant success with a lot of my woes--
back/hip ache much better,
libido better,
tongue clean and pink,
sleep better,
and other stuff.

But that odd sensation is still around, a bit.
My glucose was a bit high at one point--102 I think.
Thought I was having some kind of sugar/insulin issue--which is a new one for me,
one I don't know much of nuthin' about.
Last lab it was down to 87.
Now that odd sensation is in both feet, but very mild, and it is not always there--
seems to appear in the afternoon/evenings.

So I've wondered if my pancreas is involved, somehow.
Until this (presumed) gallbladder attack,
I really couldn't have told you exactly where my gallbladder was located.
And I thought the pancreas was on the other side.

But I know now that both organs sit just below the liver,
and they share that common duct...is it the biliary duct...?
And I also read where,
if one has a gallstone,
and it blocks up that duct--
then the pancreas' function can be impaired.

So...wondering if this is a clue to my tingly hotty numby coldy weirdy feet thing.

Also saw in cursory surfing
at least a few sources saying pancreas/sugar issues can affect libido.
So...another connection/clue perhaps.

Tossing this out there to see if any of you have any related experiences or thoughts.

 

[michael94]

narouz

If gallstones are coming out on their own you most certainly have a gallbladder packed with them, not to mention many in the liver as well ( not all are calcified ). Have you ever done a liver flush?

 

[narouz]

narouz

If gallstones are coming out on their own you most certainly have a gallbladder packed with them, not to mention many in the liver as well ( not all are calcified ). Have you ever done a liver flush?

Well, really, I don't know that I passed a gallstone.
I'm pretty sure it was a gallbladder episode of some sort.
Reason I think I may've passed one is
that the pain started in the center
then over time moved to the right and perhaps downward a bit--
all that apparently a classic description of gallstone passing.

With the liver flush thing...
As I think I may've said upthread,
I've looked a bit askance in the past upon such "flushes" ("one weird trick" etc)...
but now...I'm game.
However, I have read that it is not such a beautiful idea to do one of those flushes
when you don't know what's in there--
like if you have a giant stone in there, and you try to flush it...yikes!...

That's why I was thinking it might make sense--although it would be expensive--
to get an MRI or ultrasound:
see what's in there first.

But then Jennifer put that other option in my mind--the chanca piedra "stonecrusher."
Maybe that should be my next step: surely would be nice to avoid paying that big dough
for the MRI or ultrasound.
See what that does.

Have you done a liver flush, ice cream?

 

[narouz]

 

[michael94]

As far as I'm aware ultrasound will only detect calcified stones, but if you have calcified stones you surely have many more which are not. Not sure about mri.

Liver flushes are certainly not something to take lightly, but in my experience are very safe and possibly the single best thing you can do for your health. It may seem like a new trend but people have been taking oilive oil+ citrus mixtures for hundreds of years, at least.

Your body appears to creates stones as a defense mechanism against toxins/parasites. Eventually there is too many and now your liver/gallblader become backed up and loaded with toxic stones. The way liver flushes work is you relax the bile ducts with magnesium then take a olive oil+citrus mixture. I have done them, they are painless and work very well ( unfortunately I forgot to take pictures lol! ). However, you can feel quite bad/angry afterwards because there will be some "leakage" as your body gets rid of the stones through digestive tract. There are various protocols, Andreas Moritz is the most popular but some people can't stand the epsom salts ( magnesium sulfate ). Magnesium citrate is much gentler, both can be found at cvs/walgreens cheap (make sure to get pure magnesium sulfate without scents if you go for epsom salts ). There are other take as well. Dr. Sutter for example recommends oilive oil + lemon juice + mexican coke with no need for preparation beforehand. Some people have even taken just olive oil + orange juice with good success. Which is best, I cannot say honestly. Andreas moritz himself had gallstone attacks and has experience working with hundreds of people passing large calcified stones painlessly. I used his method minus the apple juice with good results. Be warned it is quite draining on your energy, something for the weekend. I will post links below.

https://www.davidwolfe.com/liver-gallbladder-flush-protocol/
http://www.curemanual.com/2009/01/d...-he-did-his-daily-liver-flushes-for-2-months/

Unless you are severely constipated I would not recommend too many enemas. I used to think enemas were a good idea but a friend mentioned that they lower potassium drastically. Should probably be reserved for extreme situations.

 

[narouz]

As far as I'm aware ultrasound will only detect calcified stones, but if you have calcified stones you surely have many more which are not. Not sure about mri.

Liver flushes are certainly not something to take lightly, but in my experience are very safe and possibly the single best thing you can do for your health. It may seem like a new trend but people have been taking oilive oil+ citrus mixtures for hundreds of years, at least.

Your body appears to creates stones as a defense mechanism against toxins/parasites. Eventually there is too many and now your liver/gallblader become backed up and loaded with toxic stones. The way liver flushes work is you relax the bile ducts with magnesium then take a olive oil+citrus mixture. I have done them, they are painless and work very well ( unfortunately I forgot to take pictures lol! ). However, you can feel quite bad/angry afterwards because there will be some "leakage" as your body gets rid of the stones through digestive tract. There are various protocols, Andreas Moritz is the most popular but some people can't stand the epsom salts ( magnesium sulfate ). Magnesium citrate is much gentler, both can be found at cvs/walgreens cheap (make sure to get pure magnesium sulfate without scents if you go for epsom salts ). There are other take as well. Dr. Sutter for example recommends oilive oil + lemon juice + mexican coke with no need for preparation beforehand. Some people have even taken just olive oil + orange juice with good success. Which is best, I cannot say honestly. Andreas moritz himself had gallstone attacks and has experience working with hundreds of people passing large calcified stones painlessly. I used his method minus the apple juice with good results. Be warned it is quite draining on your energy, something for the weekend. I will post links below.

The Amazing Liver Gallbladder Flush Protocol (And My SHOCKING Results) - DavidWolfe.com
Dr. Sutter Tells us how he did his daily liver flushes for 2 months | The Cure Manual

Unless you are severely constipated I would not recommend too many enemas. I used to think enemas were a good idea but a friend mentioned that they lower potassium drastically. Should probably be reserved for extreme situations.

Thank you for those ideas, icecream!
I will definitely explore further this whole world of liver/gallbladder flushes.
And if there are others who have experiences in this realm,
I would be very interested to hear about them.

I seems like trying the chanca piedra--which is supposed to, over time, break up/dissolve stones--
would be a good thing to try before any liver/gallbladder flushing.
Have you ever tried that?

I just picked up a couple small bottle of the tincture at Whole Foods,
and took my first dose a few minutes ago.

 

[Jennifer]

Excellent! I hope the chanca piedra works well for you, narouz. It's also beneficial for the kidneys, and since kidney issues can be felt in the lower to mid back region (I think you've mentioned having lower back pain before?), you may find it helps with that, too. I was taking no prisoners and bought a huge 4 ounce bottle. lol My kidneys are filtering really well now so I think it helped with that, too.

Thank you for the heads up on the ginger candies. I'll definitely check them out. :)

 

[narouz]

Excellent! I hope the chanca piedra works well for you, narouz. It's also beneficial for the kidneys, and since kidney issues can be felt in the lower to mid back region (I think you've mentioned having lower back pain before?), you may find it helps with that, too. I was taking no prisoners and bought a huge 4 ounce bottle. lol My kidneys are filtering really well now so I think it helped with that, too.

Thank you for the heads up on the ginger candies. I'll definitely check them out. :)

Yeah, thank you for the tip, Jennifer!

I just figured out a couple of interesting connections
between stuff we've been talking about in this thread:

1. the chanca piedra is the Spanish name for the same herb, amalaki,
which is one of the main constituents
of Triphala--the Ayurvedic traditional tonic I mention upthread--
and which I've already been taking for a few days now

2. SaltGirl was saying how vitamin C really helped her with her galling :) issues;
well, amalaki is SUPER high in vitamin C--
like one of the highest sources there is.
And if some of the things I've read about it are true,
it is an especially healthy form of vitamin C.

Well...one thing just occurred to me:
I somehow have the idea that the amalaki used in Triphala comes from the fruit of the plant.
But I likewise somehow have the notion that the chanca piedra in the "Stonebreader" tincture
I just bought and dosed up on
comes from the leaves.
I could be completely wrong in those vague ideas I find lodged in my brain--
will have to delve into these things more carefully tomorrow.

Still...some interesting confluences.

 

[michael94]

Thank you for those ideas, icecream!
I will definitely explore further this whole world of liver/gallbladder flushes.
And if there are others who have experiences in this realm,
I would be very interested to hear about them.

I seems like trying the chanca piedra--which is supposed to, over time, break up/dissolve stones--
would be a good thing to try before any liver/gallbladder flushing.
Have you ever tried that?

I just picked up a couple small bottle of the tincture at Whole Foods,
and took my first dose a few minutes ago.

No narouz but it appears to be a very helpful herb for kidney and liver health. Do share whether you find it helpful or not. Andreas Moritz also reports that epsom salts alone can be used to stop a gallbladder attack, so it may be good to have on hand ( dose is about 2 teaspoons in a glass of water ). Magnesium citrate is an alternative. Both work by relaxing the liver/gallbladder ducts so pressure can be relieved and stones move more freely.

 

[michael94]

One other thing to add. Epsom salts, aside from relaxing liver/gallbladder, are quite good at combining with and expelling toxins/waste in the small/large intestine. I have followed a "colon cleanse" technique (in addition to several liver flushes ) as described here: Healing, Anti-Aging, and Yoga: Miracle of Epsom Salt - Colon Cleanse - Rid toxins from your body!!!
and I am by far the healthiest I've been in a long while. My eyes are returning back to their natural color, skin looks healthier (glow), etc.

 

[michael94]

@Jennifer

 

[Jennifer]

Well...one thing just occurred to me:
I somehow have the idea that the amalaki used in Triphala comes from the fruit of the plant.
But I likewise somehow have the notion that the chanca piedra in the "Stonebreader" tincture
I just bought and dosed up on
comes from the leaves.
I could be completely wrong in those vague ideas I find lodged in my brain--
will have to delve into these things more carefully tomorrow.

No, I think you're right, narouz. On the back of my bottle it says the tincture is made from the leaves.

One other thing to add. Epsom salts, aside from relaxing liver/gallbladder, are quite good at combining with and expelling toxins/waste in the small/large intestine. I have followed a "colon cleanse" technique (in addition to several liver flushes ) as described here: Healing, Anti-Aging, and Yoga: Miracle of Epsom Salt - Colon Cleanse - Rid toxins from your body!!!
and I am by far the healthiest I've been in a long while. My eyes are returning back to their natural color, skin looks healthier (glow), etc.

Your eyes are changing color, too? Mine are turning green. Most of my life they've been almost black, but when I did 80/10/10, they started turning light brown. Since going mostly raw in January, the brown has broken up, revealing large patches of green.

 

[michael94]

Yes similar story with mine Jennifer, hope you are well...

For my next liver flush I think I'm going to use Dr. Kelley method, which is the same as Andreas Moritz' but with an addition cup of heavy cream (or a very big serving of carrageenan free vanilla ice cream) and berries before the olive oil mixture. Dr. Kelley reports this helps clean the liver even deeper than just the olive oil/lemon mixture alone. I'm finding it quite fun to experiment with all these different types of flushes...lol. I will try to take pictures this time should be about a week from now.

 

[narouz]

With these "liver" flushes using magnesium (epsom salts) and oil...
I see how they would, obviously, "flush" the intestines--and quite dramatically I expect.
But...I guess I'd like to see a little more evidence that they flush the liver and gallbladder.

Peat has talked about how the...forget the guy's name now:
mid-last century had a protocol for clearing out the intestines
which included some steep volume of oil, but no magnesium.
And Peat says this is a rational way to push things in the right direction--
by clearing the gut.
But he doesn't talk about the liver getting cleared as well.
Doesn't mean it doesn't happen, but...

 

[narouz]

Interesting article on chanca piedra...

Chanca Piedra (Break-Stone): Overview
Alternative Names: Break-Stone.

Chanca Piedra, grown in the rainforest, has been used by Peruvian herbalist as a treatment for gallstones and kidney stones, urinary infections, hepatitis B, A, C, and antiviral applications for generations.

Chanca Piedra is a composite name, "chanca" meaning "to break" in Quechua and "piedra" meaning "stone" in Spanish.

Chanca Piedra is the popular name given to several small shrub-like plants in the Phyllanthus genus (botanical family Euphorbiaceae), including Phyllanthus niruri, and Phyllanthus stipulatis. These two species have the same medicinal effects and look identical, except for their seeds, by which the botanist can tell them apart. A third species, Phyllanthus amarus, has been considered identical (perhaps not a different species at all) to Phyllanthus niruri.

Function; Why it is Recommended
Chanca Piedra has a great number of organic acids that after its ingestion pass through thekidney and are rapidly filtered by the glomeruli, avoiding its re-absorption. Chanca Piedra increases the solubility of alkaline salts and help to maintain normal bacterial levels in the urogenital tract. The phenolic component that it has, have been identified as a strong antioxidant. It is also known its hepatoprotector effect on the Hepatitis type B, C, A, herpes, and HIV.

Chanca Piedra has been proven in scientific studies to have antihepatotoxic, antispasmodic,antiviral, bactericidal, febrifugal, and hypoglycemic activity. It is believed to help stimulate the production of bile and to promote healthy liver, kidney and gall bladder function.

Research done in Brazil at the Federal University of Santa Catarina in 1984 on Chanca Piedra revealed an alkaloid (phyllanthoside) in the leaves and stem with strong antispasmodic activity. It served as a relaxing agent for smooth muscles and they concluded that its spasmolytic action probably accounted for the efficacy of chanca piedra in expelling stones. Brazilian researchers have also discovered powerful, long-lasting pain-blocking activity in the roots.

The analgesic activity of Chanca Piedra was demonstrated in 1994 and 1995 by another research group in Brazil. The diuretic, hypotensive and hypoglycemic effects of Phyllanthus niruri were documented in a 1995 human study, which showed a significant diuretic effect, and a significant reduction in systolic blood pressure in non-diabetic hypertensive and female subjects. Blood glucose was also significantly reduced in diabetic patients taking Chanca Piedra for 10 days. It is also considered an immune system stimulator.

The plant is shredded and boiled and then lemon juice is added as a tonic for the liver (taken in small amounts four times daily). It is also traditionally used to clear obstructions throughout the various internal organs of the body by promoting the elimination of mucus and stones.

In different areas of South America, Chanca Piedra is used to treat a wide variety of conditions. It is used to treat edema and excess uric acid (as in gout), as well as to treat stones of the gall bladder, kidney, and bladder. In some areas, it is used to treat malaria, typhoid fever, flu, colds, constipation, dysentery, or stomach ache. It is also used there, for inflammation of the bowels (IBS), pimples, diabetes, and ulcers.

Chanca Piedra has also traditionally been used for diabetes, prostate disorders, asthma, fever,tumors, bladder infections, as a diuretic, for painful joints, jaundice, indigestion, vaginitis, viruses of the reproductive tract, proctitis, poor circulation, excessive phlegm, bronchitis, and coughs. It is also considered an anti-spasmodic and muscle relaxant, specific to the urinary tract system.

Traditionally it is also used as an anodyne (pain reliever), aperitif (appetite stimulator), a digestive, carminative (helps gas to be expelled from stomach and intestines), and vermifuge (expels worms and other parasites from the intestinal tract), diuretic, and emmenagogue (stimulates menstrual flow).

Modern life has stressed the liver of the average person. Chanca Piedra can be used, cycling on and off throughout the year, to assist the liver in performing its normal function of detoxification of the body. Liver stressors include eating excessive dairy, meat, and sugar, fried fast foods, processed foods with preservatives, antibiotics, pesticides, drinking water "decontaminated" by chlorine, drinking water containing parasites, the use of hormones in young women as contraception and in menopausal women as a means of preventingosteoporosis and heart disease, the use of steroid hormones to combat chronic inflammatorydiseases, and the use of toxic chemotherapies to combat cancer.

Break-Stone gained world-wide attention in the late 1980s due to the plant's antiviral activity against Hepatitis B. Preliminary clinical trials with P. niruri on children with infective hepatitis using an Indian drug containing Phyllanthus amarus is as the main ingredient showed promising results which fueled the subsequent in vitro and in vivo studies. The in vitro inactivation of Hepatitis B by Break-Stone was reported in India in 1982. A study that followed indicated that in vivo, Break-Stone eliminated Hepatitis B in mammals within 3-6 weeks. Several subsequent studies in the late 1980s and early 1990s failed to produce any effect against hepatitis, but other research conducted from 1990 to 1995 has indicated that Chanca Piedra does demonstrate antiviral activity against Hepatitis B.

Phyllanthus niruri/amarus is considered, based on accumulated research, as the most effective natural, non-toxic remedy for the Hepatitis B virus, a pathogen now carried by hundreds of millions people around the world.

Research during the 1990s on Break-Stone revealed that its antiviral activity extends to human immunodeficiency virus (HIV). A Japanese research group discovered Phyllanthus niruri's HIV-1 reverse transcriptase inhibition properties in 1992 with a simple water extract of the plant. Bristol-Myers Squibb's Pharmaceutical Research Institute isolated at least one of the constituents in the plant responsible for this activity – a novel compound which they named "niruside" and described in a 1996 study.

Side-Effects; Counter-Indicators and Warnings
There has been no toxicity reported in any of the clinical studies, nor have there been any side-effects reported, except for an occasional case of cramps during the expulsion of stones from the use of the whole plant either as a tea or in "crude" (whole plant) extracts in capsules. If cramping occurs, dosage can be cut in half.

Chanca Piedra (Break-Stone) - Why it is Recommended

 

[Wagner83]

This is interesting has anyone more first hand experience to share? I have seen extremely positive as well as very negative reviews on amazon for both for kidney stones and gallstones. It's always difficult to know where the truth lies in amazon reviews..

 

[EIRE24]

I'm sorry to hear about your gallbladder attack, narouz.

My cousin just had hers removed after a couple years of trying to hold onto it using ACV. Unfortunately, I didn't find out in time or else I would of suggested she look into having the stones broken up via ultrasound waves (Lithotripsy). Of course, it wouldn't have targeted the root cause, but at least she could of found relief without having to resort to surgery.

When I was having frequent gallbladder pains, Ray suggested belladonna to relax the gallbladder and some olive oil to trigger bile and the release of stones. I tried that for a while but was still having random pains so I took an herbal tincture of chanca piedra, also known as stone breaker, and so far so good. I haven't had an issue since. I don't know if that herb is Ray approved, though.

And +1 for Lindsay's ginger suggestion. Marshmallow root/leaf and ginger teas have all worked really well to calm an upset stomach when I've had one.

Jennifer, how did you get rid of these pains?

 

[Jennifer]

Jennifer, how did you get rid of these pains?

An herbal liver and gallbladder formula, the chanca piedra tincture, an herbal antimicrobial formula and sticking to only the low-fat fruits and non-starchy veggies for an extended period. Once the pains were gone, I slowly added in avocados and olives and then coconut. For some reason, coconut hurt my gallbladder the most out of those fat sources.

 

[ddjd]

Some gallbladder sites say cheese is a difficult for a struggling/attacking gallbladder.

5 days into trialling zero dairy I've got an aching pain from my gall bladder. Not unbearable but constant