Fruit Intermittent Fasting

Inaut

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@Tarmander just discovered your podcast hub. Looking forward to checking it out.
 

Inaut

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Thanks Amigo! Let me know what you think.

Really liked the interview. You have a good interviewing style and Tim did an excellent job giving detailed yet absorbable responses.

Looking forward to burning through some of your previous episodes.

Keep up the good work.
 

Tarmander

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Really liked the interview. You have a good interviewing style and Tim did an excellent job giving detailed yet absorbable responses.

Looking forward to burning through some of your previous episodes.

Keep up the good work.
Appreciate it...people seem to like the dopamine episode, I think around 28, and although off topic, episode 40 is pretty cool about interrogation.
 

postman

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"Positive thinking" is a fraud. Sounds a bit like this guy is blaming failed coching on clients being negative. Optimism comes after health, not the other way around. I think it's probably very rare for someone unwilling to seek out a coach. Any kind of blaming the patient/client is dangerous territory because it's basically an unfalsifiable assertion and it might reinforce bad thinking or bad protocols. Maybe I read too much into it but I'm allergic to this sort of stuff, it really is pushing the cart in front of the horse and you can shut off the internal guidance mechanism by pushing any kind of thinking, even if it's positive.
 

Tarmander

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Found it on spotify podcasts... Thumbs up :)

I am curious, do they put their own ads into the episode? I think stitcher does.

How can any kind of fasting be considered peaty
Well you eat fruit during your "fasting" period, so it is a bit of a work around.

"Positive thinking" is a fraud. Sounds a bit like this guy is blaming failed coching on clients being negative. Optimism comes after health, not the other way around. I think it's probably very rare for someone unwilling to seek out a coach. Any kind of blaming the patient/client is dangerous territory because it's basically an unfalsifiable assertion and it might reinforce bad thinking or bad protocols. Maybe I read too much into it but I'm allergic to this sort of stuff, it really is pushing the cart in front of the horse and you can shut off the internal guidance mechanism by pushing any kind of thinking, even if it's positive.

I think if you had asked me a few years ago I would have agreed with you. However there is a roundabout way "positive thinking" makes sense.

One of the best things for my health was finding a group of people who loved and supported me. I have been able to get advice and take concerns to them, and really grown in trust with this group of people. If I was negative all the time, a downer, I would not have been so easily accepted into the group. I have had to shift some of my internal cynicism to be with them as they are all incredibly positive and energetic. Health is definitely a part of being positive, but it isn't everything.

I also agree that if a coach was super pushing me to be positive all the time, I would drop them. I would want results, not a therapist.
 

sugarbabe

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I am curious, do they put their own ads into the episode? I think stitcher does.


Well you eat fruit during your "fasting" period, so it is a bit of a work around.



I think if you had asked me a few years ago I would have agreed with you. However there is a roundabout way "positive thinking" makes sense.

One of the best things for my health was finding a group of people who loved and supported me. I have been able to get advice and take concerns to them, and really grown in trust with this group of people. If I was negative all the time, a downer, I would not have been so easily accepted into the group. I have had to shift some of my internal cynicism to be with them as they are all incredibly positive and energetic. Health is definitely a part of being positive, but it isn't everything.

I also agree that if a coach was super pushing me to be positive all the time, I would drop them. I would want results, not a therapist.
How did you find this group of people? Are they also interested in being healthy?
 

TheSir

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"Positive thinking" is a fraud.
100% agree with this. Psychology follows physiology. A "positive" mental state is an organic process, it is simply a manifestation of good health.
Both are in an intricate feedback loop with each other. Your state of health is influenced by your attitude and your attitude is influenced by your state of health. This is because neither psychology or physiology are separate entities. They are, in essence, the same entity. And within this entity, everything affects everything. You can eat the healthiest diet in the world, yet if you are lonely and experience no meaning in your life, you will be worse off than someone who drinks a litre of vodka every day and wakes up with gratitude each morning and is surrounded by loving friends.

Ever heard of placebo? People can be tricked into curing their own illnesses by nothing but thought. Saying that psychology follows physiology or vice versa is black-and-white thinking, which can never be correct.
 

postman

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Both are in an intricate feedback loop with each other. Your state of health is influenced by your attitude and your attitude is influenced by your state of health. This is because neither psychology or physiology are separate entities. They are, in essence, the same entity. And within this entity, everything affects everything. You can eat the healthiest diet in the world, yet if you are lonely and experience no meaning in your life, you will be worse off than someone who drinks a litre of vodka every day and wakes up with gratitude each morning and is surrounded by loving friends.

Ever heard of placebo? People can be tricked into curing their own illnesses by nothing but thought. Saying that psychology follows physiology or vice versa is black-and-white thinking, which can never be correct.
Vodka is a pretty good medicine. Instead compare someone who is sober and seriously ill but in good company vs someone in excellent health but lonely. Having experienced both I think physical pain is a lot worse than social pain. I really don't think they're comparable. Additionally, if you're lonely but healthy, you are well equipped to solve that loneliness problem. If you're ill but in good company it's a much harder problem to solve, the fact that you're in company with people might even make it harder for you to get well because of cultural and social pressures to conform. Saying that black-and white thinking cannot be correct is black-and-white thinking. Yes it's a feedback loop that goes around. But seriously, it's seriously very hard to be in a bad state psychologically when your physiology is doing well. Even if your life is objectively miserable it's ok because you become very stress-tolerant.
 

Lollipop2

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@Tarmander didn’t Ray Peat mention about using juice during “fasting” or long time between food as preferable to “fasting”? I clearly remember him stating that which supports this idea. Forgive me, but I can not remember which interview I heard him talk about it.
 

homyak

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Both are in an intricate feedback loop with each other. Your state of health is influenced by your attitude and your attitude is influenced by your state of health. This is because neither psychology or physiology are separate entities. They are, in essence, the same entity. And within this entity, everything affects everything. You can eat the healthiest diet in the world, yet if you are lonely and experience no meaning in your life, you will be worse off than someone who drinks a litre of vodka every day and wakes up with gratitude each morning and is surrounded by loving friends.

Ever heard of placebo? People can be tricked into curing their own illnesses by nothing but thought. Saying that psychology follows physiology or vice versa is black-and-white thinking, which can never be correct.

A healthy diet is not indicative of health, it is much more complex. To pursue any form of "meaning", you have to fulfill your lower needs (health); of course, there are always exceptions, but generally this a fact. I agree with you that psychology and physiology are not separate entities, but the latter has a far greater influence on the former. Yes, placebo is real, but it is not a reliable course of action for a person who is trying to fix a chronic mental illness. I would recommend directly fixing the underlying physiology, rather than trying to induce a placebo effect. The mantra "just think positive" is not an effective way to address an underlying health problem, which will have far greater effects than "positive thinking".
 

TheSir

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Saying that black-and white thinking cannot be correct is black-and-white thinking.
Yet still true :D

A healthy diet is not indicative of health, it is much more complex. To pursue any form of "meaning", you have to fulfill your lower needs (health); of course, there are always exceptions, but generally this a fact. I agree with you that psychology and physiology are not separate entities, but the latter has a far greater influence on the former. Yes, placebo is real, but it is not a reliable course of action for a person who is trying to fix a chronic mental illness. I would recommend directly fixing the underlying physiology, rather than trying to induce a placebo effect. The mantra "just think positive" is not an effective way to address an underlying health problem, which will have far greater effects than "positive thinking".
Fair enough.
 

Tarmander

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@Tarmander didn’t Ray Peat mention about using juice during “fasting” or long time between food as preferable to “fasting”? I clearly remember him stating that which supports this idea. Forgive me, but I can not remember which interview I heard him talk about it.
Not sure, never heard that.

How did you find this group of people? Are they also interested in being healthy?
Some are interested in being healthy. There are a few big fans of the podcast in there...mostly moms who have a lot of kids and have to solve "problems"

It is a small house church, maybe a couple dozen people max, and it was definitely off the radar. I was looking, going to different churches...most had a terrible feel and message. I do not understand how people can go to most churches these days. But I heard about this small group from my cousin who went...and they are all about love and have strong male leaders. It has really made a big difference in my health.
 

milkboi

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Vodka is a pretty good medicine. Instead compare someone who is sober and seriously ill but in good company vs someone in excellent health but lonely. Having experienced both I think physical pain is a lot worse than social pain. I really don't think they're comparable. Additionally, if you're lonely but healthy, you are well equipped to solve that loneliness problem. If you're ill but in good company it's a much harder problem to solve, the fact that you're in company with people might even make it harder for you to get well because of cultural and social pressures to conform. Saying that black-and white thinking cannot be correct is black-and-white thinking. Yes it's a feedback loop that goes around. But seriously, it's seriously very hard to be in a bad state psychologically when your physiology is doing well. Even if your life is objectively miserable it's ok because you become very stress-tolerant.

100% agree
 

sugarbabe

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Not sure, never heard that.


Some are interested in being healthy. There are a few big fans of the podcast in there...mostly moms who have a lot of kids and have to solve "problems"

It is a small house church, maybe a couple dozen people max, and it was definitely off the radar. I was looking, going to different churches...most had a terrible feel and message. I do not understand how people can go to most churches these days. But I heard about this small group from my cousin who went...and they are all about love and have strong male leaders. It has really made a big difference in my health.
Wow that's great, that would be my ideal church. I can't stand the regular ones anymore left the church years go.
 
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