Fructose Exacerbates Hepatocellular Injury In Methionine-Choline Deficient Diets

Discussion in 'Scientific Studies' started by _lppaiva, Oct 10, 2019.

  1. _lppaiva

    _lppaiva Member

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    Dietary fructose exacerbates hepatocellular injury when incorporated into a methionine-choline-deficient diet. - PubMed - NCBI

    Being that most here are a fan of longevity, I think the general recommendation is to avoid methionine. I think this study is really important for anyone who relies heavily on fruit and sugar, being most of us here.

    I am not sure, however, if "depleation" of methionine by glycine has the same effect. Perhaps a diet "high" (with enough) methionine and an optimal ratio of glycine (and also the other non inflammatory aminoacids) might be the best of both worlds?

    "Mice fed MCD formulas developed similar degrees of hepatic steatosis whether they contained glucose or fructose. By contrast, mice fed MCD-fructose developed significantly more hepatocellular injury than mice fed MCD-glucose, judged by histology, apoptosis staining and serum alanine aminotransferase. Liver injury in MCD-fructose mice coincided with an exaggerated rise in the ratio of long-chain saturated to unsaturated fatty acids in the liver. Notably, hepatic inflammation was not enhanced in mice fed MCD-fructose, correlating instead with hepatic lipid peroxidation, which was equivalent in the two MCD groups."

    This kinda of bugged me out though:

    "The data suggest the enhanced cytotoxicity of fructose in the MCD model is related to its ability to stimulate de novo lipogenesis, which yields harmful long-chain saturated fatty acids."

    Wouldn't that be palmitic acid, which haidut has shown is protective?
     
  2. ExCarniv

    ExCarniv Member

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    Looking at Chronometer my ratio of Methionine:Glycine is like 1:4 so I'm not worrying to much.

    Other ratio is Pufa:SatFat and is almost 1:8.
     
  3. MeatOrchid

    MeatOrchid Member

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    Can you post a screenshot?
     
  4. ExCarniv

    ExCarniv Member

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    IMG_20191010_154111.jpgIMG_20191010_154003.jpg
     
  5. Samurai Peat

    Samurai Peat New Member

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    I think it's just the choline deficiency alone that's causing this. Choline and vit A and thyorid are required to make cholesterol and for steroidogenesis (pregnenalone and progesterone and testosterone and all that). I don't think methionine deficiency is a bad thing.
     
  6. ExCarniv

    ExCarniv Member

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    And I don't think having 2-3g per day is bad either if you have 2-3x Glycine to balance.
     
  7. OP
    _lppaiva

    _lppaiva Member

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    I am not sure how glycine consumption affects methionine status aka is there a difference between methionine deficiency and high glycine to methionine ratio? It is my understanding that methionine depletes glycine, not the other way around, so indeed perhaps having optimal glycine intake while also having proper methionine intake is better.

    Also, it is my understanding that regarding proteins,t importance is on ratios rather than specific amounts. Balancing methionine and cystine with gelatin and tryptophan with BCAA's and other aminoacids helps combat their downsides, but I am still looking it up.
     
  8. ExCarniv

    ExCarniv Member

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    For every gram of Methionine you need 2g of Glycine approximately I think that's what Chris Masterjohn said about balancing aminoacids.

    Most cuts of meat have a ratio of 1:2 of Methionine:Glycine, a couple extra grams from Gelatin is enough imo.
     
  9. Angel45

    Angel45 New Member

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    I only eat the yolks of the eggs so I can cut the PUFA in half. I have to eat extra choline and that's the only way I can think of not going over on PUFA. Still not eating liver only taking raw freeze dried liver in capsules...lol
     
  10. redsun

    redsun Member

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    The fat is only in the yolk, meaning the pufa is only located in the yolk. You are still getting the same amount of pufa as a whole egg. Personally I don't take issue with naturally occuring pufa in animal foods especially not the 1g in an egg but just letting you know if you do keep in mind you are still getting all the pufa.
     
  11. Angel45

    Angel45 New Member

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  12. OP
    _lppaiva

    _lppaiva Member

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    The whites also have methionine, which may support the liver further. I'd see no point in throwing the whites away, although haidut has said that the yolks are the most important part, and eating egg whites only doesn't make sense (my guess is tryptophan).

    I really need the choline also. I eat about two-three eggs in the morning, cooked in coconut oil to offset a little the PUFA
     
  13. ExCarniv

    ExCarniv Member

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    Pastured eggs have 2x Vitamin E,
    Pastured eggs naturally have 2.5x vitamin E than regular soy ones, so more E to offet the pufa, I wouldn't worry about the PUFAs in eggs.
     
  14. Hans

    Hans Member

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    Methionine is not bad. Peat thinks eating 100g+ protein is a good idea, with between 120-150g being "the best".
    Eating that much protein will help a great deal against fatty liver. Obviously micros such as copper and choline is very important as well.
     
  15. Tristan Loscha

    Tristan Loscha Member

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    yes.eat egggs.the entire thing is healthy.
     
  16. ExCarniv

    ExCarniv Member

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    Absolutely, liver, eggs, muscle meat and gelatine/glycine/bone broth all necessary for a healthy diet.

    I don't worry about methionine , pufas in eggs or iron in liver.
     
  17. OP
    _lppaiva

    _lppaiva Member

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    Mine arent pasture raised (yet). I got a scholarship to study in a rural area, so I'll have access to raw dairy and pasture eggs more easily (I am not so sure about it, because most people where I live, specially small farmers, aren't very knowledgeble about this. They may do it out of convinience, but wont market it as such, which makes them hard to find).

    Anyway, at least they won't come from unknown origins and I can choose better.
     
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