From Someone Dead You Can't Take Living Organs

[Giraffe]

Unnoticed by the public ... Switzerland is silently moving towards an opting out solution (= intention to donate is presumed).

Organspendegesetz in der Schweiz – Was man Euch bisher verschwiegen hat!

Besuche den Beitrag für mehr Info.

uncutnews.ch

 

[haidut]

Unnoticed by the public ... Switzerland is silently moving towards an opting out solution (= intention to donate is presumed).

Organspendegesetz in der Schweiz – Was man Euch bisher verschwiegen hat!

Besuche den Beitrag für mehr Info.

uncutnews.ch

Combined with their recent push to allow doctors in NZ, Switzerland, Belgium, Netherlands, etc to decide on behalf of the patient in regards to euthanasia, even in cases of survivable diseases like COVID-19, I'd say the stage is set for large-scale organ harvesting across all of the "developed" world.

 

[Dolomite]

My drivers license has a place to put a sticker if you are an organ donor. So anyone can place the sticker on there at any time. It really bothers me and I am trying to figure out how to make sure no one places a sticker for me. In the past you had to sign a line and actually designate what organ/s you were donating.

 

[L_C]

My drivers license has a place to put a sticker if you are an organ donor. So anyone can place the sticker on there at any time. It really bothers me and I am trying to figure out how to make sure no one places a sticker for me. In the past you had to sign a line and actually designate what organ/s you were donating.

What state are you in?

 

[L_C]

We all intuitively understand when a person is dead: the breathing stopped, the heart stopped beating and the body has become cold.

....

Here is a couple of things I came across reading about transplant medicine and listening to testimonials of parents who had agreed to organ donation after their son or daughter had been declared brain dead.

• Only a couple of hours after their son or daughter was hospitalized parents were asked if they agree with organ donation. The options they were given: (a) we stop life support, (b) we arrange for organ donation. (Important to understand: Once the hospital has declared the patient brain dead, the health insurance will not pay any further treatment.)
• The parents were not informed what organ procurement (aka harvesting) practically means.
• They were not informed what "brain dead" means. Requirements for diagnosis differ between countries, and some doctors say there is no such a thing as brain death: what we see is a coma. The parents knew nothing of this.
• The procedure to diagnose brain death includes that the patient is taken off pain killers and subjected to pain and stress.
• For me to be with my loved ones when they are dying is an important part of coming to accept their death, it is part of the grieving. To have your loved ones around when you die is consoling. All this is denied to organ donors and their loved ones.
• The patients who were declared brain dead looked like most other patients in ICU: they are sleeping, the body is warm, the heart is beating, they are mechanically ventilated ... To see them like this makes it harder for the parents to come to terms with their death, and often the announcement that the patient is dead (or brain dead) came very surprising.
• You can't get living organs from a person that has died. There would be blood clots that make the organs unusable. So during organ procurement surgery the organ donor is mechanically ventilated. The hands are fixated during the surgery. The surgeon cuts him open from throat to pubic bone. This is often followed by a raise in heart beat, blood pressure, sweating, reddening of the skin. These symptoms normally are considered as a sign of pain, but not in the so-called brain dead. (In Switzerland though they always give very heavy pain killers before they start.)
• The heart is the last organ that is taken out. Biological death occurs as the result of this surgery.
• Parents later beat themselves for having taken a decision without understanding the consequences. They think that they failed to protect their child. Several mothers (among them two nurses) described that they wanted to see their child again after organ procurement, and what they saw was a face that looked terrified.
• In cases where parents later thought "something doesn't add up" and demanded the hospital records it turned out that the diagnosis "brain dead" was questionable to say the least. And there are several reports of parents who refused to give in, and who successfully fought to get their child transferred to a different hospital. And guess what? These people are alive, and there were no lasting neurological issues.
• In some cases mother and father were not able to talk with each other about what has happened and how they feel. Many are traumatized for very many years.

......

"opting in policy" vs "opting out policy": In many countries you need to actively opt out if you decide not to donate your organs. In other countries (e.g. Germany, US) you need to opt in. Family members can be asked to take the decision for you if you have not declared what your wish is. If you are abroad the law of the country where you are is applicable.

.....


Here is an open letter in German:

Offener Brief über die dunkle Seite der Organspende

How does actually organ transplant surgery work? Let's say they want to take liver out of the 'brain dead' person. Must donor be physically next to a person who is a recipient of a new liver?

How are the organs sustained during time they cut a donor open and place a liver into a recipient? How long can an organ last without being oxygenated? Thank you.

 

[Giraffe]

How does actually organ transplant surgery work? Let's say they want to take liver out of the 'brain dead' person. Must donor be physically next to a person who is a recipient of a new liver?

How are the organs sustained during time they cut a donor open and place a liver into a recipient? How long can an organ last without being oxygenated? Thank you.

There are officers in hospitals whole sole purpose it is to enable and organize organ harvesting. They identify potential donors and report them to a central coordination unit. These officers have access to all patient information and do not need to get the treating physician's permission. If the approval of the family is needed, they talk to the unsuspecting family. They ensure that an operation theater is available. The donor is kept alive as long as needed. He may be given thyroid or whatever is useful to make his organs fitter. After harvesting the removed organs are kept cool for transport. The organs are viable for a couple of hours or up 36 hours depending on the organ. There is a list here.

 

[Herbie]

The medical industry is so sickening, one would have to be a psychopath to carry out these procedures and create these policy’s. If people weren’t so degenerated by ever worsening food and stress than none of this would exist.

 

[Dolomite]

What state are you in?

Missouri

 

[changeling188]

@haidut and others you may be interested in this article concerning euthanasia: The Lethal Corruption of Euthanasia – Quadrant Online

"Consider Belgium, next door to Holland, whose euthanasia law from 2002 states that the patient “must be suffering intractable and unbearable pain”. Thirteen years later, a review in the New Yorker shows how broad the criteria had become for euthanasia in Belgium, involving cases with no physical pain at all:[xviii]

Although most of the Belgian patients had cancer, people have also been euthanized because they had autism, anorexia, borderline personality disorder, chronic-fatigue syndrome, partial paralysis, blindness coupled with deafness, and manic depression.

In 2013, (psychiatrist) Wim Distelmans euthanized a forty-four-year-old transgender man, Nathan Verhelst, because Verhelst was devastated by the failure of his sex-change surgeries; he said that he felt like a monster when he looked in the mirror. “Farewell, everybody,” Verhelst said from his hospital bed, seconds before receiving a lethal injection."

when the default progressive position is entropy and extinction under the guise of benevolence... though the sex change story is pretty comedic.

 

[changeling188]

medicine demonstrating its penchant for satanic narratives yet again

 

[changeling188]

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

We all intuitively understand when a person is dead: the breathing stopped, the heart stopped beating and the body has become cold.

....

Here is a couple of things I came across reading about transplant medicine and listening to testimonials of parents who had agreed to organ donation after their son or daughter had been declared brain dead.

• Only a couple of hours after their son or daughter was hospitalized parents were asked if they agree with organ donation. The options they were given: (a) we stop life support, (b) we arrange for organ donation. (Important to understand: Once the hospital has declared the patient brain dead, the health insurance will not pay any further treatment.)
• The parents were not informed what organ procurement (aka harvesting) practically means.
• They were not informed what "brain dead" means. Requirements for diagnosis differ between countries, and some doctors say there is no such a thing as brain death: what we see is a coma. The parents knew nothing of this.
• The procedure to diagnose brain death includes that the patient is taken off pain killers and subjected to pain and stress.
• For me to be with my loved ones when they are dying is an important part of coming to accept their death, it is part of the grieving. To have your loved ones around when you die is consoling. All this is denied to organ donors and their loved ones.
• The patients who were declared brain dead looked like most other patients in ICU: they are sleeping, the body is warm, the heart is beating, they are mechanically ventilated ... To see them like this makes it harder for the parents to come to terms with their death, and often the announcement that the patient is dead (or brain dead) came very surprising.
• You can't get living organs from a person that has died. There would be blood clots that make the organs unusable. So during organ procurement surgery the organ donor is mechanically ventilated. The hands are fixated during the surgery. The surgeon cuts him open from throat to pubic bone. This is often followed by a raise in heart beat, blood pressure, sweating, reddening of the skin. These symptoms normally are considered as a sign of pain, but not in the so-called brain dead. (In Switzerland though they always give very heavy pain killers before they start.)
• The heart is the last organ that is taken out. Biological death occurs as the result of this surgery.
• Parents later beat themselves for having taken a decision without understanding the consequences. They think that they failed to protect their child. Several mothers (among them two nurses) described that they wanted to see their child again after organ procurement, and what they saw was a face that looked terrified.
• In cases where parents later thought "something doesn't add up" and demanded the hospital records it turned out that the diagnosis "brain dead" was questionable to say the least. And there are several reports of parents who refused to give in, and who successfully fought to get their child transferred to a different hospital. And guess what? These people are alive, and there were no lasting neurological issues.
• In some cases mother and father were not able to talk with each other about what has happened and how they feel. Many are traumatized for very many years.

......

"opting in policy" vs "opting out policy": In many countries you need to actively opt out if you decide not to donate your organs. In other countries (e.g. Germany, US) you need to opt in. Family members can be asked to take the decision for you if you have not declared what your wish is. If you are abroad the law of the country where you are is applicable.

.....


Here is an open letter in German:

Offener Brief über die dunkle Seite der Organspende

Oh this was so gut wrenching to read Girraffe, especially about the "terrified look" on the donors face afterwards. I am speachless.

 

[Peatness]

The law around organ donation in England has changed. All adults in England are now considered to have agreed to be an organ donor when they die unless they have recorded a decision not to donate or are in one of the excluded groups. This is commonly referred to as an ‘opt out’ system. You may also hear it referred to as 'Max and Keira's Law'. You still have a choice whether or not you wish to become a donor.

What is the opt out system?

The law around organ donation is changing in England. This page answers to some of the most common questions about the coming law change regarding organ donation and the opt out system, including: How is the law changing? | What is Max and Keira's Law? | Why do we need an opt out system? | Am I...

www.organdonation.nhs.uk

Opt out here

Register your decision

You can opt in or opt out of becoming an organ donor by registering on the NHS Organ Donor Register. Register in minutes!

www.organdonation.nhs.uk

 

[haidut]

@haidut and others you may be interested in this article concerning euthanasia: The Lethal Corruption of Euthanasia – Quadrant Online

"Consider Belgium, next door to Holland, whose euthanasia law from 2002 states that the patient “must be suffering intractable and unbearable pain”. Thirteen years later, a review in the New Yorker shows how broad the criteria had become for euthanasia in Belgium, involving cases with no physical pain at all:[xviii]

Although most of the Belgian patients had cancer, people have also been euthanized because they had autism, anorexia, borderline personality disorder, chronic-fatigue syndrome, partial paralysis, blindness coupled with deafness, and manic depression.

In 2013, (psychiatrist) Wim Distelmans euthanized a forty-four-year-old transgender man, Nathan Verhelst, because Verhelst was devastated by the failure of his sex-change surgeries; he said that he felt like a monster when he looked in the mirror. “Farewell, everybody,” Verhelst said from his hospital bed, seconds before receiving a lethal injection."

when the default progressive position is entropy and extinction under the guise of benevolence... though the sex change story is pretty comedic.

Yeah, it is already out of control. The last case I saw and posted about was 2 Belgian brothers in their 40s - blind, but not deaf, and in perfectly good cognitive and phsyical capacities. The original idea of euthanasia was to end the suffering of terminally ill people who are about to die anyways, for which some arguments can be made in favor. However, it has now degenerated into also assisting the death of people who simply want (or are coached) to die, without any physiological evidence that they are terminal. In 5 years, it would probably be considered normal to euthanize a baby if his/her parents decide to do so, and in more totalitarian places if the state decides so. From there, it is only a short step from the powers that be deciding on a daily basis who lives and dies, purely on a whim.
There was an article in The Atlantic (of all places!) about how the world was reverting back to absolute monarchies, where the royals decided who lives and dies purely on a whim, without much/any evidence, and often solely because the royal felt like his/her power entitled them to such decisions. The elite these days probably feels even more powerful than past royals, considering the technology at its disposal. So, I am not surprised we are going again in that direction. Why would the elite bother with pesky things like laws and evidence if they can circumvent it all with a medical excuse/tyranny? On that note, we can all expect more medical emergencies in the near future. Barring that, WW3 is probably next.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Yeah, it is already out of control. The last case I saw and posted about was 2 Belgian brothers in their 40s - blind, but not deaf, and in perfectly good cognitive and phsyical capacities. The original idea of euthanasia was to end the suffering of terminally ill people who are about to die anyways, for which some arguments can be made in favor. However, it has now degenerated into also assisting the death of people who simply want (or are coached) to die, without any physiological evidence that they are terminal. In 5 years, it would probably be considered normal to euthanize a baby if his/her parents decide to do so, and in more totalitarian places if the state decides so. From there, it is only a short step from the powers that be deciding on a daily basis who lives and dies, purely on a whim.
There was an article in The Atlantic (of all places!) about how the world was reverting back to absolute monarchies, where the royals decided who lives and dies purely on a whim, without much/any evidence, and often solely because the royal felt like his/her power entitled them to such decisions. The elite these days probably feels even more powerful than past royals, considering the technology at its disposal. So, I am not surprised we are going again in that direction. Why would the elite bother with pesky things like laws and evidence if they can circumvent it all with a medical excuse/tyranny? On that note, we can all expect more medical emergencies in the near future. Barring that, WW3 is probably next.

"Off with their heads!"

 

[tankasnowgod]

In 5 years, it would probably be considered normal to euthanize a baby if his/her parents decide to do so, and in more totalitarian places if the state decides so. From there, it is only a short step from the powers that be deciding on a daily basis who lives and dies, purely on a whim.

Remember former Virginia Governor Ralph Northam's comments? (especially at 1:10-1:40)


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQ7ySa9xAto


Now, he doesn't explicitly state "we would kill the infant after delivery" or "a post birth abortion is acceptable," but he's clearly suggesting such a thing in his comments, especially based on the context. What conversation, exactly, is taking place while the infant is "kept comfortable?" And to say "the infant would be resuscitated IF THAT'S WHAT THE MOTHER AND FAMILY DESIRED..."

So wait..... if the mother doesn't care if the infant is resuscitated, everyone is just supposed to let a now TOTALLY INDEPENDENT HUMAN just die? At that point, there isn't any conceivable argument that this is something being done to the mother's body, seeing as the baby is OUTSIDE of the mother's body. There is no excuse for that, the baby is now alive on it's own, and with things like adoption and Child Protective Services, there is an obvious attempt to give children that are unwanted by their birth parents a chance at life.

 

[Giraffe]

Unnoticed by the public ... Switzerland is silently moving towards an opting out solution (= intention to donate is presumed).

Organspendegesetz in der Schweiz – Was man Euch bisher verschwiegen hat!

Besuche den Beitrag für mehr Info.

uncutnews.ch

Information for people in Switzerland (German and French):

Ärzte und Pflegefachpersonen gegen Organspende am Lebensende | Äpol | Winterthur

Spendern werden ihre lebenden Organe, das lebende Herz aus dem Körper geschnitten. Sie sind nur laut Gesetz, nicht aber biologisch tot und werden durch die Organentnahme getötet. ÄPOL, Winterthur, Schweiz, Organspende Nein, Argumente gegen/contra Organspende

www.aepol.net

 

[Peatness]

Information for people in Switzerland (German and French):

Ärzte und Pflegefachpersonen gegen Organspende am Lebensende | Äpol | Winterthur

Spendern werden ihre lebenden Organe, das lebende Herz aus dem Körper geschnitten. Sie sind nur laut Gesetz, nicht aber biologisch tot und werden durch die Organentnahme getötet. ÄPOL, Winterthur, Schweiz, Organspende Nein, Argumente gegen/contra Organspende

www.aepol.net

In the UK, England at least, you have to opt out

 

[VitoScaletta]

@haidut and others you may be interested in this article concerning euthanasia: The Lethal Corruption of Euthanasia – Quadrant Online

"Consider Belgium, next door to Holland, whose euthanasia law from 2002 states that the patient “must be suffering intractable and unbearable pain”. Thirteen years later, a review in the New Yorker shows how broad the criteria had become for euthanasia in Belgium, involving cases with no physical pain at all:[xviii]

Although most of the Belgian patients had cancer, people have also been euthanized because they had autism, anorexia, borderline personality disorder, chronic-fatigue syndrome, partial paralysis, blindness coupled with deafness, and manic depression.

In 2013, (psychiatrist) Wim Distelmans euthanized a forty-four-year-old transgender man, Nathan Verhelst, because Verhelst was devastated by the failure of his sex-change surgeries; he said that he felt like a monster when he looked in the mirror. “Farewell, everybody,” Verhelst said from his hospital bed, seconds before receiving a lethal injection."

when the default progressive position is entropy and extinction under the guise of benevolence... though the sex change story is pretty comedic.

Well said sir

 

[VitoScaletta]

This thread is horrifying.