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EXCLUSIVE: Evidence Shows Director General Of WHO Overstated The Fatality Rate Of The Coronavirus

  1. "In summary, President Trump was right when he said the WHO’s coronavirus fatality rate was much too high.

    Evidence proves the coronavirus is not as deadly as what was reported by the WHO and is continually repeated in the media.

    In fact, current data shows it is not as deadly as the flu. The elderly and the sick should be concerned and protected. Everyone else has little to worry about.

    Again, don’t believe what the media is telling you. They are lying again."



    Rest of article at link:
    EXCLUSIVE: Evidence Shows Director General of World Health Organization Severely Overstated the Fatality Rate of the Coronavirus Leading to the Greatest Global Panic in History
     
  2. But isn't it much more contagious than the flu (just guessing since I have seen they expect 40-70% of people to get covid-19 in the U.S.) which could be 150+ million people in the U.S. alone. Sick people go to the ER/hospital (regardless whether should be or not) which is going put tremendous strain on the hospital/healthcare system and lead to all sorts of problems. The main issue at hand appears to be controlling the spread of it over time, not necessarily the mortality rate (although this is obviously critical as well).
     
  3. Don't know what that prediction is based on, but the 40-70% prediction is insane. It probably won't be based on "testing" since I doubt even 40 million people will bother with that test. Even in Wuhan, the epicenter, the temporary hospitals have been removed, because new cases have slowed, and the vast majority have recovered. The idea that it will put "tremendous strain" on the healthcare system isn't too likely. There might be a few cities that have issues in a few area for week or so (as frequently happens), but nothing staggering, certainly not hundreds of thousands in hospitals all around the country.

    This just appears to be another over hyped fake pandemic.
     
  4. Plus I'm wondering how many of the pneumonia deaths are really influenza + underlying condition such as "ordinary" coronavirus. If like me you've had a bad cold in late 2019 that took several weeks to get over, what exactly was it?
     
  5. New cases have slowed because the city has been on lockdown. And if this spreads among the elderly too quickly, many would require hospitalization (guessing) which would strain the healthcare system.
     
  6. The basic reproduction number R0 is a mathematical model (with lots of assumptions) used in epidemiology. For CoV-2 the R0 is estimated to be around 3. This means that when two out of three (67 %) have become immune (thanks to prior infection) the infection stops to spread. - This is what is communicated here in Germany.
     
  7. That's quite an assumption. Especially seeing as all diseases, both infectious and noninfectious, slow down in spring and summer months, lockdown or not. A lockdown likely did nothing, as most Chinese patients were diagnosed by CT Scan, which can detect pneumonia, but didn't even check for the presence of any virus, let alone COVID 19.
     
  8. CoV-2, is this same as CoV-19?
     
  9. Yes. I mean SARS-CoV-2 (formerly known as 2019-nCoV). The disease is Covid-19.
     
  10. Early information about fatality rates is necessarily imperfect, because data is limited. Data is still limited, so they still don't know the real fatality rate.

    Uncertainty is because:
    - limited testing means we don't know how many people have been infected but had little or no symptoms. The case fatality rate is based on identified cases. It may turn out to be higher than the actual fatality rate.
    - it is still spreading fast, and of the current cases, we don't know how many will survive. The case fatality rate may increase as currently ill people die, or if treatment conditions worsen.
    - conditions, methods and availability of treatment vary from country to country etc

    It doesn't mean people reporting case fatality rates were lying, just that not everyone understood what they meant. Anyone who claims they know the long term real fatality rate ahead of time with certainty is being unrealistic at best.
     
  11. Quite an assumption? Seems like common sense to me and not sure how you could argue that limiting human to human contact would limit transmission? But good day
     
  12. Well, because it's never been done before to this degree in history, and yet you see the same patterns every spring and summer in every disease, as I mentioned. Also, considering the fact that, in China, they weren't even looking for any virus, simply diagnosing pneumonia with a CT Scan, and labeling them "COVID-19." Pneumonia can have all sorts of causes, both viral and non-viral. It also seems like common sense that you would need to establish the presence of a virus in a person before you could diagnose them with that virus. So good day to you as well.
     
  13. Bingo

    If it spreads as easily as it seems, I bet we have been dealing with it in pockets awhile now
     
  14. I think you just have to look at the Diamond Princess. Those people were kidnapped and held hostage under the false idea of "quarantine," and locked into their rooms 22-23 hours a day. That was a perfect viral incubator, and even then, they could only manage a 0.5% death rate, and infect 712 people of 3500.
     
  15. It's common to list pneumonia as cause of death even if it's not flu-related. Nor even respiratory-related.

    It's the medical way of saying "End of story, moving on to the next victim."
     
  16. Thanks. Just making sure if I have updated to the latest and greatest version.
     
  17. Well we now have other fears looming. Economic collapse, global depression, erosion of personal freedoms in the name of “safety”, to name a few. Wasn’t the Patriot Act supposed to be temporary? We have half the population pleading with the government to lock us up in our homes. For how long? No one seems to care. I am genuinely more concerned about projections of 20% unemployment, swathes of airlines bankrupt, one hundred thousand jobs lost in only a few weeks. The cautionary principle in the form of extreme isolation measures may have costs extending many years into the future, the scale of which we have no idea, and against a virus which may not warrant it, save for the screeching media who, make no mistake, are one of the few groups benefiting from the panic.
     
  18. Or it's a good time to have a real vacation in your own home. It can be stress-free. May also find the time to clear the garage or get the things you piled up in the garage primed and ready to live the life you want to live. Minus the distraction of being a couch potato watching sports all day.
     
  19. Whole EU is closed up as of now. Nobody is allowed in. People landing in airports who are non EU citizens are not let in.

    Comment section of german news channels is concerning. People are begging for the government to impose a ban on going out of the house and punish people who still do it. Ridiculous.
     
  20. The government in my country is going to provide 75 million doses of vaccines for the influenza virus to the population. Old people, pregnant women, children and those with health problems are the main targets of this vaccination campaign. Pretty much all the people who should be avoiding vaccines like the plague.

    "Please enslave us! And punish the ones who don't like it.". It's scary how powerful brainwashing can be.

    I've seen people in the comments of Brazilian news on youtube saying "we're screwed" and things like that, but I've also seen people who can see though the smokescreen, which is a relief. They're questioning why the government isn't reporting the other deaths that happen daily, while giving huge publicity to one death supposedly caused by this new virus. The tests are unreliable to say the least, and the person had diabetes and hypertension. He was already sick. Who know what he really died of. And they may very well be lying about this cause of death, just to make people even more afraid. They officially said on the news that the next few months will be very stressful for the population. Whoever is behind this situation is a pure trash. Stressing out people like this.
     
  21. Problem is countries with many foreign workers like Italy caused a massive fleeing of people which carried the virus in eastern Europe., that is the reason why all infected people are "returning home" aka running away from Spain, Italy, Germany. Literally the infected ones are all people from the west Europe coming to eastern Europe and they families or who they were in close contact. And I see sick people simply do not care to quarantine themselves, some people refuse to believe there is a virus and attack authorities, violence happens. Of course these are only several cases that I know personally of, however enough to cause a government to call for national emergency. Think about many times of the guy who was found positive with the virus and the next day took a plane to eastern europe, this is what some people knowing they have the virus do, just go in the open carelessly, they do not self quarantine.
     
  22. By that logic shouldn’t we lock the whole world down every flu season? So far the flu is far deadlier with estimated 650,000 deaths this season.
     
  23. This was a confirmed case from the hospital, he did not care and went around and interacted with people everywhere.
    Would you go around planes and airports knowing with lab tests you have the virus like this guy did?
     
  24. indeed,and because such diamond princess is a huge piece of Architecture,it has to
    be artificially ventilated,hence assured viral exposure of the hostages.

    S.Korea reports 1% fatality,with the same problems of still-too-low general testing.
    the highly symptomatic infected are overrepresented.
     
  25. Or is big business trying to normalize the new,now to be expected general
    immune-weakness that is coming from suggested vegan or SAD-based diets.
     
  26. Isn't there a study that gives us last year/s figures on flu deaths and pneumonia deaths, for the first 3 months, for each country? This way, we can look at this year's fatalities attributed to COVID-2019 in a better perspective? We would at least be able to tell how badly the numbers are off, if ever, if the numbers are lumping in flu and pneumonia deaths into the total for COVID-2019.
     
  27. I don't understand why the mortality rates even matter at this point. Also don't understand why people liken it to the seasonal flu. The problem is not the death rate nor the type of flu. The problem is that there is a contagion going around which is overloading hospital resources and in Italy and Wuhan, people are unable to get access to health care despite what they are suffering from... which is what we are trying to prevent in the US. The problem is the rate of people having pneumonia was at peak already due to seasonal flu and endotoxin, add in this virus sprung from a patented super virus and now we have a problem. Never before have there been such a sharp influx in cases of pneumonia.
     
  28. Spring Breakers still here in the south having a great time at the beach. No word that hospitals are overrun at all. 200 cases so far.
     
  29. People may be better off staying out of the hospital. No one really seems to know what to do in the hospital.
     
  30. Someone who was on the ship said they were not quarantined til much later. They were allowed to roam around and visit the common areas.
     
  31. They were isolated in their rooms for at least a week, and the incubation properties of the ship would still be in effect during the "free roaming" part of this first human trial.
     
  32. This is the most ridiculous thing I have heard yet. Shut down industries, ruin people's lives, bankrupt small business, all because some hospitals might (still a slight possibility) be at capacity for a week or two and 100-500 people might not get the same level of medical care? Insanity. And a true moving of the goal posts from the original scare tactic (as Haidut pointed out in his post on mortality rate).

    Lots of events could temporarily overload hospital beds in an area. That's no justification for telling 330 Million supposed "free" people that they can't go to work, can't go to restaurants, can't go to bars, can't use their constitutional right to peaceably assemble, can't go to a concert or sporting event (an attack on such events could surely overload said beds), and can't be within 6 feet of another person.

    Beyond that, there isn't even proof that the vast majority of cases in China (which still accounts for over half of the tiny, tiny 200,000 or so cases world wide) was even caused by a contagion. They used a CT Scan. They were diagnosing pneumonia, which has several non-viral causes.

    In Italy, there were maybe two people in all that were hospitalized and died from COVID 19. MAYBE two. Every other case has other serious diseases that likely were the cause of hospitalization and death. And that's straight from the President of Italy's Health Authority. Google Translate

    And guess what? Beyond all of that, you have potentially created a NEW and MORE SERIOUS health problem, and potential epidemic of suicides. Isolating animals is well known to cause depression, and you just did that. Also, the serious financial stress imposed on people (anyone who's laid off, part time, or small business owner or employee) could do that. We might not know the TRUE impact of that manufactured health crisis for years to come, as businesses might take months or years to fail all due to this over reaction.
     
  33. Sure there has. Because of the horrid air pollution in China, this has been an ongoing issue since the 1980s. There are 300,000 cases every year in Wuhan alone. At look at that, every single case in China can be justified well within that number.
     
  34. Its insane how the public are freely giving up autonomy over fear of death - and vehemently arguing with anyone that disagrees. Madness.
     
  35. This is due to low empathy which many people on this forum have so they can only think by numbers and chart comparisons to something that they do not see as a threat.
    If my relatives have compromised health in their 60s and 70s, cardiac issues, I do not care for them to be infected with influenza or coronavirus doe them to die. I do not want any person carry any virus to be around them or around me.
    This is the reason when I am knowingly sick I do not go around people to get them sick also like some guys did with the coronarvirus.
     
  36. Thank-you for helping quell the hysteria. People are just repeating media lines. They are the same lines disseminated across every news channel. "Stay home Flatten the Curve" "Children are disease vectors" "social distancing" It's like they are all repeaters. I refuse to be a repeater. Even in the face of war I refuse to be a repeater.
     
  37. @sugarbabe @tankasnowgod and @raysputin , thank you. Your replies really help put things in perspective for me.
    Mass hysteria is more contagious than anything, I don't want to be part of it.
     
  38. I do notice a lot of parroting in the media and news. At this point most local stations are reporting nothing but the virus for the most part -- and usually the exact same infographics or etc. over and over again ('X' many ill; these places closed; footage of Donald Trump or other politicians on all the big media channels in the States like Fox, NBC, ABC, CBS; something-something about keeping apart and washing your hands endlessly and so on).

    Some of the words/terms repeatedly used are:

    Pandemic/crisis/national outbreak/etc.
    Coronavirus/COVID-19
    Growing
    Lockdown
    Spreading
    Infected
    Death/dying
    Businesses/financial impacts/economy crashing
    Emergency
    Dealing with
    Social distancing/whatnot
    It will get worse/some variation of this
    There is no cure/treatment/vaccine/etc. (really motivating stuff)
    Testing/tested/hospitalizations/ventilators/shortages/etc.
    What to do/what you should do
    More people/another person/another subject branched together or joined with the main virus heading (hyperfocusing on every case or situation that is believed to be linked to the virus, even if it isn't)

    The ironic part is there is a growing trend to try and keep people calm and telling them to not go to extremes, while at the same time the news I see repeats those terms I listed above most of the day (and even some of the night) it seems, almost like excessively focusing on it non-stop and relishing in pointing out every new supposed case or piece of info out of desperation like a toll-count or killshot metric urgently being refreshed.

    I think it is not only news but even daytime talk shows and such are doing the same thing somewhat as the news too. I don't watch the news normally anyways but I have noticed it seems almost obsessive/questionable on how the media on some level chooses to broadcast info as if it a parent spoon feeding a young child. Nothing in the news usually seems to drive up independent thought and questioning much -- just mostly seems like it provides info in a blank, authoritarian-esque style that disencourages "outsider" thinking as if questioning the content too much would make you seem too "insane."
     
  39. [emphasis mine]
    This is a personal decision you can always take: Keep a bit of distance to coughing and sneezing people. Don't let people get near you when you are sick. Don't go near your susceptible dear ones when you suspect that you have caught a bug. Postpone visits if you can or if you need to visit them, make sure you keep a bit of distance. This has been practiced in my family for many years.

    The risk of transmission by asymptomatic people is close to zero.

    Regarding hygiene... First wash my hands when I arrive, is something I have done since childhood. And since I have been told that the most likely way to get infected with a bug is rubbing your eyes I try to keep attention to what I have touched. If I need to rub my eyes I mostly do it with the back of my hand. (I don't know if this is OCT, but this is what I do.)
     
  40. agreed. Ill keep investigating but this whole things stinks of intentional or unintentional fabrication.
     
  41. this doesn't seem to be about "knowingly sick" people... the unknowingly "sick" people are being restricted. Restrict the high risk and let society run, which in return will provide better care for the compromised.
     
  42. I’m not sure this will cause depression and suicides in the short run. Even in the long run. People are going to get money / minimal universal income, **** like rabbits via tinder and such, not commute for hours on end to a job they despise, serotoninergic food surplus will be dumped unto everybody living in that communist state and sheeple will be happy and dumbed down just like in the movie Idiocracy

    i for one don’t miss working.
     
  43. @Wagner83 @Opioidus
    Bangkok Cocktail was Liponavir+Ritonavir,and additionally Oseltamivir.
    If you guys can choose,Liponavir+Ritonavir would be my prefered medication.
    Hang In there & keep us posted!
     
  44. They’ve also referred to it as the “Wayne Gretzky” situation multiple times where you don’t skate to where the puck is but where it will be. It’s laughable. CNN literally has a running title that says 7000 cases in the US while talking about automobile manufacturing shutting down and global pandemic in big red letters.
     
  45. absolutely. Build a home gym. There will be no shortage of grain fed meat, rice, potatoes.
     
  46. Look, it's going to vary. Some might enjoy this, or make the best of the situation. Some are working from home, and might even get a bit of a financial boost from this (not paying for gas and such). Not everyone hates their job, in my experience, few do. Most have issues with their job, but they are also missing out on friendships or side benefits the job creates. Not to mention contractors, waitresses, bartenders and such, along with other part timers. They might lose thousands, even tens of thousands of dollars, because of this (maybe more due to lingering effects after official lockdowns end), and a tiny check from the government won't offset this. I've already seen some layoffs in my company (although, those were to be expected soon), but the timing is horrid for those affected.
     
  47. My fear is that Trump may not want to un-declare the state of emergency in time for our Presidential election. Power corrupts and Trump has been pushing the envelope for absolute powers and immunities. Does this state of emergency have a definite term?
     
  48. You seem to be an expert on infectious disease so would love your take on the below:

    Sick staff fueled coronavirus outbreak in Seattle nursing homes
    "Staff members who worked while sick at multiple long-term care facilities contributed to the spread of COVID-19 among vulnerable elderly in the Seattle area, federal health officials said Wednesday. At least 30 coronavirus deaths have been linked to Life Care Center in Kirkland. A report Wednesday from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention provided the most detailed account to date of what drove the outbreak."

    U.S. virus plan anticipates 18-month pandemic and widespread shortages
    "A federal government plan to combat the coronavirus warned policymakers last week that a pandemic “will last 18 months or longer” and could include “multiple waves,” resulting in widespread shortages that would strain consumers and the nation’s health care system. “Shortages of products may occur, impacting health care, emergency services, and other elements of critical infrastructure,” the plan warned. “This includes potentially critical shortages of diagnostics, medical supplies (including PPE and pharmaceuticals), and staffing in some locations.” PPE refers to personal protective equipment."
     
  49. Hi

    tankasnowgod : how did you discard the fatality fage from South Korea given the high number of tests that they have done ?
     
  50. South koreans used cloroquine (malaria medication), zinc and azithromycin. Their death rates are considerably lower than other countries and they supposedly did a lot of testing, so the low death rate can't be due to low detection rates.
     
  51. Why are you worried about this State of Emergency ending? None of the other ones ever have. In fact, the Reconstruction Acts have never been repealed. We are technically still under Marshall Law.

    EDIT- The Reconstruction Acts part was correct, but I was a bit off on State of Emergencies. Several of them have ended, but many are still in effect. List of national emergencies in the United States - Wikipedia

    Trump has declared 6, all 6 still in effect.
    Obama declared 11, 9 of which are still in effect.
    Bush Jr. holds the current record, with 11 still in effect.
    Clinton has 6 still in effect, equaling Trump.
    And Carter still has 1 in effect.

    I think Trump will most certainly end this before the elections (I doubt he's pushing for any long term shutdown), and he is looking at a pretty big time win. Both Biden and Sanders are weak candidates, and neither can draw the types of numbers Trump can at a rally. The Primary Model (which is based on Primary Voting) pretty confidently picked Trump (and note, if anything, he is concerned that the disruptions over the Corona Virus could negatively impact Trump)-

    The Primary Model

    Also of note, while Trump did declare a "State of Emergency" and did a heel turn (in my view) by endorsing these massive shutdowns, he didn't really start this. Governors and Mayors all over the nation started it, along with mass cancellations by orgs like MLB and NCAA.

    Previous to the heel turn, Trump raised the same concerns about over reacting to the news, pointing the Seasons Flu numbers and the official COVID 19 numbers.
     
  52. Human mastery of global geological engineering would be a pretty epic feat.

    I have been hearing that many people can carry the various without symptoms and then transfer it, is this not true?
     
  53. I don't know if I'm really an expert (don't really claim to be), but here is my take-

    This is a nursing home. By definition, the patients there are old and sick. If COVID 19 did spread at a nursing home, I would be beyond shocked if it were the first virus to do so. I don't know how big it is, but regardless, I'm sure all 30 of those patients had other diseases and conditions. Labeling cause of death "Coronavirus" is dishonest, to say the least. It's quite possible that it may have helped accelerate their demise, but in no way would it have been the sole cause, if any.

    The only thing that I can gather is that maybe the nursing home needs better protocols to prevent sick workers from infecting chronically sick patients. This would be a good standard of care at all times in such a facility.

    First off, this story misrepresents that plan itself. You can find it here- https://int.nyt.com/data/documenthe...-plan/d367f758bec47cad361f/optimized/full.pdf

    Those quotes come from a section labeled "Assumptions"

    In context, it reads like this-

    "In the absence of facts, planning assumptions represent information deemed true. They are necessary to facilitate planning development efforts. Assumptions set a baseline for planning purposes and do not take the place of specific activities or decision points that will occur during a COVID-19 outbreak. The following planning assumptions assisted in the development of an operational environment for this plan.
    1. Universal susceptibility and exposure will significantly degrade the time lines and efficiency of response efforts.
    2 . A pandemic will last 18 months or longer and could include multiple waves of illness.
    3. The spread and severity of COVID -19 will be difficult to forecast and characterize."

    There are further assumptions you can read directly in the plan. It does not state that it WILL last 18 months or longer, and certainly didn't "warn" or "anticipate" that, like the article claims it did. It assumed that for planning purposes only.

    And even if the plan did warn or anticipate those things, as the article claimed, it still doesn't mean they would come to pass.
     
  54. Thanks for responding. I guess my point is that many people (especially in today's world) have pre-existing conditions and are already sick so while covid-19 may not be the ultimate cause of death, it certainly seems to be a tipping point in many cases and so should not be taken lightly. 30 deaths in one nursing home in this short amount of time is alarming and it's clear its highly contagious so precautions (avoiding contact with others) is probably necessary.

    The government just announced that the stimulus package in response to covid-19 is bigger than the 2008 financial crisis so not sure how you can that this won't put strain on the healthcare system, planning assumptions aside
     
  55. I’m positive that the end goal is to have total control over the population of any country and have a system in place just like in China.

    1) dramatically exaggerate a pandemic. Reddit and the likes heavily moderated to promote officials’ message
    2) curfew everywhere, mass anxiety, hatred of non abiding citizens
    3) wait for a few weeks or months while everybody’s mental health gets increasingly worse due to loneliness and lack of funds
    4) majority wants to get out
    5) Chinese people can get out but they’re tracked so that everyone knows who is “positive for the virus” and where they are at any given time. People may start being willing to give up privacy for freedom to go out and about
    6) majority is fine with being tracked 24/7 as a “preventative” way to avoid contagion
    7) full control of populations
     
  56. I noticed in January that the people in the hospital where I work seemed to be having notably worse respiratory problems this year. We just got the ability to test for corona last week but I suspect it’s been around for at least a couple months. The hospital has already opened up a previously closed unit to use exclusively for corona patients. I’ve also been asked to increase my hours and that’s never happened in over 20 years. I don’t like how the media is handling this but it does seem fairly serious.
     
  57. It wasn't a single nursing home, those 30 deaths referred to at least two different places, and I don't know what time frame you think it was, but those deaths occurred over a month and a half. And yeah, many people in this world may have some pre-existing condition, but most people aren't so serious that they are in nursing homes. They really are a last resort. You put a family member in hospice if you expect them to live days or weeks. You put them in a nursing home if you expect them to live a couple months to about a year.

    No clue why you think a stimulus package would have any relation to something putting a "strain" on the healthcare system.

    The economy has already suffered a direct attack from the response to shut everything down. If anything, the size would be in response to that.
     
  58. well, it will all work better if there is actually something that makes pneumonia worse.

    if that isn’t disturbing to y’all I don’t know what is.

    I’m Bill Gates, co-chair of the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation. AMA about COVID-19. : Coronavirus

    even redditors in there can see what’s up. China isn’t the problem, China is the solution
     
  59. It may be an end goal (and I think it's actually a world goal, not a nation), but I doubt they would push all their chips in on a single event. Especially in the gun-havingest country on the planet. If anything, there would be a series of these, likely spread out over years/decades. If you read about the World Revolutionary Movement, they are slow and methodical, and have been working toward this goal for 250 years. I think they would be fine working toward it for another 50 or 100 years. I don't think they would suddenly panic and try to do this after only a single event.
     
  60. I don’t doubt there will be resistance, especially here in the US. But lock everybody down with limited access to food and supplies and watch what’s unfolding.

    Even lions in a cage become soft.

    Stage 1) resistance. Stage X) acceptance.

    yeah, world goal, not Trump’s.
     
  61. Again, that would still point to multiple event like this over the coming years and decades.
     
  62. Clearly you have all the answers to this situation. You're right. We shouldn't avoid contact with one another and this won't cause any issues to the healthcare system.
     
  63. if you keep making a crisis worse than it actually is, with media on your side, I’m confident you can fast forward it all pretty significantly

    you can be one smart guy on the internet, posting on a forum of healthy skeptical peons, but don’t forget about how crowds are stupid. Majority tends to rule.
     
  64. Well, yes ... no

    I have followed press conferences and interviews right from the beginning, and the health authorities and the other experts (virologists and/or clinicians) repeatedly said that the chance to catch the virus from someone who is asymptomatic is extremely slim (I think part of the reasoning was that they assumed that there were not that many infected people around.) In an interview today the virologist said that people might start to be infectious 12 or 24 hours before they show symptoms, but he concludes this from laboratory tests only. These lab test can only show how much virus is in a sample. They do not have studies that really looked at transmission. What they see in the lab is that there is a lot of virus in the throat when they first see the patient. And this 'viral load' in the throat decreases in the following days, while that in the lung increases. Now they say, the first test was taken when the patient already had symptoms, the virus in the throat decreased in the following days, so if we extrapolate... The highest load might have been before the first sample was taken, but we don't know, because we don't test it.

    Here some current official statements:

    Robert Koch Institute (German centre for infectious disease control)

    BAG Switzerland (Swiss Health Authorities)

    To sum it up: I think that the risk to infect someone while you are asymptomatic is slim, but when dealing with very vulnerable people I wouldn't take that risk if I could avoid it. And wash your hands! :):
     
  65. The answers I gave were from the source material you provided. I don't know where I said anything about human contact and the healthcare system previously, but I personally think we can't really survive without human contact, and I also think we would be much better off without the so called healthcare system.
     
  66. Me too! Thanks, you guys!
     
  67. Childish.
     
  68. I read that too. Pretty cool!
     
  69. I hope you are right in that it won’t be done after a single event. Was just thinking the other day the population is primed for this now and it’ll be easy to do this again and lock everything down. Not quite the same as previous ‘pandemics’. And people will want to be isolated and vaccinated.

    I’m wondering though what is this would mean for the economy and the market. The assumption is the market is always going to go up over time as history as shown. But the current event makes me question that.

     
  70. So they not only do not get much sun and of that it does get, not much of the solar radiation reaches the earth to get the D3 stimulated. It is one of the most polluted cities in the world which cuts the sun even more!. Sounds like the perfect brooding ground for unhealthy people. I wonder what the normal death and disease rate is within a soup like that?.

    And in Italy can you imagine what the living conditions are like for the sweat shops there?

    I read that police investigator researched the death rate of the Chinese immigrants and for a period in the 90's there were very few deaths. Upon further investigation he found that the deaths were not reported. When someone died, the Chinese mafia disposed of the body and used the work visa or passport to bring in a replacement worker.
     
  71. The neighbor wouldn’t even pet my dog yesterday and a lady walking on the sidewalk with her pooch picked hers up and stood off on the side as I strolled past.

    My sister is a nurse and told me she’s stressed out because she’s on “front lines”. I asked “oh, you have many cases?” She’s replies, “there’s one lady who we’re pretty sure has it”.

    My mom’s employer is opening early and only letting in a certain amount of people at a time.

    People are losing it so quickly.
     
  72. People seem very twitchy around here. You can feel the tension when someone coughs. Can‘t be healthy to be on edge like that for prolonged periods.
     
  73. If we didn’t have the media and health authorities obsessing over it it probably would have just passed as a bad flu season tbh. Already back in December we noticed here how many people caught colds and flus and how severe they felt.
     
  74. I was stressing a little when the grocery store was empty (last week). I’ve digested it now and really don’t give af. I think things may become more shaky but I believe we are going to be in a much better condition in a few months. I used to be a big Illuminati watcher, now I’m a lot more level headed. As much as there is evil trying to end us with constant fear and psy ops, I believe in a greater force of good which moves all things.

    If we don’t buy the hype collectively, the paradigm changes

    Jmo

    If this is it though, whatever mang
     
  75. I was stressed out because of the supermarket situation too. I had no reason to.
    Germany is weird. Fresh food is stocked and plenty is available. But the gigantic toilet paper section is completely empty since a week :lol:
     
  76. Bidet bro. Corona Proof :)
     
  77. Yup, bidet :D that‘s why there was no worry here.
     
  78. Anything you can share in regards to how you got to this position, I am all ears. So far, this operation has been confirming some of my worst beliefs about the things you mentioned, and also many people's reactions. I would love to move even a bit toward where you are.
     
  79. Ghost wipe baby!
     
  80. I envy you :D.
    All this corona stress is messing up my stool quality
     
  81. The issue is i’m ghost wiping but I still have to use toilet paper to dry my bum as I opted for the $50 option (with no dryer).

    @tankasnowgod theres a whole narrative (it may be simply that) that the banking cartel/Illuminati is being taken down during this time. This covid thing was originally planned to consolidate power but is now being used against them. Using the country lock downs as a method to contain the cabal from traveling and cutting off money via government restrictions. I used to think that white hats and black hats were two faces of the same coin (still may be) and that this would inevitable lead to a NWO but I’ve realized that good may still exist as I think it exists within me. They want us to fear and not realize the power of human spirit. We aren’t a plague on this earth as we have been taught to believe.

    The conspiracy is a stretch I’ll admit but the connections cannot be ignored. I think the US announcing the use of chloroquine as the “cure” on the first day of Spring is just the start of the quelling of the media enduced hysteria. Everybody can agree something doesn’t make sense with this corona stuff and the narrative being promoted through the media is the trick. It’s not the end of the world but they want us to believe that

    Epstein, Weinstein, and Prince Harold have deeper connections to this whole thing than we even understand. It’s not old news.

    If things go completely radio silent in the upcoming weeks, it could be that the war is heating up. All will be revealed (or we are completely f*cked). You decide how you want reality to go....
     
  82.  
  83. Good post @raysputin

    One of the things that had always made me uneasy about Trump was the article about his apartment on the 66th floor in Trump Towers in New York. There was a lot of occult symbols shown in pictures....

    Wasn’t he reported to have been on Epstein Island as well? I don’t know what to be believe but as I said, it could just be another form illusion and then.....we are..... screwed
     
  84. =
    I think worst case scenario is trump escalates a cold war pt 2 with China over the “China virus” (more appropriately US germ warfare Bill Gates viru$). I don’t really want to think what day to day life will be like for Americans. I imagine now is a good time to think about how to grow your own food. Not trying to be an alarmist, even if your current situation doesn’t change much and you can go back to work soon, the fact that the military can do this over this many deaths supposedly caused by a supposed virus says a lot about (or our lack of) freedom under a techno-fascistic oligarchy of psychopaths.
     

  85. Not to go all religious (revelations comes to mind) but conversely I can see this situation de escalating issues with a false sense of peace by eradicating the “evil” ones. Exposing the cabal and shifting attention. 7 years of peace maybe and the kabooya? I have no idea what to think at this point. I want to be optimistic but I know better..... Just thoughts and by no means based on anything of concrete evidence.
     
  86. I want to be optimistic also. On a personal level, it’s making me think deeply about my priorities and what a life of truth and integrity mean to me.
     
  87. I must admit, it is pretty brilliant how the media/CDC/WHO weaponized the flu.

    People now react to a simple cough as if it's deadly. :eek:
     
  88. If a mom is suspected of having Coronavirus, her baby is taken away from her and put into an isolette and taken to a unit with other positive patients. Somehow skin to skin, immediate breastfeeding and the warmth of the mother’s body are more deadly to a newborn than being in a plastic isolette and probed by random health care workers.
     
  89. No, it wasn't Epstein Island nor was Trump on the Lolita Express. He did know Epstein, and did hitch a ride on one of his smaller jets to NY a single time long before there were even suspicions about Epstein. He also reportedly kicked Epstein out of Mar A Lago after the staff started raising some concerns, and appears to have cooperated fully with the original investigation into Epstein.
     
  90. I can't even think about this. To feel the depths of it would be too painful. I HAD to be with my babies after they were born. That bond needs to happen and if it doesn't the Mother is less attuned to their child.
     
  91. ..emphasis on "no concrete evidence".

    To be honest, the whole thing just makes me feel lonely.
     
  92. the immune issues that arise from separation are known and well documented, but i think the emotional and psychological issues are even more disruptive. the worst part about this is that it is a suggested protocol, but most people rarely refuse protocol in hospitals because they think they have to do everything they are told.
     
  93. I'm well aware of the narrative of which you speak, and have believed (or wanted to believe) in it for a while. In fact, Trump was the only elected official that actually challenged this clown show, when his first address to the nation on Corona Virus. Then, when everything was being cancelled left and right, and governors and mayors started to initiate lockdowns, he seemed to do a heel turn and endorse all the actions. Admittedly, the damage had pretty much already been done, so maybe that's just some theater move.

    I didn't really consider the chloroquine news too carefully (funny, if it has been Methylene Blue, I would have been 100% back on board), but that is a good sign. Still, the damage to many individuals and small businesses is going to be huge, it already is for many. Each week that goes by like this is going to make it harder for them to come back, and some might not be able to reopen. All the financial moves look to be yuuuge wins for the Banksters at the moment (I feel like Ron Paul shouting at a Tornado with a Shotgun.... does that make sense?). Maybe this is Trump tricking them and will pull out some Doctor Who "Timey Whimey" move that amazes almost everyone, myself included, something like the rumored compact that almost all nations have signed to default on their debt and make the Banksters take the loss. The first scenario seems more probable, but that compact would seem to play out with the same sort of public moves.

    Sorry, that paragraph got away from me a bit. Maybe it is going to be okay, maybe a lot better than okay. I have been getting in touch more with my imagination during this time (and plan to continue to), and regardless of anything else, I might be a lot better in many ways for going thru this time.
     
  94. Well, to be fair, we are in a period of a couple weeks where the actions of most major companies and government leaders from local to Federal have been making decisions left and right based on "no concrete evidence," so maybe this is a time to run with it?
     
  95. One thing to keep in mind is that the outcome of this will probably be Trump's entire legacy, so I wouldn't be surprised to see some "unconventional" warfare on his part.

    Should be interesting.
     
  96. I think we are fellow midwesterners. My sister is a nurse in Grand Rapids MI, but formerly worked at U of M’s hospital in Ann Arbor. They called her last week offering $3,500/week to come back to work there. She’s not going to (has two little kids). But shows how serious regional hospitals are taking it.

    the flu season has been dreadful here in Chicago. My family, with three little kids, has been battling one cold and virus after the other since December. We are typically very healthy and have never had flu before, and kids have never needed antibiotics until this winter.

    three weeks ago when my mother in law was visiting, she, my husband, and I all had terrible flu symptoms. Kids had very mild to no. She goes back home and seemingly infects her other son’s family. My father in law, who takes chloroquine for his arthritis, is the only adult family member who doesn’t get it. I suspect we all had covid 19.
     
  97. I’ve noticed a ton of ppl incl myself attributing their flus to covid19. I think it makes us feel safe thinking we already had it and survived just fine. Let’s not forget corona viruses are normal viruses people get every year.

    Maybe you did, maybe you didn’t. I dunno. Nobody knows much