Excellent Interview Of Denis Wilson In T3

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Denis Wilson, md: Low Body Temperature as an Indicator for Poor Expression of Thyroid Hormone

E. Denis Wilson, md, will address thyroid function and Wilson’s Temperature Syndrome at the 2015 Restorative Medicine Conference in Blaine, Washington, October 1 through 4. Dr Wilson was the first practitioner to use sustained-release T3thyroid hormone. For 20 years, he has treated more than 5000 patients with T3 and trained more than 1000 physicians on how to use T3 to improve the health of patients with low thyroid function and low body temperature who have normal blood tests. He is the author of Evidence-Based Approach to Restoring Thyroid Health.1

Integrative Medicine: A Clinician’s Journal (IMCJ): What originally drew your attention to issues of thyroid and metabolism?

Dr Wilson: A patient came to my office and she brought with her a book and she said that I should read it. It was called Hypothyroidism: The Unsuspected Illness, by Broda Barnes, md.2 In that book, he explains the importance of using body temperature as a guide to evaluate thyroid function. I was intrigued by that and also his suggested treatment of using desiccated thyroid as an empirical treatment to normalize the body temperature. Though I did not look at the book for a few weeks, I eventually read it and decided to try his approach in a few of my patients. To my surprise, some of those people got 100% better.

That was really illuminating to me because, according to my training in medical school, that was not supposed to happen. These people had normal thyroid blood tests and, supposedly, that meant that they could not benefit from thyroid hormone treatment. These people did not get just a little bit better; they got completely better. It did not work for all the patients I tried it with, but it worked in about 60% of cases.

I was looking at the other 40% and wondering how we could help them, too. It could be that they did not have thyroid problems, or maybe the particular treatment I was using was not really addressing their issue. As I was trying to think of ways to increase the yield, I looked at the thyroid hormone pathways and saw that T4 is converted to T3. It turns out that this step is really important. I thought that, perhaps, these patients have a problem with the conversion of T4 to T3. So I started giving some of these treatment failures—these patients who had failed to respond to the pervious treatment—T3 directly. A lot of those treatment failures became treatment successes. That is how it all started.
 
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ecstatichamster
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I didn't post the full article - you can follow the link.

It's very worthwhile reading.

I think I am one of those people who needs T3 at least for now. Along with NDT or maybe just T4.

I started with T3 mostly, and it didn't raise my temperatures or pulse for awhile.

Then later on, after PUFA depletion, T3 started to work. But I was still hypo, waking at 97.1.

Then I started NDT, up to 2 grains. I got hot, and sweaty, and my waking temps reached 97.9.

But I had flu-like body aches.

Now, those are gone, but my waking temps fell from 97.9 to the next morning 97.7...and day by day now they are 97.1!

Meanwhile my HR is a bit high, in the 90s or even 100 at rest.

I can either boost NDT, or start T3 again.

The interview says that some people don't get higher temperatures due to rT3 and even T4 itself blocking T3.

He says this is VERY frequent.

I also read from another source that some people get a high HR but their temps don't budge that much, and those people can get almost immediate good results by adding T3.
It will in this case RAISE their temps and LOWER their HR (from the too-high to the good-normal, in my case from 100 or so to 85 maybe.)

who are in my situation seem to get a lower HR and a higher temp when they take T3 in addition

So today I'm cutting from 2 grains to 1.5 grains of NDT and adding T3.
 

matisvijs

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Well, it could've been that you had high RT3 and the T3 didn't work initially due to that - as it happens the fix for this situation is to just keep supplementing the T3, your RT3 will eventually drop because the body produces less T4(which RT3 is converted from), so the existing RT3 gets cleared over time, while much less new RT3 gets produced due to the fact that the body senses that you have sufficient T3 levels, so there's no need for more T4 to be produced and your TSH goes down.
 
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ecstatichamster
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Well, it could've been that you had high RT3 and the T3 didn't work initially due to that - as it happens the fix for this situation is to just keep supplementing the T3, your RT3 will eventually drop because the body produces less T4(which RT3 is converted from), so the existing RT3 gets cleared over time, while much less new RT3 gets produced due to the fact that the body senses that you have sufficient T3 levels, so there's no need for more T4 to be produced and your TSH goes down.

I think the T4 from the NDT first worked, then created too much rT3 or the higher T4 in my body conversion into T3 isn’t great. Your fix is exactly what I thought so I will try. But I probably will stick to some NDT or T4 while increasing T3.
 

Scenes

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I’ve played around with the different types of thyroid and have found t3 alone to be the best, but I absolutely must have taurine with it to avoid adrenaline issues.

Without taurine, t3 makes me colder in the long run.
 

nbznj

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That’s why we should always have full Thyroid panels before getting someone on t4 only, t3 only or a combination therapy.

Nice to read a doctor admitting that what they were taught was absolutely retarded. Broda Barnes’ book is phenomenal.

I can’t get over the fact that, as peat said, heart disease was basically solved pre WWII. Yet here we are now, with our bataillions of endocrinologists measuring tsh and t3 uptake
 
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tca300

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Ray Peat on using T3 to lower RT3

" T3 can help, but the basic cause seems to be high cortisol and adrenalin, probably other stress hormones. Keeping vitamin D in the normal range, avoiding unsaturated fats, and having some sugar such as orange juice frequently can help. "
 

lampofred

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Great article. Wish he had started going into the specific nutrients that improve T4 -> T3 conversion because I definitely have an issue with that. T3-only supplementation doesn't work for me in the long-run.
 

nbznj

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Great article. Wish he had started going into the specific nutrients that improve T4 -> T3 conversion because I definitely have an issue with that. T3-only supplementation doesn't work for me in the long-run.

The deiodinase enzyme depends on selenium and zinc is also important. Of course, if you have a selenium deficiency, T4 to T3 conversion goes down. If you increase selenium in those patients, the T3 levels go up.

If t3 only doesn’t work in the long run then you’re probably going to be the type that responds better to t3+t4. Don’t listen to anyone else’s ideal ratio, you’ve got your own unique mix of deiodinase activities + micronutrient assimilation
 

ddjd

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Ray Peat on using T3 to lower RT3

" T3 can help, but the basic cause seems to be high cortisol and adrenalin, probably other stress hormones. Keeping vitamin D in the normal range, avoiding unsaturated fats, and having some sugar such as orange juice frequently can help. "
doesn't t3 itself increase cortisol, as it does all hormone production?
 

sweetpeat

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in what sense? increases cortisol metabolism???
T3 lowers cortisol binding globulin, which would have the effect of raising free cortisol. But as tca300 said clearance is also probably increased. I find my liver starts getting bogged down if I don't get enough t3.
 

matisvijs

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T3 lowers cortisol binding globulin, which would have the effect of raising free cortisol. But as tca300 said clearance is also probably increased. I find my liver starts getting bogged down if I don't get enough t3.

Well, as far as I understand, it would not necessarily increase the total free cortisol but rather the percentage of unbound cortisol - T3, if utilized properly by the cells is very effective at reducing total cortisol production, so even if a higher percentage of cortisol that is produced is unbound, if much less total cortisol is produced, then the total level of unbound cortisol will still be lower than before. Is my thinking right on this?
 

matisvijs

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aren't free cortisol and unbound cortisol the same thing?

It'd be interesting to get Peat's take on this, as I know his understanding of what a 'free hormone' is differs from the mainstream's version that only an unbound hormone has biological activity (I think he was talking about this in the context of thyroid hormones). The mainstream science does differentiate between bound and and unbound cortisol - Assay of unbound cortisol in plasma. - PubMed - NCBI, seeing the percentage of unbound cortisol being significantly more increased than the increase in total cortisol in diseases like Cushing's syndrome. What this really means or whether they eventually have identical activity in the body, I don't know, but the ratio between bound/unbound cortisol is scewed in certain pathologies...
 

lampofred

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I think higher cortisol is a good thing as long as it's due to increased production of pregnenolone/progesterone (which it is in the case of thyroid supplementation) and not due to an increased conversion of progesterone into cortisol.
 
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