Epidemic Influenza And Vitamin D

[nad]

how was your salt intake before and after peating?
Milk,how much,and how much Ca supplement?
How much Magnesium?
What got got better and what got worse since peating?

Salted to taste. Last 3 years adding it to OJ at night 1/4 tsp for 160 mg of OJ w/Mg, and some extra to meal sometimes, and when feel like tired.
Milk started to drink regularly just here, so 5 years.
Before just didn't like it, but had some cheese, ice cream, kefir, yogurt (not now), some sour cream, some whole milk just very occasionally,
was not enough I think.
Now about 1/2 liter - 1 liter, plus 500 -1000 mg Ca carbonate (not religiously, last year only).
And a lot of cheese, ice cream, some sour cream, milk jello, sometimes kale broth or cabbage soup.
Mg with me always for over 10 years, diff. doses, as needed, 200 - 600 mg.
Nothing actually got much better, just much less migrain after Mg.
Most up and down, more down, too long list, but calcification is new w/ supplementation (D,K2, Bs, Ca etc.) which, I was hope, will help.

 

[Tristan Loscha]

Salted to taste. Last 3 years adding it to OJ at night 1/4 tsp for 160 mg of OJ w/Mg, and some extra to meal sometimes, and when feel like tired.
Milk started to drink regularly just here, so 5 years.
Before just didn't like it, but had some cheese, ice cream, kefir, yogurt (not now), some sour cream, some whole milk just very occasionally,
was not enough I think.
Now about 1/2 liter - 1 liter, plus 500 -1000 mg Ca carbonate (not religiously, last year only).
And a lot of cheese, ice cream, some sour cream, milk jello, sometimes kale broth or cabbage soup.
Mg with me always for over 10 years, diff. doses, as needed, 200 - 600 mg.
Nothing actually got much better, just much less migrain after Mg.
Most up and down, more down, too long list, but calcification is new w/ supplementation (D,K2, Bs, Ca etc.) which, I was hope, will help.

Calcium,if not coupled to already good health,
can be problematic.
I would rec to stop the Ca from Carbonate and only consume it from foodstuff,
and not more than 800mg to 1500mg?
You have to be consistent with Magnesium intake,Ca is toxic without opposition of Mg.
It didnt came from the D,as you already posted,your D increased only ever so slightly from 30 to 35,
(is your range ng/ml or nmol/L in your region?)
what you took is low dose.
the actual range for hypercalcemia and possible calcification starts at 150ng/ml,which is huge
and not natural attainable.
Ray Peat recommends 50-60ng/ml,but i believe his Ca-recommendations of grams of Calcium
from milk is way too high for someone who doesnt have severe D-deficiency.
D increases (normalization) intestinal Ca-uptake and increases (normalization) renal Ca-re-uptake.
The studies he read about Ca when he made up his mind were formulated without proper knowledge
and amelioration of D-deficiency.So they used large doses of Ca to unknowingly compensate for
D-deficiency,which hinders Ca-absorption and retention.
Labs that would be needed,i hope other members who are more knowledgeable about testing
give their opinion also,are not only D,but PTH,serum or ionised Calcium,serum phosphate.
furthermore,it was found that people over the age of 60 have over 30% more Bodysodium,
and presumably Chlorine,in their bodies,compared to younger Individuals.
Calcium Channel Blockers are prescribed for various cardiac-related disorders,
and there is evidence that Salt excess in tissues is disturbing Calcium-homeostasis,
which can lead to improper Calcium deposition.My personal NaCl and Ca recc is not in line with Ray Peats opinion in that matter.
I would rec to reduce Salt intake to the levels used in Kidney-Disease,no more than 2-3g
Salt from all sources.

 

[Sulcuscentralis]

yeah no way. Never been seen before specially with a dose of 2000-5000 IU. Then eveyone under the sun would have calcified hearts as just short amount of sun exposure gives you 20 000+ IU

in mice models where the claim that excess vit D causes calcification they use 100 000-500 000 IU per day for a week. Thats a huge dose for an animal small as a mice and would assume that a similair dose in humans would be several milions IU.

No freaking way 2000 IU would cause calcification. More likely @nad got the calcification from her deficiency she was trying to treat and not the other way.

Supplemental vitamin D is not exactly the same as getting it from the sun - that is how we supposed to get it. Amazoniac posted a study a while ago in a different thread which discussed how oral vitamin D used a different transport mechanism when consumed orally and used different metabolic pathways and thus the effects were different.

 

[Tristan Loscha]

Supplemental vitamin D is not exactly the same as getting it from the sun - that is how we supposed to get it. Amazoniac posted a study a while ago in a different thread which discussed how oral vitamin D used a different transport mechanism when consumed orally and used different metabolic pathways and thus the effects were different.

What is your opinion on that matter?
D3 has different 'kinetics' if produced in the derm,then transported by binding Protein.
Oral D3 goes into the liver first,but then orthodox transport via binding Protein ensues.
Binding Protein has high affinity and very high capacity.
The effects after all distribution efforts are highly similar,if not exactly the same.
UV-D3 and Oral-D3 are leading to similar calcifediol and Calcitriol amounts and ratios and ranges.
'Spillover' event after large Bolus doses are interrupting meaningful order ever so slightly,
and have to be accepted as unavoidable imperfections.

 

[Sulcuscentralis]

What is your opinion on that matter?
D3 has different 'kinetics' if produced in the derm,then transported by binding Protein.
Oral D3 goes into the liver first,but then orthodox transport via binding Protein ensues.
Binding Protein has high affinity and very high capacity.
The effects after all distribution efforts are highly similar,if not exactly the same.
UV-D3 and Oral-D3 are leading to similar calcifediol and Calcitriol amounts and ratios and ranges.
'Spillover' event after large Bolus doses are interrupting meaningful order ever so slightly,
and have to be accepted as unavoidable imperfections.

Can't really comment on that, but it would make sense to get it the natural way. UV light has other benefits like increased dopamine production in the CNS and maybe direct antiviral effect. UVB lamps are really effective from I heard and paired with a red/infrared lamp to mimic the sunlight should do the trick. I recently bought a uvb amp for reptiles and currently experimenting on myself using it everyday for 20 minutes with a LED red light device. Going to test D3 levels soon. The mood boost effect is instant, but it might be placebo.

 

[tara]

It seems peculiar that places like Spain and Italy, where presumably vitamin D levels are generally higher than normal, are recording drastically more deaths than in somewhere like Scotland, where I'm from, where vitamin D levels are probably very low. Obviously there are many more variables than simply vitamin D levels, but I find it peculiar nonetheless.

The age standardised death rates for flu and pneumonia are much higher in the UK than in Spain, Italy, France (more than double).
The most likely reason COVID-19 deaths are lower in the UK than Southern Europe ATM is most likely to do with where it has spread first. Remains to be seen how these stats will look after a year, or when spread has gone further. CFR can't be meaningfully compared at this stage.

 

[Giraffe]

[emphasis mine]

Ray Peat recommends 50-60ng/ml,but i believe his Ca-recommendations of grams of Calcium from milk is way too high for someone who doesnt have severe D-deficiency.
D increases (normalization) intestinal Ca-uptake and increases (normalization) renal Ca-re-uptake. The studies he read about Ca when he made up his mind were formulated without proper knowledge and amelioration of D-deficiency.So they used large doses of Ca to unknowingly compensate for D-deficiency, which hinders Ca-absorption and retention.

A high PTH causes a host of issues, and Ray Peat has written a lot about the parathyroid hormone. PTH stimulates conversion of 25(OH)D to calcitriol. As a result calcium is taken out of the bones, calcium reabsorption from the renal tubule is increased and more calcium is absorbed from food.

Several factors increase PTH:

• low calcium intake
• low magnesium intake
• high phosphorus intake
• low protein diet
• low vitamin D levels.

Ray Peat Email Exchanges - Ray Peat Forum Wiki

While sufficient calcium intake spares vitamin D, you can't conclude that with optimal vitamin D levels the amount of calcium you get from one or two quarts of milk becomes toxic:

• While calcium intake has effect on calcium balance, there is no effect on extracellular fluid (ECF) calcium concentration. (source)
• The effect of vitamin D levels on absorption is very small.
  
• The percentage of calcium that is absorbed decreases with higher intakes.

The body keeps the calcium level in the extracellular fluid tightly regulated.

The Effect of Vitamin D on Calcium Absorption in Older Women

Participants were randomized to receive one of the vitamin D3 doses, 400, 800, 1600, 2400, 3200, 4000, or 4800 IU/d, or placebo for 1 yr. Calcium intake was increased to 1200–1400 mg daily by giving daily calcium citrate.

In this study, if serum 25OHD increased from 20 to 66 ng/ml [...]

The increase in absorbed calcium of 6% on high doses of vitamin D is so small that the same amount could be obtained from half a glass of milk (100 ml) or 100 mg elemental calcium.

You have to be consistent with Magnesium intake,Ca is toxic without opposition of Mg.

This is a faulty simplistic view of the processes in the body. When the body is stressed it loses magnesium and calcium goes to the wrong places, and this calcium does not come from food, but was resorbed from the bones. High dietary calcium intake is protective. We need all of the alkaline minerals (sodium, calcium, magnesium, potassium) in sufficient amounts.

 

[RealNeat]

I just bought a Sperti UVB lamp going to pair it with my red light device a few minutes every other day.

 

[Hairfedup]

It seems peculiar that places like Spain and Italy, where presumably vitamin D levels are generally higher than normal, are recording drastically more deaths than in somewhere like Scotland, where I'm from, where vitamin D levels are probably very low. Obviously there are many more variables than simply vitamin D levels, but I find it peculiar nonetheless.

......

 

[Tristan Loscha]

[emphasis mine]



A high PTH causes a host of issues, and Ray Peat has written a lot about the parathyroid hormone. PTH stimulates conversion of 25(OH)D to calcitriol. As a result calcium is taken out of the bones, calcium reabsorption from the renal tubule is increased and more calcium is absorbed from food.

Several factors increase PTH:

• low calcium intake
• low magnesium intake
• high phosphorus intake
• low protein diet
• low vitamin D levels.

Ray Peat Email Exchanges - Ray Peat Forum Wiki

While sufficient calcium intake spares vitamin D, you can't conclude that with optimal vitamin D levels the amount of calcium you get from one or two quarts of milk becomes toxic:

• While calcium intake has effect on calcium balance, there is no effect on extracellular fluid (ECF) calcium concentration. (source)
• The effect of vitamin D levels on absorption is very small.
  
• The percentage of calcium that is absorbed decreases with higher intakes.

The body keeps the calcium level in the extracellular fluid tightly regulated.

The Effect of Vitamin D on Calcium Absorption in Older Women






This is a faulty simplistic view of the processes in the body. When the body is stressed it loses magnesium and calcium goes to the wrong places, and this calcium does not come from food, but was resorbed from the bones. High dietary calcium intake is protective. We need all of the alkaline minerals (sodium, calcium, magnesium, potassium) in sufficient amounts.

This is all very true.Some exceptions exist,hyperresponders to the upregulated mechanism of Ca-uptake
mediated by D,or diet-errors like milk-alkali-syndrome,albeit rare.

 

[Kingpinguin]

Supplemental vitamin D is not exactly the same as getting it from the sun - that is how we supposed to get it. Amazoniac posted a study a while ago in a different thread which discussed how oral vitamin D used a different transport mechanism when consumed orally and used different metabolic pathways and thus the effects were different.

well what you gonna do if you live in a country where 7 months of the year sun goes up 10:00 and goes down 14:30. Mostly cloudy during that time aswell and the sun never reach any high point in the sky

 

[Sulcuscentralis]

well what you gonna do if you live in a country where 7 months of the year sun goes up 10:00 and goes down 14:30. Mostly cloudy during that time aswell and the sun never reach any high point in the sky

UVB lamps. Paired with a red light device.

 

[Kingpinguin]

UVB lamps. Paired with a red light device.

already use that from time to time. Tanning bed with red light buildt into it.

 

[nad]

Thanks everybody who responded to my post,
when I'm reading Tristan Loscha it looks logical and worth to try,
so was @Amazoniac, when he told me I made damage by taking V-D.
Giraffe is very convincing (except Ca citrate - I remember Ray said it takes Ca from bones), so many different theories,
a lot against Peat's opinions, so many contradictory and mutual exclusions, everybody put a lot of sources.
I remember also like Dr. Peat said that lately even on PubMed not always correct information.
I'm reading and I'm totally lost!
What should I do!!??
How to prevent calcification and can I reverse my own,
why my V-D level not rise even on 5000 mg for year plus a lot of sun?(I'm 66, so sun along is not enough)
Already lost a lot' of time to experimenting, got bad result.
My chic and magnificent bouquet of problems getting even bigger.

 

[David PS]

It seems that low vitamin D might be related to the ACE2 issues with this coronavirus.
Coronaviruses attach to cells via ACE2, Vitamin D might reduce ACE2 |

 

[Tristan Loscha]

Thanks everybody who responded to my post,
when I'm reading Tristan Loscha it looks logical and worth to try,
so was @Amazoniac, when he told me I made damage by taking V-D.
Giraffe is very convincing (except Ca citrate - I remember Ray said it takes Ca from bones), so many different theories,
a lot against Peat's opinions, so many contradictory and mutual exclusions, everybody put a lot of sources.
I remember also like Dr. Peat said that lately even on PubMed not always correct information.
I'm reading and I'm totally lost!
What should I do!!??
How to prevent calcification and can I reverse my own,
why my V-D level not rise even on 5000 mg for year plus a lot of sun?(I'm 66, so sun along is not enough)
Already lost a lot' of time to experimenting, got bad result.
My chic and magnificent bouquet of problems getting even bigger.

You have to get your diet completly ordered and doing low impact sport and movement,like fast walking
3 times a week or light jooging for 30minutes.But Diet is the most important thing.