Epic Write-up About Salt And Sodium

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Apr 7, 2016
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Hey guys and girls,

Just completed a big write-up I did about salt last weekend.

You might be interested in the read:

Why Everything You've Heard About Salt Is Wrong (Seriously) And How To Easily Manage Your Sodium Intake.

(Yes, there's a clickbait title because otherwise, I will not clicks from Google, which I need to survive.)

The article is 15,000 words long, so there's a lot of free content there.

I've basically been able to corroborate many of Peat's claims on salt and sodium, although I'm not as unanimously positive about salt as he is.

(I've also included a very short "nerd section" about Peat's work near the end.)

If you've got any comments or corrections of my mistakes, please tell me.

I've changed my articles before because of great feedback from this forum.

I'm actually beginning to see the feedback from posts on forums like these as a "peer-review" because it's very hard (if not impossible) for just one scientist to get everything right about a health topic in one sitting of writing - even if you go through lots of studies.

Enjoy and let me know what you think!

P.s.:

Peat's "diet" is one of the only diets out there that get the potassium part of the equation right. I make some pretty radical claims in my article, such as that pre-historic man probably had access to supplemental salt (an argument that is always denied by the low-sodium proponents, and the lynchpin upon which they base their entire faulty low-sodium recommendation.), and I argue that the consequences of a sodium intake cannot be understood without potassium (and chloride).

Again, enjoy!
 

Inaut

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Thanks for posting @KalosKaiAgathos
I like baking soda a lot but feel I'm lacking in the potassium department sometimes . I eat a lot of potatoes and fruit but I'm not sure if I'm keeping an adequate ratio.....
 

KalosKaiAgathos

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Yeah, fruit is one of the reasons Peat's "diet" is higher in potassium - same for potatoes. People who use a ketogenic diet, for example, will have a hard time getting enough potassium because so many of their calories are sourced from fatty acids that contain almost no micronutrients.

Diets high in grains have the same problem, as you get a disproportionally low potassium intake from grains compared to fruits or tubers (calculated per calorie).

Edit: Damn, I should probably change my signature, which is sourced from the period I was heavily studying philosophy.
 

paymanz

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Thanks.

I think one reason that low salt intake increases stress hormones is that these hormones helps body retain more salt.
 
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Great article Kalos, I find your websites content highly valuable. As for the signature I'd keep it as it is, very inspirational, it deserves to be spread.
 

KalosKaiAgathos

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Great article Kalos, I find your websites content highly valuable. As for the signature I'd keep it as it is, very inspirational, it deserves to be spread.

Thanks a lot I guess! I was even doubting whether I should post my articles here even, because I'm not a 100% Peat follower (but are influenced by him, as I am by others).

So thanks!
 

KalosKaiAgathos

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Thanks.

I think one reason that low salt intake increases stress hormones is that these hormones helps body retain more salt.

Interesting. Do you have any studies on that?

Yes, 2 types of "stress" hormones are important. First there are the traditional stress hormones, such as cortisol and adrenaline. Secondly, there's aldosterone and the kidney hormones - technically not stress hormones - which kick in on a low salt diet (the latter hormones are really active in an Indian society which does not add any salt to their meals and who only become 40 years old, even though they're the poster child for low-sodium proponents because they've got low plood pressures (but high death rates)).
 

paymanz

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also salt is important for potassium absorption at blood and kidney level (aldosterone) and also at cellular level.other solutes as well , like taurine,creatine , on chronic hyponatremia your cells loses them. Adaptive decreases in amino acids (taurine in particular), creatine, and electrolytes prevent cerebral edema in chronically hyponatremic mice: rapi... - PubMed - NCBI

salt restriction also increases serotonin.

another interesting fact is chronic low salt intake is bad for bones ,activates osteoclasts for example.(which actually might be caused by high serotonin level)
 
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Dennis

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Oct 12, 2015
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Hey guys and girls,



Why Everything You've Heard About Salt Is Wrong (Seriously) And How To Easily Manage Your Sodium Intake.



P.s.:

Peat's "diet" is one of the only diets out there that get the potassium part of the equation right. I make some pretty radical claims in my article, such as that pre-historic man probably had access to supplemental salt (an argument that is always denied by the low-sodium proponents, and the lynchpin upon which they base their entire faulty low-sodium recommendation.), and I argue that the consequences of a sodium intake cannot be understood without potassium (and chloride).

Again, enjoy!

Great writeup KalosKaiAgathos . Quick question: Indirectly you seem to imply that red meat in general is not a great source of potassium. Most likely this refers to muscle meat. What about organ meats, and gelatinous cuts ( like oxtail) ?
 

Brundle

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The article no longer appears to be up, but it would be interesting to read a refutation of the Raw Primal / Carnivore claim that salt is unnatural and bad for humans, as it is "a rock" and we wouldn't have had access to it before we started mining it 10,000 years or less ago.

Perhaps our needs were lower before the rise in carbohydrate intake in the Neolithic, as cereals (unlike meat) don't contain significant sodium, making it necessary to supplement?
 

revenant

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"Preagricultural humans are calculated to have consumed only 768 mg of sodium, but fully 10 500 mg of potassium each day."

https://www.nature.com/articles/1600389.pdf?origin=ppub

But I wonder if people living near the sea might've had a much higher intake. If you're eating seafood (like raw oysters) you're bound to get some salt water with it. And AFAIK the sodium intake is based on the sodium content of game meat, fruits and vegetables; but some animals will go out of their way to find salt in nature, so maybe early humans did too?
 

JudiBlueHen

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Apparently it doesn't need to be mined. It can be made by evaporation if you live near the sea. I'm guessing that's how it was done thousands of years ago as in the Old Testament, where clearly salt was used.
 

GAF

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The 2003 book, "Salt, A World History" by Mark Kurlansky tells all about how humans found, consumed, manufactured, and obsessed over salt. Hunter gatherers drank the blood of animals and hunters knew where the animals were because animal trails lead to salt licks so the hunters also knew where salt could be obtained directly without drinking blood.

Great book. Super intetesting.
 

GAF

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Salt restriction is just another component of the depopulation psychopaths' playbook. I posted a pdf of the pages from Kurlansky's book that tells the story a few days ago in another thread.

"Salty" meant high sex drive.
 
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"Preagricultural humans are calculated to have consumed only 768 mg of sodium, but fully 10 500 mg of potassium each day."

https://www.nature.com/articles/1600389.pdf?origin=ppub

But I wonder if people living near the sea might've had a much higher intake. If you're eating seafood (like raw oysters) you're bound to get some salt water with it. And AFAIK the sodium intake is based on the sodium content of game meat, fruits and vegetables; but some animals will go out of their way to find salt in nature, so maybe early humans did too?

The ratios and systems are still intact in my opinion,and our bodies are wasting precious Potassium,while jealously safeguarding the now overburdened Saltsupply.Sodium is a micronutrient,like Mg,and not Big-Boys/Gals-Club material like Ca,P,or the uncrowned King of Kings,special K,Potassium.
 

tankasnowgod

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"Preagricultural humans are calculated to have consumed only 768 mg of sodium, but fully 10 500 mg of potassium each day."

https://www.nature.com/articles/1600389.pdf?origin=ppub

But I wonder if people living near the sea might've had a much higher intake. If you're eating seafood (like raw oysters) you're bound to get some salt water with it. And AFAIK the sodium intake is based on the sodium content of game meat, fruits and vegetables; but some animals will go out of their way to find salt in nature, so maybe early humans did too?

I don't think studies like this have much (if any) credibility. Researchers can't accurately calculate levels of minerals, vitamins, calories and macros that humans eat that live in the same time as they do. Imagine how far off they are calculating diets 5000 years ago. Some issues just off the top of my head..

1. Sodium content of foods may have changed drastically over 5000 years.
2. Higher sodium foods may have been regularly eaten 5000 years ago that aren't considered today
3. People may have gotten sodium from methods other than eating, for example, breathing in sodium in air or transdermally. This could be a massive factor for those living in coastal areas or islands.

Even ignoring those, human need for sodium might have changed over 5000 years, due to dietary and other factors.
 

CO2 Retainer

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Apr 4, 2021
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"Preagricultural humans are calculated to have consumed only 768 mg of sodium, but fully 10 500 mg of potassium each day."

https://www.nature.com/articles/1600389.pdf?origin=ppub

But I wonder if people living near the sea might've had a much higher intake. If you're eating seafood (like raw oysters) you're bound to get some salt water with it. And AFAIK the sodium intake is based on the sodium content of game meat, fruits and vegetables; but some animals will go out of their way to find salt in nature, so maybe early humans did too?
I think needs for sodium has increased as there is more excitation of cells and energy loss going on nowadays. I think a very retrieving effect of Sodium is, that it can activate NaKATPase and thus create CO2. CO2, in turn, would lead the sodium and calcium influx outwards. If there is not much influx of Ca and Na going on in the first place, maybe our body doesnt need as much.
 
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