Energin - Liquid B-Complex Vitamin Mix

[Nomane Euger]

I finished a bottle of Energin a few weeks ago. Have to say I haven't felt anything different from it. And I actually thought I could benefit from B vitamins.
I took regular doses, 1 serving at most, cause it's a hassle to pour all that liquid over your body.

Me just a few days and I get very weird anxiety causing dreams,i didn’t take 25 drops,15 drops two days in a row and at night an evil shaman throw a gem containing my soul in a deep black whole and I feel my soul leaving my body

 

[equipoise]

I finished a bottle of Energin a few weeks ago. Have to say I haven't felt anything different from it. And I actually thought I could benefit from B vitamins.
I took regular doses, 1 serving at most, cause it's a hassle to pour all that liquid over your body.

Seriously? I deffo did, I miss Energin.
I felt definitely faster/sharper on it, could focus on music practice more, skin better looking, nails growing fast af. Really feel it did my carb metabolism good.

 

[Amazoniac]

- The Vitamins: Fundamental Aspects in Nutrition and Health (978-0-12-802965-7)

"Most foods contain the vitamin as free biotin and as biocytin bound to food proteins. However, in milk, biotin occurs almost exclusively as the free vitamin in the skim fraction."

"In general, less than one-half of the biotin present in feedstuffs is biologically available. Although all of the biotin in corn is available, only 20–30% of that in most other grains and none in wheat is available. The bioavailability of biotin in meat products also tends to be very low."

Spoiler

"At low concentrations, free biotin is absorbed across the enterocyte by two carrier-mediated processes. Its uptake is facilitated by a Na+-dependent multivitamin transporter (SMVT) bound to the apical membrane (brush border).[11] It can also be inhibited by certain anticonvulsant drugs[12] and ethanol or its major metabolite acetaldehyde (Table 15.3). The intracellular trafficking of SMVT involves distinct trafficking vesicles, the microtubular network, and the microtubule motor protein dynein.[13] The process is not specific for the vitamin, as SMVT also functions in the cellular uptake of pantothenic acid and lipoic acid, which it binds with similar affinities and can inhibit biotin uptake. At the basolateral membrane, another Na+-dependent transporter is involved in translocating biotin to the plasma. The SMVT is regulated by protein kinase C, which can phosphorylate the transporter. Suboptimal SMVT expression is thought to underlie the low biotin absorption observed in alcoholics, pregnant women and patients with inflammatory bowel disease, seborrheic dermatitis or on anticonvulsants, or longterm parenteral nutrition. Four SMVT splicing variants have been identified in the rat."

Spoiler

"Both free biotin and nonhydrolyzed biocytin can be absorbed by diffusion, mainly in the jejunum. This becomes physiologically significant only at luminal concentrations >5 μM; even then, biocytin is less well absorbed than the free vitamin."

"A key feature of biotin metabolism is that it is recycled by proteolytic cleavage from the biotin-dependent carboxylases by the enzyme biotinidase. This recycling and the prevalent hindgut microbial synthesis of the vitamin allow quantitative dietary requirements for biotin to be relatively small. Inborn errors of biotin absorption and metabolism have been identified; some respond to large doses of the vitamin."

"Few cases of clinical manifestations of biotin deficiency have been reported in humans. Those have occurred in patients supported by TPN without biotin supplementation, in nursing infants whose mothers’ milk contained inadequate supplies of the vitamin,[43] in infants born with congenital biotinidase deficiency, and in adults eating egg whites. Signs included periorificial dermatitis, ketolactic acidosis, conjunctivitis, alopecia, hypotonia, ataxia, seizures, developmental delays, and increased risk to skin infections. One case involved a child fed raw eggs for 6 years. The signs and symptoms included dermatitis, glossitis, anorexia, nausea, depression, hepatic steatosis, and hypercholesterolemia. The impairments of lipid metabolism responded to biotin therapy (Table 15.8)."

Spoiler

 

[Digital Samurai]

@haidut thanks for making all these products for us. This product def works for anybody who is wondering. In my case it's working a little too well.

When applied 5 drops to my belly button, I get a little boost of energy within minutes, but then also get sweaty palms that last me throughout the day. The sweaty palms feels like a stress response, is highly annoying and lasts for a large portion of the day.

I had this same reaction to niacinamide when i tried supplementing it, so I believe my body is struggling with niacinamide specifically in this product. I suspect eating food makes it go away, at least temporarily, but i can't seem to eat enough food to ever keep the sweaty hands at bay.

Not sure what to do about it other than 1) stop niacinamide or 2) eat so much food i get fat. Neither option seems desirable especially since i've already gained 50 lbs while peating. I guess another option would be to reduce dosage down to a single drop and just slowly raise it over time.

If anybody has ideas shoot me a PM. (dont want to derail thread, just wanted to say it works really well, and in my case a little too well lol).

 

[ArnieSoderwall]

When applied 5 drops to my belly button, I get a little boost of energy within minutes, but then also get sweaty palms that last me throughout the day. The sweaty palms feels like a stress response, is highly annoying and lasts for a large portion of the day.

To be clear, you are seeing these results entirely from a topical application? Or is the belly button application in addition to an oral dose? If so, what is the oral dose?

 

[Sam321]

Re: Energin - custom, liquid dietary supplement with B vitam



All of the water soluble vitamins have certain solubility in ethanol and water. So the dosages are as close to the maximum solubility for each vitamin as possible. For vitamin B6 we only dissolved what Ray considers a good dose (i.e. <10mg).
Also, keep in mind that the old study "j." posted in another thread showed topical absorption close to 90% and it avoids the liver, so if you use this vitamin topically the plasma concentrations would be comparable to an oral dosage 15-20 times higher, which puts the thiamine way into the safe range.

@haidut do you still stand by the statement "if you use this vitamin topically the plasma concentrations would be comparable to an oral dosage 15-20 times higher, which puts the thiamine way into the safe range."?

Curious as I just bought Energin and am trying to match the dosage of my previous b complex best I can.

 

[Digital Samurai]

To be clear, you are seeing these results entirely from a topical application? Or is the belly button application in addition to an oral dose? If so, what is the oral dose?

entirely topical

 

[ArnieSoderwall]

entirely topical

Thank you for that response. That's very intriguing. Any reason you chose belly button of all places (as opposed to inside of wrist or inside of elbows)? My belly button is concave (other's are convex, I think). Is it well suited for a topical application?

 

[InChristAlone]

If this ratio is really the main marker of sexual preferences , then energin seemed to increase it in the favor of women. Other things I noticed was a possible slight reduction in libido and a total disinterest for porn (it has happened to me in the past though). Too bad the thiamine seems to prevent me from using it , sinus problems can be really annoying (started getting problems behind the eyes as a result, couldn't use my brain etc..). The first few days were ok then either thiamine got the better of me or my body got used to the product. Someone suggested there were amphetamines in it while an other person said they used various combination of B vitamins and never got such effects. Do you have a CoA you can share?
An other thing, energin seemed toimprove my mood , I did not get much energy from it, even when I applied it topically.
As for the pretty bad nightmares and waking up at night I reported, it sounds like someone had troubles with disturbed sleep too Tocovit And Energin (haidut's Supplements) .

Do you know why thiamine could cause sinus problems?

 

[Sam321]

@haidut thanks for making all these products for us. This product def works for anybody who is wondering. In my case it's working a little too well.

When applied 5 drops to my belly button, I get a little boost of energy within minutes, but then also get sweaty palms that last me throughout the day. The sweaty palms feels like a stress response, is highly annoying and lasts for a large portion of the day.

I had this same reaction to niacinamide when i tried supplementing it, so I believe my body is struggling with niacinamide specifically in this product. I suspect eating food makes it go away, at least temporarily, but i can't seem to eat enough food to ever keep the sweaty hands at bay.

Not sure what to do about it other than 1) stop niacinamide or 2) eat so much food i get fat. Neither option seems desirable especially since i've already gained 50 lbs while peating. I guess another option would be to reduce dosage down to a single drop and just slowly raise it over time.

If anybody has ideas shoot me a PM. (dont want to derail thread, just wanted to say it works really well, and in my case a little too well lol).

Decrease dosage to 2 drops and see what you can tolerate.

Probably reving you up and increasing metabolism and caloric requirements or maybe giving your liver some detox power.

 

[Sam321]

I have been trying to find a good supplier of the allithiamine. If we find one I will make the change immediately.

Thiamax
Hit up Elliot Overton about it.

 

[chompie]

Yeah I too figured it must be tied to insulin, but I can't quite explain it. I already take 300-400mg of magnesium in 3 doses after meals and a teaspoon of potassium bicarbonate. And I tolerate carbs extremely well and don't have any insulin or blood glucose related issues. Wonder if it is instead tied to methylation...

Edit: forgot to add that it is definitely not the niacinamide, as I can take up to 500mg at a time without issues.

@Jam did you sort this out? Exact same issue here. I tolerate niacinamide and thiamine in extremely high doses on their own. Though this gives me incredible headaches.

 

[Jam]

@Jam did you sort this out? Exact same issue here. I tolerate niacinamide and thiamine in extremely high doses on their own. Though this gives me incredible headaches.

Sorry, no. I will give it another whirl soon.

 

[chompie]

Sorry, no. I will give it another whirl soon.

I think I sorted out the headache problem. It seems to stem from the biotin. The only way I can keep the headaches off while taking energin is to drink way more water than I want to.

 

[Demyze]

Dear Idealabsdc,

I just want to put out there that I am VERY interested in being able to purchase a liquid B1 and B3 ONLY supplement with higher amounts of these.

I think a lot of other people might want to as well and its very convenient to just order from you rather than having to buy the bulk powders, mix and everything and to just order with other supplements I buy from idealabsdc

Thx 4 hearing me out

 

[DaikonRadish]

Can any one tell me when the expiry date is on this bottle?and is it normal for it to leave a neon yellowish orange stain on the skin after topical application?

 

[chompie]

Can any one tell me when the expiry date is on this bottle?and is it normal for it to leave a neon yellowish orange stain on the skin after topical application?View attachment 34217

7/22 and yes

 

[DaikonRadish]

7/22 and yes

Thanks. Feeling better already after 1 drop.

 

[Vajra]

Excellence,

What's your favorite pose and material, and your favorite square? Your future sculptor and the Bulgarian government need to know.
( ) Tick if you feel comfortable being truncated.

Now the irrelevant part:
- If riboflavin has that bright yellow coloration, and if the brightness doesn't diminish over time after topical application, then how is it being absorbed?
- Do you know how supplementing the vitamins contained in Energin interferes with the other b vits? Does it increase the need of any other specifically? Can it induce a deficiency in other nutrients?
- Check this:

View attachment 4227
*Blood values were not so reliable.

Is this chart the fruit of hard work on Microsoft Excel or is there a site you used to generate that?

 

[PeskyPeater]

Where is the evidence that B vitamin like biotin in ethanol can be absorbed through the skin, thank you :)

find this:

Percutaneous absorption of biotin in healthy subjects and in atopic dermatitis patients - PubMed

The study was designed to test the ability of sequential applications of biotin-containing ointment to increase serum biotin levels. Twenty atopic dermatitis patients (mean age, 20.5 yr) and 11 healthy subjects (mean age, 25.5 yr) volunteered to participate in this study. The diagnosis of atopic...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov