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Energin - Liquid B-Complex Vitamin Mix

Discussion in 'IdeaLabs' started by haidut, May 14, 2014.

  1. ChineseinSweden

    ChineseinSweden Member

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    @Amazoniac and @haidut, thank you both for your replies, and I'm terribly sorry for my late response. I really wanted to reply earlier with some follow up questions but have not been able to due to my health struggle, low energy, brain fog and anxiety. Now two months later I still have blood sugar crashes during the day, but not during the night, even though I keep eating a lot and very often.
    I have re-introduced Energin with a dosage of 4-5 drops per day. I have not dared to add back niacinamide.
    Current symptoms include extreme muscle weakness and muscle ache, and lately heart palpitation (resting pulse often from 90 to 120).

    My understanding/knowledge of biochemistry, physiology and interactions between different vitamins/minerals is very limited. At the time of my original question I didn't have any idea that it could be related to the balance between different B vitamins. I previously forgot to mention that I used to consume large amounts of vit B5 (against acne), which I am on my way of cutting out.
    I was under the impression that methyl donors were bad for you. Now that I have done some more research I realize the way I have supplemented these B vitamins (especially niacinamide?) may have depleted my methyl donors which is not good either. Is there some way I can know for sure that I have actually depleted them? what are the symptoms? Do you think the low blood sugar crashes I experienced were mostly due to methyl donor depletion?
    I don't know if I get enough protein/choline/betaine/creatine/magnesium/inositol since it is currently far too exhausting for me to measure and log every meal.
    I try to have some animal protein with the three main meals(mostly eggs, fish, chicken, ground beef and shrimp). I sprinkle a little bit of gelatin powder here and there throughout the day (no idea how much in total). I probably average 1-2 eggs per day (does this provide enough choline?), take about 1500 mg Betaine Hcl per day(digestion aid) and supplement around 400-500 mg magnesium daily.

    Which dosage would you recommend? Are you talking about supplemental folate in the form of methyl folate? How long time does it typically take to restore this balance? I recently also realized I haven't been including liver or much fresh greens in my diet during the past year or so. No legumes, either. According to Chris Masterjohn's video on folate, I might have been deficient in folate already before starting Energin. Do you think a blood test of plasma folate level would be useful?

    I would really appreciate more insight in helping me resolve some of these symptoms I suffer.

    Thanks a lot!
     
  2. Amazoniac

    Amazoniac Member

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    From what you mentioned it seems to be something else, perhaps made worse with the imbalanced supplementation. I would consider everything mentioned on the following thread (especially vit C and D):


    Have you searched on the lines for 'under/overmethylation symptoms'? There are various discussions on it. Chris also commented about the effects:


    Another one to consider is potassium chloride instead of HCl. Potassium is involved in glucose metabolism and many people don't get enough. Given the heart issue, it's better to improve it first or start with modest doses and increase as you can handle.
     
  3. fredbastiat

    fredbastiat New Member

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    Forgive me if this has been asked previously, but the site image lists the older bottle with 40 drops and B7 (no B5). I'm curious why the switch from B7 to B5?
     
  4. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    It is not a switch - the B7 is still there and we just added B5. We also managed to dissolve the same amount of vitamins in a smaller bottles so the shipping cost are lower (at least for international packages).
     
  5. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    We changed it in November. The addition of B5 was one reason and the other was that we have not changed prices for almost 5 years while our costs keep rising. Also, believe it or not, the 1oz bottle is more expensive than the 2oz ones and most vendors are sold out. So, I guess due to higher demand the few vendors that cell those feel then can charge more for 1oz bottles.
     
  6. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    It was a small number of bottles since the 1oz opaque ones are very hard to source. So, if we run our of them we use the transparent ones as a back up option. They still block UV light, so they are not entirely useless :):
     
  7. Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    how did you find this form of b1? effective?
     
  8. Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    how did you find this form of b1? effective?
     
  9. Joeyd

    Joeyd Member

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    where are you based Wilfrid? im in UK. it would be great to find a reliable source of thiamine pyrophosphate powder
     
  10. johnwester130

    johnwester130 Member

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    after a while i noticed no effect
     
  11. Agnichaga

    Agnichaga New Member

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    When using the energin my stool becomes a yellow ochre color. I've never noticed that using any other B supplements. Is that a normal thing or a sign of malabsorption?
     
  12. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

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    Could be a sign of poor absorption of B2. I would ask a doctor about it.
     
  13. Texon

    Texon Member

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    @Amazoniac @haidut I think B12 deficiency is very underestimated. Check out this link and see what you think.
    B12 Deficiency Support Group | Vitamin B12 Deficiency Overview - B12 deficiency affects the hormones
    I also can't tolerate methyl folate, and I have experienced the downsides of impaired methylation caused by taking too much niacinamide.
     
  14. bzmazu

    bzmazu Member

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    Do you track your foods? What do you consider a deficiency?
    Here is what I get without really trying...my average for a week...
    Vitamin B12... 35.2 mcg...RDA 2.4 mcg...percent of RDA 1,466
     
  15. ifg7

    ifg7 Member

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    Hi @haidut, this week I received my bottle of Energin. However at the label the dosing is 40 drops (2ml), and here I've read that the amount got reduced to 20 drops. How is it finally? I am just not sure how to dose it.. Thanks!
     
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