Eckhart Tolle's A New Earth

Discussion in 'Meditation, Mindfullness, Religion, Spirituality' started by Pet Peeve, Jun 24, 2016.

  1. Pet Peeve

    Pet Peeve Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2015
    Messages:
    290
    Are you familiar with Eckhart Tolle's A New Earth? I'm curious what you guys think. I've been carrying this book around with me now for six years, never get enough of it. It's about how the mind is structured.
     
  2. mt_dreams

    mt_dreams Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2013
    Messages:
    522
    it's a decent rehashing of ideas. I've read both the book you mentioned and the power of now back when I was in uni.
     
  3. PhilParma

    PhilParma Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Messages:
    165
    Intellectuals find it to be lightweight fluff, but thankfully I'm not very smart, so it did reshape the way I view the world quite a bit. I remember reading it for the first time and nodding my head vehemently in agreement the entire time. Once food and shelter needs are met, a vast majority of the human MO is ego/self-image enhancement. People want (need?) to feel big/important/special, etc. It made me see nearly everything people do through that lens. True modesty is incredibly rare.
     
  4. Tarmander

    Tarmander Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2015
    Messages:
    1,026
    I went and saw him speak one time and he said something pretty interesting. He said he very rarely says anything that is really disagreeable or belief based. In other words there isn't much you can disagree with that he says. He points at realty and says "look" but in a very poignant way. The people who do disagree with him have usually made up some argument that they think he's making. The whole book is a very long way of saying "this, just this.."
     
  5. Westside PUFAs

    Westside PUFAs Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2015
    Messages:
    1,407
    He's the German Deepak Chopra. He's spiritual-ing all the way to the bank.

    e.jpg

    “I went to a bookstore and asked the saleswoman, 'Where's the self-help section?' She said if she told me, it would defeat the purpose. Why do so many people need help? Life is not that complicated. You get up, you go to work, you eat three meals, you take one good s**t, and you go back to bed. What's the f***ing mystery? The part I really don't understand, if you're looking for self-help, why would you read a book written by somebody else? That's not self-help, that's help. There's no such thing as self-help. If you did it yourself, you didn't need help. You did it yourself. Try to pay attention to the language we all agreed on.” - George Carlin
     
  6. Sam Suska

    Sam Suska Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2016
    Messages:
    10
    Gender:
    Male
    Hi, about two and a half years ago I read "A New Earth", and, like many others, it led me to re-shape both my world view and my view of myself. Reading that book was so influential that it played a small role in me going on to write my own book, actually. To me, it was not only thought provoking it was inspiring. Now, I recommend the book to anyone with general curiosity for self, life, success, health, etc. So, I guess you could say I think very highly of the book. Let me say this: it has serious "new age" flaws, for sure; but it is still very worth the short amount of time it takes to read.
     
  7. Ideonaut

    Ideonaut Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2015
    Messages:
    226
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Seattle
    I can't stand Tolle. He seems like a kindergarten imposter compared to Nisargadatta Maharaj (I AM THAT).
     
  8. Dessert_All_Day

    Dessert_All_Day Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2016
    Messages:
    70
    Gender:
    Male

    This made me laugh. There's some woo but less than Chopra in my opinion. Yeah, they both made their fortunes but I'm not convinced that Peat shouldn't go ahead and try to make his:D. Insights (whether spiritual or scientific) that people find valuable do tend to be worth lots and lots of money.
     
  9. Ukall

    Ukall Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2016
    Messages:
    205
    Gender:
    Male
    I never read that one. "The Power Of Now" is his first book. It's pretty interesting. When I read it, I don't know, but my daily walking went from "thinking about my problems, about the past and what I have to do in the future" to "look and listen all what was happening around me like listening to the birds, the cars, everything. And also my sensations in my body". I can say it was pretty amazing realizing that there are birds singing when I go to college.
    Well, what you said there seems to be complicated. In fact, we complicate life doing that.
    "You get up, you go to work, you eat three meals", come on, why do I have to do that? Is this what are we meant to be and do?
    Also, three meals... what if I want four or none? This is a generalizing so much that doesn't even make any sense. Many people don't live that way and are on completely abyss. Saying that is easy when life's good.

    For example, I agree so much with Eckhart when he says that 90 or more per cent of our thoughts are completely useless and that we are possessed by our mind. I am trying to sleep and I am thinking about what I am going to do on the next year. I mean, wtf, I don't even know if I will be alive one year after, why dafuq I am thinking about this?
    Also, many people don't know that he was a college student before and was taking a PhD and he thought completely different that time. Actually, spirituality things were like hindrance for him because they would distract him from his studies.

    Scientists or people who are more into science, conceptual knowledge, usually don't like, actually some hate so vigorously, things like meditation, awareness, spiritual knowledge.

    Eckhart talks a lot about Consciousness and sometimes "makes fun" of scientists.


    "A lot of our knowledge is just covering up our ignorance with words. Entire PhDs are like that. And there is a refusal to recognize that the heart of Life or the Universe, there is a deep mystery that we cannot conceptually understand. But because people have this huge egos they cannot admit, specially if you are scientist, you can't admit to yourself that there is a deep mystery, there's a huge amount of things that you do not understand, they can't get themselves to say that. So they have to pretend that they know. It's just words, all little scribbles on a piece of paper."


    "Scientist don't even mention the word consciousness."

    In my opinion, if it helps a person, why not?

    Two videos that I find them very interesting:

     
  10. damngoodcoffee

    damngoodcoffee Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2015
    Messages:
    240
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Finland
    I used to be into meditation, gurus etc. but now i think that stuff is pretty useless. I think enjoying the freshness of the moment or whatever is a basic quality in most people. These guru are arrogant IMO. All that guru stuff definitely made me more arrogant too.
    Enjoying the moment and witnessing thoughts etc. became a huge burden for me eventually. I'd even say i was pretty damn close to losing my mind.
    Nowadays i worry about the past and the future and all that stuff and i'm a lot happier this way! :grin
    Enjoying, relaxing, worrying, thinking... it's all a part of life.

    :2cents:
     
  11. Dessert_All_Day

    Dessert_All_Day Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2016
    Messages:
    70
    Gender:
    Male
    Interesting; I've had precisely the exact opposite experience.

    Really? I think it's the rarest quality you'll find in a person. I see it as people seeming like they're enjoying the present when they're actually not (i.e. they could be enjoying it a lot more and they're expending so much more effort than is necessary).

    The fact that people need to create small talk or do anything, even meaningless things, to avoid just being in the present is evidence that they're striving to make the present better than it needs to be. This takes energy. This is stressful. Peat advocates should be the first to notice this type of thing. A calm, aware mind is naturally happy in the present, even while sitting in total silence.

    Gurus like Tolle believe that wandering (thinking) minds are less happy than non-wandering minds. When a mind is thinking without noticing it's thinking (the default state for the human mind), its experience is capped, often at the expense of deeper, more profound experiences and potential insights. Sam Harris mentions scientific studies supporting this hypothesis in his book "Waking Up."

    Which gurus do you find to be arrogant? I don't mind a bit of arrogance if it comes bundled with enough valuable truth. I'm sure many people see Ray Peat as arrogant.

    This is fairly standard among people seeking enlightenment. It's called "The Dark Night of the Soul" in spiritual circles. It seems to be a necessary side effect of changing the way one's mind operates.

    Spiritual gurus worry about the past and future because they're human. It's impossible not to worry. They just worry a lot less. The past is only relevant in that we learn from mistakes we've made. The future is only relevant in that we plan for it (discounted for the chance that we may die before it even arrives). The present is where all the good stuff actually is. Most worrying is worth eliminating.
     
  12. damngoodcoffee

    damngoodcoffee Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2015
    Messages:
    240
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Finland
    There's no way to know how "aware" other people are. I think it's pretty arrogant to assume that everybody else is in some sleep state where they don't know that they are human beings thinking.
    [​IMG]
    That's what i thought that i was going through. I just don't believe it anymore. Reincarnation. Enlightenment. Why should i believe any of it? I do believe in God of some sort, i just don't believe anything gurus or anybody else says about it. Who knows maybe i'm going towards enlightenment i don't know. :grin I just don't want to take anybodys word for it. :tinfoilhat
     
  13. Such_Saturation

    Such_Saturation Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2013
    Messages:
    6,045
    the term guru
     
  14. Ukall

    Ukall Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2016
    Messages:
    205
    Gender:
    Male
    You were not enjoying the moment then. You know, the mind is really tricky: you may think your are present, but you are not. Actually, you even said "I was pretty damn close to losing my mind.", confirming you were still on the mind-state, and yes, the mind will make you lose your mind, so to speak.
    The mind wants always to be filled with something. When you find something that brings you happiness, some days after, that thing doesn't give you happiness anymore. Then you search for another thing and another thing and another thing... Seeking for happiness.

    Believe... There isn't anything to believe. You completely misunderstood everything. You think this spiritual thing is something to believe.
    Ironically, Eckhart doesn't belong to any religion and uses the term God on a different way comparing how religious people use.

    Towards Enlightenment, like a (mind) goal, right?

    Listen to this then:


    It's just a word. Like your name.
    If people created the word 'guru' to define who these people are, to simply understand and communicate with each other, we use it.
    You equate this word as a bad or negative thing, but you see, it's your way to interpret it and how you deal with it.

    It's like on sports: there are people who like X team and other people who like Y team.
    If one X person starts to talk with a Y person and he know he likes the Y team, he immediately changes his posture and his speech because of that. Once you see him, you do not seem him anymore: you only see a filter on his face saying "this guy likes Y team". You equate who he is because they like something you don't like. But is he only that: a person that likes a different team? And again, that's merely a judgment. Like you are judging the word guru.

    Even in this world of Health & Nutrition there is hate and war everywhere:
    Sugar people will talk happily with other Sugar people. But Sugar people will be mean and mock Fat people and vice versa. Some people blindly follow someone without even care to listen what others perspectives have to say. You narrow and tunnel your vision in only one way of thinking.
    However, it would be much more interesting and productive to reunite sugar, fat, etc people and debate science on a peaceful way to discover and improve our knowledge even more. But the Ego of these people is usually too high for that to happen.
     
  15. Dessert_All_Day

    Dessert_All_Day Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2016
    Messages:
    70
    Gender:
    Male
    I disagree. How aware is a person engaged in a typical bar fight? How aware is someone who's driving drunk? These are at the extreme end of the spectrum just to pound this point home, but such examples aren't even necessary; you can tell a lot just in everyday conversation.

    Do they pay attention to you when you talk? Are they reactive? Are they willing to have patience and listen? How much silence are they comfortable with? Less enlightened people are usually steering the conversation and situation in a more pleasant (and often distractive) direction for themselves. Again, most people do this. But listen to enough "gurus" and you'll notice they're patient, non-reactive, not bothered by silence, they don't care what others think of them, they're excellent listeners, etc.

    Yeah, they're all lost in thought and don't realize it. It's cute. Most people mistakenly believe enlightenment to mean "noticing stuff around you once in a while." This is like mistaking professional golf to mean "driving a golf ball really far at the driving range that one time I went there."

    The dark night of the soul is akin to ripping off the band-aid. But everyone is moving towards enlightenment. Some are just faster than others, like everything else in life.
     
  16. Ukall

    Ukall Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2016
    Messages:
    205
    Gender:
    Male
    We are all enlightened, it's something already within us. But it's obscured, because we are simply lost and possessed by our mind.
    Like when it's a cloudy day, we cannot see the sun. However, the sun (enlightenment) is still there and the clouds (mind) are covering it.
    This is how understood enlightenment. Ok, there are other 'gurus' that define it on another way. Yet, they all point to the same thing, hopefully.

    "because the way from unhappiness or suffering to transcendence it's easier than the way of superficial happiness to transcendence. Superficial happiness keeps you in the dream world for quite a while."
    It seems harsh saying this, but it has some truth. When you are lost in the superficial/dream world, it's harder to transcend. I mean, that's why when people lose their job or lose a family member or lose their house or have a disease for some moment they feel depersonalized: who am I now?
    On a scientific point of view, I've already read our gut flora changes when we have some traumatic experience. It's pretty interesting too, despite not knowing if this is really truth or not.

    And again, I prefer knowing that there different explanations that point to the same thing. And which one serves and helps a person, IMO, it is always a plus. Mixing both point of views, even better.
    In my experience, it was through meditation that I started looking and being aware of my body. Only after that, I started to respect what my body wanted and this got me into nutrition and health.
     
  17. damngoodcoffee

    damngoodcoffee Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2015
    Messages:
    240
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Finland
    "You completely misunderstood everything." What an arrogant thing to say. I think there's a lot to believe in this stuff.. :| Maybe these gurus don't demand your belief in an obvious way like some other religions, but in sneaky subtle ways they absolutely do.
    belief
    belief

    belief :wink etc.. etc..
     
  18. Dessert_All_Day

    Dessert_All_Day Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2016
    Messages:
    70
    Gender:
    Male
    This is true. Gurus are all pointing to the same thing but they describe the path differently depending on their audience. Westerners, for example, really like their egos and dualism and goals and personal pride and whatnot and want there to be some sort of process, so they're often taught a less direct path to enlightenment to avoid too much mental instability and confusion.

    Couldn't agree more.
     
  19. Ukall

    Ukall Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2016
    Messages:
    205
    Gender:
    Male
    How I was being aggressive? I was simply pointing a fact.
    Let me rephrase it then: "You are not understanding it completely. It is more complex than you think. Even I don't understand it very well."
    I know this cycle very well: now I am being more aggressive. And writing this, makes me even more aggressive...
    You may not believe, but I understand you very well. I do the same thing when someone criticizes me or point something I don't agree.

    Do you believe that you are damngoodcoffee (xD)? Seriously, when you were born, did you believe in anything? Do you think a baby believe in anything?

    "I sometimes say animals are closer to God than humans. They are closer to the source. The humans are more lost in the mind forms. Being is more obscured to the human because of the overlay of ego and mental formation."

    The clip from Dr. Jill Bolte Taylor explains this very well.

    Well, I never said I was a guru. My mind still possesses me, however not as it used in the past. I am much more aware how it operates.
    For example, instead of arguing with a person and start shouting, I immediately notice how my speech is becoming aggressive and I am more aware of it. Completely different. But this is only a example. I don't follow blindly the need to treat someone differently, just because I don't agree with him. I mean, how can you see aggressive in those people? If not starting a fight is being aggressive, I mean, I don't know...
    I think if there's something to learn, how not listen to it?

    Thinking of it, I find the Vegetarian Movement very aggressive, for example. For me, it is like starting a new war. (too much serotonin on their blood? :p)

    "You do not become good by trying to be good. Peace is your priority, not saving the world. That follows that."
     
  20. Ukall

    Ukall Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2016
    Messages:
    205
    Gender:
    Male
    @damngoodcoffee , seriously, watch this video and tell me if he is being aggressive also