Anti-Peat E2 Is Not The Problem

Discussion in 'Debate - Anti-Peat' started by b555, Jul 25, 2020.

  1. b555

    b555 Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2020
    Messages:
    101
    “. E2 promotes energy homeostasis, improves body fat distribution, ameliorates insulin resistance (or enhances insulin sensitivity), improves β-cell function, and reduces inflammation. “

    The Role of Estrogens in Control of Energy Balance and Glucose Homeostasis



    Aromatase activity and bone homeostasis in men - PubMed

    “Extraglandular aromatization of circulating androgen pre-

    cursors is the major source of estrogen in men. Several lines



    of clinical and experimental evidence now clearly indicate

    that estrogens in men are necessary for longitudinal bone

    growth, attainment of peak bone mass, the pubertal growth

    spurt, epiphyseal closure, and normal bone remodeling. In



    adults, estrogens appear to be more important in maintain-

    ing male skeletal mass than androgens. With aging, individ-

    ual differences in aromatase activity may help to distinguish



    among men and their rates of bone loss. The concept that a

    minimum circulating level of estrogen is needed to prevent

    bone loss in men is supported by promising new data (1, 62).

    Additional studies are needed to better understand the role



    of glandular vs. peripheral aromatization, to clarify the con-

    tribution of androgens to bone homeostasis, and to identify



    how genetic, environmental, pathological, and pharmaco-

    logical influences might modulate aromatase activity, in-

    creasing or reducing estrogen production in males and



    thereby affecting skeletal health.”







    Error - Cookies Turned Off



    Beyond the Abstract - Role of estrogen in normal male function: Clinical implications for patients with prostate cancer on androgen deprivation therapy, by Richard J. Wassersug, et al



    Brain Aromatization: Classical Roles and New Perspectives

    “Aromatase plays a critical role in brain function under physiological and pathological conditions (Fig. 1). Classically, aromatase has been implicated in the control of reproductive status, sexual development, neuroendocrine function, and sexual behavior. As such, the predominant center of aromatization is within limbic neural circuits that regulate these functions. The regulation of aromatase within these circuits is complex and not uniform in all brain regions. Evidence exists for post-transcriptional control, but sex steroids exert the major transcriptional control. Brain-derived estrogen is necessary for the effects that testosterone exerts on sexual differentiation, gonadotropin secretion and male-typical reproductive behavior, however, its role varies among species playing more essential roles in rodents than in primates. More recently, brain aromatase has been shown to play unanticipated roles in neurogenesis, neural plasticity, neuroprotection, and repair suggesting that local estrogen synthesis has broader roles in brain function than previously appreciated. These exciting new observations hold the promise that someday pharmacologic regulation of brain aromatase could offer therapeutic opportunities for the treatment neurologic disorders and cerebrovascular disease.”





    “Conclusion

    Recent evidence has demonstrated that many biological actions historically attributed to testosterone are instead, at least in part, mediated by its aromatization product E2. The data are strongest for effects on bone, fat mass, insulin resistance and VMS. “

    MECHANISMS IN ENDOCRINOLOGY

    Estradiol as a male hormone Nicholas Russell1,2 and Mathis Grossmann1,2
     
  2. OP
    b555

    b555 Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2020
    Messages:
    101
  3. OP
    b555

    b555 Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2020
    Messages:
    101
  4. mrchibbs

    mrchibbs Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2017
    Messages:
    1,715
    No offence, but you posted the same video and links before.

    I'll be the first to say that estrogen plays an important role, but it certainly is the problem in many cases, and is most certainly not neuroprotective.
     
  5. GutFeeling

    GutFeeling Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2017
    Messages:
    276
    Gender:
    Male
    It's not like if you block estrogen with an AI for example will cause problems, it can but most of the times no. Especially in men.
     
  6. OP
    b555

    b555 Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2020
    Messages:
    101
    Show me the studies.
     
  7. OP
    b555

    b555 Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2020
    Messages:
    101
    You never want to block estrogen with an AI.. An AI is basically poison.
    You dont want to disrupt the aromatization its very important. There is many studies showing this. Here is just one of dozens.
    "However, only the group with elevated estradiol levels (T group) demonstrated significant verbal memory improvement."

    The role of aromatization in testosterone supplementation
     
  8. OP
    b555

    b555 Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2020
    Messages:
    101
    Minireview: Neuroprotective Effects of Estrogen—New Insights into Mechanisms of Action


    In summary, our understanding that estradiol is a complex pleiotropic hormone that plays important nonreproductive functions in the adult brain has emerged rapidly. We now appreciate that estradiol appears to act at two levels: it appears to decrease the risk of disease, and also to attenuate the extent of injury incurred by suppressing the neurotoxic stimulus itself or increasing the resilience of the brain to a given injury. Nonetheless, studies have only begun to decipher and probe the cellular and molecular bases of the novel actions of estrogen. As we continue to gain greater insights into the mechanisms of estradiol-mediated protection, we will be better able to develop estrogen-like compounds that selectively elicit protective effects for use as therapeutic agents to ameliorate cognitive dysfunction and diminish the risk and severity of neurodegenerative diseases and neurotrauma.

    “This review demonstrates the remarkable body of work that has been conducted on the neuroprotective and neurotrophic actions of estrogen in the brain. Clearly much progress in our understanding of estrogen actions in the brain has been derived from this body of work that spans decades. Just as clear is the need for continued focused research in the area to resolve lingering controversies in the field and to address complex mechanisms that underlie estrogen neuroprotective and neurotrophic actions.”
    Neurotrophic and Neuroprotective Actions of Estrogen: Basic Mechanisms and Clinical Implications
     
  9. Shman Frontal

    Shman Frontal Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2020
    Messages:
    44
    Gender:
    Male
    Thanks for this topic. I think that Peat and this Forum miss a thing or at least we all got something wrong. I think its Estron and Estriol which are very dangerous, but not Östradiol. Östradiol seem to be often to low, and thinking about that the standard immunoassays measuring of Östradiol is pretty inaccurate everything makes sense. We need to get deeper in this to understand everything. PUFAs' Topic too
     
  10. JKX

    JKX Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2018
    Messages:
    194
    Gender:
    Male
    I've read up on this quite a bit given the influx of views on this topic recently.

    My take on it remains aligned with Ray's. Estradiol does appear to reduce with age, but this would make sense due to the reduction in the androgen pool with aging.

    It all leads back to hypothyroidism. Ray isnt silly and has 40+ years of real world experience in this area. You may not agree and that's fine. But solely viewing health from the point of view of the elevation or reduction of a single steroid is blinkered. Less androgens being produced, less available to aromatise to estradiol.

    I think its the total estrogen load on the orgsnism which is a more important factor to keep in mind. This is why Ray recommends keeping androgens up and estrogen low. Its a protective state over time.

    While estradiol falls, estrone rises with age and is much more relevant for estrogen-driven diseases – To Extract Knowledge from Matter
     
  11. OP
    b555

    b555 Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2020
    Messages:
    101
    Yes i think so too
     
  12. schultz

    schultz Member

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2014
    Messages:
    2,261
    Estrogen is closely involved in cancer and all degenerative diseases. In an adult it can be kept low with no negative effects. Other things can even fill in for estrogen, like histamine for example, so it's not even really needed in an older human.

    This is my opinion at the moment.

    But everyone is free to keep their estrogen high if that is what they would like.
     
  13. OP
    b555

    b555 Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2020
    Messages:
    101
    What are you doing to keep estrogen low?

    Also what studies do you have to show that estrogen is involved with cancer?
     
  14. mrchibbs

    mrchibbs Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2017
    Messages:
    1,715
    Sure. Just search for "estradiol" and filter by user to get only Georgi's (haidut) posts. You'll find hundreds of posts highlighting studies on estradiol going back 5+ years.

    Just want to say that I appreciate that you're questioning things, but Ray has referenced a gazillion studies on estrogen and estradiol specifically in his articles and newsletters over the years, and as you'll find, Georgi has posted a great deal on the topic in this forum.

    There is overwhelming evidence that estradiol can and is often associated with deleterious effects. It's not just us Peat-heads parroting a theory. I think it plays an important physiological role (of cellular division and growth for instance), but there is a synergy between E2 and P4 which is often overlooked by most of the researchers.
     
  15. mangoes

    mangoes Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2013
    Messages:
    379
    Really? It’s well known that estrogen is carcinogenic. All you have to do is google
     
  16. mrchibbs

    mrchibbs Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2017
    Messages:
    1,715
    The famous Women's Health Initiative study which was halted in 2002 made it so clear, yet nearly 20 years later we still have physicians prescribing estrogen. And MTF transgenders are often given purely estradiol, which is criminal.
     
  17. boris

    boris Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2019
    Messages:
    1,367
    Gender:
    Male
    If you‘re interested in that you can read Peat’s articles on estrogen and the references at the bottom. There is endless material about it.

    I linked one in your other estrogen thread.
     
  18. mangoes

    mangoes Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2013
    Messages:
    379
    I know! And post menopausal women are given estrogen and a synthetic progestin. Terrible
     
  19. mrchibbs

    mrchibbs Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2017
    Messages:
    1,715
    Absolutely, and typically it's a tiny amount of progestin or none at all as well. It should be large doses to balance out the estrogen.

    The "successful" transitions of MTF with obvious rejuvenation and hair regrowth always involve micronized progesterone taken rectally, and those people take 400mg daily, along with the E2 and sometimes other "anti-androgens".
     
  20. OP
    b555

    b555 Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2020
    Messages:
    101
    Im part of a HRT group on facebook that is against blocking estrogen. @haidut articles and peats articles have all been posted there and all heavily debunked by the doctors in the group.
     
Loading...