Does Anyone Get The Sense That Grain Carbs Provide A Different Kind Of Energy?

[jet9]

Grains make me tired afterwards.

What source of carbs do you feel best on ?

 

[YUPEATER]

What source of carbs do you feel best on ?

Fruits I guess.. mostly oranges, melon and banana.

If I eat bread or a cookie I really feel that I need to rest lol. So I have cut out most of these things and eat it only occasionally.

 

[Owen B]

Among all carbs, boiled starches like rice, pasta and oats have some unique properties in terms of promoting insulin-stimulated glucose disposal in skeletal muscle to enhance glycogen storage. Simple sugars, and this includes baked/fried starches like bread and chips where the starch polysaccharides are broken down, raise blood sugar but are less efficient at promoting muscle glycogen storage.

Muscle glycogen is the by far biggest store of glucose we have in the body so having those well filled up likely plays a big role in satiety, stress reduction and energy levels.

More info here
Natalie Zimmerman: "The Woefully Misguided War On Carbohydrates"

I second that but is it insulin that stores? Wouldn't it be glucagon? The boiled starch doesn't fractionate and gets taken up as glycogen avoiding the insulin rush you'd get with a baked or fried starch. I thought insulin stores, but as adipose and fluid.

Maybe that's why starch "feels different". It's getting stored for medium or long term energy needs rather than for short term needs.

 

[Peatogenic]

Wheat in the form of bread or pasta ?

I know wheat makes me more anxious/moody but I think I do have better energy on it (especially physical, compared to potatoes).
No wonder athletes usually preload on pasta before games.

Bread. I don't think I've ever felt great with pasta or even rice. I eat a ton of root vegetables and fruit, but like another commenter, I just don't feel right without bread and I feel I have better metabolism with it. At first I thought it was the endorphin effect of grains, or some kind of serotonin addiction, but lately I've gotten the sense that it's more complex. It's not really about satiety of starches, because I could (and do, almost) have potatoes/beets/parsnips/etc. every meal but still feel lacking. (I usually always eat fruit carbs alongside my starches)

 

[Collden]

I second that but is it insulin that stores? Wouldn't it be glucagon? The boiled starch doesn't fractionate and gets taken up as glycogen avoiding the insulin rush you'd get with a baked or fried starch. I thought insulin stores, but as adipose and fluid.

Maybe that's why starch "feels different". It's getting stored for medium or long term energy needs rather than for short term needs.

Glucagon I'd think rather stimulates breakdown of glycogen to raise blood sugar when insulin gets too high. Insulin definitely stimulates glycogenesis, but I'm not sure if it is what makes boiled starches unique, if so you would expect a number of other foods like white bread and milk to have the same effect, but in my experience they don't.

 

[Sativa]

I just don't feel right without bread and I feel I have better metabolism with it. At first I thought it was the endorphin effect of grains, or some kind of serotonin addiction, but lately I've gotten the sense that it's more complex.

Wheat (and dairy btw) is accompanied by pleasant (and addictive) Opioid effects...thanks to the prolific opioid peptides from digestion.

Yam's are a good starch too btw! More exotic than potatoes perhaps...

 

[Runenight201]

If wheat and dairy have opioid properties than drug me up cuz life is way better with them in my diet.

I rotate in a lot of different starches and i consistently find that wheat makes me feel the best. Specifically bread, specifically croissants, specifically croissants with sugar.

Most other starches have a depressant effect where I’m satiated but left with a heavy stomach and low energy. Bread and sugar have an uplifting effect.

 

[redsun]

If wheat and dairy have opioid properties than drug me up cuz life is way better with them in my diet.

I rotate in a lot of different starches and i consistently find that wheat makes me feel the best. Specifically bread, specifically croissants, specifically croissants with sugar.

Most other starches have a depressant effect where I’m satiated but left with a heavy stomach and low energy. Bread and sugar have an uplifting effect.

Well opioid effects means lower dopamine, higher prolactin which in the long run we do not want as it has negative effects on drive, motivation, brain function, etc... I never noticed it until I hopped off dairy just how addicting it is and likewise how strong the urge to consume it is and get that pleasurable opioid hit. I have much higher general drive and motivation without dairy. Some other user posted that having coffee with dairy helps block the opioid effect, though I cant recall whether it needs to be with the meal or before it...

 

[Runenight201]

Well opioid effects means lower dopamine, higher prolactin which in the long run we do not want as it has negative effects on drive, motivation, brain function, etc... I never noticed it until I hopped off dairy just how addicting it is and likewise how strong the urge to consume it is and get that pleasurable opioid hit. I have much higher general drive and motivation without dairy. Some other user posted that having coffee with dairy helps block the opioid effect, though I cant recall whether it needs to be with the meal or before it...

I believe it was elephanto in regards to coffee and dairy but I don’t believe he is active here anymore. I have noticed that coffee, milk, and sugar is almost a magical elixir, where each individual part on its own has pros and cons but the sum of its part is a wonderful concoction of focus, energy, motivation, etc...

I think there’s more than just opioid effects when it comes to bread. It’s been a long while since I’ve consumed opiates but I do remember a strong relaxative effect and just wanting to lay around and enjoy the high. Bread and sugar seems to do none of that. I’m sure the carbohydrates and b-vitamins play a role in offsetting or not allowing the opiate effects to be strongly expressed. I get a brain high and energy and instantly feel ready to do what I want to do. Life appears brighter and my mind tends towards optimistic vs cynical or pessimistic thoughts. Coffee, milk, sugar, bread, all make me a very optimistic person.

 

[redsun]

I believe it was elephanto in regards to coffee and dairy but I don’t believe he is active here anymore. I have noticed that coffee, milk, and sugar is almost a magical elixir, where each individual part on its own has pros and cons but the sum of its part is a wonderful concoction of focus, energy, motivation, etc...

I think there’s more than just opioid effects when it comes to bread. It’s been a long while since I’ve consumed opiates but I do remember a strong relaxative effect and just wanting to lay around and enjoy the high. Bread and sugar seems to do none of that. I’m sure the carbohydrates and b-vitamins play a role in offsetting or not allowing the opiate effects to be strongly expressed. I get a brain high and energy and instantly feel ready to do what I want to do. Life appears brighter and my mind tends towards optimistic vs cynical or pessimistic thoughts. Coffee, milk, sugar, bread, all make me a very optimistic person.

Yeh, actual opiates have much stronger, more obvious effects so you are never going to feel that level from milk or wheat, but it is still there. If may not be enough to cause problems in everyone, as well as there are nutrients in the foods that can help offset as you said but I think it's important to actually spread this info that way when we have a member that has screwed up motivation, at least people can know and advise others that dropping dairy is a good call generally to help if that is the case.

 

[Peatogenic]

If wheat and dairy have opioid properties than drug me up cuz life is way better with them in my diet.

I rotate in a lot of different starches and i consistently find that wheat makes me feel the best. Specifically bread, specifically croissants, specifically croissants with sugar.

Most other starches have a depressant effect where I’m satiated but left with a heavy stomach and low energy. Bread and sugar have an uplifting effect.

The high butter content of croissants (but without the milk proteins?) Is interesting to think about. Aren't starches better digested with saturated fat? I, too, love croissants and find them not problematic at all...and I specifically eat them with powdered sugar.

Also, motivated was the word I was looking for. Bread feels more motivating, strengthening than any of the starches. Whenever I am happiest and lowest in experiencing stress, I seem to crave bread.

 

[Runenight201]

The high butter content of croissants (but without the milk proteins?) Is interesting to think about. Aren't starches better digested with saturated fat? I, too, love croissants and find them not problematic at all...and I specifically eat them with powdered sugar.

Also, motivated was the word I was looking for. Bread feels more motivating, strengthening than any of the starches. Whenever I am happiest and lowest in experiencing stress, I seem to crave bread.

Yes the croissants I buy state they are all butter croissants. I used to dip bread in butter but it wasn’t quite the same as croissants. There’s certainly something to how the butter is infused with the flour in the baking process that is superior to lathering the butter on top of the baked flour.

Are the French a low stress culture? They should be with all the bread and croissants they eat!

 

[ebs]

I've noticed starch is better for libido and strenght, while sugar is more relaxing/anti stress.

Should make sense considering sugar lowers cortisol.

 

[Marcine]

I am weary of heavy metals and toxins in grains. Like high arsenic in rice due to the use of chicken manure to grow it. Humans take in alot of aluminum now with chemtrails dropping it onto fields so even organic would probably test high?
Besides I do not seem to hit the protein marker without meat so I do potatoes almost daily as a backup. But coming off carnivore the muscle gycogen storage from grain starch is good to know! Thanks!

 

[jet9]

Bump for more experiences / thoughts on grains.