Deteriorating Dental Health

[sunny]

Any Xylitol will do, even if not from birch?

 

[sunny]

Do you know if this is OK to use with current cavities?

 

[sunny]

Bite - they make tooth bits that you chew and then brush. Available in the US but not sure elsewhere.

Do you know if this is OK to use with current Cavities?

 

[yerrag]

Here’s my remineralization protocol that’s worked for me in reducing the translucence I had started to notice in my teeth (they are now whiter and healthier looking as a result):

1. Brushing twice a day with a toothpaste containing hydroxyapatite, a fluoride alternative used widely in Japan and other countries
2. Chewing gum containing Recaldent, a special casein protein which studies suggest can help remineralize teeth
3. Shining red light on teeth for a few minutes every couple of days
4. Rinsing mouth out (after drinking OJ or Coke) with homemade powder made of baking soda, xylitol, and bromelain powder (the latter mostly for whitening).
5. Calcium, calcium, calcium. Lots of milk and cheese, which sounds like you’re doing. I also supplement with eggshell calcium as well as vitamins D and K2.

Thanks. You hit the bull's eye with hydroxyapatite.

'Ive been using Dr. Manhart's calcium-zinc mouthwash and brushing my teeth with the same for the past two years. It has kept me free from recurring periodontal issues that had taken already 4 teeth. I was worried that if the periodontal issue stayed persistent, I would slowly and surely lose all my teeth, given how difficult and seemingly hopeless it would be to stop the periodontal microbes that lie underneath the gum line.

I had suspected that the calcium he uses is hydroxyapatite because I came across it and found it to be antibacterial. Since he also has a product that improves the skin and I've tried it and it works very well, I was able to confirm that hydroxyapatite is used also for cosmetic and dermatological improvements.

I could probably make my own mouthwash and save a few bucks, but no, I rather buy his product as it costs me from 50-100 dollars a year, and for that amount, it is a great deal as these past 2 years, due to COVID, I didn't want to submit to the stupid Covid protocols my dentist imposes on his clients. It turned out to be a good thing, as not only did I not develop plaque, I pretty much eradicated my periodontal issue (with regular mouthwashing and brushing of course).

It also helped that my gut doesn't produce endotoxins that causes plaque to build up on my teeth, and it also helps that I take enough calcium in my diet these days that my teeth does not leach calcium and cause my teeth to pit. That is based on Peat's ideas.

Calcium Therapy Institute – We'll help you to smile more.

We'll help you to smile more.

www.calciumtherapy.com

 

[sunny]

Thanks. You hit the bull's eye with hydroxyapatite.

'Ive been using Dr. Manhart's calcium-zinc mouthwash and brushing my teeth with the same for the past two years. It has kept me free from recurring periodontal issues that had taken already 4 teeth. I was worried that if the periodontal issue stayed persistent, I would slowly and surely lose all my teeth, given how difficult and seemingly hopeless it would be to stop the periodontal microbes that lie underneath the gum line.

I had suspected that the calcium he uses is hydroxyapatite because I came across it and found it to be antibacterial. Since he also has a product that improves the skin and I've tried it and it works very well, I was able to confirm that hydroxyapatite is used also for cosmetic and dermatological improvements.

I could probably make my own mouthwash and save a few bucks, but no, I rather buy his product as it costs me from 50-100 dollars a year, and for that amount, it is a great deal as these past 2 years, due to COVID, I didn't want to submit to the stupid Covid protocols my dentist imposes on his clients. It turned out to be a good thing, as not only did I not develop plaque, I pretty much eradicated my periodontal issue (with regular mouthwashing and brushing of course).

It also helped that my gut doesn't produce endotoxins that causes plaque to build up on my teeth, and it also helps that I take enough calcium in my diet these days that my teeth does not leach calcium and cause my teeth to pit. That is based on Peat's ideas.

Calcium Therapy Institute – We'll help you to smile more.

We'll help you to smile more.

www.calciumtherapy.com

I did buy Dr manharts mouthwash, brushes, and some of the fabric inserts that lay on the teeth from reading your post about it. I did not get around to using the fabric much, thanks for the reminder. I can't say whether or not it helped. I recently visited a dentist and have many Cavities. I wonder if it is related to the milk intake. I drink it all day at work, don't have the ability to brush after each time. The milk is basically an easy calorie source all day in a very busy job that does not afford the time to brush. I have started to bring baking soda water that I rinse my mouth with and zellies mints.

I am curious what you found with the skin product?

I have also used uncle harrys tooth powder and mouthwash.

Recently I have been trying methylene blue at gumline. Surprisingly it does not stain teeth, though I have not dared swishing entire mouth.

It is frustrating to say the least. I brush and floss daily. Never missing. So I am inclined to think something is affecting pH, or a bacteria is present that must be dealt with. The dentist I visited is doing testing to determine what bacteria are present.

 

[yerrag]

I did buy Dr manharts mouthwash, brushes, and some of the fabric inserts that lay on the teeth from reading your post about it. I did not get around to using the fabric much, thanks for the reminder. I can't say whether or not it helped. I recently visited a dentist and have many Cavities. I wonder if it is related to the milk intake. I drink it all day at work, don't have the ability to brush after each time. The milk is basically an easy calorie source all day in a very busy job that does not afford the time to brush. I have started to bring baking soda water that I rinse my mouth with and zellies mints.

I am curious what you found with the skin product?

I have also used uncle harrys tooth powder and mouthwash.

Recently I have been trying methylene blue at gumline. Surprisingly it does not stain teeth, though I have not dared swishing entire mouth.

It is frustrating to say the least. I brush and floss daily. Never missing. So I am inclined to think something is affecting pH, or a bacteria is present that must be dealt with. The dentist I visited is doing testing to determine what bacteria are present.

I think the skin product is the same thing as the moithwash, the label being the only difference.

I forgot to mention that along with Manhart's products, I used 3 drops of SSKI in an ounce of water as a final mouthwash each night before turning in. I swish around the mouth (not gargle) for as long as I can (at least 5 minutes).

I also have to give Manhart's mouthwash a long swishing followed by a long brushing. It is a chore at first, and I'm attempted to skip or shorten it but I didn't.
It eventually becomes a habit. And when it sticks, oral health improves greatly.

A lower premolar was coming loose and the dentist recommended extraction 2 years ago, but @Jam advised using iodine and so now that tooth is firmly in place.

There are many i's to dot and t's to cross and it's not just one magic bullet to get it done. And the results don't bear out in a few months but takes a year or two to bear sweet fruit.

Perhaps even the saliva being alkaline due to good metabolism and good microbial health plays a big part as well.

I think also that the part of microbes is overblown. If you look at Dr. Manhart's $11 toothbrush, it is just regular el cheapo toothbrush with ho hum bristles. It doesn't have the fancy designs of Orab-B but simply has a coat of calcium-zinc at the back of the toothbrush, which erodes to give off calcium and zinc as we brush. The longer we brush the more goes into our mouth. Not that microbes don't play a part, but the hydroxyapatite, which is a calcium compound that forms our bones, has an antimicrobial property which is probably potentiated by zinc.

Not that antibiotics can't be helpful but by itself it doesn't have staying resolving power given than antibiotics can't be taken for a long time without some harmful side effects coming from it. I had used just the SSKI for say about 6 months and a gingival abscess beneath said tooth won't go away, but I took tetracycline for another reason, and I was surprised to see the gingival abscess go away. But I personally wouldn't want to use antibiotics as a first option.

 

[Peachy]

I used to depend heavily on sensodyne-type toothpastes. I had a lot of pain if I didn’t use them.

I was under eating so I corrected that and ate better overall. Adequate nutrients, adequate calories.

Then I dropped the sensodyne. For a month I swished with coconut oil twice a day and brushed with water before and after each time.

Then I got tired of that routine and switched to a toothpaste without glycerin so that the saliva could interact with my teeth. I think of glycerin like Pledge furniture polish. Deflects bacteria, but saliva too.

The toothpaste I use is Wellnesse. It has baking soda which can be a little abrasive but it’s worked fine for me. It has hydroxyapatite as well.

Whitening Toothpaste | Wellnesse | Wellnesse

Wellnesse mineralizing toothpaste relies on natural ingredients to clean teeth, soothe gums, and freshen breath. All smiles, no harsh chemicals. And, we are Glycerin-Free!

wellnesse.com

 

[sunny]

I think the skin product is the same thing as the moithwash, the label being the only difference.

I forgot to mention that along with Manhart's products, I used 3 drops of SSKI in an ounce of water as a final mouthwash each night before turning in. I swish around the mouth (not gargle) for as long as I can (at least 5 minutes).

I also have to give Manhart's mouthwash a long swishing followed by a long brushing. It is a chore at first, and I'm attempted to skip or shorten it but I didn't.
It eventually becomes a habit. And when it sticks, oral health improves greatly.

A lower premolar was coming loose and the dentist recommended extraction 2 years ago, but @Jam advised using iodine and so now that tooth is firmly in place.

There are many i's to dot and t's to cross and it's not just one magic bullet to get it done. And the results don't bear out in a few months but takes a year or two to bear sweet fruit.

Perhaps even the saliva being alkaline due to good metabolism and good microbial health plays a big part as well.

I think also that the part of microbes is overblown. If you look at Dr. Manhart's $11 toothbrush, it is just regular el cheapo toothbrush with ho hum bristles. It doesn't have the fancy designs of Orab-B but simply has a coat of calcium-zinc at the back of the toothbrush, which erodes to give off calcium and zinc as we brush. The longer we brush the more goes into our mouth. Not that microbes don't play a part, but the hydroxyapatite, which is a calcium compound that forms our bones, has an antimicrobial property which is probably potentiated by zinc.

Not that antibiotics can't be helpful but by itself it doesn't have staying resolving power given than antibiotics can't be taken for a long time without some harmful side effects coming from it. I had used just the SSKI for say about 6 months and a gingival abscess beneath said tooth won't go away, but I took tetracycline for another reason, and I was surprised to see the gingival abscess go away. But I personally wouldn't want to use antibiotics as a first option.

I have been using distilled water in the oral rinse bottle. Do you think the water used makes any difference?

 

[yerrag]

I have been using distilled water in the oral rinse bottle. Do you think the water used makes any difference?

I find it better to use tap water as it is chlorinated. Using distilled water eventually causes some mold to form inside the bottle.

I suspect it's because my mouth touches the bottle when I use it. So now I'm careful to use tap chlorinated water and not touch the bottle with my mouth when using it.

 

[sunny]

I find it better to use tap water as it is chlorinated. Using distilled water eventually causes some mold to form inside the bottle.

I suspect it's because my mouth touches the bottle when I use it. So now I'm careful to use tap chlorinated water and not touch the bottle with my mouth when using it.

Ahh, I squirt mine in a glass, I have not had that problem.

 

[yerrag]

Ahh, I squirt mine in a glass, I have not had that problem.

I only get to find out my mouth is a source of molds lol

 

[Phaedrus]

Do you know if this is OK to use with current Cavities?

I don’t see why not? I wouldn’t expect a total reversal of an existing cavity but it should certainly help slow or stop it’s progression and help you avoid new cavities. If you have any teeth that are in very bad shape I would just chew the toothbits carefully or let them dissolve in your mouth before chewing. I doubt they’re hard enough to break a tooth but if a tooth is already in pain you might want to avoid chewing it with that tooth.

 

[DonLore]

Saliva is nothing more than a buffer against the effects of acid erosion and mitigating acid erosion does not form new apatite crystals from the minerals in saliva. I know this is most peoples operating theory when it comes to remineralisation(i guess Peats too)but it's actually never been shown to work that way. When most companies market products for "remineralisation" what they really mean is reduced tooth sensitivity by filling in micro tubules in teeth to prevent ingress of bacteria from getting to the pulp. They achieve this with a bunch of artificial forms of fillers like the Novamin stuff in Sensodyne toothpaste which is a sort of bioengineered glass which can fill in these tubules, or Micro Crystalline Nano Hydroxyapatite of either calcium or zinc which show pretty weak binding properties to dentin, but are decent if your issue is related to tooth sensitivity


Speaking as somebody who has actually achieved some remineralisation i think the saliva thing is a complete waste of time and focus as is focussing on calcium. Calcium has a lot of benefits and should be an important factor in your nutrition, but teeth isn't one of them

What did help then?

 

[Sitaruîm]

Saliva is nothing more than a buffer against the effects of acid erosion and mitigating acid erosion does not form new apatite crystals from the minerals in saliva. I know this is most peoples operating theory when it comes to remineralisation(i guess Peats too)but it's actually never been shown to work that way. When most companies market products for "remineralisation" what they really mean is reduced tooth sensitivity by filling in micro tubules in teeth to prevent ingress of bacteria from getting to the pulp. They achieve this with a bunch of artificial forms of fillers like the Novamin stuff in Sensodyne toothpaste which is a sort of bioengineered glass which can fill in these tubules, or Micro Crystalline Nano Hydroxyapatite of either calcium or zinc which show pretty weak binding properties to dentin, but are decent if your issue is related to tooth sensitivity


Speaking as somebody who has actually achieved some remineralisation i think the saliva thing is a complete waste of time and focus as is focussing on calcium. Calcium has a lot of benefits and should be an important factor in your nutrition, but teeth isn't one of them

What about the study posted by @haidut showing that endurance athletes had the worst oral health, presumably due to their mouth being dry all the time?

 

[ursidae]

Speaking as somebody who has actually achieved some remineralisation i think the saliva thing is a complete waste of time and focus as is focussing on calcium. Calcium has a lot of benefits and should be an important factor in your nutrition, but teeth isn't one of them

How did you achieve remineralisation?

 

[sunny]

What about brushing with calcium hydroxyapatite itself from capsules? Amazon product ASIN B000I4DLJKView: https://www.amazon.com/Now-Supplements-Calcium-Hydroxyapatite-Capsules/dp/B000I4DLJK/ref=mp_s_a_1_3_mod_primary_new?keywords=calcium+hydroxyapatite+powder&qid=1664356899&qu=eyJxc2MiOiI0LjQ5IiwicXNhIjoiMy4xNiIsInFzcCI6IjIuNDIifQ%3D%3D&sbo=RZvfv%2F%2FHxDF%2BO5021pAnSA%3D%3D&sr=8-3

 

[yerrag]

What about brushing with calcium hydroxyapatite itself from capsules? Amazon product ASIN B000I4DLJKView: https://www.amazon.com/Now-Supplements-Calcium-Hydroxyapatite-Capsules/dp/B000I4DLJK/ref=mp_s_a_1_3_mod_primary_new?keywords=calcium+hydroxyapatite+powder&qid=1664356899&qu=eyJxc2MiOiI0LjQ5IiwicXNhIjoiMy4xNiIsInFzcCI6IjIuNDIifQ%3D%3D&sbo=RZvfv%2F%2FHxDF%2BO5021pAnSA%3D%3D&sr=8-3

Not a bad idea. Add zinc though.

And then experiment on yourself.

 

[singuluscorpora]

Give Dr Ellie Phillips protocol a try (let’s say at least for a month).
You don’t have to buy and read her books since there is such a nice summary like this one:

https://cdn.fs.teachablecdn.com/9IDFpH42QaeMfTl8BQwM

The drawback is that it is not cheap, but the stabilized dental health and the long lasting mouth freshness is worth a try.

 

[sunny]

How did you achieve remineralisation?

+1

 

[Mossy]

What about brushing with calcium hydroxyapatite itself from capsules? Amazon product ASIN B000I4DLJKView: https://www.amazon.com/Now-Supplements-Calcium-Hydroxyapatite-Capsules/dp/B000I4DLJK/ref=mp_s_a_1_3_mod_primary_new?keywords=calcium+hydroxyapatite+powder&qid=1664356899&qu=eyJxc2MiOiI0LjQ5IiwicXNhIjoiMy4xNiIsInFzcCI6IjIuNDIifQ%3D%3D&sbo=RZvfv%2F%2FHxDF%2BO5021pAnSA%3D%3D&sr=8-3

Funny you mention this. I was looking at that very supplement, thinking of doing just that. I'm not certain what the consistency of magnesium stearate is like, but that could be a factor in how well this powder is brushable. I've opened other capsules for mixing, that had rice flour, and the rice flour did not mix well at all. I'm guessing magnesium stearate may be more dissoluble. I may try this, and if it's not good for brushing I'll just add it to my mouth wash.