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Deep Vein Thrombosis Treatment Questions: Surgery & Blood Thinners

Discussion in 'Ask For Help or Advice' started by Arctic Fire, Dec 6, 2018.

  1. Arctic Fire

    Arctic Fire Member

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    Relative has large blood clot in femoral vein (deep vein thrombosis or DVT) and will likely need surgery very soon unless there's some quick-acting Peaty alternative of which I'm unaware. Relative has been put on enoxaparin (blood thinner) at the moment, and docs will want him on blood thinners for months after surgery as well.

    Obviously, we are painfully aware of the defects of conventional medicine and want to substitute RP's wisdom wherever possible, but because of size of clot, it sounds like we need to act quickly.

    As always, would value the thoughts and experiences of this community, which has given us so much.

    (1) Anyone have any thoughts about or experiences with "catheter directed thrombolysis," the procedure the MDs want to use to remove the clot? Know of Peatier or less bad alternatives? CDT procedure will likely require CT scan + additional radiation during procedure. Any ways to reduce radiation exposure? Docs predictably say that CT scan is necessary and ultrasound isn't enough.

    (2) Among blood thinners, what are the least awful options from a Peat perspective? Maybe aspirin will be an option after relative gets home, but we'd like to know least bad alternatives for while he's in hospital. I've heard this hospital pushes warfarin after surgery.

    (3) Any hidden risks of which we should be aware, either from the surgery or the blood thinners? We'd like to minimize dangers to relative's brain and mobility.

    (4) Other thoughts, suggestions, or advice?

    Many, many thanks.
     
  2. OP
    Arctic Fire

    Arctic Fire Member

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    Admins, can you replace the acronym DVT in thread title with the words "Deep Vein Thrombosis (DVT)"? Not everyone knows the acronym. Thanks.
     
  3. StephanF

    StephanF Member

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    Read up on Thomas M. Riddick's research on the Zeta Potential and its connection to cardiovascular disease. Dr. T.C. McDaniel had severe arrhythmia in his mid 50s and nobody could help him until he stumbled upon Riddick's research. Dr. McDaniel formulated 'Zeta Aid', which prevents cardiovascular disease including deep venous thrombosis. He lived to be almost 102 years old! He also wrote up his experience with DVT in his brochure:

    "I was excited to join my friends driving to Pittsburgh for a medical conference. We traveled in a Lincoln that was both comfortable and spacious. My friend's wife would occasionally remind us that we had to take a break.

    We had good water with us and did our best to eat and drink as wisely as travel would support. For 8 hours, the back seat of that Lincoln was my home.

    Two days after we returned home, I suddenly experienced symptoms that could only mean the approach of Deep Venous Thrombosis (superficial venous phlebitis). Like flashes of lightening and sufficiently painful to interrupt a thought or action, sharp pains kept returning at intervals of 2-3 minutes.

    I had a serious problem.

    Our patients know most problems can be traced to the inhibition of antegrade flow of blood. It is most often venous rather than arterial. We note that Venous Stasis is prominent in many diagnoses referencing Deep Venous Thrombosis, or Peripheral Phlebitis. Our patients know how to produce antegrade flow by dispersion of the formed elements (red and white cells and platelets.)

    I started an I.V. of anionic surfactants. The fluids were normal saline and the surfactants were those essential to reverse the clumping of cells interfering with the antegrade flow, and to disperse the formed elements to dissolve the clots and increase the slowed Circulation.

    From past experience, we have observed that the essential electrolytes are anionic: the Chlorides, Citrates, Carbonates and Sulfates.

    Usually by the end of the I.V. (about 30 minutes) we notice a marked improvement. In my case, I did not have much relief. The pain and involuntary muscle spasms persisted.

    I raised the ratio of anionic surfactants and got some relief in 10 minutes. I had a belated understanding about why I had to add anionic surfactants to my I.V.

    I did not practice what I know.

    As a 180 pound male, I should have about 8 liters of blood. I also know that the number one problem in venous stasis relates to inadequate liquid intake.

    I know that we are usually two liters low in blood volume before we become thirsty enough to search for drink.

    I was in hypovolemia.

    I drank 3 liters of water within 6 hours. ‘Good’ water to OUR patients is distilled or Reverse Osmosis water.

    We teach that the common problem in Cardiovascular Renal Disease is the pollution that comes with high amounts of cationic electrolytes.

    The primary cationic electrolyte is Aluminum, trivalent in power, a critical element in the precipitation of water to make it potable, unaware that we are still polluting ourselves.

    We cannot see the sediment in the bottom of the container, or at the bottom of the larger containers at the city water works. These chemicals are used to produce precipitation. The supernatant can then be siphoned off, pushed through our pipes and into our homes.

    The single greatest medical device of the 20th Century (in MY opinion!) is the Reverse Osmosis water unit. The R/O module will remove these toxic Substances in part responsible for Intravascular Coagulation, Deep Venous Thrombosis, Kidney Stones and Pulmonary Emboli, all components of The Wheel of MisFortune.

    I made three MAJOR errors: I sat too long, drank too little and did not move around enough to produce antegrade flow by contraction of muscles (either walking or standing). The one lesson to be learned is that if we are going to stay healthy, we have to maintain constant vigilance about what we eat and drink.

    This brochure is an excerpt from my book, Disease Reprieve, originally published in 1997. Few books written by Physicians acknowledge that many of the 'healers' need 'healing'."

    Dr. TC McDaniel Zeta Aid Welcome

    Control of Colloid Stability through Zeta Potential & its relationship to cardiovascular disease

    I am right now studying Riddick's book. What an eye-opener, he was way ahead when he published this book in 1967, I think he is still way ahead, similar to Dr. Gilbert Ling, and ignored. I lost my mother and my elder brother due to colloidal blood instabilities from blood transfusions causing two severe strokes with my mom and stroke, lung embolism and coma in my brother. I tried to educate the doctors...

    With best wishes,

    Stephan
     
  4. StephanF

    StephanF Member

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    Here is a graph that I composed from Riddick's book on the change in the Zeta Potential with the concentration of various electrolytes (the more negative the ZP, the more stable the colloid):
     

    Attached Files:

  5. Sheila

    Sheila Member

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    Thank you StephanF,
    I shall be most interested to read this book since I tend to use small doses of both chlorides and sulphates utilising an old methodology. At appropriate levels (ie. not bucket loads, @yerrag ) potassium chloride is very useful at restoring cardiovascular and other system 'flow'. I will be interested to learn more about how it may work as there are pH changes using both chlorides and sulphates that I could do with understanding better. There may not be a pH change per se, but a promotion to acidity in the tissues is what I think I am seeing. I could be quite wrong.
    I wish you well with your research, thank you for bringing this to my attention.
    Kind regards
    Sheila
     
  6. StephanF

    StephanF Member

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    Hi Sheila,

    The Zeta Aid is a combination of potassium salts, formulated by the late Dr. McDaniel. As one can see from the graph, potassium citrate and potassium pyrophosphate would be the best candidates, the blood already possesses large amount of sodium chloride, so potassium chloride might not be so favorable. Besides that, Zeta Aid also raises the pH, probably with potassium bicarbonate. Zeta Aid does not contain any sodium salts, I did a flame test!

    One has to understand basic chemistry, the valence of anions and cations. From the graph one can see that a few ppm of aluminum chloride can zero out the Zeta Potential, which is used in water treatment plants. But then residual aluminum salts are in the municipal water system! I use reverse osmosis systems for over 20 years. Aluminum has a valence of +3, the chloride has a valance of -1, a valence ratio of 3:1. Just the opposite valance ratio, 1:3 is achieved with potassium citrate, which strengthens the Zeta Potential.

    Here is a formula that Thomas M. Riddick came up with:

    Zeta Potential / Pot Citrate

    Yesterday, I started reading, again, Chapter 22 of Riddick's book on cardiovascular disease. He did experiments on his staff and other volunteers, he developed a 'Scleroscope' which is a microscope mounted horizontally to look at the eye's capillary blood vessels and to determine the 'grade' of the colloidal suspension of the blood. He also recorded the ECG to determine arrhythmia, etc. Then he put his volunteers under a regimen of different mixtures of potassium salts and instructed them to at least drink 1.5 l of water every day. He managed to improve the cardiovascular conditions of his volunteers in 2-1/2 months! Very interesting read. He also instructed them to not use any aluminum pots or pans and to reduce salt consumption, which was checked by specific conductance of their urine.

    I buy the Zeta Aid 25 bags at a time, so it cost me $10 per month. I also share the Zeta Aid with friends of mine here in Reno. A lot of good results. Blood pressure stabilizes, my mild arrhythmia is essentially gone as long I take it.

    With best regards,

    Stephan
     
  7. Sheila

    Sheila Member

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    Dear Stephan
    Thank you for your reply, most interesting and I appreciate your time. I have now read Chapter 22 and am familiar with chemistry.

    I noted the formula here Zeta Potential / Pot Citrate and that Dr Riddick used citrates primarily. But, if I understand correctly, he buffers the solution with bicarbonates to keep the pH quite alkaline.

    As you probably are aware, Ray Peat is not fond of citric acid or citrates viz. KMUD: Hair Loss, Inflammation and Osteoporosis (2012) because of their calcium leaching effect.

    RP: Yeah. There’s been a lot of publicity in the last few months about calcium supplements not being very helpful, and the most popular form of calcium supplement medically has been either calcium gluconate or calcium…I guess gluconate is probably the most popular…

    HD: Or citrate.

    RP: Citrate, yeah. Citric acid itself causes you to lose calcium in your urine. Lactate is another popular supplement. All of those have their anti-calcification effects, causing you to lose calcium or misplace it.

    HD: And here they advertise that calcium citrate is the only observable form for menopausal women, and you’re saying that it actually inhibits some of the absorption of the calcium?

    RP: It activates the loss of calcium in urine, where carbonate…it isn’t quite as soluble if you don’t have a lot of acid, but eventually, all the way down to your intestine, it has the chance to absorb, so it’s a very effective, but safe supplement, because the carbonic acid…the carbon dioxide is the form that stimulates bone formation rather than breaking down the bone.


    and this makes me think, that the added bicarbonate may be mitigating this effect to some degree as it is well known that citric acid dissolves kidney stones (and kidney calcification is certainly present to some degree in CVD). If that is the case, one would wonder why a high fruit diet, where one could easily ingest 3-5g of potassium a day should not do the trick also. Alas finding the precise nature of all the potassium compounds in fruit and veg has eluded me to date. Even @Amazoniac has not uncovered.

    If I have missed something, please do correct me if you have both the time and inclination.

    And also, if I may, a question. I have observed a lot of people on a relatively high fruit and fruit juice diet (along with adequate protein). Many of them report a degree of fluid retention and also a craving for salty foods (and or dairy) when they ramp up (what I suspect is) potassium intake in this manner. There could be many reasons for the former, but the latter suggests to me some balance is missing/required. Fruit juice itself is really quite acidic so I wonder if additional bicarb would be useful. Dr Peat says that salt, to taste, is useful and after three days or so the body reduces any initial fluid retention associated with it. I also appreciate that fruit juice is not just an electrolytic substance per the Riddick Reagent, so there may be confounding substances therein.

    In your own case, if I may, you state that your "mild arrhythmia is gone" if you continue to take the Zeta aid. Is this then reduction in symptoms via continuous flushing of sludge or are there other improvements too? One would expect improvements wherever circulation is better maintained by this electrolyte combination. I might also expect improvements to be worse in winter than in summer. And finally, what is the pH of your final drinking solution?

    I would welcome any comments you may have.
    Thank you, best regards,

    Sheila
     
  8. yerrag

    yerrag Member

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    Sheila, KCl doesn't get to be an acidic load the way MgCl2 is. So I feel safer in its use. It has more or less the same acidic load as NaCl.
     
  9. Sheila

    Sheila Member

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    My dear Yerrag,
    Lovely to hear from you. I tagged you more to bring this interesting thread to your attention (rather than to take the St Michael). I hope you find it so if you are not already versed on the Zeta potential.
    I read that you are going well, great stuff,
    Best regards
    Sheila
     
  10. yerrag

    yerrag Member

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    Thanks Sheila. Great to hear from you. The zeta potential is really Greek to me. Since you recommend it to be, it should be worthwhile to give it more than just a passing scan or read.
     
  11. Sheila

    Sheila Member

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    Dear Yerrag,

    I think, FWIW, some aspects have merit which is why I am reading more. Experiential merit that is, and also how the (comparatively) very low dose electrolytes that I have used (you may recall we discussed this wrt KCl) may work their (seeming) magic. KCl has been my 'go to' for improving flow, especially lymphatically which makes sense if it is able, even at this 65mg dose (BD or TDS), to assist with colloid stabilisation. So far, and it is early, I can not see how the energy of a cell can be consistently raised here, so electrolytes alone seem like a more temporary fix. That might be perfectly good of course and clearly many were helped (including with blood pressure stabilisation) and it is an interesting application of a more industrial chemical application. In this it reminds me of Andrew Fletcher's IBT.

    StephanF's original post was Zeta Potential In The Blood and there are some interesting points in here also. I always felt that low dose KCl worked a bit like aspirin so it is interesting to see that they both increase stabilisation (or Zeta potential). I am not sure yet about the distilled water aspect, but then I neither live in a city nor drink municipal water. I could distill my thrice filtered rain water but my Alembic might then introduce too much copper and I have it on other projects currently anyway.

    More if I find anything of merit. FWIW!
    Sincerely,

    Sheila
     
  12. Sheila

    Sheila Member

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    Greetings potential Zetans,

    Having now read much of Disease Reprieve and a lighter review of Zeta Potential by Hendrickson, a few comments. The latter's write up is entertaining but also takes some diversions into standard naturopathic leanings, so expect 'the usual' on sugar without context, nor any mention that the red blood cells, which he analogises to cars on a freeway, are big carriers of sugar (in this case, glucose). Naughty cars. He does point out that with poor protein digestion one makes the 'sludge' situation worse (and this also has electrico-chemical effects) and that we should all be drinking more water as thirst is a 'late to the party' indicator of need... I think if you're interested this is a reasonable primer but Disease Reprieve is more nuanced and contains experiential content. For the time-poor, Chapter 8 onwards might be advised.

    Anyway, FWIW, I find the Zeta Potential an intelligent application of physical chemistry understandings to a biological system. I can see how it could be beneficial AS LONG AS ingestion of 1.4g of potassium citrate and 60mg sodium citrate a day does not have long term consequences. Any time one reduces inappropriate precipitation, there should be an improvement in blood flow and circulation, both hugely beneficial. Sadly in reducing the complexity of blood flow in an organism to the complexity of blood flow in (say) a copper pipe, some of the nuances such as the effects of endtoxin, hormones, available energy are unexplored but as a principle to be considered, and as a potentially tactical method of improving circulation it might be very useful. Longer term all the other components still need to be addressed, I think. I need to re-read and re-consider but it has also taught me a few things about why Cl-, SO4 2- and dare I add PO4 2- have been useful and, at very low concentrations; that large cationic supplementation has, as we know (but again has become the naturopathic norm (!)), significant draw backs, and that keeping blood from becoming aggluted to preserve health has been around as an idea for a very long time.

    A few months of experimentation and finding where our conductance meter is appear to be in order.
    Best regards
    Sheila
     
  13. OP
    Arctic Fire

    Arctic Fire Member

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    Thank you very much, @StephanF and @Sheila, for your thoughtful comments. My slow response reflects a very busy last few weeks rather than a lack of appreciation for your contributions.

    We are definitely interested in restoring adequate blood volume and normalizing blood viscosity, as you suggest and RP has recommended.

    According to the doctors, the catheter directed thrombolysis largely eliminated the clot. My relative can walk again with no problems. The docs have him on apixaban (blood thinner) and low dose aspirin. We'd obviously like to get him off the apixaban.

    Relative is severely hypothyroid, and getting him on a thyroid supplement would likely help prevent future coagulopathies. Unfortunately, he responds very badly even to low doses of thyroid, which increase sensitivity to his high adrenaline. So we have some challenges ahead...
     
  14. Sheila

    Sheila Member

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    Greetings Arctic Fire
    I am so pleased your relative is improving.
    Since your relative appears to run on a high level of adrenalin, my suspicion is that his/her extremities will have poorer circulation than might be prudent already. Maybe a squash ball to help keep the hands moving, and a foot roller to help the feet (over and above the zeta principles to improve flow) I am thinking your relative is elderly. I have found the foot roller useful in gently stimulating the feet which helps with both circulation and with nervous system stimulation to the rest of the body. Also, with older people, losing their footing, due to poorer foot position sensing is of course a big fall risk. On apixaban the potential for accidental bleeding increases, so falls would not be good yet exercise remains important. You would know all this of course.
    IIRC Dr Peat mentioned a high carb diet working a bit like thyroid supplementation, so maybe abundant fruit if your weather is not freezing. Low dose b vitamins (yeast extraction?) would help to ensure the carbs get used. But changing a person's diet is sometimes problematic so merely an idea, that may or may not be of use. In older people I have found that less is absolutely more and very slowly does it.
    Best of luck to you,
    Sheila
     
  15. OP
    Arctic Fire

    Arctic Fire Member

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    Thanks for your reflections, @Sheila.

    Yes, my relative's hands and feet get cold easily.

    Even mild exertion seems to spike his adrenaline and lactate, so he's gone from active to extremely sedentary. The roller sounds like a good way to obtain some benefits of activity. (And it can double as a cat or dog toy.)

    Yes, fruit and B1 have been most helpful, and he also responds well to low doses of Haidut's B complex (energin).

    Raising the metabolism of someone with high stress hormones is tricky. An adverse reaction might indicate an increased sensitivity to adrenaline, to which the body hopefully will adjust, or instead, it might indicate a deficiency rendering higher metabolism harmful. We encounter this problem often...
     
  16. Sheila

    Sheila Member

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    Yes @Arctic Fire, this is precisely the problem encountered on this Forum:
    It was @yerrag who brought this idea to my attention and RP has mentioned it specifically in relation to older people, always to proceed slowly. Theoretically, 'raising metabolism' should like the tide, raise all boats, but it does not seem to; some areas get over-stimulated, some not touched (or maybe incapable of response) and it can be difficult to figure out whether one is helping or hindering. It was @charlie who recently brought in stagnant lymphatics - thus the moment one 'raises metabolism' can the wastes get out? If not, it won't take long to cause more problems. This is precisely what most people experience.

    As an aside, I think that can be the issue with 'too little' progesterone causing (seemingly) oestrogen symptoms. I struggle with the idea that just giving more progesterone will sort that without some issues of its own. I know progesterone is very useful, but is there really any free lunch with mega dosing of anything?

    Inducing better circulatory and lymphatic flow (if indeed one can separate) whilst raising metabolism seems optimal (always easier said than done) which is why I think zeta principles have much merit, introduced of course, very slowly so that the kidneys and other systems have time to adjust. I suspect most people are functionally dehydated (especially those with 'water retention') but adding in more water, may or may not help depending on whether it is capable of being used. Fruit may be one solution there, along with naturally higher potassium levels from it. Sugar has surfactant effects that can work against flow and increase lymphatic problems. I suspect this effect will be seen more in women than men. And more in the elderly. It is always such a fine line but RP, always to his credit, stresses the need for 'surrounding' nutrition with high 'sugar'.

    I know that RP classes himself as 'very sedentary' but his system is already working to the point where this does not, it would seem, affect him. In 'normal' older people I think walking, or rolling foot movement might be very important - I have a feeling that sole of foot stimulation moves lymph or contributes more than we think to lymphatic circulation. If walking is too much, then I have found good results with those foot rollers, done little and often. So ultimately there are two things here - optimal electrostatic repulsion so the blood can actually flow (zeta principles), and physical stimulation so that the channels are able to take that flow (mechanical AND perhaps de-calcification strategies).

    IF I am in any way correct, @StephanF should find more effects to his (and his other friends) taking of zeta aid than just heart/circulation improvements. I would be interested in even n=1 anecdotal thoughts there. Warmer hands and feet would have to be in this mix, which - all things being equal - is why I think older people might especially benefit.

    The very best of luck.

    Sheila
     
  17. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    @Sheila :hattip
    I believe anything isolated(magnesium, calcium, vitamin D, progesterone, pregnenelone, etc) will cause another imbalance somewhere else and I feel there is no way to get ahead of those imbalances no matter how hard I try.

    From my findings the water retention is the body trying to do everything it can to hydrate a severely dehydrated and acidic environment. I have witnessed a "draining of the swamp" from a diet with a majority of fruit is eaten. From my observations high fruit intake is the best for hydration and for optimal hormonal levels.
    I would also suggest:
    Inclined Bed Therapy - Increase Circulation For Better Health - Life Giving Store

    and

    Help Move Lymphatic Fluid With "Shaking The Tree" - Life Giving Store
     
  18. Sheila

    Sheila Member

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    Dear @charlie,

    Thank you, you are such a gentleman. If I knew how to use those animated critters, I would find one that curtsied in reply!

    I am trialling the high fruit myself these past 3 weeks; your posts inspired me to do so and yes it is doing exactly as it 'says on the tin'. Or should I say, fruit basket. Have to admit, I thought it was bonkers initially (have also been following Jennifer for whom I also have much admiration) but if I can align the zeta principles then we may have both an experiential AND theoretical understanding of why it is so helpful. I concur with your thoughts about water retention. I think one can see that RP also knows this but his system is better able to handle the milk aspect (and balancing electrolytes therein). If one is sufficiently out of whack, that is a later not initial step. Goodness this is all so fascinating AND exciting. As you said, dear Charlie, adding the lymphatics back in makes a whole lot of things suddenly clear. And, as RP said, 'ideally something should not make sense until it ALL makes sense' or words to that effect.

    Inclined bed is wonderful but I found higher fruit improved its assistance further. I will be rejuventated and back doing the Cha Cha Cha soon! (Never the 'Can Can' no matter what @Amazoniac hopes). I will study Shaking the Tree again, who cares if it is somewhat inelegant, if it works...! Thank you for bringing it to my attention, and indeed for everything you do at RPF that engenders such learning and helps so many.

    Best regards
    Sheila
     
  19. StephanF

    StephanF Member

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    Hi @charlie, @Sheila,

    Most interesting the 'Shaking the Tree'! I have a small trampoline with conical springs and that is also excellent in moving the lymphatic fluid. I have read 'The Golden 7 plus One' from Samuel C. West and have been in contact with his son Karl. I am also sleeping on an inclined bed for the last three years or so.

    In addition, I have a grounded aluminum fly screen underneath my bed (Home Depot) and a conductive half sheet connected to ground that is at the lower end of the bed.

    I have corrected the sleeplessness of a teenager that had ADHD, after putting the fly screen underneath his bed, with a 9V battery in the grounding circuit (negative to ground, positive pole to the screen) he sleeps through the night and is transformed! Earth energies sometimes are affecting sleep, if the bed is in a bad 'spot'. My dad died of stomach cancer and much later, a dowser found a crossing of 'water veins' where the bed of my father stood.

    With regard to water retention, I noticed a weight increase of 2-3 pounds after a salty meal. Drinking lots of water will flush the salt and the retained water out in a day or two.

    I am taking Zeta Aid every day for several years now. A few weeks ago, I finished reading Thomas M. Riddick's book on colloidal stability and the Zeta Potential again. He was way ahead of his time. I have lost my mother and my elder brother due to blood transfusion causing the weakening of the Zeta Potential with stroke and death within 3 days with my mom and my brother underwent an 11 hour surgery where his heart stopped, had a lung embolism, was in a coma for 2 months, after sending a magnetic pulser to Germany (EarthPulse) and the doctors finally agreed to use it, he woke up after another 2 weeks, couldn't speak, was unable to move or feel, then feeling came slowly back, started raising his arms, then was transported to another clinic, had another stroke that left him blind, then life support was stopped and he finally passed away last October. He was 66 years old but not in a good state of health when entering surgery (bladder cancer).

    When I talked to the physicians, they had never heard of the Zeta Potential. I gave them a short write-up to educate them! In the other clinic, the director of neurology claimed that the EarthPulse wasn't doing anything and didn't want to have anything to do with the Zeta Aid.

    With best regards,

    Stephan
     
  20. charlie

    charlie The Law & Order Admin

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    Stephan, :hattip

    Some who have done the trampoline and also shaking the tree reported they thought shaking the tree was more effective. Also, while moving the lymph is important, it is even more important that the channels of elimination are open and you are able to move the lymph out.

    Interesting. So you have it on the floor?
    Incredible. What is the purpose of the battery?

    I tried it recently and had some great results, but also a few bad ones. Maybe I am in a bad spot.
     
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